*promote

Self promoting this video and sending it back into the queue for one more try; last queued Friday, July 22nd, 2011 7:42am PDT - promote requested by original submitter luxury_pie.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/norway/8655120/Oslo-explosion-dozens-injured-buildings-damaged-after-Norway-city-blast.html

No details have yet emerged, but it is statistically likely that there is foreign influence involved. If so, the Norwegians have brought this upon themselves.

Let's hope this one will wake us up.
>> ^Smugglarn:

YAY CULTURAL RELATIVISM!
HOORAY FOR MULTICULTURALISM!

So now foreigners can't even be trusted in countries because they have bombs and they're there to blow up people? Even if it turns out to be a foreigner how the fuck do you two explain all the foreigners that day who DIDN'T blow anything up? The country is full of fucking morons and only a very select few of them post here, remember sifters there's tons of motherfuckers who actually think like this.

Also why does anything even genuine sentiment on Twitter sounds like you're being an asshole?

"I fear that many 100s could be dead. Poor poor poor guard that worked in the first floor. :(,"

The blast was near the Prime Minister's office, though he is reportedly safe. 2 confirmed killed so far.

... and apparently someone dressed as a police officer opened fire at Utøya.

Turns out it was Magi after all: http://img45.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=140441220_Untitled_1_122_66lo.jpg

Maybe let's all count to 10 before using this to re-enforce our pre-existing world views? You know, on account of people still currently dying as a result of this and at least pretending you care.

>> ^Pprt:

No details have yet emerged, but it is statistically likely that there is foreign influence involved. If so, the Norwegians have brought this upon themselves.
Let's hope this one will wake us up.
>> ^Smugglarn:
YAY CULTURAL RELATIVISM!
HOORAY FOR MULTICULTURALISM!


Who are you people? Like, I honestly struggle to believe you actually exist in real life. Do you live under bridges or something, like, you know, a troll?

Latest: Several people killed at the shooting at the youth camp.

You make the same mistake as the media in Sweden and Norway; labeling all immigrants and refugees as "foreigners". The problem with terrorism, crime, rape etc is fairly specific to different ethnic and religious groups of refugees: Somalis, Iraqis, Albanians etc. Not all of them, but they are dramatically over represented. I happen to know a an MP that is of Iraqi descent, but she is an atheist and I would guess from, if not upper class, then upper middle class. So that would be dominating factors, but knowing that - importing violent, uneducated fanatics?

The right wants cheap labour. The left wants votes to bring down the right. The middle and lower classes lose - including a lot of immigrants that have done nothing but being well mannered citizens of a secular democracy.

Oh, and do not think for a minute integrated immigrants feel sympathetic with the criminal element. Only left wing stooges do that - often in the media.

>> ^Yogi:

So now foreigners can't even be trusted in countries because they have bombs and they're there to blow up people? Even if it turns out to be a foreigner how the fuck do you two explain all the foreigners that day who DIDN'T blow anything up? The country is full of fucking morons and only a very select few of them post here, remember sifters there's tons of motherfuckers who actually think like this.
Also why does anything even genuine sentiment on Twitter sounds like you're being an asshole?
"I fear that many 100s could be dead. Poor poor poor guard that worked in the first floor. ,"

Saw something that said this might all be over a stupid Mohammed cartoon.

Wow, who could have guessed that importing a culture that hates you and that solves problems with murder could have negative repercussions??

"Eyewitness Andre Scheie told NRK: "There are very many dead by the shore... There are about 20-25 dead." Mr Scheie also said he saw people dead in the water at the camp."

You're amalgamating two quite separate things: terrorism and crime. The latter has everything to do with lack of education (including basic civic behaviour sometimes), of money, and/or is a result of immigration with purely criminal intent (yes, that exists too). The former, however, needs only nationalistic or, in this case, religious ideology to be its fuel. Most (if not all) recent Islamist terrorists have come from middle-to-upper class families, have usually been well educated and had no "criminal gain" (i.e. $$) to be made from their actions.

