*politics
*news

Adding video to channels (News, Politics) - requested by NetRunner.

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One down.......

Mancow is one of the biggest dinks on the airwaves.

The perfect start of an FAC!

Next up, Hannity.

Why didn't they cut his head off?

^quantumushroom, conservatives keep saying that and THAT IS NOT THE POINT!

Al Qaeda cut someones head off, yes that is terrible. What should we do in return you might ask? Where is the line? the line is LAW, and it's up to our government to make those laws. If people want to debate on the legality of waterboarding let them and then let them vote on it the way a civilized society does. The point is that we have voted on it and the law says it is torture. Can you dispute that?

This was a much friendlier atmosphere than what Christopher Hitchens did it in, and what the gitmo prisoners went through. And still he called it torture. That's gotta say something.

*fear *controversy

Adding video to channels (Controversy, Fear) - requested by kronosposeidon.

speak it Jigga-J!!

Tags for this video have been changed from 'waterboarding, torture, mancow' to 'waterboarding, torture, mancow, libertarian, Matthew Erich Muller, Mancow' - edited by MycroftHomlz

I'm not suggesting waterboarding isn't torture, but I wonder if a lot of more commonly-accepted interrogation techniques wouldn't be interpreted as torture by your average radio host.

your profession matters not, when you're giving an opinion on the torture being physically received, but that isnt your question.

i dont really understand the question, i guess.... or, maybe i do, and i don't understand why it's a question.

i think you're trying to say something about talk radio hosts... and obviously those run a gamut... so is there really an average? what bias have you formulated exists in the average host?

all questions that dont need to be answered.

I'm against Torture, including water boarding. Its UnAmerican to do. When it is done, the person(s) responsible either for authorizing it, or proceeding, have to hold themselves fully accountable to the law. And that is the problem the Republicans and conservatives have. They do not want to be held accountable to things they did, that are not just illegal, but out right immoral!

This guy lasted a few seconds and cracked. He wasn't tied down (shoe lace binding? come on), nor punished with beatings while this was going on. He could stop when he wanted.

Anyone, and I mean ANYONE, who says water boarding is not torture, should be water boarded. But if they 'tap out', they admit that its toture. I think Mr. Olbermann offered Hannity $1000/second. And Mr. Hannity has not taken the bet. He knows he's full of sh*t, just like all the other conservatives. This guy now has admited it. Only time will tell how deep his resolve is, to say what he experienced his torture.

I guess this was a cool video. But after watching these two videos, it's obvious that this guy went through a pussy version of waterboarding.
http://www.videosift.com/video/Christopher-Hitchens-is-Waterboarded
http://www.videosift.com/video/Playboy-Bets-He-Can-Take-15s-of-Waterboarding

This guy didn't even have his mouth covered! When Christopher Hitchens tried gasp for breath, he had a wet towel smothering him. Mancow seemed to be lying flat and just tilting his head back. I have no idea why they were concerned with elevating his feet. Not to mention, he was in a studio holding a squishy stress cow being waterboarded by a guy that admits he's not a professional.

^ I think that elevating the feet somehow changes the brain chemistry so a person can't hold their breath. I think.

Then again, it might have something to do with concentrating the water in the subjects head.

just shows you how retarded some people are . engine if you could get religious people to actually see how retarded they are.

>> ^quantumushroom:
Why didn't they cut his head off?


It's hard to listen to him make the case that Bush, Cheney and everyone else involved in water boarding are war criminals without a head numbnuts... =)

"...have to hold themselves fully accountable to the law. And that is the problem the Republicans and conservatives have"

Why do people continually make distinctions between republicrats and demicons? Party affiliation has very little to do with this issue. So what if water boarding is torture or not? For some, having to listen to people take sides with either party while discussing the politics of the United States is torture. For some, it's excruciating torture to have people who are seemingly educated, with the alleged ability to think critically, continually taking sides with one hydra's head or the other-Almost as mind-numbingly mundane as seeing video after video on the dead-horse subject of whether or not water boarding is torture.
Jesus, why not discuss whether or not the programming of a nation to take one side or the other on an issue is acceptable or healthy? Robotic media junkies with walking papers from the majority of secondary schools or universities in the western hemisphere somehow tend to become more and more self-righteous and religious in their fervor, as the geopolitical chaos becomes increasingly non-linear.

