1)So once a video is in someone's personal queue, what happens to it there? And what happens once they've used all three?

2)If it hasn't had three requeues, it's still available for what? Another requeue? Like *saving one's own video? I like that.

3)And a video in someone's personal queue trumps a video that I try to sift?
i.e. - I tried to sift a clip from robot chicken only to find that it's been sifted and quasi-discarded to someone's personal queue, so mine is a dupe? I don't agree with that one bit. If theirs didn't make it, then mine sure as hell shouldn't be a dupe.
If this is not the case, please disregard previous rant.

1) It just sits there. It just sits there.

2) Yes. Just like the *requeue we've all grown accustomed to.

3) Yes. If you think it should be Sifted up (and it didn't previously make it) you're more than welcome to promote and/or vote up the existing one.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

To answer your first question MG - the post stays there in the personal queue. Voting is enabled- so it may still make it to the front page.

For the second question, if you are submitting a dupe of something that's already been submitted, go and vote for the one that's already there and give it a boost. Why should your subsequently submitted post take precedence?

Hmm. Well, I don't like three, but I do love the ability to revive a post you couldn't requeue in time. Is there anyway to make this retroactive so we can bring some discarded posts into the personal queue? There's a few of mine I'd like to give another shot at that had almost 10 votes...

[edit] voting is still enabled on personal queued videos? That's pretty sweet. if voting is still enabled on the personal queued videos, then I am certainly more than happy to vote on a video that I'm duping. That makes perfect sense, and I retract my rant.
Another question: Will personal queue videos show up in standard searches as well as the dupe confirmation page of the video submission process?

Well Hopefully it goes well. Though I have seen some * quality videos that have been requeued several times. Lets not forget that 2 or 3 "requeues" was not considered all that much back in the days of a 4 day queue time. so I'm not so sure it should be considered to many times now.

So my question is: Will the search engine look in people personal queues?

>> ^arsenault185:
Well Hopefully it goes well. Though I have seen some quality videos that have been requeued several times. Lets not forget that 2 or 3 "requeues" was not considered all that much back in the days of a 4 day queue time. so I'm not so sure it should be considered to many times now.
So my question is: Will the search engine look in people personal queues?

The difference with the now old requeue is that you had to keep requeuing or your video would get discarded. Now you can leave it for a few days then come back and give it another shot.

Yes, searching includes personal queued videos by default.

Awesome.(I figured as much, but had to ask for curiosity's sake) Once again, you guys pull though with some amazing work. It's why I'm more than glad to chip in a few bucks every month to ensure I have a great online community to go to.

edit. had been answered, i'd just missed it.

I just had a thought... What if we allow the net "Hot" tab to also pull videos from personal queues to help them get sifted? Yes? No? Or did you already have that in mind?

All this and no button.....to see *requeue in the comment thread every time is annoying....!

I can't help but feel that I had something to do with this update somehow... (Remembers the videos that took 6-8 requeues to get sifted)

So just so that I can understand, we only get three requeues then after that I won't be able to requeue at all and it gets moved into the personal queue, where it stays till either sifted or promoted...

Is there a limit of how many videos can be in the personal sift?

so basically, the personal queue is to rid the general queue of rot. the personal queue is the same thing as "unsifted" it just doesn't show up to the general public-at-large; you have to find it in the submitters queue or you can stumble across it by searching.

ME LIKE!!!!

What if we allow the net "Hot" tab to also pull videos from personal queues to help them get sifted?
A good thought, but this is not possible because the Hot list shows only videos submitted in the past 2 days, but videos don't expire and get sent to the personal queue until 2 days after submission.

I can't help but feel that I had something to do with this update somehow
Self-absorbed much? But really, no, this had nothing to do with you or any other individual Sifter.

So just so that I can understand, we only get three requeues then after that I won't be able to requeue at all and it gets moved into the personal queue, where it stays till either sifted or promoted...
Right.

Is there a limit of how many videos can be in the personal sift?
Refer to the post: "There is no limit to the quantity nor an expiration for personal queued videos."

the personal queue is to rid the general queue of rot. the personal queue is the same thing as "unsifted" it just doesn't show up to the general public-at-large
Exactly!

(Wow. A change that everyone actually seems happy about. How nice! )

the reason why I said I had something to do with the update was because of my last video that got requeued about 10-20 times before I killed it...

still though, at least this should help other getting videos sifted now that can't be discarded, (unless if they want it discarded...)

*coderrific - since I have no more power.

Can you believe it, Lucky? Even I don't have a single complaint about any of it!
It just flat out rules.

