*quality

Holy shit. This is one of the most chilling things I have ever seen.

If this story ever gets made into a movie or a book, I think it could be really interesting if put in the right hands and given the appropriate angle. What a travesty.

EDIT: Shoot. Didn't realize i don't have any more points.

griefer_queafer cannot award a quality point for this post because griefer_queafer does not have enough Power Points - ignoring quality request by griefer_queafer. (You can always purchase more Power Points.)

you should see the conversation and uprising this is causing on both Reddit and Digg
http://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/9chmm/mentally_challenged_man_beaten_to_death_nsfw_lets/
http://digg.com/world_news/Mentally_Challenged_Man_Beaten_to_Death

>> ^griefer_queafer:
quality
Holy shit. This is one of the most chilling things I have ever seen.

I am so fucking mad right now. This did not have to happen.

>> ^nomino:
you should see the conversation and uprising this is causing on both Reddit and Digg
http://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/9chmm/mental
ly_challenged_man_beaten_to_death_nsfw_lets/
http://digg.com/world_news/Mentally_Challenged_Man_Beaten_to_Death


Just read the early stuff. After a while, it becomes a reddit/digg dick-measuring contest. Thank god for the sift.

I just watched a man being murdered.

>> ^blankfist:

I just watched a man being murdered.


Me too.
Murdered for sport.
By a bunch of Marines.
"Semper Fi" my ass

*quality

Boosting this quality contribution up in the Hot Listing - declared quality by aspartam.

Charge those two for murder.

>> ^Drax:
Charge those two for murder.


What about the people who stood there and did NOTHING? They should be charged with manslaughter or something.

I don't understand why they thought that was necessary.

That's a cold-hearted cruelty I've never seen before.

The closest thing I can think of is this guy in my home town who used to like to get into fights with people and try to bite their noses off.

Watching that just broke my heart.

>> ^nomino:
>> ^Drax:
Charge those two for murder.

What about the people who stood there and did NOTHING? They should be charged with manslaughter or something.


True enough, that was my knee jerk post. No matter what they where told before hand someone should have intervened when the guy said, "Take this mother fucker" if they hadn't arleady.

This is completely fucked up. How much shit like this happens that DOESN'T end up on tape?

Also, Id like to know the story on how this tape got to the net.

edit-Christ I just read the guy posted the video himself.. WTF? If that's true, the mentaly handicaped person is the one who lived.

I think that everyone in that room could be charged with conspiracy to murder, or at least aiding and abbetting a murder.

I'm not watching this. I'm sorry, this is just wrong.

I considered posting this more than 2 hours ago, but decided against it. I don't know what the verdict was on whether or not the dude was actually killed because of this, but regardless.. does this belong on the sift? Actions have already been taken, local authorities informed, etc. Perhaps a sift talk post with a link to the reddit page would have sufficed. There is good, sober conversation going on there.

Tags for this video have been changed from 'wrong, mentally, challenged, beaten, death' to 'wrong, mentally, challenged, beaten, death, master Jesus Christ' - edited by MrFisk

^Yes, this is acceptable; it's not just a "death porn" video.

saddest,most horrifying moment "ok..ok..you got me,you got me"
i have dealt with marines.
most were awesome,professional soldiers..marines.
then you would run into a marine where something must have broke in them during training.
made you a bit uneasy around them.
i am afraid of noone,but a crazy person?
they scare the bejesus out of me.
a crazy person has no boundaries,no point of control.
the mentally ill person was not the crazy one.
i know marines...that was no marine.
he was a crazy person.
god..this video makes me feel like weeping.

If I posted this gruesomeness, I'd be banned.

Fucking animals. This made me sick. From the beginning this could have gone in a direction to the extreme opposite. They could have shown this obviously mentally challenged man some compassion by humouring him and giving him some compassionate human interaction by listening to him and befriending him. Alternatively they could have simply shown him the door in a polite manner.

One thing I will never understand is how someone could do this to another. Just another reason why I find it impossible to believe in a compassionate God, right now I want the vengeful bastard from the Old Testament to come collect blood in retribution. People like this don't deserve to exist. There is no punishment for people like this, and if Hell does exist, it's still not enough.