The semantics of the present day represented in a great deal of threads here on Videosift with political themes is what is torture...the English language being daily butchered to include more "newsspeak" at the sacrifice of common sense and intuition. It's painful to watch as the space on these servers is clogged with more and more armchair editorials of political events by lackeys and dupes who watch too much goddamn television.

Been lurking here for some time and and felt the need to address what should be obvious to most people satisfied with such diversion: That discussing these subjects ad-infinitum is counter-productive and a waste of brain time. Why belabor and moan while ignoring the masterful deception of news organizations in keeping the people of a nation preoccupied with simple symptoms of a greater problem-That of what is now an obvious puppet government in the U.S., and a nation whose peoples become more moronic and unable to process simple information with each new generation, who are convinced that more laws, and more prohibitions are the obvious way to repair the damage. Shut up about water boards, Gitmo, republicans and democrats, police brutality, etc already. Everyone let the shit get this way, no one is without fault. For fucks' sake, ween yourselves of the use of traditional currency for a change or learn some applicable skill to make your life on police planet a bit more comfortable and enjoyable for you and yours.
Happy to have offended the misguided sensibilities of the majority.

This is one of our local Chicago radio hosts. I used to listen to his show over 15 years ago when it was practically a Howard Stern Show clone, which is why it's pretty ironic to see him getting into politics and courting the Conservative movement and morals so much now. Kudos to him for swallowing his pride to admit it's torture, though.

>> ^Nithern:

This guy lasted a few seconds and cracked. He wasn't tied down (shoe lace binding? come on), nor punished with beatings while this was going on. He could stop when he wanted.
Anyone, and I mean ANYONE, who says water boarding is not torture, should be water boarded. But if they 'tap out', they admit that its toture.


Any torture denier who volunteers to be water boarded should be given the full experience. Strap them down tight, yell at them, and start pouring, when they tap out, keep pouring, until they're thrashing against their bindings. All the while asking them if they murdered their mothers not stopping until you get an affirmative answer. Then let them up, sobbing and wheezing, having pissed and shit themselves from fright. Then you can ask them if it's torture.

I'm glad to see some of the pro-'enhanced interrogation techniques' people getting their day in the sun. I can watch these videos all day long.

ok sallyjune, let me see if i've got this straight:

all politicians are the same, and care not at all for america.
the news media is designed to keep us arguing over issues in black and white.
the news media's design is part of what keeps politicians in power.
all americans are guilty of being duped by said media.
all americans are guilty of allowing said politicians to keep power.
arguing over issues in black and white is what keeps politicians in power.

therefore:
stop arguing over issues the news media has told you to.
stop using money.
learn to farm or build things.
watch world change around you.

????

this is not so much offensive as just dumb. i could understand if your answer was to debate issues that DO matter such as the structure of the american news media or the electoral system in this country, or perhaps what it is in american culture that makes people so willing to give up their freedoms. this is not your answer though. your answer is actually the same as those you deem moronic. you want to stick your head in the sand and live your life simply to make life "comfortable and enjoyable for you and yours."

this is exactly how we got where we are in the first place. that is exactly what the news media and politicians require in order to keep people frightened and willing to give up their freedoms.

welcome to the majority.

@youmakekittymad,
could not have said it better.
i was going to respond to sallyjune in a similar fashion.
now i dont have to=)

"you want to stick your head in the sand and live your life simply to make life "comfortable and enjoyable for you and yours."

