If any site region blocks, then it should be disallowed.

There are a lot of us outside of the US, and quite frankly it irks me a whole lot when I can't watch something just because I can't be bothered spoofing my IP to be a US one.

It's as if a whole segment of the US online industry still doesn't understand the concept of a world wide web.

I agree, actually, but if a gold star member goes to comedy central, they can just embed from there, however much it is disallowed for the lesser stars. Hell, I suspect a lot of gold stars don't even know we disallowed comedy central.

I don't even know how hard it would be to place restrictions on gold star embedding, or if it should be done with community action. This is the recent submission that pushed me over the edge, but it's not the only one by far: http://www.videosift.com/video/Jon-Stewart-brilliantly-disects-the-State-of-the-Union

I'm definitely opposed to outright banning particular hosts. I know it sucks for non-U.S. located users, but do we want to cut off our nose to spite our face?

I think a better solution is selective filtering for users, though I realize the db is already under a lot of load. Perhaps this could be done client side?

>> ^jonny:
I'm definitely opposed to outright banning particular hosts. I know it sucks for non-U.S. located users, but do we want to cut off our nose to spite our face?



We already had this discussion. You may be opposed to it, but the result of the previous discussion was that we, as a group, did want to ban certain hosts. Perhaps people no longer want to, but we did decide we wanted to.

I think we either rescind the ban, or we talk about how given that we wanted to ban certain hosts, the banning is no longer happening.

I just think it shouldn't be done in dribs and drabs, by default. If we aren't banning them, shouldn't we put them back up on the approved list of sites for the non-star members?

No more CC. If people can't see it, then it's not a quality video.

>> ^oxdottir:
>> ^jonny:
I'm definitely opposed to outright banning particular hosts. I know it sucks for non-U.S. located users, but do we want to cut off our nose to spite our face?
We already had this discussion. You may be opposed to it, but the result of the previous discussion was that we, as a group, did want to ban certain hosts. Perhaps people no longer want to, but we did decide we wanted to.

I'm aware of the old discussion (and more recent ones: 1, 2, 3). The solution was to prevent CC embeds from validating, but that restriction went away, implying that the decision had been reversed.

Also, there are other hosts (1, 2) with the same problem which were not banned.

Most importantly, though, this problem is not necessarily a host-wide issue. Shall we remove YouTube as a valid host because many of the embeds won't work outside of the US?

Clearly, this is going to be an ongoing issue. Outright exclusion of hosts in this way is not a viable solution in the long term. While the actions of Viacom may fairly be called draconian, should VS react in an equally draconian way? I vote no. There's a lot of smart people here, and I'm sure we can develop a solution which is more effective.

re: The solution was to prevent CC embeds from validating, but that restriction went away, implying that the decision had been reversed.

I think that "solution" was only in removing CC as an embed host for "all" members (one of the standard 16 hosts in the image block) but the diamond/G100 (and now G50) ability to embed from anywhere overrides that restriction (which i believe is still in place)

Right, I see what you mean Thylan. It was simply removed as one of the blessed hosts. Still, I think my points above still stand, in particular, that this is going to be an increasing problem as all sorts of new licensing deals are generated. The big content creators are just beginning to dabble with this.

On a side note, this is part of the reason I argued against allowing gold-50s to post from anywhere. That is a very easily abused privilege. Perhaps we should reconsider that as well? Maybe allow 50s to promote and shift the post from anywhere up to 100 or even back to 250.

you're right. i just turned gold a few days ago, and discovered that we could post CC. i know i have two CC videos on the sift right now. one is number 3 on the top 15 and the other is a lower voted video. i kind of want to let my top 15 video run it's course until it's out, but i guess i can discard my other one.

what should i do?

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

Leave what's already there alone.

I'd rather not be prescriptive and force this through code. But yes I would ask that as a community we adhere to our ComedyCentral boycott.

alright, from now on, i won't sift CC.

that's ok, special_ops, as I will now be posting exclusively from here.

wtf? are we simply going to ignore this issue until it's a big enough problem for each host that we're forced into some absurd ad hoc solution?

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

That Warner bros. link works for me here in Aussieland.

Random region blocking is a problem and pisses me off as much as anyone. I'm hoping that it's just part of the painful growing process of web video- and as it matures these stupid walls will come down.