I also considered posting this some 8 hours ago - and decided against it. This coming from someone who argued that http://www.videosift.com/video/Faces-Of-Death should have stayed. I even looked at the FAQ again, and since this was neither a news piece nor a lengthy documentary, it would've been against the rules. But I guess lucky's already voted for it, so we're making an exception this time, aren't we?

i think the importance has over-ridden VS rules.
getting the word out,passing the information along is important.
this happened in 1984.
thats 25 years where these sadistic and fatal actions took place.
25 years of no justice.
is it real? did this actually happen?
i would rather be on the side of enthusiasm rather than be cautious and allow this to go un-noticed.
sometimes you have to look horror in the face in order to battle it.

Felt very strange 'upvoting' something like this... extremely disturbing.

Upvoting the cause, not the actions.

>> ^liverpoolfc:
Upvoting the cause, not the actions.


I hope that goes without saying. If that wasn't the case, we'd all be as guilty as the people who were in the room and did nothing.

Two things stopping me watching or voting for this:

1) I would rather not have the image of someone being beaten to death in my head
&
2) We've reached our data allowance at work so it'd cost 15c a Mb to watch it.


But from reading about what it contains it sounds pretty darn disgusting.

The reddit thread has a lot of cyber investigation going on trying to track down those involved.

It would seem that Bobby Joe Blythe posted this video with great pride. And has another video of what he did to the person who fought this man afterwards because he took 'too long' to down him.


What a disgusting individual, and what disgusting individuals all who were there.

It will be interesting to see if this turns out to be some sick hoax however as it's quite odd this coming out like this now...

Also, there are some reports (although it would seem only from BJB) that the man survived this and ended up in a mental institution.

Someone on the reddit page said that they knew of this incident for a while and claimed that the supposedly mentally challenged man was just high on drugs. I'm too lazy to find the comment, but it's in the linked reddit thread nomino posted.

Not watching.

>> ^nomino:
>> ^liverpoolfc:
Upvoting the cause, not the actions.

I hope that goes without saying. If that wasn't the case, we'd all be as guilty as the people who were in the room and did nothing.


Was responding to Januari who felt weird upvoting.

>> ^nach0s:
Not watching.


Thanks for the annoncement. We don't care

*quality

This video has already declared quality - ignoring quality request by nibiyabi.

*dead

This published video has been declared non-functional; embed code must be fixed within 2 days or it will be sent to the dead pool - declared dead by sepatown.

*dead

Only published or personal queue videos may be flagged dead - ignoring dead request by finch451.

someone with superpowers *dead this up so we can get a new source

Invocations (dead) cannot be called by sillma because sillma is not privileged - sorry.

ah, hehe

*dead

Only published or personal queue videos may be flagged dead - ignoring dead request by berticus.

non-youtube aiternative: http://www.livevideo.com/video/520A80743A794A2DA4FA4E3B438A9789/bobby-joe-blythe-lets-his-blac.aspx

since it's dead i haven't watched it, but i just want to remind people of this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bystander_effect

but of course that doesn't apply to you, right?

>> ^KamikazeCricket:
>> ^nach0s:
Not watching.

Thanks for the annoncement. We don't care


Thanks for the denouncement. We don't care.

I'm pretty sure that this is as close to snuff as anything we've ever had on here. Scary stuff.

It seems like the outrage level is high enough that law enforcement is getting involved, and I wouldn't be surprised if the media doesn't pick this up. They love featuring shit from the internet.

Until these assholes are properly arrested, arraigned, prosecuted, convicted, confined, and sodomized, let's all just focus on this:



Edit: from the Reddit postings, it's unclear whether the victim survived or not.

So let me get this straight...

When video evidence of a crime being committed surfaces, the correct course of action is not to deliver it to the authorities but rather to post it to aggregate video sites under the self-imposed guise of a justice-brandishing vigilante.

Argh... I don't know. I'm highly disturbed, bothered, depressed or name-your-adjective by this video. I'm so bothered that to a degree I wish I could replace my upvote with a no-vote after watching a second time. This video is something to me personally that's newsworthy and should be seen by those who are willing, especially as details and context come forward, but is so gut-wrenchingly awful and horrific I'm not sure I should have supported it with a vote.

Then again, as always, I am glad of the reasoned and intelligent conversation to be found on the Sift. Thanks to folks like nomino, EndAll, and MrFisk bringing these things to light. It may not be a happy topic, but an important one.

I hope those guys rot in jail.