Assumptions and perception-bound assessments that make one feel comfortable when faced with veracity are infantile and counter-productive. youmadelkittymad goes from one extreme to another with my suggestions. Did not say stop using money. Did not offer who might be included in the "you and yours": Could have included the planet's entire population now couldn't it. Enoch? You don't have to do anything you do not desire nor are compelled to do.

"farm or build things?" Inferred without evidence or acceptable reasoning.
Merely stated fact. That this issue of water boarding is represented here as some undeniable subject which must be resolved, that stopping it will make people feel better about what part they may have had in its cessation, and that there are an inordinate amount of videos posted on this site (and others) about it and that due to the programming pumped into homes and minds, through major media outlets, which are owned by folks who wish to guide the minds of the easily led. We have a nation in the U.S., of somnambuloids.

Much more important are the day's issues of some far more meaningful significance. Find those videos. It's much more easy to please the crowd and accumulate votes finding thousands about water boarding.

*the mob grows restless as meaning rears its ugly head
My head is as far out of the sand as a satellite in low orbit.

Most politicians are sucking the teat of special interest and lean increasingly more towards state control. Not all. The few that are not are the minority and get no air-time save to lambast and deride them.

One must try harder to chop a head off using a dull edge. Few more swings perhaps??

Funny thing is he knows he's in a room with friends, he's unrestrained, talked to kindly, knows there is a medic right near, knows he can end it at any time (and does.)

Actual terrorists are restrained, roughed up, screamed at, hooded so they don't even see whats about to happen to them, and then forced to undergo this for 15-30 seconds at a time, and undergo it more than 180 times each.

In the end, this guy I'm sure realizes just that, and knows.. instantly, it was torture. And he probably even cant imagine what it would be like under actual 'enhanced interrogation' (read: TORTURE!) circumstances.

Isn't it funny that every single self-absorbed pundit who insists this isn't torture, the minute they undergo it, they admit, torture, all the way. I mean don't they realize that through our history as a country any time it has ever been used on an American, we prosecuted the torturer for war crimes?

It's torture. End of discussion how about it?? The subject should have been concluded 823,467 video submissions ago, then perhaps,
"Move the hell on."

Funny how with 21 comment upvotes for the "Hannity" comment one can see aaaaallll the folks who have wasted time listening to the man. He has, thank the gods, still a place on the air-waves to continue to sell ad time with his blubbering. He's a weasel on par with most politicians and its fortunate we still have not gone the way of censorship with am/fm talk radio-Freedom of speech is really no freedom at all now days, however, bondage be evidenced here by the willingness of the common man to grab a torch and head to the castle. Any good regime change needs help from self-righteous, fervent, automatons.

Book burning in the 21st century present day amounts to shutting down any speech that offends anyone in any way. NWO is full of those ready to sacrifice true freedoms. Doesn't take a brain surgeon to read a teleprompter-masses are swayed with reason sacrificed on the altar of emotionalism.

I'm still waiting for video of a liberal DJ being aborted...

>> ^TangledThorns:
I'm still waiting for video of a liberal DJ being aborted...


I'm still waiting for anti-abortion conservatives to care for all of the unwanted children in the world.

>> ^rougy:
>> ^TangledThorns:
I'm still waiting for video of a liberal DJ being aborted...

I'm still waiting for anti-abortion conservatives to care for all of the unwanted children in the world.


Oh swish swish.

>> ^vairetube:
your profession matters not, when you're giving an opinion on the torture being physically received, but that isnt your question.
i dont really understand the question, i guess.... or, maybe i do, and i don't understand why it's a question.
i think you're trying to say something about talk radio hosts... and obviously those run a gamut... so is there really an average? what bias have you formulated exists in the average host?
all questions that dont need to be answered.

The question wasn't meant to be an attack on radio hosts - the point I was trying to make is that even conventional interrogation techniques might be perceived as torture by the layperson. (Again, I'm not suggesting waterboarding isn't.)


>> ^TangledThorns:
I'm still waiting for video of a liberal DJ being aborted...

