*quality

Boosting this quality contribution up in the Hot Listing - declared quality by Boise_Lib.

The attacker should have a record, that is flat out assault. 3 day suspension ? I doubt it, not with it hitting the fan and going all over the internet. Doesnt matter what type of apology that bully gives, he should have a criminal record.

Seriously though, this makes me tear up with rage. What makes it worse is everyone standing around doing nothing. And yes, that kid needs to be charge with criminal assault and hate crime (or whatever it's called in Ohio).

Those sound like some really hard punches. Fuck. I hope that's how hard that kids dad beats him when he goes home at night. (not really, but still, kid's a fucking asshole).

Title is a bit misleading if the mom's pressing charges!

The point is the school is doing nothing except a slap on the wrist. The mom shouldn't have to press it, the school should. I think, at least.

>> ^FlowersInHisHair:

Title is a bit misleading if the mom's pressing charges!

I understand fully the implications of bullying and that there should be punishments for it. However sending a student to prison for felony assault I cannot support. Our prisons are some of the worst places imaginable, I know I've been there. You will not be solving a problem or educating or fixing anything you will only be enforcing the concept of an unjust world on an individual.

It does more harm than good, there has got to be a better solution.

EDIT: I know I'll get flack for this and that's fine, but again you will set out trying to stop a bully and you'll end up creating something much worse.

>> ^artician:

Those sound like some really hard punches. Fuck. I hope that's how hard that kids dad beats him when he goes home at night. (not really, but still, kid's a fucking asshole).

I'd be willing to bet that dad is probably a violent homophobe as well, his beating came in the form of a high-five.

besides the homophobic backgroud: what happened in schools that suddenly beatings are so brutal? there has always been fighting in schools and there always will be i suppose but back in my days it was just a simple hit and not even to the face or anything. a simple bruise at most. but nowadays? kids act like loonatics, going full assault on each other. beatings to the head, kicking, continuing even if their victim lies on the ground... i just can't get my head around it how violent youth has become.

It's our culture. It's Hollywood. A peaceful rectification doesn't sell tickets.

A tad oversimplified imo. Here in Switzerland we gobble just as much Hollywood as Americans do, but when stuff like that happens in school a) the teachers are on the kids back in a matter of seconds b) the kid goes to court (if found guilty: criminal record and fines to pay, not jail time).

I think the first part of your response is closer to the point: it's a culture of tolerating homophobia (and other forms of hate/violence towards the Other) as "freedom of speech/religion". At least that's how it seems seen from this side of the pond.

>> ^rougy:

It's our culture. It's Hollywood. A peaceful rectification doesn't sell tickets.

>> ^conan:

besides the homophobic backgroud: what happened in schools that suddenly beatings are so brutal? there has always been fighting in schools and there always will be i suppose but back in my days it was just a simple hit and not even to the face or anything. a simple bruise at most. but nowadays? kids act like loonatics, going full assault on each other. beatings to the head, kicking, continuing even if their victim lies on the ground... i just can't get my head around it how violent youth has become.


Super violent outbursts are exceptional. Remember these kids are pounced on for showing any masculinity at all in school - sometimes they snap but usually not. Schools are run by soccer moms now and they're trying to androgynize all the boys completely. I was shocked to hear from my nephews than in their school the girls get in more fights than the boys. Most the boys I see now are 'edgy' Bieber haircut guitar playing moody half women.

3 days out of school suspension is exactly why shit like this still happens.

If you wanted to beat someone up and you knew after you did you'd get to sit at home and play on your Xbox for 3 days would you hesitate? Well ok maybe not you but if you were a bastardized version of yourself.

How is this not instantly a criminal offence? Victim, offender, video evidence. Please post any news found updating this story.

Something that just came to mind and I'm not sure if it's relevant or not. Isn't Glee set in Ohio?

Orwellian "hate crimes" are total bullsh1te. Does it matter why some thug attacks an innocent? Maybe he hated the logo on the victim's jacket. Maybe earlier he saw the victim had a large amount of cash and attacked him to steal it under the guise of bullying. Not only are hate crimes unconstitutional, as critics point out, they make crimes harder to prosecute.

Punish the crime, not what is the assumed motive.