>> ^dag:
That Warner bros. link works for me here in Aussieland.

That's just the user page. Do their vids work for you? The Chili Peppers vid caused problems for lots of folks (originally embedded here).

Random region blocking is a problem and pisses me off as much as anyone.

me too!

I'm hoping that it's just part of the painful growing process of web video- and as it matures these stupid walls will come down.

No offense dag, but wishful thinking won't solve this problem. Think about the nature of the companies we're talking about here. They are not likely to become less restrictive. My guess is that region specific embeds will spread. In other words, one version for US, one for continental Europe, etc. That's only a guess - I don't have a crystal ball anymore than you do. But that's the point - videosift will need to figure out a way to tailor the experience for users depending on their geographic location for a variety of possible reasons/hosts/content generators. I know that sucks, but it is certainly possible from a technical standpoint. The biggest problem is likely to be fractured comment threads.

The basic point is that disallowing embeds from an entire host is a Bad Idea, imho.

Sometimes, people just don't know. I didn't and I broke the 'rule'.

As new people join and more people gain these superpowers, the conversation about CC embeds being taboo will be forgotten or never known to begin with.

This should be accepted as a rational outcome and any resolution that is arrived at here should deal with this issue.

sooo..I got me some gold....what can I get for it ya whinin' bitches???? Cause I love Comedy Central about as far as I can imagine how easy it would be to throw most a you sorry motherfuckers.....

http://www.videosift.com/video/Whos-Really-Using-MySpace-SNL

hulu is ok, cause you can watch it in the us?

If this bias continues, I'm cancelling my subscription. I'll also regret my donation.

Turncoat!

i haven't embedded from them, and won't, until they just fucking let people watch.

oh. and it's not CC's fault, directly, imho.
Viacom blows donkeys. (CC, Mtv, Vh1, etc) i think i may have mentioned that earlier elsewhere, but i think smibbo would agree, it
bears repeating.

i wish Stewart, Colbert, Trey Parker, and Matt Stone would start a telethon, to buy CC right out from under Viacom, in a hostile takeover.

maybe i'll make that my next blog entry.

because it's a goddamn shame that half of what i think is the only watchable TV in the states, is owned by tightwad, proprietary, short-sighted fuckwads.

>> ^schma:
http://www.videosift.com/video/Whos-Really-Using-MySpace-SNL
hulu is ok, cause you can watch it in the us?
If this bias continues, I'm cancelling my subscription. I'll also regret my donation.


So you would rather we post these videos using a host like YouTube or MySpace right? Well here is the problem...the companies that are going to the trouble to "region block" the videos posted on their sites such as Hulu, CC, and Adult Swim are also very diligent about getting their content removed from the sites like YT and MySpace.

So we either use hosts like YT and then within a few days the video is dead so no one can see it. Or don't post the video at all...so no one can see it. Or post it from a legal source and those that are not blocked can see it.

I think it's selfish to demand that "if I can't see it then no one should see it". If you can't see it then you can't vote for it...if enough people can't vote for it then it will die in the queue. But if enough people can see it and do vote for it then why shouldn't the video be allowed to thrive?

I'm sorry you live in a region that is blocked....that really sucks. But how is it fair to demand that we ALL be blocked by banning these hosts?

Another issue- region blocking makes pruning the sift for dead videos that much more difficult for those outside the states.

>> ^djsunkid:
Another issue- region blocking makes pruning the sift for dead videos that much more difficult for those outside the states.

Actually...because these hosts are the legal copyright owners of the materiel these videos are far less likely to go dead in the first place.

Most of the deaded videos are that way because the video was killed by the host for violating copyright of the legal owner.

I fear you misunderstand me, Grimm. That might be my fault due to inability to express my views in a foreign language; or it might be yours, because you don't understand that one blocks the US and one blocks the rest of the world.

My question is: is it ok to post from Hulu, but not from CC?

Because that seems the "consensus".

I'm pretty sure you and I agree from what you write: Either you allow both or none. (If not, then I can't make sense from your post, because your arguments can be used from either side of the border)

I don't think I'll ever get a good answer to my question, though.

>> ^schma:
My question is: is it ok to post from Hulu, but not from CC?

The simple answer is no. At this time it is ok to post from either one...but it is not encouraged. That is the reason CC was removed as "blessed" host that anyone could post from.