CA Prop 8 is Hate.
[soapbox]
I don't like to talk much about my grandfather. I don't think most people would understand the admiration I have for him. He was a WWII veteran. He survived the beaches of Normandy on D-Day. He marched across Europe, liberating concentration camps. He served his nation proudly.
But when he came back, the country he fought for institutionalized him for his... and I hate this word... "queerness" of character. They put him through electroshock therapy, a side-effect of which wiped clean many horrific memories he held of his service, for better or for worse.
My grandfather spent the last part of his life doing what he could for the San Francisco community. He sponsored people through AA, and donated his time and money to various charities, including The Names Project, better known as The AIDS Quilt. It was while volunteering that he met the man who he would share the last chapter of his life with, a Chinese national-turned-US Veteran. This man became as much a member of our family as anyone could, and I keep their dog tags together as a reminder that even though they departed at different times from this world, that they'll always be together - love is a force that bonded them, and their mementos I keep will always be with one another.
My grandmother never divorced my grandfather - she had a decent insurance plan as a College teacher that she would never want my grandfather to not be covered under. They lived apart from the time my dad was in 6th grade, but remained in constant contact, and would always be at family functions together. They always considered themselves "husband and wife." On my grandfathers deathbed, she confessed that she still cared deeply for him, and that she had no regrets for marrying and having 3 kids with a gay man, for the lives they both led.
My grandfather would want me to vote against Proposition 8 on the California ballots. If there's one thing I learned from him, it is that love, in all its forms and shades and colors, love is the most beautiful thing to have and share in this world. To say that someone's expression of love is less valid than another, simply because of some silly, superficial thing as gender, is an absurdity and a gigantic step backwards for civil rights.
It sickens me to hear the proponents of prop 8 justify their hatred and bigotry. They've been spreading lies told by children to push their message of intolerance. It disgusts me to think that hate is still a "family value" in religious households. These are the people who put my grandfather in an Asylum. They were the ones who put the electrodes against his temples. They threw the switch, erasing memories in a misguided attempt to erase what they didn't like about my grandfather. They are the religious conservatives, spreading lies and misinformation to goad voters into fearing homosexuals. "Love thy neighbor, unless he's a fag," they scream from their pulpits, missing the point of the teachings they claim to hold close so far, its ridiculous. What part of "universal love" do they not understand? It boggles the mind.
I'm urging all of my fellow Californian voters to join me in voting No on Prop 8. We need to send a message to religious conservatives that bigotry has no place in the State's Constitution, that Hate is not a family value, that the love shared by two consenting adults is always a beautiful thing, no matter who they are.
I'll close with a letter I sent to the editor of my local newspaper a few years ago. It got printed, and it is one of the pieces of writing I am most proud of.
--
Twenty years from now, when homosexuals have been granted all the same protections and benefits of heterosexual married couples, we will look back disdainfully toward those who stood in their way.
The so-called “Champions of Marriage” who seek to prevent this change will be viewed as the backwards bigots they are, unable to get along with the rest of humanity, akin to the KKK and those who attempted to thwart the civil rights movements of the 1960s.
In this day of war, genocide, famine, rape, poverty and stealing, does it really matter to you that your neighbor seeks comfort in the arms of another man or woman, and why would this thought bring discomfort to you? Maybe a better question is, “If two consenting adults decided to consummate their affections towards each other in the peace and privacy of their own home, what business is it to you?” And if you’re in a quandary about it, let me give you the short answer: “None, whatsoever.”
To me, there is nothing moral about denying the love shared between two people. To deny that is to deny one’s pursuit of happiness.
--
[/soapbox]
(I just showed this to my dad, who offered up some points and edits to make).
I don't like to talk much about my grandfather. I don't think most people would understand the admiration I have for him. He was a WWII veteran. He survived the beaches of Normandy on D-Day. He marched across Europe, liberating concentration camps. He served his nation proudly.
But when he came back, the country he fought for institutionalized him for his... and I hate this word... "queerness" of character. They put him through electroshock therapy, a side-effect of which wiped clean many horrific memories he held of his service, for better or for worse.
