That's a textbook pwning.

The Healthcare debate has clearly crossed Godwin's Law repeatedly. People need to calm down with the hate rhetoric.
Nice work by Mr. Frank however.

Brilliant. Someone please remind me to *Quality this the instant it disappears from the front page.

*comedy

Mr. Frank has a future in standup when his political career is over!

Adding video to channels (Comedy) - requested by brycewi19.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag.(show it anyway)

This was great. Hooray for Barney!

I don't approve of anyone evoking the Hitler thing. It's just provokative and stupid. There's plenty of stupidity in the house bill to argue against without this kind of baloney. It gives neolibs like Frank an excuse to pretend that the opposition to the bill is limited to a few lunatics, when in fact the opposition is a huge national groundswell which is against the creation of an unconstitutional federal entitlement in a time of economic recession and unprecedented national debt.

Newest news stories indicate Democrats are going to 'go it alone' now. What courage that must take when you have supermajorities in the House and Senate. You couldn't ask for a better recipie for losing Congress in 2010 than to pass this stupid House bill over the objections of the majority of the American people. Might as well just give the Republicans the congress right now and accept the concept of Obama as a one term lame duck.

But I must note with delicious irony the absolute hypocrisy of Frank and the neolibs on this Hitler thing. It wasn't too long ago that calling your President "Hitler", making movies about assassinating him, wishing he & his family were dead, and all kinds of other awful stuff was considered the 'new patriotism'. Now according to Frank it is, "vile, contemptible nonsense"... Ah - sweet hypocrisy... How you neolibs do so revel in it.

No, no, no. You are going to stand there and listen to all the funny things I would rather do than discuss with you.

socialism ≠ fascism

>> ^Winstonfield_Pennypacker:
But I must note with delicious irony the absolute hypocrisy of Frank and the neolibs on this Hitler thing. It wasn't too long ago that calling your President "Hitler", making movies about assassinating him, wishing he & his family were dead, and all kinds of other awful stuff was considered the 'new patriotism'. Now according to Frank it is, "vile, contemptible nonsense"... Ah - sweet hypocrisy... How you neolibs do so revel in it.


I can't say wanting Bush dead was a righteous thing, but Bush was far closer to a fascist dictator than Obama is. Obama has his own plan for the destruction of America.

When Blarney Frank refers to his ethnic heritage, he means "criminal", right? He belongs behind bars for the rest of his life for his Fannie Mae thievery. With the "free" health care this fat finook is getting, you'd think he could afford decent dentures.

In other news, moonbats were shocked--SHOCKED!!--by a reference to Hitler not involving the name "Bush".

Pennypacker, Bush and Hitler were both fixtures of the far right, so although the comparison is unproductive and overreaching, it is at least born out of some basic logic. Bush did also rack up a respectable body count of innocent people, made major cutbacks on civil liberties, tortured people, and vilified his opposition as traitors to name a few things. If you want to make an overreaching comment about the current President, take a cue from our very own qm and blankfist, and go with either Stalin or Marx.

"... Dining room table..." lol. I have to use that sometime

Pennypacker, Bush and Hitler were both fixtures of the far right

I'm going to argue with you on this because you're using generalities that I consider inaccurate.

What it is you mean exactly when you say 'far right'? Strictly speaking, Adolf Hitler was a socialist. Socialism is not a 'far right' political philosophy. Hitler wanted to nationalize everything, put the government in charge, and cradle-to-grave German citizens with massive government health care, work programs, and so forth. From my perspective, this degree of socialism is a fixture of the far LEFT rather than the far right. From that perspective, Obama has far more in common politically with Hitler than Bush.

In the popular vernacular, 'far right' is used as a kind of catch-all term to describe hate groups. This means people like the KKK, Nazis, racists, anti-semites, gay bashers, skinheads, Christian cult 'compounds'... The list goes on. But generally speaking when a person says 'far right' they are talking about some sort of radical, fringe kook group that is demonstrably just way out there doing really wierd stuff.

But that's not how a neolib uses the term. When neolibs use the term 'far right', they use it as a slur to describe any and all groups that they politically disagree with. Pro-life, NRA, free-market, Christians, traditional marriage, small government... These are all perfectly normal, acceptable, every-day political and personal lifestyles that that the neoliberal left-wing maliciously smears guilt association using the term "far right".