*superdupercalafragicqualityrific!

Is the requeue limit retroactive? In other words, I have a vid in the queue that has already been requeued 4 times. Will I still be able to requeue it?

lucky, this is brilliant! a *quality upgrade. Seriously! I was getting v. sad w/ the sift's 2 day limit.

3 days + personal queue = "teh win"

Awarding lucky760 with one star point for this contribution to Sift Talk - declared quality by Krupo.

<dissent>

This sucks.

</dissent>

I like the idea, will see how it pans out. As a sifter who prefer to sift the "off the beaten path videos" it will make it a little harder to get out of the queue but at least it's not a flat out rejection anymore. A little lobbying in the right places could get a marginal video out of your personal queue.

I just realized two of the effects this rather HUGE change is going to have. #1 my Siftrocities playlist will never be the same again, and #2 Achmed-type vids will no longer be sifted up 15 times... or will they?

Actually, I guess if a video is voted to death, it's "old school" discarded, and not relegated to the "personal queue", right?


If anything, though, I think the restriction of the # of requeues will open up the queue to only the truly worthy vids, so the obscure suckas have a better chance of survival (after all, they never die, just get relegated to the personal queue).

I recall personal queue has been discussed in various versions ever since queue-reform arose (like Siftbirth+2 months or so), and I think this was a good pick. Time will show how true my prediction is.

Pretty major changes, but I think it could work out pretty well. A while back I was going to suggest a 3-requeue limit with a 3-day sifting period, so I really couldn't ask for more.

I hope it works out well.

Sweet!

sooo...is any of this going to be on the test?

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

Please note the super huge update above. Goodbye requeue, I hardly knew how to spell ya.

I'm sorry to be blunt, but I think this situation calls for it: getting rid of the requeue is stupid. It will make this site worse. That is all.

Hmm, though I understand the logic behind it, and perhaps it'll turn out to be a good idea to kill it, I'm nevertheless not too enthused by this sudden drastic shift of gears without a clutch from 3rd gear into gear 17H. i.e., what Sarzy said.

Having said that, as much as I want to protest the loss of requeue, it was a messy invocation, and the personal queue effectively negates the need for it. It also takes some of the 'bitch work' out of sifting. Get a traditional "save" (i.e., a 3rd party's *-promote) rather than doing it yourself.

It'd be nice, I think, if we *could* keep at least a single requeue-shot. Though I suppose the Power Point self-requeue/promote effectively does that, on a more limited level.

Damnit, not able to muster up sufficient nerditude to bitch about this anymore.

lawl @ 'nerditude'

And I really like this, but I think 1 requeue would be nice - for those occasions when you just sift at a bad time.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

^ Messy invocation is right. I don't think it served the Sift well. It was a kind of hack that we feel isn't required now because Sifts still can have a chance at publication even after leaving the primary queue. Let's give it a try and evaluate in a couple of weeks. It's a lot of big changes, and we don't have all the answers- but it's something we'd like to try.

I also do not like the complete removal of requeue. There have been WAY too many requeue survivors that have gone on to be very successful on their 2nd or even 3rd attempts. We'll see a lot less artsy, interesting, and/or obscure videos being sifted. Maybe I'll be wrong, but I ain't counting on it.

The "discard with 9 votes" concept always felt like a horrible waste. I think you might be right, dag.

And MarineGunrock & kronos: there's a playlist that's always going to be there for you to compensate for the lack of a requeue command: http://www.videosift.com/playlists/Krupo/VideosToSave



Remember - you don't even need the *-promote anymore, you can keep voting on stuff that falls out of 'general' queue.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

But see, the nice thing is that those artsy, interesting posts now have more of a chance to make it out- because they don't disappear as discards. They go into the private queue of those members that post the fascinating stuff- and are still votable- thereby giving them more of a chance to get out.

>> ^kronosposeidon:
I also do not like the complete removal of requeue. There have been WAY too many requeue survivors that have gone on to be very successful on their 2nd or even 3rd attempts. We'll see a lot less artsy, interesting, and/or obscure videos being sifted. Maybe I'll be wrong, but I ain't counting on it.

Correct me if I am wrong... but it seems to me like those sifters who donate are going to have an extra chance to get their stuff out their queue, because they can self-promote... And because of that, it is either yet one more incentive to donate, or favoring those who do.

I for one welcome our new non-requeueueing overlords.

recommendation: A silver star requeue invocation allowed once/X days. Allowed on any vid in one's own personal queue. Doesn't increase queue slots. Minimal use, but allows submitters to requeue those vids which nearly made it, but didn't get quite enough views or votes.

