Actually, the "fundies" are following the qur'an and the hadith, much more than the "moderates":

"Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it [...]" (2:216)

"Jihad is your duty" and "Paradise is in the shadow of swords" (hadith)

See "The End of Faith" by Sam Harris for an excellent analysis of Islam's inherent violence.

You can always count on TYT to make an argument like a couple of retards. I find it ironic that these so called "ultra-liberals" are never able to actually look at a situation and analyze it like adults, they're just the left-wing version of their right-wing extremist equivalents (though that is definitely the preferable version).
At the very least be intelligent and honest enough to admit that the Muslims in question are honestly offended and rightly so, the whole point was to offend them. Am I saying they have any right to send death threats to anybody? or even go around campus erasing drawings? no. But when someone tries to make fun of someone else's beliefs you don't have to be a genius to expect someone will be offended. The fact they can't handle their being offended like adults is another problem and whether or not this whole draw Mohammad day is an admirable move or just some cheap shot at Muslims is again, unrelated. Bravo TYT, you are morons.

It should be a 1st Amendment right to say anything. Even "fire!" in a theater. There, I said it.

Actually Ninja, I think they made two really great points.

1. Their faith comes across as really weak by being threatened by a cartoon (which I've been saying for a long time).

2. The rule is that Muslims shouldn't draw Mohammad, just the same as Muslims shouldn't eat pork. They don't go around stopping others from eating pork, why stop others from violating other rules that only apply to Muslims?

But whatever, you seem so intent oh hating TYT I doubt this will make any difference to you.

ponceleon, don't get me wrong, I'm far from sympathetic with these Islamic extremists, but to suggest they're not really offended is just plain dumb. Are Christian fanatics not offended when Jesus is made fun of? This whole attitude of trying to explain to people why they should or shouldn't be offended by explaining to them what their faith dictates is right and wrong is childish, and it's none of their business. The whole point of South Park humor is exploiting these points and making fun of them, if it wasn't so offensive we probably wouldn't find it so entertaining. The moment you stop criticizing them for their actions and start criticizing their opinions and emotions you cross the line...

>> ^NinjaInHeat:

You can always count on TYT to make an argument like a couple of retards. I find it ironic that these so called "ultra-liberals" are never able to actually look at a situation and analyze it like adults, they're just the left-wing version of their right-wing extremist equivalents (though that is definitely the preferable version).
At the very least be intelligent and honest enough to admit that the Muslims in question are honestly offended and rightly so, the whole point was to offend them. Am I saying they have any right to send death threats to anybody? or even go around campus erasing drawings? no. But when someone tries to make fun of someone else's beliefs you don't have to be a genius to expect someone will be offended. The fact they can't handle their being offended like adults is another problem and whether or not this whole draw Mohammad day is an admirable move or just some cheap shot at Muslims is again, unrelated. Bravo TYT, you are morons.


Are you being ironic? Cause Ana more or less said what you just said.

braindonut: You're right, to be honest I couldn't keep listening after his initial speech, I watched her part now, too bad it's drowned out by his blabbering, before and after...

Depictions of Mohammed are not forbidden by the Qur'an, but in certain hadith. As such, certain sects have problems with them and others do not.

The term for forbidding depictions of holy people or the divine is Aniconism. It's not unique to Islam and has been a feature of most major religions at one time or another.

Aniconism is to prevent idolatry, so expecting people of other religions to adhere is beyond ridiculous.

What I would really like to see come out of this protest is really well done, respectful depictions of Mohammed. I think that would better serve a freedom of speech protest than the stick-figure drawings of Mohammed having gay sex and blowing things up that I am anticipating.

>> ^NinjaInHeat:

Am I saying they have any right to [...] go around campus erasing drawings? no.

No? From the perspective of free speech, how is someone drawing a stick figure on the sidewalk different from someone washing it off?

I'd compare this to the Darwin fish-sprouting-legs. You could easily argue that poking fun at Christians, or "intentionally offending" them is the whole point of that logo (I'd probably agree with that myself). Are the Jesus fundies going to be offended by it? Yes. Are the rank and file, in church on Easter and Christmas people going to be offended by it? Possibly, but if they are at all it won't be anywhere near as offended as the fundies.

I think what Cenk is arguing is that if some Christian group started making a fuss about the Darwin fish, saying "I find that image offensive", "they are just trying to stir the pot", etc. they would get no consideration whatsoever. We'd just tell them to get over it. But beyond that, I think he is suggesting that among the members of this hypothetical group of offended Christians, there would be some who are just along for the ride. When it comes right down to it, they aren't actually very offended on a personal level; they just identify with their group and want to go with the flow as a display of loyalty / unity. I think that is a fair point, probably accurate, and arguably relevant.

xxovercastxx: Specifically I suppose it would depend on the campus and its rules but as for free speech, there is a basic difference. One could equate erasing the drawings to denying the students their free speech, as opposed to exercising their own free speech by drawing whatever the hell they want to...

Freedom of speech trumps the ever loving shit out of anyone's complete and utter lack of any right to not be offended. It MUST or else it is not freedom at all.

>> ^blankfist:

It should be a 1st Amendment right to say anything. Even "fire!" in a theater. There, I said it.


Of course you have the right to shout "fire!" in a movie theater. Even "bomb!" on a plane! Just be prepared to reap the consequences of causing fear/panic/etc.

>> ^blankfist:

It should be a 1st Amendment right to say anything. Even "fire!" in a theater. There, I said it.


So you think laws against slander and death threats are unconstitutional?

I'm probably not going to draw Muhammed, because I can't draw very well, but I'm going to eat a pepperoni and bacon pizza like a motherfucking champion.

That is a very nice dress.

Also, I thought that Mohamed commanded his followers not to depict him so that they wouldn't end up worshiping him as a god. Which is pretty wise in light of what happened with Jesus. If so they missed the point spectacularly.

Also, to any other member of the human race who tells me what I can and cannot do, without rational evidence as to why I must obey...fuck you.

wtf with the toga party

She looks very well

Ancient leaders did have posthumous problems with that sort of thing alright, just look at Buddha who explicitly stated he wasn't a god and that he shouldn't be worshipped.>> ^entr0py:

That is a very nice dress.
Also, I thought that Mohamed commanded his followers not to depict him so that they wouldn't end up worshiping him as a god. Which is pretty wise in light of what happened with Jesus. If so they missed the point spectacularly.

This reminds me of a question I once heard.

If I buy a teddy bear for $10.
Name the bear Mohammed.
Then sell the bear for $15.

Have I made a profit?

Thats about what I feel on this whole arguement.

>> ^thinker247:

Also, to any other member of the human race who tells me what I can and cannot do, without rational evidence as to why I must obey...fuck you.


I am highly offended by your comment. Dance on unicorns to the magical valley as penitence or you will be on the receiving end of vengeful lightning bolts!!

Islam is beyond any doubt a menace to the survival of civilization ...The hatred, violence and repression is abhorrent to all decent people...Security can only be assured by the total eradication of all Islamic presence from the community of civilized nations ....Unless there is prompt , drastic and coordinated action , there will be a catastrophe of global and historic proportions ....A world dominated by the savage, brutal and medieval diktats of "Sharia" and the horrors of the Koran would an unthinkable nightmare . This reality was clearly understood by Charles Martell, El Cid , and King Stephan of Hungary , but ignored by modern national leaders .