yay Amerika. Glad I don't live there.

You know, when Jimmy Carr can't think of a joke to make, you've gone -way- too far.

I'd never realized how much stuff was being made by prison labor...that's quite a racket someone's running, isn't it?

Isn't it amazing - the Right is always banging on about protecting freedom, and yet America is locking up more per capita than anyone else.

Look. If you're American, and don't approve of the methods of the military industrial complex securing a dependable workforce... Say so now.

And a squad car will be on it's way to pick you up and find drugs in your house shortly.

Holy shit, those numbers are insane. And comparing it to slave labour sounds awfully apt... for shame.

one statistic that was not mentioned was that 70% of american prisons are private corporations.consider that almost 80% of the prison population consists of non-violent offenders,many of them weed related,we are not going to see marijuana legalized anytime soon.the private prison system has quietly become the 9th largest lobbyist in washington.legalizing pot would see many empty cells in the future,good for the citizenry BAD for the business of running a prison whose income is based on filling those cells.
land of the free...right?

I'd very much like to say something hilarious but something must be done.
It's slavery by the back door!

The blind lady of American justice has soiled knickers. The smell isn't enough for some people; they have to see it or experience it for themselves.

It is true that we send too many people to jail for way too long. We need to let the non-violent offenders go sooner. We send drug dealer and drug users to jail for long sentences. And then we let them go. After 10 years in jail for possetion of pot, what can they look forward to? Selling more pot and going to jail again.

Well, instead of feeling sorry for these prisoners. Lets find out about these "Forced Labor Camp"
Has anyone actually spoken to these prisoners and gotten their views about this? No? Then lets not sit here and feeling sorry for them.

Forced labor? more like "Here are some job skills you can learn, maybe kill 8 hours of your life that you are going to lose anyway. Make the best of it instead of being forced to sit in your jail cell or walking around in a yard."

Or maybe "Hey, want to help America? Produce some much needed equipment for American soldiers. Make yourself feel good about yourself."

I'm pretty sure they are treated much better than some third world sweatshop child laborer.
Lets not lose any sympathy for the prisoners. Save them for the kids who have really no choice in real world.

To be fair, these are criminals. Maybe too many get locked up for relatively minor offences, and the 3 strikes and out rule is pretty insane, but mostly they are in there because they broke the law. America has the crime rate to back up the number of people in jail, and thats a sympton of millions living in poverty. I think its appalling how many people are in jail over there, but I think the blame has to be with policies that made them so fucking poor.

On the slave labour thing...meh, I think they are paying their rent. The state is feeding them. Don't think anybody should be making a profit out of it but I think it makes sense for the prisoners to at least be a productive prisoner.

^ You haven't looked at this very closely, have you?

United States prisons operate like labor camps, according to an article by a professor of journalism from California State University. Operating like the labor camps of communist China, prisons in at least two states, California and Oregon, are doing "exactly what the U.S. has been lambasting China for"....
(source)

>> ^Stormsinger:
You know, when Jimmy Carr can't think of a joke to make, you've gone -way- too far.
I'd never realized how much stuff was being made by prison labor...that's quite a racket someone's running, isn't it?


They obviously don't manufacture THAT much in prison because I can't remember the last time I bought anything labeled as "Made in America."

There's just nothing to say, but there's a lot we can do.

This is why I get passionate about the marijuana legalization. When you see these stupid policies being exploited for economic gain it goes from being deeply misguided to an evil system. Non-violent offenders being used for cheap labor seems like something history is going to view very harshly.

Moral laws makes slaves of the people who practice taboo freedoms...social laws makes slaves of us all.