So when you say "Bush and Hitler were both fixtures of the far right", I'm going to disagree with you. Bush may be a fixture of persons who want personal accountability, hold a pro-life opinion, and other aspects of what I would call a 'conservative' point of view (though - alas - he didn't follow through with small government). But he certainly is NOT a fixture of the "far right" kook fringe. That's nothing more than neoliberal whitewash. Bush never once advocated racism, violence towards others based on skin color, gay bashing, or anything of the sort.

its about time someone started calling these people out for what they are. this is exactly the right way to handle them.... quantum mushroom couldnt make a comment without slandering mr franks sexual orientation.
from urban dictionary ....Finook
Derived from "finocchio" or fennel, a derogatory term for homsexual or gay, i.e., people that wiseguys feel nervous around. Can also be spelled Fanook. this is how republicans "discuss", instead of issues ,lets call names and scream hitler !!!
Also mr frank does not get "free health care". its part of his benefit package. like my health care is. its not free, i work for it. i also pay 70 dollars a month in medicare taxes, probably to pay for this psycho ladys healthcare. the next question one should always ask is where do you get healthcare? ill bet one million shes on some government program. being on medicare or medicaid and protesting healthcare reform is like driving cross country to protest roads. these people arent against government healthcare,they are against anyone ELSE getting government healthcare. we need a system where everyone pays and everyone benefits. even republicans should be able to understand that simple concept.

Tags for this video have been changed from 'health care, town hall, dining room table' to 'obama, hitler, nazi, health care, town hall, dining room table' - edited by calvados

I think he was a bit out of line comparing her to a dining room table. I figure a nice throw pillow or maybe one of those neon royal-flush lamps.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/weblogs/TWSFP/2009/08/cnn_fails_to_report_woman_comp.asp

Well, isn't this interesting? Turns out that our crazy cat-lady is not a Republican, or even a right-wing kook. She's a left-wing kook. In fact this does not really surprise me very much, because it is typically neolibs who Godwin a discussion and call everyone they don't like 'Hitler'.

Sure Winstonfield, sure.

From dictionary.com

fas⋅cism  [fash-iz-uhm] Show IPA
–noun
1. (sometimes initial capital letter) a governmental system led by a dictator having complete power, forcibly suppressing opposition and criticism, regimenting all industry, commerce, etc., and emphasizing an aggressive nationalism and often racism.
2. (sometimes initial capital letter) the philosophy, principles, or methods of fascism.
3. (initial capital letter) a fascist movement, esp. the one established by Mussolini in Italy 1922–43.

Also, from their cultural dictionary.

fascism [(fash-iz-uhm)]

A system of government that flourished in Europe from the 1920s to the end of World War II. Germany under Adolf Hitler, Italy under Mussolini, and Spain under Franco were all fascist states. As a rule, fascist governments are dominated by a dictator, who usually possesses a magnetic personality, wears a showy uniform, and rallies his followers by mass parades; appeals to strident nationalism; and promotes suspicion or hatred of both foreigners and “impure” people within his own nation, such as the Jews in Germany. Although both communism and fascism are forms of totalitarianism, fascism does not demand state ownership of the means of production, nor is fascism committed to the achievement of economic equality. In theory, communism opposes the identification of government with a single charismatic leader (the “cult of personality”), which is the cornerstone of fascism. Whereas communists are considered left-wing, fascists are usually described as right-wing.

So you see Winfeld - as much as you will try to whine about nazi's being left-wing, you're wrong. Keep whining though, if it makes you feel better.

Fantastic.

I can quote wiki and dictionary.com too if I wanted. Look up 'Nazi party' and 'Socialist'. That's who Hitler was. A socialist - like Obama. This fact is indisputable.

Regardless, I note the myriad instance of qualified language in your defintions. They're there for a reason. 'In theory'? 'Usually'? Your source acknowledges that the definition the term 'facist' is somewhat fluid depending on who you talk to. Besides, you're using different terminology than what I was discuss. This in an odious practice typical of neolibs. When losing a discussion on substance, change the terminology to give the illusion that you aren't. I was discussing the political comparison of Obama vs Bush vs Hitler. Politically speaking, there is no question that Obama and Hitler were soulmates on a far deeper level than Bush and Hitler were.