>> ^Smugglarn:

You make the same mistake as the media in Sweden and Norway; labeling all immigrants and refugees as "foreigners". The problem with terrorism, crime, rape etc is fairly specific to different ethnic and religious groups of refugees: Somalis, Iraqis, Albanians etc. Not all of them, but they are dramatically over represented. I happen to know a an MP that is of Iraqi descent, but she is an atheist and I would guess from, if not upper class, then upper middle class. So that would be dominating factors, but knowing that - importing violent, uneducated fanatics?
The right wants cheap labour. The left wants votes to bring down the right. The middle and lower classes lose - including a lot of immigrants that have done nothing but being well mannered citizens of a secular democracy.
Oh, and do not think for a minute integrated immigrants feel sympathetic with the criminal element. Only left wing stooges do that - often in the media.
>> ^Yogi:
So now foreigners can't even be trusted in countries because they have bombs and they're there to blow up people? Even if it turns out to be a foreigner how the fuck do you two explain all the foreigners that day who DIDN'T blow anything up? The country is full of fucking morons and only a very select few of them post here, remember sifters there's tons of motherfuckers who actually think like this.
Also why does anything even genuine sentiment on Twitter sounds like you're being an asshole?
"I fear that many 100s could be dead. Poor poor poor guard that worked in the first floor. ,"

Good point, but stupidity and lack of education often go hand in hand, and some cultures are tailored around preying on functional societies. The point is, a proper risk evaluation wasn't done when considering immigration. Ideology above all reason. Tragic really.

Populist opponents of liberal immigration laws use foreign aid as an alibi, but even that is ruled by ideology and opportunism. Only fair trade works. (not the hippie brand - actual trade with proper wages being the rule)>> ^hpqp:

You're amalgamating two quite separate things: terrorism and crime. The latter has everything to do with lack of education (including basic civic behaviour sometimes), of money, and/or is a result of immigration with purely criminal intent (yes, that exists too). The former, however, needs only nationalistic or, in this case, religious ideology to be its fuel. Most (if not all) recent Islamist terrorists have come from middle-to-upper class families, have usually been well educated and had no "criminal gain" (i.e. $$) to be made from their actions.
>> ^Smugglarn:
You make the same mistake as the media in Sweden and Norway; labeling all immigrants and refugees as "foreigners". The problem with terrorism, crime, rape etc is fairly specific to different ethnic and religious groups of refugees: Somalis, Iraqis, Albanians etc. Not all of them, but they are dramatically over represented. I happen to know a an MP that is of Iraqi descent, but she is an atheist and I would guess from, if not upper class, then upper middle class. So that would be dominating factors, but knowing that - importing violent, uneducated fanatics?
The right wants cheap labour. The left wants votes to bring down the right. The middle and lower classes lose - including a lot of immigrants that have done nothing but being well mannered citizens of a secular democracy.
Oh, and do not think for a minute integrated immigrants feel sympathetic with the criminal element. Only left wing stooges do that - often in the media.
>> ^Yogi:
So now foreigners can't even be trusted in countries because they have bombs and they're there to blow up people? Even if it turns out to be a foreigner how the fuck do you two explain all the foreigners that day who DIDN'T blow anything up? The country is full of fucking morons and only a very select few of them post here, remember sifters there's tons of motherfuckers who actually think like this.
Also why does anything even genuine sentiment on Twitter sounds like you're being an asshole?
"I fear that many 100s could be dead. Poor poor poor guard that worked in the first floor. ,"

So far 17 dead, reports 7 in Oslo and 10 at Utøya. 1 person arrested, Nordic-looking guy with blond hair 32 years old and Norwegian in origin. He was dressed as a police man and shooting kids at the island Utøya. Police also thinks the same man was seen in Oslo near a brown van just before the bomb went off. For what its worth, I'm fine as I was nowhere near the events. Hopefully the same goes for my fellow Norwegian sifters. Take care everyone.

looks more like oklahoma than 9/11. as i am going to bed, it seems more like an ultranatioanlist than a jihadist.

it wasnt an extreme islamist, it was likely an extreme anti-islamist: http://www.vg.no/nyheter/innenriks/artikkel.php?artid=10080610

*nochannel *worldaffairs *waronterror *news

I expect I will be scorned for this but downvoting for zero information in the video.