>> ^ipfreely:
Well, instead of feeling sorry for these prisoners. Lets find out about these "Forced Labor Camp"
Has anyone actually spoken to these prisoners and gotten their views about this? No? Then lets not sit here and feeling sorry for them.
Forced labor? more like "Here are some job skills you can learn, maybe kill 8 hours of your life that you are going to lose anyway. Make the best of it instead of being forced to sit in your jail cell or walking around in a yard."
Or maybe "Hey, want to help America? Produce some much needed equipment for American soldiers. Make yourself feel good about yourself."
I'm pretty sure they are treated much better than some third world sweatshop child laborer.
Lets not lose any sympathy for the prisoners. Save them for the kids who have really no choice in real world.


I wonder why this comment recieved 3 downvotes. Honestly think whilst you read my post, don't simply react and go "SLAVERY BAAAAAD".

We are, after all, talking about people who we take out of society and lock in a cage. If we lock a human in a cage and deny them their freedom if not their life, why are we suddenly so indignant when we are getting work out of them? Is the work bit so bad compared to the cage bit?

Imprisoning someone, locking them in a cage, taking away their life and freedom - YAYYY, GOOD!
Forcing someone to work in reasonable conditions with shitty pay - NOOOO, TERRIBLE!

Just food for thought, guys. Obviously we need prisons to stop people hurting others, but after i stopped for a minute and thought about it, it just made me wonder:
a) why we all feel so indignant about the 'slavery' over the 'bondage'
b) why we lock people up for carrying or using drugs - surely we should lock them up IF we catch them in the act of stealing/harming others to feed their drug habit or tossing away dangerous needles/chemicals unsafely, but other than this, why do we need to lock these people in a cage? They only hurt themselves.

...well, ok they may 'hurt' their relatives too, but so do smokers, drinkers, gamblers and over-eaters.

they also left out the statistic that 80% of people released from prison, find themselves back in prison within a year, because NOONE will hire them. they can't work, so back to crime.

a really good friend of mine just got out last year after doing way too much time for petty drug possession. hes a nice guy and a smart guy and has some skills, hes a not a thief or a sex predator or crazy, he was just a kid who experimented with drugs and got caught. but noone will hire an excon. so he grows and sells pot now while he keeps looking for a job.

you heard the statistic, the us prison system was designed to house the black and brown male.

Home of the Free, indeed.

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Sadly this is nowhere on any American politicians radar. In fact, this video is the longest I've ever seen it discussed on network television.

>> ^dannym3141:
>> ^ipfreely:
Well, instead of feeling sorry for these prisoners. Lets find out about these "Forced Labor Camp"
Has anyone actually spoken to these prisoners and gotten their views about this? No? Then lets not sit here and feeling sorry for them.
Forced labor? more like "Here are some job skills you can learn, maybe kill 8 hours of your life that you are going to lose anyway. Make the best of it instead of being forced to sit in your jail cell or walking around in a yard."
Or maybe "Hey, want to help America? Produce some much needed equipment for American soldiers. Make yourself feel good about yourself."
I'm pretty sure they are treated much better than some third world sweatshop child laborer.
Lets not lose any sympathy for the prisoners. Save them for the kids who have really no choice in real world.

I wonder why this comment recieved 3 downvotes. Honestly think whilst you read my post, don't simply react and go "SLAVERY BAAAAAD".
We are, after all, talking about people who we take out of society and lock in a cage. If we lock a human in a cage and deny them their freedom if not their life, why are we suddenly so indignant when we are getting work out of them? Is the work bit so bad compared to the cage bit?
Imprisoning someone, locking them in a cage, taking away their life and freedom - YAYYY, GOOD!
Forcing someone to work in reasonable conditions with shitty pay - NOOOO, TERRIBLE!
Just food for thought, guys. Obviously we need prisons to stop people hurting others, but after i stopped for a minute and thought about it, it just made me wonder:
a) why we all feel so indignant about the 'slavery' over the 'bondage'
b) why we lock people up for carrying or using drugs - surely we should lock them up IF we catch them in the act of stealing/harming others to feed their drug habit or tossing away dangerous needles/chemicals unsafely, but other than this, why do we need to lock these people in a cage? They only hurt themselves.
...well, ok they may 'hurt' their relatives too, but so do smokers, drinkers, gamblers and over-eaters.


