*promote

Promoting this video and sending it back into the queue for one more try; last queued Friday, June 27th, 2014 12:52pm PDT - promote requested by eric3579.

Good friend of mine screams like a girl whenever HE sees a huge spider.

I'm not being insulting, just accurate.

Actually, female anatomy actually forces women to throw differently from men. the joints don't move the same and force a more awkward motion. So, "throwing like a girl/woman" is simply an accurate expression.

I was with the premise until "always" came onto the screen. We have some serious gender issues and how we treat women is appalling. How we treat corporations is even more appalling to me, and it's destroying our society putting them above humans.

Source, or GTFO

Simply an accurate expression. Yeah, right.

"Say, I was watching your throwing motion, noticed that you throw in a manner similar to that of a girl. Just sayin.'"

Washington Post good enough for you?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/throw-like-a-girl-with-some-practice-you-can-do-better/2012/09/10/9ffc8bc8-dc09-11e1-9974-5c975a
e4810f_print.html

*promote

Promoting this video back to the front page; last published Friday, June 27th, 2014 12:52pm PDT - promote requested by JiggaJonson.

Washington Post is fine as a source, although it's better to review the actual scientific literature instead of a journalist's write-up of it. Even more important than that is to read the article accurately and comprehend what it is telling you.

To wit, "There doesn’t appear to be a muscular or structural reason for the difference."

You said there is a biological reason for the throwing motion of a girl which is just flat out wrong. Yes, because of size and strength differences, women will only throw about 75% of the speed and distance when compared to men, but that has nothing to do with their joints. "Throwing like a girl" is used as a description of the throwing motion, not the results of the throw. This technique can be taught and practiced.

As the scientist in the Washington Post piece says, "The more we argue for gender differences, the more we feed people’s stereotypes. A belief in large gender differences is incompatible with equal opportunity."

*viral, *commercial

Adding video to channels (Viral) - requested by Zawash.

Although I do think that women's rights still have a bit of a long way to go, this particular video is kinda bullshitty...

They refer to physical activities ("run like a girl", "throw like a girl", "fight like a girl", etc), and also about the moment when those expressions change meaning.

It usually changes meaning when boys develop during puberty, and become faster and stronger than girls. It is an insult, but it's not exactly a lie... women, are for the most part, slower and weaker physically speaking.

"Why can't run like a girl also mean win the race?". It can, if you're running against other girls, but the fastest girl would not be able to run faster than the fastest boy. Period. It's not a matter of equality or justice. It's a matter of biology. There is a reason why there are gender based competitions. Because it wouldn't be fair to put female athletes against male athletes (in most sports. there are a couple of exceptions obviously). That's also the reason why women's sports are usually not as relevant.

Women's rights activists need to focus more on social issues and less on biology. Unless they're thinking about tampering with genetics, men and women will always have differences, and there's little that can be done about that.

I agree with what you're saying, but i think you're saying it very matter of factly which might put some people off. But talking objectively about the average capacity of human beings, males are physically stronger and that's simply down to what our bodies were adapted for during the evolution of our species. It's the same for other species (though not necessarily male/female as us).

This video probably has a good point, but they way they perform and/or present the experiment makes it worthless.

Any person stood in front of thousands of pounds worth of camera equipment, on a stage, is going to throw differently to how they normally throw when asked to throw "like" someone they are not; the person will perform for the cameras. Then the director emphasises the word "girl" in the way i think she does in the first instance and the person thinks "oh, this person means badly, delicately" and does as requested. We do not get to hear the tone of voice she uses for all of the different people as the video is heavily edited and cut - the cynic in me says for good reason.

But a young girl stands intimidated in front of all of the cameras feeling absolutely no obligation to perform out of character, being told "don't worry, we're just going to ask you to do a few things for the camera", is asked to "run like a girl" with no emphasis, the kid thinks "well i'm a girl, i run like this." There is a natural bias to the results because of this. I may as well ask a bunch of people to bark like a dog, then get a dog to bark; you are asking someone to do something unnatural to themselves, and so you can expect them to overact to try and fit the bill, they will do a charade.

"Run like a girl" and "throw like a girl" are very commonly used phrases in english that i've only heard used sarcastically. So i have a further question; how many young girls are familiar with those phrases compared to how many young boys/adults are familiar with those phrases? Because i think that those phrases are used less to and around young girls than they are to young boys. So again the way the question is asked adds a bias to the results; the girl might not have registered the phrase where the boy knew it had an implied meaning. In fact, the clip of him later confirms that he didn't even associate the "girl" he was pretending to be with his sister. In other words she probably doesn't throw like that and he knows it, he was just play acting to her request.