My grandfather spent the last part of his life doing what he could for the San Francisco community. He sponsored people through AA, and donated his time and money to various charities, including The Names Project, better known as The AIDS Quilt. It was while volunteering that he met the man who he would share the last chapter of his life with, a Chinese national-turned-US Veteran. This man became as much a member of our family as anyone could, and I keep their dog tags together as a reminder that even though they departed at different times from this world, that they'll always be together - love is a force that bonded them, and their mementos I keep will always be with one another.
My grandmother never divorced my grandfather - she had a decent insurance plan as a College teacher that she would never want my grandfather to not be covered under. They lived apart from the time my dad was in 6th grade, but remained in constant contact, and would always be at family functions together. They always considered themselves "husband and wife." On my grandfathers deathbed, she confessed that she still cared deeply for him, and that she had no regrets for marrying and having 3 kids with a gay man, for the lives they both led.
My grandfather would want me to vote against Proposition 8 on the California ballots. If there's one thing I learned from him, it is that love, in all its forms and shades and colors, love is the most beautiful thing to have and share in this world. To say that someone's expression of love is less valid than another, simply because of some silly, superficial thing as gender, is an absurdity and a gigantic step backwards for civil rights.
It sickens me to hear the proponents of prop 8 justify their hatred and bigotry. They've been spreading lies told by children to push their message of intolerance. It disgusts me to think that hate is still a "family value" in religious households. These are the people who put my grandfather in an Asylum. They were the ones who put the electrodes against his temples. They threw the switch, erasing memories in a misguided attempt to erase what they didn't like about my grandfather. They are the religious conservatives, spreading lies and misinformation to goad voters into fearing homosexuals. "Love thy neighbor, unless he's a fag," they scream from their pulpits, missing the point of the teachings they claim to hold close so far, its ridiculous. What part of "universal love" do they not understand? It boggles the mind.
I'm urging all of my fellow Californian voters to join me in voting No on Prop 8. We need to send a message to religious conservatives that bigotry has no place in the State's Constitution, that Hate is not a family value, that the love shared by two consenting adults is always a beautiful thing, no matter who they are.
I'll close with a letter I sent to the editor of my local newspaper a few years ago. It got printed, and it is one of the pieces of writing I am most proud of.
--
Twenty years from now, when homosexuals have been granted all the same protections and benefits of heterosexual married couples, we will look back disdainfully toward those who stood in their way.
The so-called “Champions of Marriage” who seek to prevent this change will be viewed as the backwards bigots they are, unable to get along with the rest of humanity, akin to the KKK and those who attempted to thwart the civil rights movements of the 1960s.
In this day of war, genocide, famine, rape, poverty and stealing, does it really matter to you that your neighbor seeks comfort in the arms of another man or woman, and why would this thought bring discomfort to you? Maybe a better question is, “If two consenting adults decided to consummate their affections towards each other in the peace and privacy of their own home, what business is it to you?” And if you’re in a quandary about it, let me give you the short answer: “None, whatsoever.”
To me, there is nothing moral about denying the love shared between two people. To deny that is to deny one’s pursuit of happiness.
--
[/soapbox]
(I just showed this to my dad, who offered up some points and edits to make).
35 Comments
rottenseedI'm actually reading my prop book right now. As I'm only on prop 2 and obviously procrastinating I agree. Thank you for sharing your awesome story. It really is important to get these personal accounts of how our laws affect people.
kronosposeidon^What he said.
*quality
siftbotAwarding Kagenin with one star point for this contribution to Sift Talk - declared quality by kronosposeidon.
eric3579Thanks for sharing.