>> ^rougy:
I'm still waiting for anti-abortion conservatives to care for all of the unwanted children in the world.

I'm still waiting for people to use a little perspective and understanding and stop turning every mention of a controversial topic into a slap-fight.

>> ^ReverendTed:
I'm still waiting for people to use a little perspective and understanding and stop turning every mention of a controversial topic into a slap-fight.

Look who's talking.

That was a reeeeeeeeally tame version of waterboarding, and even THAT terrified the guy to death.

"enhanced" interrogation... not torture. LOL. Eat it stupid ass neocons.

Waterboard the cameraman.

Waterboarding and the human body's reaction to it.

During this this technique, the feeling of drowning occurs through the collection of water and stimulation of nerves in the back of the nasal cavity.

In a topwater drowning scenario, a mixture of water and air is being inhaled into the lungs. The water settles from the bottom up and the lungs use the air. The lungs will function until they have been completely filled with water. Once the water has triggered nerve impulses in the nasal cavity, the body begins to accept death.

In waterboarding, this effect is given repeatedly. When the victim is sat up, the water flows from the nasal cavity into their lungs- and they might have the opportunity to cough it out. Then they are tilted back again.

Drowning = death. In a real waterboarding situation you make a person believe that they are about to die. Fucked up


The amount of water doesn't mean shit.
i'm not calling homeboy a liar but it feels more like a publicity stunt.
the "not a professional" torturer was a fucking meathead.

<sigh>

I hate what this waterboarding/torture debate has become. People daring each other. Political posturing. A subject for one TV show's host to berate another.

Disclosure: I fully believe waterboarding is torture.

I'm very worried thought that this is going to lead to, dare I say it, a meme, where fucktards are going to be doing this to each other in their basements and backyards. Or the next initiation method for frat boys.

In the end the point, the real debate, is going to be lost. While I think there may be some benefit in having naysayers take a try at this so they realise how wrong they are, I have a feeling in the end all this daring will be self-defeating if somehow this becomes a mainstream thing.

What's up with this new water boarding trend? Can't we change the subject? Who cares about waterboarding, it's not like it's mutilating you or anything. Check out some medieval torture ways, waterboarding is nothing compared to that.

some of those rare 'rational' conservatives.

uhmm...yea... err...ok. Somehow I don't think this was quite any where near what they actually did because...this is some tame shiat. Its going to take a bit more then pouring water over my mouth for 10 seconds to really scare me..I mean as one who swam alot when i was a kid...yea..holding my breath for 10 seconds wasn't exactly a feat of strength. Hell if you REALLY wanted to torture me, turn my head and pour that water into my ear... OMG I hated that!

I had originaly thought they had some how forced water into the mouth (via tube or what ever) and attempt to force it down the throat, in effect trying to actually drown you (which is the act of putting water in your lungs, NOT holding your breath) for a very brief period of time. Simply pouring water over my mouth while plugging my knows will just cause me to no longer breath until said water flow is gone at which point a few things can happen... nothing if I can last longer then the flow of water... or I black out due to lack of oxygen.

Anyways... I've seen worse torture in the movies... NOT to say I would ever condone this. It is clearly imprisonment with intent to do harm and on that alone merits its illegal-ness.

Actual terrorists are restrained, roughed up, screamed at, hooded so they don't even see whats about to happen to them, and then forced to undergo this for 15-30 seconds at a time, and undergo it more than 180 times each.

You're perpetuating an incorrect meme here. One terrorist was waterboarded that many times, and only 3 total.

When I was training to be in the Air Force, we had an OSI interrogator come in, and talk about all the dirty tricks they used to get confessions from people. Waterboarding wasn't one of them, being IMO too harsh for the Air Force.

But then again, in SERE training they waterboard the participants, but they certainly don't hook electrodes up to their genitals and run a lot of current through them, or chop different parts of their body off. So I'd say it's somewhere between acceptable practice (none of the OSI stuff disturbed me morally, and I'm someone who is very protective of civil liberties) and torture.