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The police just gave an update:

A right wing extremist placed a huge bomb in oslo outside the government hq, killing at least 7.
He then went to the governemtn partys youth camp (with 500+ teenagers), and killed atleast 80 people.
He was dressed as a cop, and tried to lure some teenagers to him claiming he had important information and then executed them. Before he went from tent to tent and hunted the rest.

So all in all there's probably over 90 killed, many of them teenagers, many of them shot infront of their friends.

Unfortunately when the news came out, there was a lot of hatred against muslims (including a friend I was gaming with, whom I tried to reason with before it was known that it was a norwegian), and people of non-norwegian descent got called some unfair names at them.
I think it's important that people focus on the tragedy, and stop trying to play the blame game. People has died, *MANY* parents have lost their teenage son/daughter today, all because of one guys strong beliefs.

Bringing more hatred to the table will not make anything better.

Woke up at 4 am today to the news that atleast 80 young people where shot dead on Utøya. The guy was walking around on an island with 600 kids and young people in tents aged 15-25 in a police uniform. One girl on the radio minutes ago : "I looked out the window and saw a man who was shooting at girls lying on the ground.." Apparantly he used his policeuniform to maximize the killing, frightened kids who where hiding from the gunman, was lured out by the "policeman" and then excecuted in cold blood.

This was one sick fuck.

weird, my first thought was that it was domestic terrorism.
-karl

Peace will never be possible until we outgrow archaic belief systems (religion).

What a fucking asshole.

My first thought was that the explosion was the work of Muslim terrorists, and when I heard about the shooting - things didn't make sense. First, that it was a socialist gathering - they are useful idiots for the terrorists, but they were the party in power so maybe that was the reason. Second, it came out pretty early that the shooter was blond. I figured it was a retaliation - but couldn't find any timeline.

Now, everybody predictably screams that there is no Muslim threat, and the Nazi bogie man is everywhere. Which couldn't be further from the truth, and has been the dogma in Sweden, giving Muslim youths and Anarchists carte blanche to rob, vandalize, brutalize and murder citizens they don't approve of - oh and everybody else.

Everything sucks.

Fuck!
http://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/ixc7a/atleast_80_people_killed_in_ut%C3%B8ya_massacre/c27ext2

Well I hope someday we stop blaming the first thing that comes to mind.
Also: fuck hatred.

>> ^Smugglarn:

My first thought was that the explosion was the work of Muslim terrorists, and when I heard about the shooting - things didn't make sense. First, that it was a socialist gathering - they are useful idiots for the terrorists, but they were the party in power so maybe that was the reason. Second, it came out pretty early that the shooter was blond. I figured it was a retaliation - but couldn't find any timeline.
Now, everybody predictably screams that there is no Muslim threat, and the Nazi bogie man is everywhere. Which couldn't be further from the truth, and has been the dogma in Sweden, giving Muslim youths and Anarchists carte blanche to rob, vandalize, brutalize and murder citizens they don't approve of - oh and everybody else.
Everything sucks.

Do you ever get bored of being wrong? Little vulture.

>> ^Smugglarn:

First, that it was a socialist gathering - they are useful idiots for the terrorists, but they were the party in power so maybe that was the reason.

Yes, when shamefully backtracking from your previous hate-mongering, do not forget to spit on the lives of murdered children, because them or their families were not part of the "right" political party.

You are a vile, disgusting person.

"Useful idiots" is a term of phrase which is apt, given you know anything about the sociopolitical climate in the region. Spit on their lives? I did nothing of the kind.