^ You should sift that, KnivesOut. Guaranteed #1


As for the black belt "Marine" who decided to go past winning the "match", there's probably about 3 million other black belts -and more than a couple Marines- out there that want to kick your ass. You have no honour.

Discussion involving the son of the attacker(ColdFire$):
http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=88535&page=45

>> ^rougy:
I don't understand why they thought that was necessary.
Pure ego. Martial arts in the US is full of charlatans and egotists. Blythe created a world for himself in which his ego reigned supreme by opening a dojo. Someone came along and threatened his personal self image and he reacted murderously.

Aaaaand, I didn't watch the video. I can't watch that. I believe it's important that it exists but there's no reasonable excuse for me to watch it.

The story behind this is that the handicapped guy kept going around the mall and trying to steal stuff. After that he decided that with help of Jesus he will become a karate master and decided to take on the local karate club. People were pissed at him and naturally beat him up.

Also, he can not be sued because you can sue only withing a specific period of time after an incident. Which might be 10-15 years. Also, the guy didn't die.

Any real karate student knows to have more respect... karate isn't about ego and violence, it's about respect and defense.

I contacted the Hanford police department and the guy that answered the phone said they are looking into it. I also googled and all I saw were people who were posting it so I emailed nbc nightly news with the link. If this isnt being persued for prosecution then I have a real problem.

>> ^TheFreak:
>> ^rougy:
I don't understand why they thought that was necessary.
Pure ego. Martial arts in the US is full of charlatans and egotists. Just the fact that this man uses his former Marine background as a resume indicates that he lacks any substantial success in his life. He's created a world for himself in which he's important by opening a dojo. Someone came along and threatened his personal self image and he reacted murderously. I'd guess he had very low self esteem due to domestic violence until he joined the Marines and found an identity.
Aaaaand, I didn't watch the video. I can't watch that. I believe it's important that it exists but there's no reasonable excuse for me to watch it.


Well said...

A post on bullshido says it was in dumfries virginia.

After reading several forum discussions on this I think it's safe to say that almost every level of law enforcement and all major media outlets have been informed.

The only info that seems to be missing is the victim's name.


>> ^fjules:
The story behind this is that the handicapped guy kept going around the mall and trying to steal stuff. After that he decided that with help of Jesus he will become a karate master and decided to take on the local karate club. People were pissed at him and naturally beat him up.


Yeah... naturally. If he did any of the things that they said, he clearly deserved being almost stomped to death.
Go back to liveleak.

Ok, for those of you who are curious but don't want to watch:

Snarky, sarcastic comments from Sensei White Trash.

Karate Kid-ish statements from the victim.

Blackbelt Marine attacks victim, I would say almost unprovoked, the victim claimed to be just doing a non-contact exposition, not a fight. The victim obviously brought a SuperSoaker to a gunfight. What he says is so out in left field, you don't need to know Karate to realize he's full of shit.

There is actually a fight, and the victim actually gets a couple decent hits in, but more dumb luck and speed than anything.

The victim gets pushed into a corner, and shoved by a couple students, but he is still on his feet, and DOES "say uncle". The fight should have ended there.

Blackbelt Marine still hammers away at the victim, knocking him down, possibly unconscious.

THEN THE PIECE OF SHIT, DISHONOURABLE, FUCKTARD STARTS HEAD STOMPING THE VICTIM.

Finally BM gets called off by the REST OF THE STUDENTS, not the Sensei, who is a bullshit fucktard in his own right for letting it go that far.

Then we are treated to a closeup of the 1/4 inch wide, non-stop trail of blood from where they dragged the victim outside.

I saw this on LL and considered posting it; never pursued it. The idea of sharing something so mind-boggling lost to the raw animalistic brutality.

There's NO reason for these people not to be punished. "Law Enforcement" has all they need for this one.

That black belt was a pussy. What they did to that man was despicable. Even in street fights, people know when to call the fight, and usually the crowd wants to make sure no one has to be sent to the hospital.

These assholes have probably gone on to have happy, productive lives, with families, jobs, vacations, weddings, and all the other joyous occasions we all want to enjoy in life. I wish I could go back in time to every happy moment those fucktards had in their lives since 1984 and play this video on a projector, just to constantly remind them of what they did (or allowed to happen).