>> ^quantumushroom:

Orwellian "hate crimes" are total bullsh1te. Does it matter why some thug attacks an innocent? Maybe he hated the logo on the victim's jacket. Maybe earlier he saw the victim had a large amount of cash and attacked him to steal it under the guise of bullying. Not only are hate crimes unconstitutional, as critics point out, they make crimes harder to prosecute.
Punish the crime, not what is the assumed motive.


Oh critics say something...well they must be right...make crimes harder to prosecute...yeah must be true. Please present some evidence for your claims.

Also I disagree it's Orwellian unless it's the powerful subjugating the weak with thought crimes. When it's a law for protecting the weak and minorities, I don't agree. Just doesn't make sense unless the scales are balanced.

Here is the simplest way I can think of to describe it. @quantumushroom

Say some teenagers spray paint their names on one side of a Mosque and a neo-nazi group spray paints 'death to all Muslims' on the other side. Is there a difference between these crimes? Is there a difference in intent? Absolutely. The teenagers have committed vandalism. The neo-nazis have committed both vandalism and a targeted act of terrorism against a group of people.

Attacking someone because of their sexual orientation is both battery and a calculated act of terrorism against a group of people.

You don't have to agree with it, but do you at least get the distinction?

Will the bully's stereotypical treatment in prison fit the crime?

The idea is that the crime is politically motivated. It is their status within society that is being targeted not themselves as individuals. What makes it a hate crime is the likelihood of it triggering others to do the same in a way that a non-politically motivated instance of crime would not.

You are smart enough to know this already QM.

Oh critics say something...well they must be right...make crimes harder to prosecute...yeah must be true. Please present some evidence for your claims.

http://articles.latimes.com/1995-01-29/local/me-25875_1_hate-crime-cases

Also I disagree it's Orwellian unless it's the powerful subjugating the weak with thought crimes. When it's a law for protecting the weak and minorities, I don't agree. Just doesn't make sense unless the scales are balanced.

What's more powerful than government and its badly written, randomly-enforced laws?


----

Here is the simplest way I can think of to describe it. @quantumushroom

Say some teenagers spray paint their names on one side of a Mosque and a neo-nazi group spray paints 'death to all Muslims' on the other side. Is there a difference between these crimes? Is there a difference in intent? Absolutely. The teenagers have committed vandalism. The neo-nazis have committed both vandalism and a targeted act of terrorism against a group of people.

Attacking someone because of their sexual orientation is both battery and a calculated act of terrorism against a group of people.

You don't have to agree with it, but do you at least get the distinction?

I'm aware of the difference, however, if someone hands out flyers and holds a sign saying "Exterminate all left-handed albinos", that is protected speech. What the 'hate crime' lobby is saying is, if the same individual spray paints this message on a wall that is not his property, he is to be punished both for vandalism AND the message; the latter would then be punishment of thoughtcrime.

---

The idea is that the crime is politically motivated. It is their status within society that is being targeted not themselves as individuals. What makes it a hate crime is the likelihood of it triggering others to do the same in a way that a non-politically motivated instance of crime would not.

You are smart enough to know this already QM.

Per my previous excellent examples, we can only make assumptions as to the intent of a criminal. Do you seriously think some violent teenaged punk targeting a weaker target has political motivations? How do you prove it? You cannot. A much more plausible but equally unknowable motive is that this school does not swiftly punish offenders for committing acts of violence.


Changing tracks slightly, this video is also an excellent example of how you cannot expect government to save your bacon and watch over you all the time. Every feminine-acting boy--indeed, every picked-on youth--must decide for himself at some point, though he may not like training, whether it would be worthwhile to learn rudimentary boxing or martial arts, or at the very least, how to take a punch. Krav maga on youtube: 25K videos.

What if it can be proven?

File, idea & video sharing.... <----Why I LOVE the internet.
A w-a-y too easy access to a victim humiliation broadcasting tool.... <---- Why I HATE it.
^Upvoted^

Don't go overboard guys- should the kid be suspended/kicked out school? Definitely. But prison/criminal record? If your argument is that it is for setting an example you really should check your moral compass (because precisely this way of thinking leads to these events).

If it could be proven, as in the thug admitted that the only reason he attacked is because the other kid seemed gay? Other crimes aside, if you punish the thug for that, then please openly abandon freedom of speech and thought in the name of safety and protecting feelings, because you can't have it both ways.

Apparently Asian kids are targeted for bullying more often than gays, but Asians have never been in vogue with the left. Maybe next year!




>> ^Kofi:

What if it can be proven?