In regards to hate, that is that bubbly feeling you're feeling right now. Strange to call me a hate monger, when you are relishing in it. >> ^9547bis:

>> ^Smugglarn:
First, that it was a socialist gathering - they are useful idiots for the terrorists, but they were the party in power so maybe that was the reason.
Yes, when shamefully backtracking from your previous hate-mongering, do not forget to spit on the lives of murdered children, because them or their families were to part of the "right" political party.
You are a vile, disgusting person.

The people on the youth camp island, taken a day before the shooting.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/aufnorge/5961420854/in/photostream

People suck.

I hope Norway stays the same fact is its always going to be possable to go on a killing spree or blow shit up and there is no way to fully stop it , stuff you put in just locks the nation up and makes it a shittier place to live in.

This should be treated as a natural disaster some nut job went mental and killed a bunch of people this will always happen but thankfully 99.9% of humans find it very hard to kill people and realize its not a fair an constructive way of doing things.

what's in-lightning about this is how fucking stupid the news coverage is , iv just been watching the bbc and the reporting is so retarded they have alredy plasterd the guys photo up all over the place making it a more appealing route for other crazies and instead of simply stating facts they started speculating that it was muslims from the get go , and then they keep interviewing people who are going on about how norway needs to tighten up security( despite the fact this would do fuck all against this typ of atack ) ontop of that all the porn shots and repadly showing the same footage that has no real content but exists for people to glare at the car accident. ( its fine to have some general shots but the constant looping and the way its edited together is so cheep )

Allso 150 people dead is terrible but that's not really that many over the years for Norway so how they have been doing things ( ie not running idoitic forghen policies) has actually worked out far better for them than what the uk and US have been doing.

Sorry dude, but you're kind of an idiot. No hate here. Just callin it like it is.

>> ^Smugglarn:

"Useful idiots" is a term of phrase which is apt, given you know anything about the sociopolitical climate in the region. Spit on their lives? I did nothing of the kind.
In regards to hate, that is that bubbly feeling you're feeling right now. Strange to call me a hate monger, when you are relishing in it. >> ^9547bis:
>> ^Smugglarn:
First, that it was a socialist gathering - they are useful idiots for the terrorists, but they were the party in power so maybe that was the reason.
Yes, when shamefully backtracking from your previous hate-mongering, do not forget to spit on the lives of murdered children, because them or their families were to part of the "right" political party.
You are a vile, disgusting person.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/24/world/europe/24oslo.html?_r=2

One more reminder to all the right wing "christians" that jumped on the "islamic terrorist" bandwagon the second a car blew up, this was one of YOURS, not one of theirs. Are you starting to fear a backlash against YOUR religion and world view?
Just asking.

wiki on Norwegian gun politics.

There is no apparent public desire to introduce a concealed carry permit at this point in time, and there is no such license available to civilians.

Maybe that should change. Like, yesterday.

The point. You missed it.

>> ^quantumushroom:

wiki on Norwegian gun politics.
There is no apparent public desire to introduce a concealed carry permit at this point in time, and there is no such license available to civilians.
Maybe that should change. Like, yesterday.

>> ^newtboy:

One more reminder to all the right wing "christians" that jumped on the "islamic terrorist" bandwagon the second a car blew up, this was one of YOURS, not one of theirs. Are you starting to fear a backlash against YOUR religion and world view?
Just asking.


I'd like to point up thread were I was one of the first to yell stop and wait before re-enforcing your prejudices over this.

For the right wing so-called Christians I would urge they be judged the same as anyone else. The ones cheering this act and declaring it as justice served are the enemies of free people everywhere. Not to pick on Islam in any way, but I do NOT see entire nations filling with cheering so-called Christians rejoicing at this act the same way we really did see entire nations filling with cheering so-called Muslims rejoicing after 9/11. That difference must not be forgotten, as it is vital. The Westboro Baptists are exactly the equivalent evil, and they are right at home in America, but I am not familiar with any nations were a Westboro Baptist like cult has nearly a majority within the population. "Islamic" jihadists however have multiple places were that can be said to be true.