And I had to laugh at the “cult of personality is the cornerstone of fascism" bit. Between Obama and Bush, which one is the one that built his entire political career on the cult of personality? Say what you like, but Bush rarely (if ever) went on about "me me me ME!" But every time Obama opens his socialist (and now I guess facist) piehole, it's always "MY plan", "MY agenda", "MY this", "MY that". The guy is a total narcicisst. America's in far more danger from Obama and his cult of personality zombies than it ever was under Bush.

"But I must note with delicious irony the absolute hypocrisy of Frank and the neolibs on this Hitler thing. It wasn't too long ago that calling your President "Hitler", making movies about assassinating him, wishing he & his family were dead, and all kinds of other awful stuff was considered the 'new patriotism'. Now according to Frank it is, "vile, contemptible nonsense"... Ah - sweet hypocrisy... How you neolibs do so revel in it."

I have to say that you are building yourself quite the straw man here. Frank never made a film about killing Bush nor did he ever call Bush Hitler or wished Bush and his family ill will. Since we are talking about the man himself, it is a rather weak argument to clump him with "neolibs" and then go on to list things that "neolibs" may or may not have done and assign the blame to Frank himself. I am sure there were lots crazy people doing crazy things while Bush was in office, but that has no bearing Frank or the validity of the argument he made in that town hall. It is disingenuous at best.

Winstonfield - you are a sad, sad man. Arguing with you is like arguing with a dining room table.

^ I hope Barney is reading this.

You can't argue with someone who makes it up as they go along.

WP has never given a shit about the truth. He's the kind of person who makes living in this country practically unbearable.

It's hard not to like that guy. He really is quite wonderful in his brass honesty. I also like that we have a homosexual congressman! How rad is that?!

Oh Winstonfield. I can't help but crack a smile every time you use the term 'neo-lib'. Your penchance to muddy discussions and repeat your truthinesses are so enjoyably predictable.

It's funny, but people bite at your bait and then when you switch they don't catch it. You just keep talking, always giving a slight nod to the previous person's view, but never actually facing their arguments. You want to think that anything you can argue someone else into believing is the truth. You want to think the ends justify the means. How can you be so obviously wrong and still consider yourself doing something good?

It's just gotten to the point where all I do is laugh at each of your posts. I used to want to engage you in discussion, but you don't have discussions. You just have you. And, while truly sad (and worthy of sorrow, to which I certainly nod my cap and hope I won't have to feel that for you any more) I can't help but see you doing it to yourself over and over again. At some point one must simply laugh, do you not agree?

And, actually on-topic, I did think Barney pwned this woman, and it's clear she deserves it, but I wonder whether it actually helps the D's case. Once again each side can see it like they want: The D's think the lady got smacked down and the R's rightfully claim that Barney failed to address her point. I know, I know. It's difficult to see that the R's can say that, but it was just like when Obama 'snapped' at that guy in the press conference, saying that he liked to wait a couple days until he fully understood a situation before commenting on it. The D's side claimed their guy showed his stuff and the R's claimed he weaseled out of answering the question.

I wish it were as simple as Winstonfield pretends it is.

I'll keep downvoting winfield's comments as long as he keeps using the moronic made-up term 'neolib'.

As opposed to what is regarded as mainstream conservatism (the neocons nowadays), liberalism practically hasn't changed. Hence, there's just no such thing as neoliberalism. And getting at one's opposition by adding a prefix that the mindset one supports appropriately deserves isn't politics, it's kindergarten tactics. Which is obviously the best people like him can muster and yet another reason why Sifters should just disregard the troll.

>> ^Throbbin:
Winstonfield - you are a sad, sad man. Arguing with you is like arguing with a dining room table.


LOL!!!

Please Winstonfield take your gun, go with your sister (that is also your wife) and go play the banjo, and cover that red neck of yours

These comments really sicken me. What's so terrible about what Pennypacker said? Is it because he made controversial contrarian comments and added the word "neolib"?

Please stop ridiculing and picking on the dissenting voices on this site. This is exactly the issue I take with majority opinion whether it begins from the left or right; it breeds not only sheep, but self righteous hatred. When you hear a voice of the minority, it should be our human duty to embrace it and make efforts to understand it instead of ostracizing it outright. To me, there is not a higher purpose for a man than to shirk his belief system so he can try to understand another's, and I defy anyone to prove me otherwise.