your argument would be pertinent and concise if we didnt consider a few facts:
1.the prison system is no longer about rehabilitation or punishment but much more to do with corporate business and politics.
2.labor camps would not be an issue if A.the labor was voluntary B.defense contractors and corporations didnt profit from this labor and C.they were actually being taught skills which could translate to a job with livable wages (there are a few prisons which offer this but they are a minority and have limited openings and availability).

one more point i would like to make concerning your argument.
you create a false premise by making it out to seem that others only have a problem with the forced labor issue but not with the actual incarceration.
this is patently false.nobody is saying that violent criminals,thieves or drug dealers should not be punished and removed from society.what we ARE saying is that non-violent offenders,petty thieves and pot smokers should not be spending years in a penitentiary and then,as an example, being forced to labor for the profit of a giant defense contractor,who reaps huge profits.

let me conclude with a few things to think about:
we find ourselves in a dilemma.on the one hand america is incarcerating more people than the rest of the world combined and the majority for non-violent offenses.
on the other hand we have created a HUGE prison industry which employs millions of people to keep it running.sometimes whole townships entire economy is based on a single federal prison.
so what do we do?
if we legalize weed and change it from a type A narcotic to a mush lesser class we would effectively diminish the prison population on a massive scale.this means lost revenue for corporate run prisons and means major unemployment which could devastate entire communities.
this is the dilemma and to me it is a moral one but there is no easy answer.

I don't see a dilemma here. What you describe is the reason it will be hard or impossible to change this abomination of a system (as long as we have legal bribery for those running this country), but it's not a dilemma.

>> ^enoch:
if we legalize weed and change it from a type A narcotic to a mush lesser class we would effectively diminish the prison population on a massive scale.this means lost revenue for corporate run prisons and means major unemployment which could devastate entire communities.
this is the dilemma and to me it is a moral one but there is no easy answer.

>> ^enoch:
snip

Allow me to retort:

You say "my argument" - i didn't have an argument. I had questions. I was playing devil's advocate and asking why we downvoted the guy's comment.

I really have no clue what you are responding to in half of your comment, that might be due to punctuation tho, hard to follow - but i'm fairly sure you read way more into my comment than i put

Lets attack people in IRAQ it ensures the FREEDOM(TM) of citizens in the USA! YEAH YEAH! *BEATS CHEST*

I guess "I have that video" is the new "that's what she said".

There is some serious fact checking to be had here methinks.

Finally! Thanks Amateur for mentioning this. It took me to the end of 27 comments to find someone who said this.

First off, theres some obvious fudging of facts or at the very least lack of a presentation of all the facts.

Just as a quick example.....He says that the US has X times the amount of prisoners as lets say Iran. But what he glosses over is the fact that the US also has some multiple of that country's population.

Oh some more points where STEPHEN FRY IS WRONG....if you're American and you believed this arrogant crack-pot you should be ashamed.

1. The three strikes law is NOT UNIVERSAL only present in about 26 states
2. The strikes only apply to Felonies or Violent crimes (as they are defined in the states)
3. To show you how Fry the Sheperd for which you are the sheep misled you, heres the four cookie story. A freakin six-time parole violator...assault...and he broke into the store to rob the safe not steal cookies.

"In one particularly notorious case, Kevin Weber was sentenced to 26 years to life for the crime of stealing four chocolate chip cookies (previous strikes of burglary and assault with a deadly weapon).[11] However, prosecutors said the six-time parole violator broke into the restaurant to rob the safe after a busy Mother's Day holiday, but he triggered the alarm system before he could do it. When arrested, his pockets were full of cookies he had taken from the restaurant.[12]"


The point is, Stephen "whopdi freakin doo" Fry, on some random TV game show/program shoots off three random facts of unknown origin and everybody here bites into it. "Well hes Stephen Fry he must be spitting out the absolute truth." I feel like your mother but.....you shouldn't believe everything you see on TV.