It's all equally ugly, but I suppose my point is that the Westboro Baptist nuts like this guy are a foe already effectively beaten, with limited ability to fight against us as free people. 'Islamic' nuts though are holding entire populations at ransom and bringing civil war against freedom loving muslim people unfortunate enough to share geography with them. It is still the much bigger fight, and will continue to be a problem until it is tackled as such rather than being dismissed as the 'chosen' lifestyle of the people there.

>> ^bcglorf:
>> ^newtboy:
One more reminder to all the right wing "christians" that jumped on the "islamic terrorist" bandwagon the second a car blew up, this was one of YOURS, not one of theirs. Are you starting to fear a backlash against YOUR religion and world view?
Just asking.

I'd like to point up thread were I was one of the first to yell stop and wait before re-enforcing your prejudices over this.
For the right wing so-called Christians I would urge they be judged the same as anyone else. The ones cheering this act and declaring it as justice served are the enemies of free people everywhere. Not to pick on Islam in any way, but I do NOT see entire nations filling with cheering so-called Christians rejoicing at this act the same way we really did see entire nations filling with cheering so-called Muslims rejoicing after 9/11. That difference must not be forgotten, as it is vital. The Westboro Baptists are exactly the equivalent evil, and they are right at home in America, but I am not familiar with any nations were a Westboro Baptist like cult has nearly a majority within the population. "Islamic" jihadists however have multiple places were that can be said to be true.
It's all equally ugly, but I suppose my point is that the Westboro Baptist nuts like this guy are a foe already effectively beaten, with limited ability to fight against us as free people. 'Islamic' nuts though are holding entire populations at ransom and bringing civil war against freedom loving muslim people unfortunate enough to share geography with them. It is still the much bigger fight, and will continue to be a problem until it is tackled as such rather than being dismissed as the 'chosen' lifestyle of the people there.



I'm sad to say I have seen entire nations 'worth' of people rejoicing at the death of Muslims, just not any actual nation. There certainly have been rallies in America that at least in part were to 'celebrate' Muslim deaths. I agree, it's not as pervasive as in Muslim countries, and not accepted by the majority of our population as it seems to be in Muslim countries, but it certainly IS something that happens here (at most Faux supported and teabagger rallies for example). We have a much more diverse and larger population, so there is likely NO cause the entire population will ever get behind.
My point is, as long as a group advocates violence and intolerance against another group, they have some responsibility when one of their group (insane or not) uses their rhetoric to justify violent acts against "X", and should be ridiculed for their hypocrisy when they complain about the same thing from the other side of their fight.
This is not meant to indicate that western culture is the same, or even close to the same as the Muslim culture, it is meant to indicate that when your anti-"X" group becomes "X" in order to fight against "X" you've already lost the fight before you begin. To reiterate, if you become what you despise in order to rail against it, you end up despising yourself in the end.

There certainly have been rallies in America that at least in part were to 'celebrate' Muslim deaths. I agree, it's not as pervasive as in Muslim countries, and not accepted by the majority of our population as it seems to be in Muslim countries, but it certainly IS something that happens here (at most Faux supported and teabagger rallies for example).

I think we are largely agreed then, as that was my main point. I think you overstate the teabagger rallies and/or understate the jihadist ones though.

I'm not familiar with any western rallies(aside from the westboro nuts I already mentioned) where they specifically celebrated the deaths of muslims because the deaths of muslims was deemed a good end. On the flip side, there are repeatedly rallies of emboldened jihadists dancing in the streets and cheering the deaths on 9/11 and from other attacks and violence since then.

The difference is important to keep in perspective and not to be underestimated. It is where we are headed if we don't confront the extremists in our midst now while we have them outnumbered. It is also important as our like minded moderate allies in those foreign nations need our support and help against a much more determined and violent enemy than we do ourselves.