I simply do not understand this place anymore. It is filled with beautiful understanding people, yet when dealing with a political dissenter they demand blood (pardon my hyperbole). Additionally, I'm growing more and more tired of people creating political fabrications to control opinions:

My great friend DFT is labeling Hitler the same as Bush, saying they're both right wing as if being right wing makes you evil like Nazism. This is nothing more than political posturing and beneath us all. Hitler's party was the National Socialist German Workers Party. You seriously cannot get more left than that! And I could care less that he's a leftist. This doesn't mean Obama is akin to Hitler. To be perfectly honest, whether you're left or right has little to do with whether you're an authoritarian committing genocide or not. Your left and right politics doesn't make you evil. You have to make a choice, as a leftist or a rightist, to be evil.

That said, can't we simply enjoy what Barney Frank did here? The guy is a gregarious and interesting man who is brave enough to come out and run for Congress, and I am glad to see him there. Politics aside.

>> ^blankfist:
Hitler's party was the National Socialist German Workers Party. You seriously cannot get more left than that!

Excuse me? - "The Nazi Party is generally described as being at the extreme or far right of the left-right political axis."

Seriously BF, wtf? Was that a joke? I hope you didn't make the same mistake and consider the German Democratic Republic a democratic state merely because of what the title implied.

As far as winfield is concerned, iaui summed him up well. The guy's the definition of a troll, contributing nothing to the website except comments, in which he offers almost nothing but dissenting 'opinion', which is copy & pasted from conservative media, rarely relying on facts and generally ignoring other' rebuttals. Please, do not compare him to yourself, because he's nothing like you except for the occasional disagreement with mainstream opinion, which, in your case, I welcome and have learned to value.

The text says "generally". Even still, Wikipedia apparently is not the most ubiased means of discovering information. Just because someone typed that into wiki doesn't make it so. The Nazi party was leftist. If that is what you're outraged by, then you're missing my point, and I pity your demagoguery.

And no that was not meant to be a joke. None of this was a joke.

^ I can understand what you're saying about people becoming very angry in these threads when someone opposes their political viewpoints. People need to calm the fuck down, there is nothing to gain by losing your temper...and that goes for you too, blanky

People can compare Obama to Hitler all they want but it wont change the fact that OBAMA DIDN'T KILL 9 MILLION JEWS YOU THICK FUCKS. *throws things around the room in a temper tantrum*
DID IT EVER OCCUR TO YOU THAT COMPARING HIM TO HITLER ONLY DEMEANS THE LOSS OF LIFE THAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED IN THE HOLOCAUST?!?!?!?! FUCK!

ahh that's better.

Yeah blanky, EDD is right on. Look past the fucking name, dude, the Nazi party was a right wing movement.

*quality ass handing Barney

Boosting this quality contribution up in the Hot Listing - declared quality by JiggaJonson.

Well, I hate to upset you bf, but your claim that the Nazis were leftists is - there's no other way to call it - absurd and literally anyone who's recognized as a historian and isn't an anti-semite will back it up. This coming not from Wiki, but from someone who's read Mein Kampf, written several assessments on Nazi policies for a Politics course and whose family has experienced first hand as well as chronicled Nazi rule in Eastern Europe. That is why I mentioned I thought that statement of yours might've been a joke, it's that ludicrous. I know you're serious when it comes to political discussions, so I'll just say that it's obvious you've been horribly misinformed on this subject and leave it at that. Information on Nazi ideology and politics is freely available on the net and in history books, so I trust that if you don't feel 100% sure, you'll verify your info.

My dining room table demands an apology! Silence should be considered an asset and certainly does not warrant a comparison to that girl.

Pennypack, you are free to believe that fascism is 'left wing' if you like. I have no interest in pulling you back from the fringe.

maby people should stop using words like

left , right , conservative, liberal , socialist ,communist

unless they define specifcly what they mean and how they are using the word.

these words are useless unless defined clearly partly because of there political function ,

The many years of emotive propaganda atached to the words has not helped. communism , socialism , capitalism are not inherently bad notions or good notions or words. but often they are used with a presumption that everyone is on the same page as to there emotive understanding of the word.

may I say....ooo snap?