Someone *quality this post and I will throw you my next promote.
siftboteric3579 cannot award a quality point for this Sift Talk post because eric3579 does not have enough Power Points - ignoring quality request by eric3579. (You can always purchase more Power Points.)
eric3579I think this video somewhat speaks to this subject.
http://www.videosift.com/video/Marriage-is-about-and-nothing-else-matters
kagenin says...>> ^eric3579:
I think this video somewhat speaks to this subject.
http://www.videosift.com/video/Marriage-is-about-and-nothing-else-mat
ters
Yeah. I really liked that poem, thanks for posting that here. I hadn't seen it yet. Thanks for all the kind words and support. And awesome burning man avatar, I'm bummed I couldn't make it to that this year, but I was fortunate enough to go the last two years. Hoping to make it to next year's burn.
Thank you kind folks of the sift. Protecting our civil rights shouldn't seem so radical.
alien_conceptOh man, thank you for talking about all of that with us. That is a great story, ever thought about writing a book about it?
If I could I would move to Cali right now just so I could vote No. What the fuck is all this about? Someone point me in the right direction, i'm a lowly english girl, I know nothing...
alien_conceptAnd seeing as I can now, I see absolute justification in *stickying this greatness
siftbotStickying this post at the top of Sift Talk - sticky requested by alien_concept.
berticusMakes me so happy to come here and read something like this from someone who is a) male, b) heterosexual, and c) a gamer, since I was just playing a videogame and had to listen to homophobic nonsense over ventrilo (where it is accepted without question). I see KP already beat me to a quality, so can I offer to promote one of your vids, of your choosing?
Farhad2000I hope it fails. The government and state has no business in what happens in peoples bedrooms, all those people who complain about big government and socialism are pushing forward laws that control social aspects. Sickening.
On a separate note, I hope the word gay and faggot stops being related to homosexuals. People shouldn't be labeled, but those two words are such good descriptors for some many people that I met, and they aren't homosexuals.
rottenseed^well, in all fairness, everybody else has derogatory descriptors. So if homosexuals want fair, they get it from both ends (no pun intended)
I think that word can become very powerful if we all stop using it. Eventually it can gain the strength of the "N" bomb. I say keep it in circulation and use it as often as possible to mean a lot of different things.
blankfistExcellent Sift Talk Post, Kagenin! I loved the story about your grandfather.
As I explained in my broader proposition post, the government has no place managing marriage. Marriage is a religious institution and by having our government honor it and give tax incentives to those who are married, our government is showing its religious bias. This is a terrible proposition, and I am certainly voting against it.
BillOreillyIf I lived in the cesspool of California (thank goodness I don't), I would definitely vote for Prop 8--this country is morally bereft enough without San Francisco's mayor performing gay marriages with schoolkids attending...
NordlichReiterOne thing that can be done now, to ease the pain of marriage woes, is to seek Civil Union, its marriage under a different name.
Government should have no say unto who can be married and who cannot be in this day and age.
If a can marry a African(American)woman, an Asian woman, a woman of any nationality, then any man or woman should be able to marry if they so choose to do so, another man or woman.
The days of telling people what they can and cannot do in their lives, so long as it does nothing to hurt physically any other person have been over since the Bill of Rights was ratified in the year 1791 on the 15th day of December, by the state of Virginia the last state needed to ratify. Page Thirty "The U.S. Constitution And Fascinating, Facts About It".
Rest Assured that your rights are protected by the Constitution, and you should be prepared to do every thing legally necessary to protect these rights, so long as these actions do not physically injure any one else.
EklekThanks or sharing your story! A real slice of life..
When I read about the "treatment" of homosexuality at the time, I reminded the lifestory of Alan Turing..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Turing#Prosecution_and_death
berticus^ which reminded me of this.
kagenin says...>> ^Eklek:
Thanks or sharing your story! A real slice of life..
When I read about the "treatment" of homosexuality at the time, I reminded the lifestory of Alan Turing..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Turing#Prosecution_and_death
Thank you VERY much for mentioning Alan Turing, one of the brightest minds of his era, a life tragically cut short before we could see what other potential he might have been capable of. He's nothing short of a hero who's contributions to technology sparked the information age we live in today. It sickens me that he was persecuted for his notion of love, despite making contributions to the world that helped end the largest conflict in history to date.