And I know "violence is never the answer", but I wouldn't mind taking on that pussy black belt and teaching him a thing or 2 about a thing or 2. He wouldn't last 5 minutes where I grew up.

I really hope the rumors of him not having died are true... I don't want to think I just watched a snuff film.

>> ^potchi79:
I really hope the rumors of him not having died are true... I don't want to think I just watched a snuff film.


Did you not hear the "death-rattle" ? That was one of the most disturbing things I've ever seen/heard.

You fucking hypocrites.

This is the definition of a snuff film. They filmed the murder of a 'homeless' man (stomping his throat, in addition to other injuries). The whole event was for sport and using someone who wouldn't be missed.

They filmed the blood trail.

It sat underground for decades probably as a snuff film.

How the fuck is this allowed? But you have issues with a car wreck video.
He was dead by the time he hit the back door with that broken trachea.

^ that.

I'm disappointed to see this here.

A sifttalk post would have been sufficient.

"Also, he can not be sued because you can sue only withing a specific period of time after an incident. Which might be 10-15 years." - fjules
There's no statute of limitations on murder (or attempted murder/manslaughter).

^ i actually agree with you (joedirt), that this is basically snuff - but i don't think anyone is a hypocrite - they just want to help the cause of seeing justice served. but to be honest, posting this video here and discussing it isn't doing anything. hundreds of people had already informed their local authorities before this was posted.

i think the importance has over-ridden VS rules.
getting the word out,passing the information along is important.

--

sometimes you have to look horror in the face in order to battle it.

in this case, all we've done is look horror in the face.

apparently he lived and didn't press charges the following day. i hope that is true. that is what the black belt's son is saying on some message board:

http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=88535&page=45

it doesn't change the fact that this is the scariest seen i've seen in a long time, but snuff film is probably not true. attempted snuff film i'd say.

>> ^phelixian:
apparently he lived and didn't press charges the following day. i hope that is true. that is what the black belt's son is saying on some message board:
http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=88535&page=45
it doesn't change the fact that this is the scariest seen i've seen in a long time, but snuff film is probably not true. attempted snuff film i'd say.


Just because his son said so, doesn't make it true.

I've read all the comments but I haven't watched the video.

Can anyone provide a reasonable justification for this being here, outside of satisfying morbid curiosity?

Of course this clown dick bragged about being a Marine. What an asshole.

Sounds like snuff to me. I won't be watching. It's not something I like seeing on the sift.

Is there any evidence that the retard was actually killed? The knee drop to the back of the neck was bad, however he was still moaning and moving around some. If he didn't die this is the biggest non-issue I have ever seen on VS. If he did die why is this not snuff? BS double standard. I have 6 snuff films lined up for sifting now that we have apparently lifted the ban. I feel bad for the Mongoloid, but happy that my reign of snuff shall begin. Let the wanton violence commence.

based on the whizzing sounds it seems like he broke the guy's neck and was suffocating on his own blood.
instead of turning the guy to the side, they dragged him out on his back means that he drowned in his own blood.

THIS IS A MURDER!

No, apparently this is snuff.

Wait... why is it the fat white guy's fault? The guy doing the beating killed him. He clearly lost control and couldn't stop. No one was egging him on, no one told him to stomp on the guy's head.
Sure, no one did shit afterward but don't gimme that nonsense like everyone in the room is a brutal murderer.

>> ^HenningKO:
Wait... why is it the fat white guy's fault? The guy doing the beating killed him. He clearly lost control and couldn't stop. No one was egging him on, no one told him to stomp on the guy's head.
Sure, no one did shit afterward but don't gimme that nonsense like everyone in the room is a brutal murderer.


That "fat white guy" lured him to the dojo, set up the match, let the brutality occur, issued the command to have the body taken out back, filmed the blood trail, then uploaded it to his Youtube account 25 years later. You don't need to pull the trigger to be a murderer. Charles Manson, Hitler, and Judas are so reviled yet who did they kill?

Awesome! The cops are finally involved. Hope the poor guy gets some justice... http://www.kmph.com/global/story.asp?s=10973483

To the sift... regardless of the import of this video. It is a snuff film and should be removed. I'm sorry but there has to be a line drawn in the sand somewhere. Let some other site carry this disturbing monstrosity of a video because it shouldn't be on this one.
Albrite30

>> ^razzyl:
Awesome! The cops are finally involved. Hope the poor guy gets some justice... http://www.kmph.com/global/story.asp?s=10973483


Fuckin A.