Makes me want to move to Massachusetts so I can vote for him.

Nazi stands for National Socialists so economically they most certainly were leftist.

It's impossible to define any political party by just left/right, because any given issue has its own placement on a left/right scale.

>> ^blankfist:
These comments really sicken me. What's so terrible about what Pennypacker said? Is it because he made controversial contrarian comments and added the word "neolib"?
Please stop ridiculing and picking on the dissenting voices on this site. This is exactly the issue I take with majority opinion whether it begins from the left or right; it breeds not only sheep, but self righteous hatred. When you hear a voice of the minority, it should be our human duty to embrace it and make efforts to understand it instead of ostracizing it outright. To me, there is not a higher purpose for a man than to shirk his belief system so he can try to understand another's, and I defy anyone to prove me otherwise.
I simply do not understand this place anymore. It is filled with beautiful understanding people, yet when dealing with a political dissenter they demand blood (pardon my hyperbole).

Beautiful. Spot on. Bravo. Upvote, quality, the works. You're right, I'm wrong. I apologize on the behalf of all liberals. Our bad.

Wait, there was more?

Additionally, I'm growing more and more tired of people creating political fabrications to control opinions:
My great friend DFT is labeling Hitler the same as Bush, saying they're both right wing as if being right wing makes you evil like Nazism. This is nothing more than political posturing and beneath us all. Hitler's party was the National Socialist German Workers Party. You seriously cannot get more left than that!

Hypocrisy! You condemn people who casually toss out Nazi references, and then casually toss out a Nazi reference?!

Boo! Hiss! I demand blood! Kill the nonbeliever! This is like arguing with a Nazi dining room table!

To be perfectly honest, whether you're left or right has little to do with whether you're an authoritarian committing genocide or not. Your left and right politics doesn't make you evil. You have to make a choice, as a leftist or a rightist, to be evil.

Too bad this sounds a bit like "even if you're a leftist like the Nazis, you can still choose to do good! Like Oskar Schindler!" after that Godwin turd you dropped in the middle of an otherwise feel-good comment.

I am amazed that the comment I felt was the most reasonable and insightful came from mr. westy. Regardless, good point westy. He who controls the definition controls the debate. And I think blankfist touched on a point similar to this Nietzche quote: The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently.

>> ^westy:
maby people should stop using words like
left , right , conservative, liberal , socialist ,communist
unless they define specifcly what they mean and how they are using the word.
these words are useless unless defined clearly partly because of there political function ,
The many years of emotive propaganda atached to the words has not helped. communism , socialism , capitalism are not inherently bad notions or good notions or words. but often they are used with a presumption that everyone is on the same page as to there emotive understanding of the word.

Yea these terms are usually thrown around as pejoratives

There are at least 4 signs to a bad argument:

1) You make up words to describe your opponent.
"Blankfist you are a balaboonist."
2) Resort to personal attacks.
"Rottenseed, I can't trust you your mother is catholic."
3) Compare them to an evil dictator.
"Dag, you should grow a little black mustache."
4) Use the slipper slope logical phallacy.
"If we let Netrunner continue to be a on Videosift, we will all become robots."

I like how he does some super-major-pwnage on that Mccarthy-loving idiot out...

It is hard to fit all four into one sentence. Oh, well.

>> ^rottenseed:
Yea these terms are usually thrown around as pejoratives


And then eaten like preservatives.

>> ^blankfist:
>> ^rottenseed:
Yea these terms are usually thrown around as pejoratives

And then eaten like preservatives.


And used as laxatives.

>> ^gwiz665:
>> ^blankfist:
>> ^rottenseed:
Yea these terms are usually thrown around as pejoratives

And then eaten like preservatives.

And used as laxatives.


So to take big Godwin dumps.

Stalin and Mao are figures of the FAR LEFT.

100 million murdered by communists? That's chump change!

>> ^Winstonfield_Pennypacker:
But I must note with delicious irony the absolute hypocrisy of Frank and the neolibs on this Hitler thing. It wasn't too long ago that calling your President "Hitler", making movies about assassinating him, wishing he & his family were dead, and all kinds of other awful stuff was considered the 'new patriotism'. Now according to Frank it is, "vile, contemptible nonsense"... Ah - sweet hypocrisy... How you neolibs do so revel in it.