>> ^arsenault185:
Correct me if I am wrong... but it seems to me like those sifters who donate are going to have an extra chance to get their stuff out their queue, because they can self-promote... And because of that, it is either yet one more incentive to donate, or favoring those who do.

Only if the donators decide to be selfish. The culture of VS has been surprisingly consistent in its neighborliness, for the most part. I'm optimistic that won't change much. Perhaps I'm a fool.

>> ^jonny:
recommendation: A silver star requeue invocation allowed once/X days. Allowed on any vid in one's own personal queue. Doesn't increase queue slots. Minimal use, but allows submitters to requeue those vids which nearly made it, but didn't get quite enough views or votes.


Fantastic idea.

I don't think it will work out that way. I think once a video moves to a private queue it will languish in most cases. Sure, eventually SOME will escape and make it to the front page, but once they're there they'll mostly be surrounded by LOLcats. I'm not prone to visiting members' profile pages unless I'm leaving them a comment, but that's what we'll have to do in order to view what's in a member's private queue.

Before I became a VS member I lurked for many months, enjoying the wide variety of videos I found on the front page. Not just videos like this or this or this (all good videos, mind you), but also some requeued gems like this and this and this. With this new system I believe we will see less variety, making us more like Milk and Cookes or I-Am-Bored. However I'll be the first to admit that I could be wrong, and I hope I am. But a more homogeneous front page will make this place boring to me, and that's what I fear will happen.

We'll see what happens.

>> ^dag:
But see, the nice thing is that those artsy, interesting posts now have more of a chance to make it out- because they don't disappear as discards. They go into the private queue of those members that post the fascinating stuff- and are still votable- thereby giving them more of a chance to get out.
>> ^kronosposeidon:
I also do not like the complete removal of requeue. There have been WAY too many requeue survivors that have gone on to be very successful on their 2nd or even 3rd attempts. We'll see a lot less artsy, interesting, and/or obscure videos being sifted. Maybe I'll be wrong, but I ain't counting on it.

I do have to wonder, is Videosift slowly becoming more a venue for trashy disposable media over being a source for quality obscure videos in general?

amen farhad, the middle ground attempt here is in response to that...to bad all the crapola that has made it through during these difficult times.....

>> Before I became a VS member I lurked for many months, enjoying the wide variety of videos I found on the front page.

If you'll recall, during this time when you were enjoying the Sift so much, that's when there was no requeue. And at that time, instead of "languishing" in the personal queue, expired videos were simply discarded outright.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

^ exactly.

There's no simple answer to this- there's always going to be grumbles about the "good" videos languishing or being discarded.

Though speaking as someone who has been on VideoSift from day -1, I don't feel like the number of quality videos being published has decreased over time. On the contrary, I would say it's increased.

^You could be right, both dag and lucky. It might all work out for the best. I don't know if any of us knows for sure what will happen in the next few weeks with these changes. So like I said, we'll see what happens, and I'll be hoping for the best.

And I don't think "grumbling" is always a bad thing. A healthy democracy relies on grumblers too. So let it be with VideoSift. Now I'm NOT saying that you're accusing all grumblers of being hopeless curmudgeons, dag. I'm just saying this to differentiate between good grumbling and bad grumbling.

Someone has to do it.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

I like grumbling.

I am a card carrying grumbler myself.

>> ^dag:
But see, the nice thing is that those artsy, interesting posts now have more of a chance to make it out- because they don't disappear as discards. They go into the private queue of those members that post the fascinating stuff- and are still votable- thereby giving them more of a chance to get out.


Hmm, while I like the idea that they don't disappear from view any more, it's still a case of those of us who aren't already uber-posters don't really have people coming by out profiles for a cup of tea and an Iced Vovo... So who's going to ever see our videos sitting there?

Maybe there should be a system of there always being a place on the front page where a random personal queue sift is put up... it's still not published unless it gets the votes, but it can be seen by a few more people, and perhaps bring more people to the user to see what else they may have languishing in their queue.

This front page spot could either be a case of it sits up there for a given X hours for all users, or it's just a page load by page load random sift... the 'lucky personal dip' slot?

^ I really like that idea, but what the hell is an iced vovo?

[edit]Ah, iced vo vo.

i don't understand anything any more. half of this seems like what i have been asking for for months, the other half seems like rule soup.

Just... unfathomable. Every time there's a rule change, the complexity increases.

does the search work yet?

the notification email still has the "requeue" wording in it...

Quickly not becoming a fan of the 2 pp to requeue. Basically I'll never be able to requeue a video again. (seeing as I'm only allowed 1 pp at a time.)