I have emailed this police department to encourage some action. Here are the details in case anyone else wants to follow it up and remind them that we do care about people...

Region 11
Carlos Mestas 559/585-4731 559/585-4710 Hanford Police Department
Term 3-11 425 N. Irwin Street
Hanford, CA 93230
Email: cmestas@ci.hanford.ca.us

also... thanks to Nomino for starting this off. It gives me cause for hope when we can show that even in our anonymous offices and bedrooms, we can come together and still care for the needy.

Ok.

Here we go.

Two main guys charged with murder, then the ones who dragged him out, also summarily charged with murder.

The rest who stood there doing nothing? Accomplices to murder, I would say they would be charged with Murder as well. At least conspiracy to commit, or maybe accessory to murder.

Did I mention how utterly stupid this is?

Also:

United States

The U.S. criminal code makes aiding and abetting a federal crime itself a crime[1]:

(a) Whoever aids, abets, counsels, commands, induces or procures the commission of an offense, is punishable as a principal.
(b) Whoever willfully causes an act to be done which if directly performed by him or another would be an offense, is punishable as a principal.

A person may be convicted of aiding and abetting any act made criminal under the code. The elements of aiding and abetting are, generally:

(1) guilty knowledge on the part of the accused ( the mens rea);
(2) the commission of an offense by someone; and
(3) the defendant assisted or participated in the commission of the offense (the actus reus).

4:52

That is murder, right there. No jury in the world wouldn't convict a person for the soulless shit that fail of a HB did right there. If the dudes still breathing, atemped, what ever. That mar the far king piece of sht had won about a minute before that knee kick, and carried on just because his teste rage had to avenge the dude knocking him down earlier. Not a human who is safe to, or deserves to, be part of the general population. I hope he dies alone in a box.

So, you posted a snuff video? Why is most of the sift okay with this? It's insane that we have rules against members posting porn, but not lengthy graphic videos of people being murdered.

Of course I realize nearly all of the people who up-voted don't see it as entertainment, but are outraged by the event. And if this were presented as a news story that would be completely valid.

Still, I think anyone who would want to watch this, knowing it's contents, and knowing damn well that they will never personally do anything to bring about justice, is motivated by some morbid curiosity. And we shouldn't be encouraging that. Really it is disgraceful that it hasn't been removed yet.

>> ^KamikazeCricket:
>> ^nach0s:
Not watching.

Thanks for the annoncement. We don't care


And we don't care that you don't care. So.. there.

Alright, enough is enough. The police are involved in the case now, so we don't have to propagate this anymore. *discuss

This is snuff. We have set precedent earlier. There is no newsworthiness in the embedded video other than as documentation, and we've discarded that before. See http://www.videosift.com/video/Sknyliv-airshow-disaster-Anniversary

This video is being sent to Sift Talk for discussion - discuss requested by gwiz665.

It's not snuff if your avatar has nice tits.

This may be newsworthy, but so are the Al Qaeda beheading videos. If this stays, then we should start sifting other horrible snuff vids, and I certainly don't want to see that... unless the poster's avatar has nice tits, of course.

See, the rule as it stands is ambiguously written, and so we're going to have to have a discussion like this every single time a new video gets posted -- until we get a more definitive ruling on what is and is not acceptable on the sift. I think the rule needs to be rewritten and made much more clear so we don't need to have the exact same debate every couple of weeks.

I agree with blankfist. What happened to this poor guy is newsworthy, but the video itself doesn't have any larger meaning. Unfortunately people get murdered every day, for all sorts of awful reasons. Now that the police are involved, keeping this video here becomes questionable.

I can also see a reason for keeping it: The video itself has shown the power of internet video. However, I don't think that's a good enough reason to keep it, because the power of internet video is already pretty well established. That's just my opinion.

Just to be clear, I still think the death of Neda should stay, because her death has become symbolic of the Iranian struggle for freedom, just as much as the Burning Monk became a symbol of the Vietnam War. Neither deaths are ordinary, if you'll excuse my usage of "ordinary" in this case. History has already judged both deaths as significant in the course of human events. It wasn't me, or you, or any one person here who did that. The world sometimes collectively reacts the same way to events, and especially to images of events, and before you know it, it's in the history books. Like it or not, history works that way sometimes.