>> ^NordlichReiter:
One thing that can be done now, to ease the pain of marriage woes, is to seek Civil Union, its marriage under a different name.
My gripe with "Civil Unions" is that it's proponents aim for it to be a "Separate but Equal" institution. The Supreme court found "Separate" to be inherently "not equal" during the Civil Rights era. While I appreciate the notion as a step in the right direction, it's not a big enough step to satisfy my desire for real equality.
Thanks again for the kind words, everyone. I'm really glad to see so many free-thinkers here on the sift. I'm still bummed to see so many "Yes on 8" signs and bumper-stickers on the road, though, but I just have to keep telling myself that it is they who are in the minority on this issue, and hope that those who feel the same way as I do will exercise their vote to reflect it.
BillO, try not to drink too much haterade, that stuff is bad for you.
blankfistIn the 60s, the blacks formed the Black Panthers to protect their civil rights. I may not agree with everything the Black Panthers did, but they had good cause if you ask me. I often wonder why the gays and lesbians in this country don't band together in this way? Maybe the... Pink Panthers?
JTZThank you very much for share it with us! It was very moving!
and blankfist, most of them have banded together in "Gay & Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation" and "Gay and Lesbian Alliance".
swampgirlMoving. Thanks for sharing. Alien is right^ this would make a good read, or screenplay.
mkone*quality
siftbotmkone cannot award a quality point for this Sift Talk post because mkone does not have enough Power Points - ignoring quality request by mkone. (You can always purchase more Power Points.)
CaptainPlanet420Everyone I meet says "don't go to California" because it is worse than it used to be. It's pretty much becoming the New "Jersey". This pretty well exemplifies it, since it shouldn't even be an issue. Funny how our founding fathers didn't feel the need for flamers to have special "rights." It is only through the last 50 years of sexual perversion that we are faced with this disgusting and unnatural dilemma. If you "free-thinkers" had grown up before the 60's, you wouldn't have had the "free thought" to develop these ideas yourself. You're all just following the leader...so sad. And oh please, let's hear about I'm homophobic, while you spew hateful and cursing vitriol.
gwiz665I think this is a bit of a frivolous debate.
I'm all for any couple having the exact same rights and so on, but "marriage" is a religious word, which I think they can keep to themselves. It's like saying you want to be confirmed, even though you're a hindu.
Why does "marriage" even have any civil advantages? Civil unions should be what marriage is thought of as now, and the term marriage could just be exclusive to Christians, but only a title.
Grimm>> ^CaptainPlanet420:
Everyone I meet says "don't go to California" because it is worse than it used to be.
Everyone you meet? How does that come up in conversation? How is it that everyone you meet not only knows what CA is like now but can compare it to what it used to be like?
The worst things about living in CA is how crowded it is. Why is it crowded? Because of all the people who move here from other states and countries. I guess they havn't got your memo about "don't go to California" that you and everyone you meet knows about.
Regarding our Founding Fathers...they weren't perfect you know. They also didn't feel the need for blacks to have equal rights or "special rights" as you put it.
nibiyabi>> ^gwiz665:
I think this is a bit of a frivolous debate.
I'm all for any couple having the exact same rights and so on, but "marriage" is a religious word, which I think they can keep to themselves. It's like saying you want to be confirmed, even though you're a hindu.
Why does "marriage" even have any civil advantages? Civil unions should be what marriage is thought of as now, and the term marriage could just be exclusive to Christians, but only a title.
I agree -- ideally, the government wouldn't recognize marriage for anyone, but civil unions for everyone. Let private institutions hand out "marriage certificates" if they wish. However, I value justice over semantics, and I highly doubt my stance will ever be adopted, so the next best thing to civil unions for everyone is marriages for everyone.
CaptainPlanet420>> ^Grimm:
>> ^CaptainPlanet420:
Everyone I meet says "don't go to California" because it is worse than it used to be.
Everyone you meet? How does that come up in conversation? How is it that everyone you meet not only knows what CA is like now but can compare it to what it used to be like?