The scary thing is, waterboarding is only what the spooks have admitted to. So if this is what our professional liars are willing to let out, what are they not telling us about?

I'm sure once the "enhanced interrogators" get all warmed up and limber, the real tools come out.

Car batteries and jumper cables, tin snips, vice grips, large needles. Sick fucks have been perfecting this practice for decades, so my pedestrian guesses probably aren't even close. Normal humans can't even imagine.

This is why the CIA should be accountable to someone.

>> ^jmd:
uhmm...yea... err...ok. Somehow I don't think this was quite any where near what they actually did because...this is some tame shiat. Its going to take a bit more then pouring water over my mouth for 10 seconds to really scare me..I mean as one who swam alot when i was a kid...yea..holding my breath for 10 seconds wasn't exactly a feat of strength. Hell if you REALLY wanted to torture me, turn my head and pour that water into my ear... OMG I hated that!

You clearly don't understand waterboarding. It looks simple. "Oh, face full of water. I'll just hold my breath." If it were as easy as holding your breath and getting wet, then the average time to "uncle" wouldn't be ~15 seconds. There's an intense, overwhelming physiological reaction to the sensation.

Not only was this a lame example of water boarding. If anyone knows or has listened to this guy, they would know that this was all staged. Mancow Muller is a cheap, two-bit want-to-be imitation of Howard Stern. But is even more over-the-top with his theatrics. He's a huge wrestling fan and subscribes to the "bigger, and more outrageous is better" mentality when it comes to his show.

As you can see, if you are not concentrating on the subject, but paying close attention to his reaction in the video, Mr. Muller is a really, really, really bad actor. His reaction is contrived. And very poorly contrived at that. I mean seriously, he lasts what, 2 seconds? And as many others have already said, this was nothing even remotely resembling what a real water boarding would be like. I was going to post this a few days ago when it appeared on YouTube, but did not because I thought for sure most of the intelligent people on here would see right through the obvious and very poor acting job of Mr. Muller and the completely fake "demonstration" of water boarding and not give it one single vote. Guess I was wrong.

Not trying to offend anyone, I seriously thought you guys would see right through this facade. Very surprising.

ShakaUVM,

Yes, the people that gave that '3 times waterboard' figure, where proved WRONG, with evidence that one the enemy combatants, was tortured well over 180 times by the method. So, they then said 'five times'. Would you take someone serious, if they had lied over something important? THEN, in the face of the facts, lie a second time, even with the evidence is before them.

If we went back, and asked Americans 20 years ago, or 30, or 50, or 150, whether torture for the sake of national security, means ignoring laws, Amendments of the US Constitution, and internation treaties? There would be a resounding 'NO'.

Am still amazed Americans need to have this discussion, the "is it or is it not torture?" I think it detracts from the more important facts that came out from all this. The case for that has always been closed, its pretty clear from day 1 it was torture.

- the administration put torture forward as a policy
- the OLC wrote laws and legislation allowing torture to occur
- torture was renamed and regulated in an effort to legalize its application
- it was carried out in 3 US military complexes in Abu Ghraib, Gitmo and Bagram airbase
- it was actively applied by forward intelligence agents with the US military and was encouraged
- it was used as well through US cooperation with states that torture (egypt, syria, uzbekistan and etc)
- the administration lied about torture being 'isolated bad apples' post Abu Ghraib
- private military contractors were involved in its application and administration
- the military and intelligence apparatus was forced into producing results and green light into using torture techniques.
- far worse techniques were used other then water boarding which are still being blacklisted
- they did everything to cover it up, then spin the argument around one technique, then make it seem necessary, remember that once the scandal broke the KSM argument was put forward
- its been shown not to work at all no single intelligence agency has put forward any actionable intelligence produced through torture
- there has been no ticking time bomb scenarios a la 24
- there will be no persecutions of those who were responsible for these policies
- massive international damage to american standing

So, when's Dick Chaney's turn?