Anyway, this poor dude's death, however sad it may be, probably doesn't belong here because it doesn't hold any special historical significance, especially since the police are now involved with the case. Now it has become just another random American homicide, which happened to be caught on video. So if someone's going to tally votes, count me in the "remove" column.

>> ^Payback:
As for the black belt "Marine" who decided to go past winning the "match", there's probably about 3 million other black belts -and more than a couple Marines- out there that want to kick your ass. You have no honour.


I can attest to that.

>> ^griefer_queafer:
Holy shit. This is one of the most chilling things I have ever seen.

I've seen worse in MMA, honestly. If you guys think this is bad...you don't know much about the sick, twisted world you live in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmPI0wnv01g

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3_guys_1_hammer = why we should have the death penalty.

So, apparently, now there is good and bad snuff and videosift allows good snuff.

You downvoters should read into what they did. I would shoot them myself, given the opportunity.
>> ^gwiz665:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3_guys_1_hammer = why we should have the death penalty.


Should I tally votes or just get it over with and discard? I'll give it until tomorrow, then I'll count it up. Someone could bring in dag, if you want, but it's a pretty clear case.

^If you tally the votes now, I think you'll find 67 people in favor of keeping the video, and three for discarding it. Pretty straight forward if you ask me.

^That's just not true. Plenty have posted objections and voted up anyway.

I found these that explicitly through comments were against having this rule
EndAll, MrFisk, joedirt, phoen1x, ReverendTed, Maze, albrite30, entr0py, blankfist, Sarzy, kronosposeidon, gwiz665.
Plus the downvoters, I presume, but I haven't counted them in.

If this is allowed to stay, the snuff rule is as good as null and void - we have discarded other sifts which were no worse than this.

"People will decide by votes" no they won't, that's not the way it works. The rule is there to suspend any voting on something like this.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag.(show it anyway)

I say we keep it - as its exposure on the Internet on sites like this has served a noble purpose.

Way to collect evidence against yourselves, you evil jackasses.

If you want to serve a "noble purpose", replace the embed with this one, an update as of August 22nd...



I hope they catch them.

Allowing it, will open the flood gates as this creates a bad precedent. That's the last I'm gonna say. Do as you will.

I'm just going to *return this, even though I'd rather see it discarded. Not enough people here spoke decisively against it, IMHO, and it's been languishing here in Sift Talk for over 4 days now. It's time in purgatory is over.

Returning this video from Sift Talk - return requested by kronosposeidon.

I had to downvote. I watched this for some reason not expecting to see actual death, and it has made me lose sleep ever since. I would rather this sort of death scene not be played out on the sift, but to each their own. This is just too much in my opinion.

[redacted]

*health

Adding video to channels (Health) - requested by brycewi19.

*promote

Promoting this video back to the front page; last published Thursday, August 20th, 2009 9:12pm PDT - promote requested by MrFisk.

*discuss (Not sure I can do this.)

I'm deeply disturbed that Sifters found this okay to Sift. gwiz665 gave pretty much every good reason in the world why this video does not belong here and Dag's only reply is some nonsense about "the noble use of the Internet." How garnering votes for linking to a video of a man being murdered is noble completely eludes me. Downvote.

My suggestion for rectifying this situation and actually abiding to Video Sifts own rules--replace the embed code for the current video with the one from schmawy's post above. That news video is graphic enough to give people the idea of what happened without showing the killing blow or subsequent "death rattle." It appeases Dag's "noble use of the Internet" standard (since it talks about how the police are investigating the incident) while removing an obvious snuff film from the Sift. Nomino gets to keep all his ill-gotten votes and people who want to get their kicks watching people get beaten to death can easily use the info in this thread to Google the original link for themselves.

This video is being sent to Sift Talk for discussion - discuss requested by SDGundamX.

Now, just to make this clear, I hold no ill will towards nomino for sifting this, even though I don't like the video. *controversy

Adding video to channels (Controversy) - requested by gwiz665.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag.(show it anyway)

I've said all I have to say on this one- it was languishing in obscurity- but let's gnash teeth and tear hair some more.

>> ^dag:

I've said all I have to say on this one- it was languishing in obscurity- but let's gnash teeth and tear hair some more.



First off, if I sounded snarky in my first post I apologize.