Not my intention.

Fuck all, that is a shit load of mansplaining that happened in the last two long posts. Holy hell on a handstick.

Next time the topic of "mansplaining" comes up elsewhere, and folks need an example, the last two comments are the gold standard.

I know that this comment will offend those two posters, and those who think like they do. I'm not going to argue back and forth about it though, because I have learned that is a waste of time. If I thought I could move things, I would engage. I'm older and wiser now.

Besides, I'm offended, too, so we're even.

[edit]
Actually, what I really am is sad. Sad at the cluelessness. The depth of the cluelessness. I started out offended, and wrote the above. But the more I think on it, I'm just sad at the complete lack of understanding. Sad at their need to argue. Sad at the lack of emotional empathy.

And happy at the growing number of people who "get it."

There is hope for the future.

This promote coming from a teacher who has observed boys and girls for years means a lot to me.

Thank you.

Oh... so everything is black and white then?

Nice. Great point. You win the internet. Bravo.

Please explain why what I said is wrong so I may better myself. I'm not being sarcastic.

@EMPIRE....

Really? You really want to know? You aren't going to argue with me when I tell you?

I'll take the time if you promise not to argue. If you really listen and go "huh, I didn't think about it that way."

Let me know.

I can't promise not to argue, that's a completely unreasonable request. That's like saying "You'll stay there while I talk AT you, and you will nod and eat it even if you disagree".

What I promise is that I will listen your points and consider, and think about them.

And by the way, the message of the video is not bad, is just the way they chose to approach it.
I actually watched a commercial on facebook today that says a lot more about women empowerment than this video you sifted. At least I like it a lot better and makes a whole lot more sense to me:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP3cyRRAfX0

For the record, @EMPIRE and I had a grand time in the lounge talking. Yippee for us!

True, I won. (just kidding. I conceded )

Also, Videosift should have this automatic feature:

If two people quote each other more than twice in the comments of a video, a red button should appear to take them both automatically to the lounge to have a proper discussion.

What I got out of the video is that 'like a girl' is most often derogatory and that it starts to impact women through their (for lack of a better term or for lack of knowing better) formative years. It can then be a self-fulfilling prophesy and make them feel lesser. All of this is not good and we should try not to use these terms.

However much the video is contrived to make an impact is unimportant. This concept does exist and is well known. I know I've used the term to describe a man that ran 'funny' and I know it was a shitty thing to do. Probably making me feel better in the moment.

I think that as we grow up, we do a lot of shitty things because we don't know better. As I grow older, I want to become better and understand things more. Now into my 40's, I still think I have room for improvement. And when it comes down to it, does it really matter if girls, in general, can't run as fast as guys? I think it matters more that if you want to run fast, you try and do the best you can and you don't even have to have the goal of being faster if you simply enjoy running. There is always going to be someone faster than you unless you are the fastest man or the fastest woman.

Anyway, what's your take on my comments as far as mansplaining goes?

You are going to have to work harder on the mansplaining -- I didn't see any. Your post is just intelligent, educated and observant conversation, a very different thing.

I really did have a great conversation with Empire in the lounge. Very respectful (although he did end up with a headache, poor guy.) At one point, he was explaining his response to the video and said, "I really don't think it's an insult to women" in reference to the phrase "run like a girl."

I instantly realized that could be the official motto of Mansplaining. "I really don't think it's an insult to women." Here I am, a woman, saying it is insulting and he is telling me I shouldn't be insulted.

Huh? There are reams of research showing the harmful effects of this kind of language and denigration.

....OH MY!!!!

I just realized you were Mansplaining. Except it is more Mansplaining-to-Mansplainers. From your intelligent, educated and observant place.

(And yes, I agreed with Empire that "mansplaining" is an insulting term. However, it is very useful shorthand for complex phenomena. I'd love to use a different term that is just as short that covers something so pervasive and complicated. There is a reason that term exploded in usage -- it was needed.)

In other words, I LOVE YOUR POST. Thank you.

Is there somehow i can see the discussion between bb2 and empire? Or is it a feature of the Lounge that it's gone now?

If you go there now I think it shows the last few hours of conversation... so the whole discussion should be there.