The worst things about living in CA is how crowded it is. Why is it crowded? Because of all the people who move here from other states and countries. I guess they havn't got your memo about "don't go to California" that you and everyone you meet knows about.
Regarding our Founding Fathers...they weren't perfect you know. They also didn't feel the need for blacks to have equal rights or "special rights" as you put it.
Yes, everyone I meet. The conversation? Well I doubt you have met as many millionaires and former Californians with houses in multiples states, whether I want to meet them or not. Yes, the immigrants and wackos move to California, but those aren't the normal people I deal with.
And yes, if white people had sold themselves into slavery like blacks did, then I wouldn't expect they'd get many initial rights in Africa either. MASTER OF THE OBVIOUS.
GrimmI got it now...the most populated state in the country by far (12% of total U.S. pop. with Texas coming in 2nd with 8%) got that way because of immigrants and all the outcasts/wackos from the rest of the country moved here and the normal rich people have fled the state. I'm glad we are clear on that now...for a second I thought you were just pulling this stuff out of your ass.
Also Master of the Obvious..the point YOU were making was that the founding fathers didn't give gays equal rights. It is irrelevant who sold who in what country. The fact is they didn't give blacks equal rights at the time and they didn't give women equal rights at the time...so? What does that have to do with today?
>> ^CaptainPlanet420:
Yes, everyone I meet. The conversation? Well I doubt you have met as many millionaires and former Californians with houses in multiples states, whether I want to meet them or not. Yes, the immigrants and wackos move to California, but those aren't the normal people I deal with.
And yes, if white people had sold themselves into slavery like blacks did, then I wouldn't expect they'd get many initial rights in Africa either. MASTER OF THE OBVIOUS.
dagComment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)
*unsticky
siftbotUnstickying this post from the top of Sift Talk - unsticky requested by dag.
kagenin says...Guess the sun has set on my first sticky'd post. Thanks again for all the kind words and support. I'm really glad that people enjoyed this piece, and I like how the discussions have gone.
Hopefully, this won't be the last... but the next one may come for a while.
My girlfriend and I have had do move back into her Mom's place, and it's too far off the beaten trails to get DSL. I'll be looking into other broadband options, but there are a few coffee shops with free WiFi that I'll be mooching off of in the mean time.
Thanks again folks, the support means a lot to me. Let's hope this prop gets flushed down the drain with the conservatives' dreams of taking the white house for a third consecutive term.
CaptainPlanet420>> ^Kagenin:
Guess the sun has set on my first sticky'd post. Thanks again for all the kind words and support. I'm really glad that people enjoyed this piece, and I like how the discussions have gone.
Hopefully, this won't be the last... but the next one may come for a while.
My girlfriend and I have had do move back into her Mom's place, and it's too far off the beaten trails to get DSL. I'll be looking into other broadband options, but there are a few coffee shops with free WiFi that I'll be mooching off of in the mean time.
Thanks again folks, the support means a lot to me. Let's hope this prop gets flushed down the drain with the conservatives' dreams of taking the white house for a third consecutive term.
Good luck on that dialup buddy, I'm with ya. Hopefully when you're outta high school you can afford some BB.
kagenin says...>> ^CaptainPlanet420:
>> ^Kagenin:
Guess the sun has set on my first sticky'd post. Thanks again for all the kind words and support. I'm really glad that people enjoyed this piece, and I like how the discussions have gone.
Hopefully, this won't be the last... but the next one may come for a while.
My girlfriend and I have had do move back into her Mom's place, and it's too far off the beaten trails to get DSL. I'll be looking into other broadband options, but there are a few coffee shops with free WiFi that I'll be mooching off of in the mean time.
Thanks again folks, the support means a lot to me. Let's hope this prop gets flushed down the drain with the conservatives' dreams of taking the white house for a third consecutive term.
Good luck on that dialup buddy, I'm with ya. Hopefully when you're outta high school you can afford some BB.
Thanks, Ass. I can afford my broadband. AT&T won't upgrade their rural-area lines to support DSL service.
And I'm in College.
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