That observation has a B-side. When people criticized Bush they were called terrorists, accused of hating America. A ridiculous proposal arose from the far right fringe, that you should support your president no matter what, as if anything good could ever come of that no matter what president is in office. Now those same fringe lunatics accuse Obama of being a Socialist, a Communist, a Fascist, a Kenyan, a Muslim, a Terrorist, the Magic Negro and a Racist -- and we're not even a year in.

It's not the "neolibs" that revel in hypocrisy so much as it's the fucking braindead morons.

BTW, Neoliberalism... you should probably look it up. The last big neoliberal economic policy was Reaganomics.

>> ^blankfist:
Please stop ridiculing and picking on the dissenting voices on this site. This is exactly the issue I take with majority opinion whether it begins from the left or right; it breeds not only sheep, but self righteous hatred. When you hear a voice of the minority, it should be our human duty to embrace it and make efforts to understand it instead of ostracizing it outright. To me, there is not a higher purpose for a man than to shirk his belief system so he can try to understand another's, and I defy anyone to prove me otherwise.

I agree entirely with your premise, but unfortunately our dissenters leave a lot to be desired. Right on time to provide an example is QM...


>> ^quantumushroom:
Stalin and Mao are figures of the FAR LEFT.
100 million murdered by communists? That's chump change!

This is not a rational dissenting voice, it's bait. Now it used to be that you could reel QM in, remind him that Santa doesn't bring rude children any toys, and get him to participate in a conversation like an adult. That may still be the case; I got tired of having to specifically invite his grown-up personality to come out and join the discussion, so I stopped trying. Let him act like a child, but don't be surprised when he gets treated like one.

Most of the dissenters that I found interesting have been run out of here: pinky and LittleRed come to mind.

RE: Nazism

I've said it before and I'll say it again cut and paste it here....

Nazism was a mix of both extreme left and extreme right ideologies. People tend to only think of exterminating Jews and gays when they think about Nazis, but there was much more to it than that.

Their economic policy, civil policy and united one-party vision were all extreme left. They were very hands-on with the economy and were focused on creating a collectivist society; classic attributes of the left.

On the other hand, they (obviously) supported hierarchy which is classic right. Religion was a driving force behind Nazism; another classic right attribute.

One of the points of confusion is that here in the US, "left" and "right" no longer mean what they do to the rest of the world. Furthermore, modern Nazis tend to have little in common with the originals. They want to kill the Jews, Blacks, Gays, Hispanics, etc. but they've got no consistent position on, say, economics or civics. They're little more than violent Christian fundamentalists, which is why Nazis are considered extreme right nowadays.

The point that some seem to be missing here, is that when discussing fascism, healthcare is a non-issue. Healthcare is NOT a defining trait of fascism. Whatever health system Hitler had in place is as irrelevant as whether or not he enjoyed ham and cheese sandwiches, because the concept of fascism is indifferent to both healthcare and deli menu items. This is just a stupid political game played for the benefit of gullible people.

Fucking idiots.

Common sense is your friend. Use it!

if you stand up and say nazi to a jew,then act suprised when he gets upset your are officially too stupid to live in this country, please give up your ss# and get the fuck out. or, go on fox news.

Is it worth mentioning that the Nazi party in Germany was given a significant amount of finance and support by the right wing in America, including the larger corporations including GM and Ford?

The Nazi party was still being funded by right wing America after the war started (before America chose a side and joined in). America was a big supporter of right wing fascism... right up to the point the whole 'death camps' made it embarrassing.

Right or Left - if the argument is about Socialism and Communism: Anti-communism & Anti-semitic were the number one platforms Hitler used to be elected by popular politics.

Anyone using an 'anti-socialism' platform to remove liberal freedoms is actually promoting the original Hitler Doctrine.

