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God damnit Chug.

vil says...

Steak is definitely optional. I choose steak.

Killing only stops if there are no cows. If there are living cows they will die one day. In the wild pretty quickly if you apply your morals to wolves also.

A cow has no abstract concept of the fear of being eaten (only a general fear and instincts) so unless you purposefully go out of your way to hurt it there is nothing philosophically wrong with eating one, unless you get all emotional and make a complicated moral choice. Which is your choice to make.

Cavemen is a pretty wide term. I am probably smarter than most cavemen. But from the time they got organized and hunted large animals until now man has not really changed much - a couple of tens of thousands of years. We probably tend to remember less and be more depressed and weaker and use our senses less well. Can type faster though.

HerbWatson said:

These little cute cows are left overs from the dairy industry, so we don't need to kill these ones for steak.

If we buy dairy alternatives, then the killing of these young cows stops.

Anyway, give yourself some credit, you're definitely smarter than a caveman :-)

Naomi Klein in conversation with Katharine Viner

vil says...

Totally lost it at "indigenous communities gave generational expertise to help guide the way". Pretty pictures and words in the intro. A lot of emotional balast all over the place. On purpose apparently.

Made it to 35 minutes in.
Probably should read the books first before coming to conclusions.
Wait, is that how that works?

The whole fire metaphor - pretty much how totalitarian regimes come about. Lets NOT get excited and use our brains instead. The problem of politics seems to be that if you do that no one ever notices you.

The problem of this "emotions first" approach is no actual discussion is possible if everyone is hysterical.

God damnit Chug.

vil says...

People will eat other people if they have nothing else to eat. Social eating rules are mostly that, a social construct, born of too many options. If a group of people or an influential individual decide bananas have feelings, so be it. The whole eggs are good, eggs are bad debate.

Read the bible for instance, like a quarter of it deals with social constructs that make no sense today, including rules about food. Pick and choose.

Just because of this fancy belief steaks have gotten no less tasty or nourishing. You have to kill a cow to get steak, no way around it. If this one is too cute, find another cow.

People are basically the same since hunting mammoths was a thing. Bread is OK. Meat is good.

I realllllly dont feel like working today TBH.

Capitalism Didn’t Make the iPhone, You iMbecile

vil says...

1) no, trading is not capitalism.
2) kids in China did not - that is borderline silly. Creating and marketing the iphone created a DEMAND, the MARKET had been in place already (the US constitution, the fed, the dollar, cellular infrastructure, people free to buy things of their own will, the internet et cetera et cetera et cetera ad nauseam - takes a lot of preconceptions to be able to sell such a product)
3) basically yes.
4) I am sure we agree on a lot of things, this is one.
5) I understand government=socialism. The government of the US of A funds a lot of things that would be hard to justify as socialism. Maybe an argument can be made that basic research is a social investment IDK.

Basic research does not equal fast progress though. You can be as clever as Archimedes or Leonardo but steam trains require capitalism to make sense. Iphones required masses of rich crazy americans to take off - a market and demand. Without a market and demand (or a war) progress is slow as f***.

newtboy said:

1) Capitalism has been a thing since before writing was a thing.

2) kids in China made the Iphones, which created a smart phone market.

3) do you believe capitalism and the industrial revolution started at the same time.

4) Capitalism says your poor neighbors should die.

5) The government paid ...socialism, progress.

Capitalism Didn’t Make the iPhone, You iMbecile

vil says...

1) Definitely - but without a market improvements fall flat and dont stick. Ancient people had a lot of good ideas but overall progress was really slow and retrograded often until.. well until capitalism became a thing. Abolishing serfdom, general civil rights, separation of church from state and the fall of absolutism made the Iphone possible.

2) No, that is my point. People "discover" things all the time, some of these things are deemed useful by the general public and capitalism provides the tools to finance production and distribution (the profit part is optional - it is entirely legal to sell your invention for any price or indeed give it away for free).

So to get to the original point capitalism did not discover or design the Iphone but it certainly MADE the Iphone.

3) Not impossible but incredibly slow. Generations lived out their entire lives without perceptible changes in their environments prior to the onslaught of capitalism and the industrial revolution. The advent of science from the renaissance onwards was OK, but only once factories and transport infrastructure became a thing did living conditions start to change for everyone.

A big problem with free markets is that they are never really "free". A theoretical free market implies too many things that dont ever happen in real life, like everyone having all relevant information and being able to make a good decision. People just dont do that IRL.

Also not everything can be solved by free markets because you cant just let your neighbors die poor because the market says they deserve it. However the Iphone is really not something the state should subsidize. I understand that it paid for some of the technology that went into designing it. But true socialism would have to make sure everyone could afford one, and would design a cheap bad phone to fit the need.

newtboy said:

1) There are many incentives not based on profit too, as you mentioned. I don't think it's an either/or equation.

2) Didn't iPhones basically create the smartphone market?

3) The implication is that without capitalism, science and progress are impossible.

Capitalism Didn’t Make the iPhone, You iMbecile

vil says...

But it (the internet) took off based on the possibility of profit. Got stolen from the nerds.

Of course basic research needs public funding. No direct profit - no market value. Some capitalists (entrepreneurs, people who invest their private property) look beyond direct profit and fund science, or arts, people are whimsical.

Iphones need a market. Without a market who would care if someone invented the Iphone?

newtboy said:

The first retail internet transaction wasn't until 94.

The Plant Ecology of Concrete, Garbage and Urine - Botanizin

vil says...

gorilla gardening - thats how I imagine the humble beginnings of the human race. Yes I do mean the last common ancestor.

Capitalism Didn’t Make the iPhone, You iMbecile

vil says...

There was no ground movement to develop the internet that was somehow community or government funded and that ultimately made it popular and useful.

In reality there was a 60s military communications project that got traction (after decades of basically spare-time tinkering development by weird individuals funded by socialism) when capitalism made home computers possible. Then it skyrocketed because profits could be made.

Socialism was an expensive land telephone line. Capitalism is five different ways I could get connected tomorrow at speed if I decide today. I just realized I stopped thinking about how fast my internet connection is years ago.

Capitalism Didn’t Make the iPhone, You iMbecile

vil says...

Capitalism (or the slow demise of feudalism, serfdom, slavery, bigotry and the middle ages in general) made science and progress possible.

It is a common misconception that rights and freedoms are useful in their own right. Its really up to individual people what they do with what they get.

Socialism is a step back because it tries to tell you what you should and should not do, thus limiting your freedoms and possible progress. There should always only be as much socialism as is morally acceptable.

Croatian firefighters on call seconds before winning penalty

vil says...

*croatia

Literally one russian in the entire video - the goalkeeper on TV.

Demonstrating Quantum Supremacy

vil says...

Ive now been slightly obsessively reading and discussing quantum computers with friends (including a couple clever and informed ones) for two weeks and the theoretical possibility of one day feeding the traveling salesman to a QC is about the biggest real excitement that awaits us in the medium term (decades). Hence my Sim City comment. Seriously there is very little information and a lot of exaggeration in this video. I know great things are expected from QC I just dont believe 98% of whats in the vid has anything to do with anything.

moonsammy said:

... The traveling salesman problem...

Quantum Supremacy & AI, with Stephen Fry.

Demonstrating Quantum Supremacy

Republicans Can’t Defend Trump’s Corrupt Abuses of Power

Demonstrating Quantum Supremacy



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