@bareboards2 I am utterly stupefied by your ability to dismiss my argument whilst at the same time not addressing any single part of it. Without so much as questioning my reasoning, you've labelled me, stuck me in a box and judged me, calling on others to hear of your sadness at.....what? Detailed, thoughtful and politely delivered criticism?

The worst thing here is that if i were to suggest that your reply, or the content of this video, was "femscaping" or something similarly derogatory then you would have lynched me up on the nearest tree for sexism - the thing you want to stop. Yet when you dismiss a comment i make as something equally sexist and based entirely on my gender (because you sure as shit never once mentioned any part of my argument), that's absolutely fine.

Is it really beneficial to your cause to attempt to censor people who question the content of the message; label them, dismiss them and profess your sadness for the human tragedy of ignorance like a scientologist? A good conclusion with good evidence would not need your protection from my scrutiny.

If you think i'm on some sort of misogynist bandwagon, then you're dead wrong about me. I've criticised a couple of videos recently because i considered them to be supplying dodgy data or trickery. Whenever a video wants to make evidence based claims, i reserve the right to question their methodology and that is fundamental to any kind of evidence. The topic is entirely coincidental.

If you have a problem with my argument then by all means i welcome your criticism, but criticise the argument rather than calling me sexist names. What you did to me is no different to if i had simply commented "militant-feminist bullshit" without addressing any of the video, at which point you would have highlighted your plight and appealed to sympathy. But no, i offered a thorough explanation of my feelings, and i'm still the horrible mansplainer. No - i'm analytical, and i make no apologies for the damage that does to your cause.

Of all the people who offered detailed criticism of this video, one of them sided with you and the other didn't. Guess which one you engaged in discussion? I even offered you examples and reasoning, but no, i get just sexism.

Ah, feminism... belief that both sexes may become equal by focusing only on the faults of one of them. At least the response pattern remains the same - even an amicable agree to disagree outcome is accompanied by denigration like 'mansplaining'. And the feminists wonder why it's so hard to make progress.

Empire and I got to the other side of this with a respectful conversation in the lounge.

Empire was honestly interested in why I was upset, and wanted to understand why. That seemed like a worthwhile investment my time.

If you just want to debate the video, I'm not interested. You have a right to your opinion about the video. I don't agree with it, and more importantly to me, I'm not interested in arguing about why I don't agree with it.

And I have a right to my opinion: that your critique of the vid is an example of "mansplaining." Chastise me to your hearts content. You have your opinion. I have mine. I chastised you. You chastised me. We're even, as far as I'm concerned.

As I said above in my response to Fairbs, which perhaps you didn't get a chance to read -- I do apologize for the use of the word "mansplaining." I wish there was a shorthand word that was more respectful that communicates complex and pervasive phenomena.

Anyway. If you want to understand why I was upset, I'll gladly try to explain.

If you want to debate about the video, and try to prove to me that your opinion about the video is correct, I'm not interested. I'd rather read my new Funny Times.

Private message me if you want to meet in the lounge. I promise you a respectful conversation.

Heard this for years, too.

You are absolutely correct. The response pattern indeed doesn't change. By either side.

Sauce for the goose, sauce for the gander, my friend.

Wanna change the pattern? I'd love it.

You have any ideas how to accomplish that? I'm game!

Highly related:
http://videosift.com/video/The-Throw-Like-a-Girl-Myth-MythBusters

*related=http://videosift.com/video/The-Throw-Like-a-Girl-Myth-MythBusters

Great find. Thanks.

The "Throw Like a Girl" Myth | MythBusters has been added as a related post - related requested by bareboards2.

My 2 cents -- I think "throws like a girl" refers more to the *form*, not the 10% or 20% or whatever speed/distance disparity between men/women when throwing.

And form can be learned, as shown by the mythbusters clip above.
The point is, we socialize young men to learn correct throwing form whereas we discourage young women to learn correct throwing form. Once that correct throwing form is learned, is there still a 10%, 20%, or 30% difference in speed/distance performance between men/women? Sure, just like there is with most athletic feats. But again, that (relatively small in the scheme of things) disparity is not what "throws like a girl" is referring to.

One more thing:
"You swim like a girl" -- said no one, ever.

And yet, elite male swimmers still swim a good bit faster than female ones.

Hmm..

Anyone who thinks the phrase "Throw like a girl" is an insult to girls has entirely missed the point.

Take a look at professional male versus female ballet dancers. The biological differences are quite plain to see. Generally speaking women move in a more graceful manner than men (it's one of the many reasons why we are attracted to women). These biological differences in movement, thought, behaviour, strength etc are what sets us apart. It's a plus that they're made that way.