America's eugenics program, and individual eugenecists actually inspired (and supported) Hitler, to a certain degree:

Some states sterilized "imbeciles" for much of the 20th century. The U.S. Supreme Court ruled in the 1927 Buck v. Bell case that the state of Virginia could sterilize those it thought unfit. The most significant era of eugenic sterilization was between 1907 and 1963, when over 64,000 individuals were forcibly sterilized under eugenic legislation in the United States.[63] A favorable report on the results of sterilization in California, the state with the most sterilizations by far, was published in book form by the biologist Paul Popenoe and was widely cited by the Nazi government as evidence that wide-reaching sterilization programs were feasible and humane. When Nazi administrators went on trial for war crimes in Nuremberg after World War II, they justified the mass sterilizations (over 450,000 in less than a decade) by citing the United States as their inspiration.[59] American eugenicists inspired and supported Hitler's racial purification laws, and failed to understand the connection between those policies and the eventual genocide of the Holocaust.[64]

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics#United_States

>> ^robdot:
if you stand up and say nazi to a jew,then act suprised when he gets upset your are officially too stupid to live in this country, please give up your ss# and get the fuck out. or, go on fox news.


No no, that's where the rest of us send OUR "too stupid to live here"-people.

>> ^dystopianfuturetoday:
The point that some seem to be missing here, is that when discussing fascism, healthcare is a non-issue. Healthcare is NOT a defining trait of fascism. Whatever health system Hitler had in place is as irrelevant as whether or not he enjoyed ham and cheese sandwiches, because the concept of fascism is indifferent to both healthcare and deli menu items. This is just a stupid political game played for the benefit of gullible people.


I don't think anyone is comparing health care to fascism. Health care is just fine with everyone.

Nationalized services, however, lead to an increase in government size and control and authority, and the only way totalitarian fascism can take hold in any country is when the government increases to a size where it can do so. Nazism brought National Socialism to Germany which promised to provide a social safety net to protect against the supposed evils of Capitalism.

Hitler created the ultimate nanny state. People are not wary because of health care; they're wary because of nationalized services and larger human government.

About time the Democrats started throwing some punches back.

Ooops. It looks like Obama has got the ZIONISTS angry. Who else goes around calling other groups Nazis ? I have a feeling that part of this Nazi backlash is Jewish Zionist who just want to vent against Obama and his stance against the APARTHEID state of Israel.

This woman is a walking argument for the need for improved mental health care.

She just called a gay jew a nazi. How retarded is that? I'm pretty sure Hitler spent most of his free time exterminating both minorities the right and honorable Mr. Frank belongs to. And yet she throws around the word "nazi" like rice at a wedding.

I wouldn't be surprised if she were already in a subsidized health care plan.

It's so lame when people use 'National Socialist Party' as the beginning and ending of the argument that Hitler was liberal. By the same logic, Bush's Clear Skies and Clean Water Initiatives were environmentalist. I guess it is a testament to Hitler's skill at manipulation that he can still fool modern day libertarians with propaganda some 60 years later.

The defining traits of fascism are: militarism, nationalism, suppression of the press, racial and social discrimination, genocide, church and state making sweet sweet love, massive corporate influence within the government, etc.

These are all traits of the right, and more specifically, the American right.

Holy shit. An amazingly happy slap-down from Mr Frank. Also, lots of upvotes for various commenters here.

>> ^dystopianfuturetoday:

No one said Hitler was a liberal; he was leftist and his party was left. You act as if leftists cannot be militant and violent. History is riddled with leftist governments that were violent and authoritarian. Mao. Stalin.

Being left or right isn't a state of mind. It's a political philosophy of governance. Both are equally capable of despicable horrors.

^ No denying leftists can be violent. We're just denying that this violent dictator was leftist.

We also deny that there's any kind of predisposition in America's left to be violent. We're the ones who put flowers in gun barrels, wear tie-dye t-shirts with peace symbols, talk about peace love and understanding.

As far as your vehemence that Hitler was leftist is more based on your view of what "left" means. You use what I think of as the Ron Paul left-right axis. Left means government has power, right means it doesn't.

For me at my most partisan it's closer to the original left-right terms from the French parliament; the right wing are representatives of the aristocrats, royals, and clerics, and the left represents the commoners.

Neither of those scales is playing fair.

Probably the most accurate way to describe the Nazi economic policy is to call it corporatism. Business and government were in cahoots. Libertarians say that means it's definitely leftist, I say that's absolutely right-wing, since real US lefties want an antagonistic relationship between government and business (i.e. cops aren't supposed to take up the causes of criminals), while the American right (read Republicans, not Libertarians) think government should serve the interests of business first and foremost.