Now, in all fairness Dag, it just got promoted to the front page, so it is not obscure anymore. And I'd say this is worth gnashing teeth over since it goes to the very core of what we allow on the Sift. Either the Sift has rules or it doesn't. From the Video Sift FAQ:

#3 Please do not post pornography or "snuff" films (which we define as the explicit depiction of loss of human life displayed for entertainment).

Note: The presence of human fatality is acceptable and not considered "snuff" if presented as a limited portion of a lengthy educational, informative news report or documentary. Our definition of "snuff" does include but is not exclusive to any short clip in which a human fatality occurs whether or not any victims are actually visible on camera.(emphasis added)

The currently embedded video falls squarely in the snuff category as defined by the FAQ. The alternative of embedding the news clip about the murder in its place follows Sift guidelines for allowing videos of human fatalities (on or off-camera) in the event they are a "limited portion of a... news report." It also has the other benefits I mentioned in my original call for discussion post. All someone needs to do is change the embed link.

Now, if people think there is a valid reason why we should make an exception to the rules for this video I'd like to hear it. Some reasons have already been offered in this thread. Here are some of the reasons offered for why an exception should be made and the counter-arguments to them.

1. Lots of people voted for it.

If someone posted a porn vid, I'm sure lots of sexually-frustrated male (maybe even some female?) Sifters would vote it up too... but it would still be against the rules. If sifting vids is simply going to be a matter of popularity then there need not be any rules about posting videos anymore. While the upvoting may be good-intentioned, entr0py says it even better than I can:

>> ^entr0py:

So, you posted a snuff video? Why is most of the sift okay with this? It's insane that we have rules against members posting porn, but not lengthy graphic videos of people being murdered.
Of course I realize nearly all of the people who up-voted don't see it as entertainment, but are outraged by the event. And if this were presented as a news story that would be completely valid.
Still, I think anyone who would want to watch this, knowing it's contents, and knowing damn well that they will never personally do anything to bring about justice, is motivated by some morbid curiosity. And we shouldn't be encouraging that. Really it is disgraceful that it hasn't been removed yet.



2. It's newsworthy.

blankfist gave the best counter-argument against this, so I'll just quote him.

>> ^blankfist:

This may be newsworthy, but so are the Al Qaeda beheading videos. If this stays, then we should start sifting other horrible snuff vids, and I certainly don't want to see that... unless the poster's avatar has nice tits, of course.


3. It was languishing in obscurity.

So, even though several good reasons for discarding this video were given, because no one got around to doing it the video it must now remain on the Sift forever? In spite of the fact that it breaks the rules? In spite of the fact that it--at this very moment--is in the spotlight and hence not obscure? If that's the case, then if people "sneak" a porn vid or other snuff film in and not enough people make a fuss over it, the vid should get to stay. Shall we set a time period? Three days? Four days? If a vid hasn't been discarded in that period of time it gets a permanent repreive? That doesn't seem right to me.

Let's not let this fall into obscurity again. Let's have some ethical standards. Let's follow the rules we set out for ourselves.

Let's not allow videos of humans being murdered on the Sift, regardless of the original poster's good intentions (or otherwise).

To reiterate my position, I'm asking that we change the embed to a news story of the murder rather than the actual video of the murder. It'll take someone all of 30 seconds to do, but those 30 seconds will help ensure the future integrity of the Sift.

I've made my case. I'll leave it up to the other Sifters to decide how to proceed. I will ask this time, however, that we don't return this to the Sift until a decision is made one way or the other. Either it is snuff or it isn't. If it is snuff, then either an exception is being made or it isn't. Let's tie it up all neat and clean this time shall we?

snuff snuff snuff snuff

Yeah, for once I actually agree w/ @joedirt. This is horrible horrible snuff. Clearly and definitively. It needs to be discarded. If you want to create awareness for something like this, then post it in Sift Talk. Don't be using death to garner votes. Also, wtf is w/ the channel tags??? Health? Actionpack? Terrible? Please read the channel descriptions. *nochannel *wtf *dark *fear *controversy

edit: dammit, I can't edit tags while the vid is in discussion. @nomino, where are you?

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag.(show it anyway)

Well it's definitely no longer news - I always thought it was tragic, but not as graphic as I had expected. I'm swayed though that this is no longer news and little to show us except a brute killing someone. *discard.

Discarding this post - discard requested by member dag.