Saying "You throw like a girl" is not an insult to women. The meaning isn't "You're inferior, like women". The phrase is an insult to a fellow male, quite simply saying "you're not as strong or masculine" as I am. It's the same as saying to a guy, "you dance like a girl". We love the way girls dance, but to say that to a fellow guy is an insult to them, not to women. As childish as it may seem, that's what we do. We compete with one another on that superficial level. It's a simple yet important difference in understanding what the intention of the phrase is.

qf75... you didn't read all the comments did you?

I did indeed.

You know, research has shown that men and women have more similarities than differences. There is a continuum, of course, but we are all in it together.

So. Since we have many similarities, let me say this.

If you insult a male, you insult a female.

As a woman, I am telling you that women hear the insult. The folks who put together this video hear the insult. The Mythbusters hear the insult.

Or would you like to tell me how my personal experience over 60 years is incorrect? Would you like to explain that to me?

Do I have a womb? No. Do I have the innate ability to provide the female care that a mother is able to when nursing a child? No. We are different. Accept it and enjoy the differences. You're not inferior and in that sense you're right. We're the same.

As a reformed "mansplainer" I too can hear the insult

Whoa there Doctor, sorry we took you away from your very important patients.

One day i'll reed all this text.

Boosting this quality contribution up in the Hot Listing - declared quality by lurgee.

"Mansplaining" may just be the dumbest term I've ever heard. And if you realize that it's dumb and even "apologize" for it, why continue to use it? It's inherently sexist, something you claim to be against. If you aren't interested in debate, that's fine. But when you just dismiss people's opinions as "mansplaining," are you really surprised when they respond defensively?

Personally, I hate it when people refuse to explain their opinions. It usually means they don't want to hear anything that might undermine their beliefs or force them to question their own reasoning.

I don't say it is dumb. I apologize for the insulting nature of it, and will gladly use another term if you can find one.

You say you want a debate. Let's go to the lounge and talk about this. Mansplaining. What it is. Why I was upset. How it is pervasive. What other term we can all use to describe the phenomena.

I am NOT interested in debating this video. I have been on this site since almost the very beginning (this is my second account). I have learned not to get into "debates" on certain subjects here. They go nowhere and solve nothing.

I can't go to the lounge right now -- it is way past my bedtime. Tell me when you are available, and I'll meet you there.

You are very eager for me to question my reasoning. Are you ready to question your reasoning?

We can go to the lounge (later) and have a respectable conversation and try to get through this.

I'm willing. Are you?

You all throw like filthy humans.

All this talk of insults and inhibiting social growth. The video asks when did "like a girl" become an insult? How long have human men been competing with each other? There's your answer.

Not all cultures denigrate women's ability to do things. @radx told me that in Germany, this whole thing is a non-issue, since women are perceived as being strong.

So it depends on the culture, yeah? Yes, maybe men have always insulted each other ( that is an assumption, unless you have prehistoric records -- ha!) during competition by calling them weak.

Not all cultures call men weak by saying that they are like girls.

So we are back to this insults girls and can inhibit their social growth.

Because not only are you calling men weak, you are calling girls weak.

Does that make sense?

I'm not arguing whether its an insult or not. It is obviously. That's why I just call weak people weak. Usually there's a girl there saying the same thing. I hadn't even heard the "like a girl" insult in years. I thought it had seen its time and passed.

Wow. The word count. Love the kids in the video. More power to the girls. Shoot (figuratively) whoever came up with the idea. The video actually proves the idiom is universally known and understood and then implies it insults, puts down girls.

This has nothing to do with girls, girls who can run and throw (like a man :-) or girls who can´t.

Throwing like a girl is only worth mentioning if its a man doing it, so it can only ever properly insult a man. And it absolutely works.

Theoretically one girl who can throw could also effectively insult another girl who can throw, if she so desired.

Dont feed the political correctness troll.

Lets find a video with some men in it that throw like girls and have a good laugh. Please dont tell me thats wrong because they might be insulted.

Whoa whoa you might upset the entitled old people in here who think their opinions matter, watch yourself.

All in favor to rebrand "throwing like a girl" to "throwing like 50 cent" say aye

The term is insulting, but I think it should be. I would say it draws attention to a behavior that could just be innocent or non-intentional or it could be that the person is a real condescending a-hat that needs to be called out and deserves ridicule.

The term popped up on my radar not that long ago. It's interesting understanding the nuances better so thanks!