Downvote this comment all you want but it wont change the fact that you were all led by the nose-ring.

Disclaimer: I understand fully that the US prison system has its serious problems and needs to be reformed, But Frys account of it was wrong and misleading and based in the "anti-americanism" which is so popular.


>> ^AmateurD:
There is some serious fact checking to be had here methinks.

ipfreely, actually I have. Here in Atlanta, I met a 20someyearold black male who spent time in prison for slinging dope. Guess what his job was? Trash pickup. You know those fellas that come around once a week? Yep. Sure, he may have been lying, but the fact is that this Prison-Industrial complex exists. Go look it up. It is a logical symptom and is inherently created in a capitalist system: Corporations seeking profit

No. This is the consequence of lawmakers pandering fear from old people who vote. Sure, Nixon proclaimed drugs to be Public Enemy #1 in order to counter negative Vietnam coverage, but politicians have exploited sensationalistic media coverage. Might I remind you that cocaine kills the same amount of people as aspirin, annually?
Once the baby boomers start dropping off Generation X can start the repair process.

Meh. I have no problem with three strikes. If you know you're a cookie theft away from a life term, and you still steal cookies, that's exactly where you belong, because you just can't control yourself.

If you want to make a difference, don't look at the prisons or judicial system, look at education and poverty. Those are the real drivers here...

smart gen xer's like myself, get on with the business at hand....develping new and creative alternatives for their own worlds, loved ones, and livelihoods...Black Markets and Income Tax Evasion anyone?? Civil Disobedience is the only answer, work within their system and lose it all.

Call it a hunch but I'm guessing he "glossed over" that fact because he was stating figures per-capita. Go on, look it up. We'll be here when you're done.

>> ^Confucius:
Just as a quick example.....He says that the US has X times the amount of prisoners as lets say Iran. But what he glosses over is the fact that the US also has some multiple of that country's population.

hmmmm ...call it a hunch but I dont see how what you said would change my point at all.


>> ^xxovercastxx:
Call it a hunch but I'm guessing he "glossed over" that fact because he was stating figures per-capita. Go on, look it up. We'll be here when you're done.
>> ^Confucius:
Just as a quick example.....He says that the US has X times the amount of prisoners as lets say Iran. But what he glosses over is the fact that the US also has some multiple of that country's population.

On the contrary, I understood everything you said but had nothing to add to any of it, with the obvious exception of pointing out that total population has no effect on per-capita statistics. I was snide only to match your tone.

>> ^Confucius:
You should read everything that I said and then get back to me....because you missed the point of my comment. When you understand it and get back to me with something productive ill comment till then ill just have to ignore your useless comments.

Prison industrial complex and corporate welfare. Insidious. Absolutely insidious.

1% may be on the high side, but a somewhat reliable source estimates 0.5% which is still pretty freakin' high:
http://www.statehealthfacts.org/comparemaptable.jsp?ind=760&cat=1

The higher figure may include people on parole - as this page suggests: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_States
"As of 2004, the three states with the lowest ratio of imprisoned to civilian population are Maine (148 per 100,000), Minnesota (171 per 100,000), and Rhode Island (175 per 100,000). The three states with the highest ratio are Louisiana (816 per 100,000), Texas (694 per 100,000), and Mississippi (669 per 100,000).[17]"

Interesting.

Same article points out that although China's official rate is lower, regime critics' estimates place China's prison per-capita ratio closer to the American #.

Still, one would hope that it'd be a case of China defenders trying to make themselves look better than the US in this regard than the opposite scenario you find occuring. Sad.

And how do we get so many people in jail? Arrest quotas.

http://www.videosift.com/video/Police-told-to-arrest-innocent-people-to-meet-targets

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