All this conversation about Hitler being left or right is totally beside the point.

People who say universal healthcare = Nazis are morons, and deserve to be told so loudly and often.

It's not the "neolibs" that revel in hypocrisy so much as it's the ****ing braindead morons.

Fair enough. As far as all the other comments go... "Neolib" is a term of my own creation. I use it to describe the leftist, liberal side of a debate in the very same way that neolibs use the term "neocon" to describe any/all conservatives. I'll make you a deal. I'll stop using 'neolib' as soon as liberals stop using 'neocon' as a generic epithet. Don't hold your breath.

We also deny that there's any kind of predisposition in America's left to be violent.

An old man and a black guy were beaten by left-wing AFL/CIO union thugs at health care debates. Bernadine Dorn & Micheal Ayers ring a bell? The Unibomber? The woman in this video? She's a left wing kook. The old guy that shot a bunch of people at that military museum? He was a left wing kook.

You may not want to admit this, but the left-wing of the US has a storied history of violence, intolerance, prejudice, and bigotry. The left isn't some bunch of snoots sitting around with a brandy snifter. They use guns, bombs, and violence just as much as the fringe right. It's a different brand of idiocy than what comes from - say - a bunch of skinheads, but that's no reason to pretend it doesn't exist.

while the American right (read Republicans, not Libertarians) think government should serve the interests of business first and foremost.

I'll disagree here. This is a NEOLIB (ha!) opinion that is skewed and incorrect. People on the right think federal government should be confined to its originally prescribed Constitutional duties (defense and some minor inter/intrastate regulation). That's all.

Funny how some Congressman can play the race card and get a free ride. Read the transcript.


Rachel Brown: I think the Administration is missing something in these town hall meetings, which is, that it's not just one group. The economy is collapsing. We have 30% real unemployment. Forty-eight states cannot balance their budgets and they are cutting programs to the bone. This is the context under which the Obama Administration says we need health-care reform—

Barney Frank: Well, I'll tell ya—

Brown: I'm not done. The reason why, is because they say we need to limit Medicare expenditures in order to do that, in order to reduce the deficit. That's the origin of this policy. This is the T4 policy, the Hitler policy in 1939, when he said certain lives are not worth living; certain people, we should not spend the money to keep them alive. Which is exactly what Ezekiel Emanuel has said.

So, my question to you is, one, since this policy is already on its way out—it already has been defeated by LaRouche—my question to you is: Why do you continue to support a Nazi policy, as Obama has expressly supported this policy? Why are you supporting it?

Frank: When you ask me that question, I am going to revert to my ethnic heritage, and answer your question with a question: On what planet do you spend most of your time?

Brown: [Inaudible; apparently asks Frank to answer the question.]

Frank: You want me to answer the question? [visibly and audibly enraged; lisp more pronounced:] Yes, you stand there with a picture of the President defaced to look like Hitler, and compare the effort to increase health care to the Nazis. My answer to you is, as I said before: It is a tribute to the First Amendment, that this kind of vile, contemptible nonsense is so freely propagated.

Brown: [Inaudible.]

Frank: Ma'am, trying to have a conversation with you would be like trying to have a conversation with a dining room table. I have no interest in doing it.

Blankfist sez: "No one said Hitler was a liberal; he was leftist and his party was left. You act as if leftists cannot be militant and violent. History is riddled with leftist governments that were violent and authoritarian. Mao. Stalin."

Many conservatives accuse Hitler of being a leftist, on the grounds that his party was named "National Socialist." But socialism requires worker ownership and control of the means of production. In Nazi Germany, private capitalist individuals owned the means of production, and they in turn were frequently controlled by the Nazi party and state. True socialism does not advocate such economic dictatorship -- it can only be democratic. Hitler's other political beliefs place him almost always on the far right. He advocated racism over racial tolerance, eugenics over freedom of reproduction, merit over equality, competition over cooperation, power politics and militarism over pacifism, dictatorship over democracy, capitalism over Marxism, realism over idealism, nationalism over internationalism, exclusiveness over inclusiveness, common sense over theory or science, pragmatism over principle, and even held friendly relations with the Church, even though he was an atheist.

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The duration of this video has been updated from unknown to 1:18 - length declared by bareboards2.