In other words I can forget ever sifting another video again.

inexplicable and unrelated moan.



Wanted to join in.

this was my first impression, that i jotted down earlier, on spoco's Damien Rice sift:

it'll be an adjustment. but i think the P-Q really helps, don't you?
so long as no one takes advantage of it. by purposely not voting someone else's sift up, letting theirs go from the Q to P-Q, then sifting their own.
but, honestly? i don't see anyone here, being that overtly predatory.
and any attempt to do that, would be fairly transparent anyway.

i'm here to stay, regardless of what you set Q-times, etc, to be.

[edit - apparently, lucky made the P-Q still count, as Q'ed anyway. so my scenario above, isn't a problem.]

* unqueue command. Takes something into your personal que and off the unsifted, to free up a sift slot.

To open to overuse/abuse? i'd think it might have a place.

Would mean things like this could be unqueued instead of discarded, and act like buried treasure that can still be voted on.

http://www.videosift.com/video/Craig-Ferguson-performs-with-The-Wicked-Tinkers

>> ^Thylan:
unqueue command. [...]

This is a poor idea for reasons of abuse and more. It would encourage low-quality posts, 'hoarding' of large amounts of material in one's personal queue, and would require yet another command.

The recent changes have incentivized me to post higher quality material and take more time to craft each post. I see great times ahead for VideoSift 3.14159.

possibilities for abuse made me wonder about it too. double edged tool.

>> ^gorgonheap:
Quickly not becoming a fan of the 2 pp to requeue. Basically I'll never be able to requeue a video again. (seeing as I'm only allowed 1 pp at a time.)
In other words I can forget ever sifting another video again.


You had requeue for a month and now you can't live without it?

May I keep thumping your heads in the general direction of my classic Videos to Save playlist?
http://www.videosift.com/playlists/Krupo/VideosToSave

Thank you.

Also - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iced_Vo_Vo for those of you confused.

Adjustments are never easy Krupo. Quick dramatic adjustments are even harder. It just seems like a lot of work to end up right back where we started. Also I can't save, or promote anyone elses vids. Because I have no way of getting 2 powerpoints. So basically I'm missing my *requeue, AND *save. I'll live without Requeue but why the hell can't I save other peoples videos?!

>> I can't save, or promote anyone elses vids
You must have misunderstood something along the way. Refer to the Member Privileges page:

Gold-100 Star Member

• promote² - float a post at the top of the corresponding listing; renew queue time for queued/discarded videos

² requires 1 Power Point to use

That's kinda confusing, why can't 100's get two power points instead of 1 to the squared power point?

i agree with dag but also think both kp and spoco have a good point - we should come up with a way to enable sifters to promote pq videos. i propose a "shout out" box in the unsifted section with say 15 videos. each sifter (gold star and up) would get one "shout" every 3 days. the videos in this box would rotate, say one step-up every 30 minutes thus giving them enough exposure to gain a vote or two that's missing for them to appear on the front page. suggestions?

^ I like it. But make it a button and not an invocation. Those comments just clog up a thread. Like the button used to fix a dead video.

theres a fix dead video button? where?

>> ^arsenault185:
theres a fix dead video button? where?


ZOMG. You're an idiot. You currently have six star points from fixing dead videos, but somehow don't know where the "fix dead video button is?"

I have a suggestion: how about a personal queue tab, which would work much like the unsifted tab, displaying the most recent videos to enter everyone's personal queues, and the top 15 videos that are closest to making it out of people's personal queue.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

I think that's an excellent idea Sarzy, or perhaps a panel of recently PQ'd posts.

Suggestion: I was kinda confused when Sifty just gave me an error and promptly ignored my requeue request because I missed this development and "Requeue" still appears in the "possible invocation" list. Why not remove it or have it link to this post?

I like the idea of the personal queue though. Having to time your requeues was a bit annoying/artificial and this should get rid of the "I posted this before and it didn't make it" problem.

Is this possibly the *stickiest post ever? My indexiceps scrolldownitus is starting to get sore!

But I guess we aren´t through all the options yet...

My opinion: too much change too quickly. Having no requeues seems...too radical. I wish you had cut it down to 1 or 2 and not 0.

I like the other changes, but I don't see why you changed it a lot, and then pushed it even further over the edge before the dust even settled.

I second the suggestion to put the link to this post in the "there is no requeue" invocation message.

Remember that we didn't have requeues for a very long time to begin with. They were mainly a stop-gap measure to deal with the downshift from 4-day queues to 2-day.

It's interesting how addictive an unlimited *-power got, though.