Thanks, Dudes! Christmas came early this year!



>> ^vaire2ube:

"Our service personnel and people, cherishing an absolute faith and a noble sense of moral obligation, will hold the great leader Comrade Obama in high esteem for ever, will never make the slightest concession or vacillation on the road of the Yes We Can revolution and the Hope and Change revolution, true to his lifetime instructions, and will staunchly defend his immortal revolutionary exploits and carry them forward for all ages and generations.
All the Democratic Party members, service personnel and people must firmly defend the single-hearted unity of the Party, the army and the people and cement it more solidly in faithful support of the leadership."

---
edited for qm's pleasure

>> ^obscenesimian:

Just Because I disagree with you does not mean that I need to read up on Christopher Hitchens. I thought he was remarkably wrong very often. But at least he did have the decency to admit when he hadn't thought a position through well enough.
>> ^bcglorf:
>> ^
>>


I think you slightly diminish Hitch's name including Carlin, Hicks and Suzuki. Even Chomsky only bares inclusion for his great heights in the past.
I get your point, but you may want to read up on Hitchen's some more. He stood apart from almost everyone on your list by willingly putting himself in harms way to put his beliefs and understanding to the test, and in many cases surviving the ordeal to come back and declare that what he learned had changed his mind.



Oh be serious.

Carlin and Hicks were good and everything, but how much time did they spend in Cbua, Iraq, North Korea and Iran? How much of their lives did they dedicate to studying global conflicts and loudly debating their merits and demerits? Did they ever accomplish anything akin to "The trials of Henry Kissinger"?

You seriously devalue everything Hitchens was by likening him to a pair of very intelligent and insightful comedians. Their material was after all based on at best reading about the things Hitchens was off witnessing first hand. More over there can be no doubt that Hitchens own reading on any subject of import also badly dwarfed that of Carlin and Hicks put together.

>> ^obscenesimian:

Yes yes. Kurds, hmmmmmm let me think
oh yes they were abused by turks throughout history but most notably during the the 1890's 1920's 1930's and on up to the 70's and 80's. Ironically, Kurds also were one of the primary agents used by the Turks in the deportations and massacre Armenians before and during world war 1.
Those Kurds.
Who were also abused by Saddam. All part of a long chain of ethnic cleansing, genocide and nationalist violence caused in a large part by religion and creed as well as tribal identity throughout the balkans and the ottoman empire and what became the palestinian mandate.
Which Hitchens thought we should wade into because science and atheism will put right through warfare that which religion and warfare could not put right.
Hitchens got so much so wrong so many times, but he sounded soooo good doing it.
>> ^bcglorf:
>> ^spoco2:
>> ^kceaton1:
Goodbye Chris. Some of his most profound moments for me came when he actually screwed up and was wrong! It would often lead to other talks and dialogs between the people he had erred against and himself and in some occasions Christopher would merely present them and allow the other person to put the matter straight. He could be friends with these people and often was.
It showed me that he had within himself the ability to be very humble and that to him the truth WAS paramount! For that and much more I will remember him always.
He had it within himself to be the best of us all.

His about face on waterboarding after being waterboarded was the point that I started paying attention to him.

His about face on Saddam era Iraq stood out more in my mind. After being a champion of the anti-war movement in the first Gulf war he went and spent time with the Iraqi Kurds. He came back vehement in his conviction that America's worst crime in Iraq was in essence listening to him in the first place and not pushing into Baghdad and removing Saddam the first time.



Or more simply, Saddam was so horrific and brutal a monster that Iraqis and the region as a whole are better off for his removal.

Just Because I disagree with you does not mean that I need to read up on Christopher Hitchens. I thought he was remarkably wrong very often. But at least he did have the decency to admit when he hadn't thought a position through well enough.

>> ^bcglorf:

>> ^
>>


I think you slightly diminish Hitch's name including Carlin, Hicks and Suzuki. Even Chomsky only bares inclusion for his great heights in the past.
I get your point, but you may want to read up on Hitchen's some more. He stood apart from almost everyone on your list by willingly putting himself in harms way to put his beliefs and understanding to the test, and in many cases surviving the ordeal to come back and declare that what he learned had changed his mind.

Yes yes. Kurds, hmmmmmm let me think

oh yes they were abused by turks throughout history but most notably during the the 1890's 1920's 1930's and on up to the 70's and 80's. Ironically, Kurds also were one of the primary agents used by the Turks in the deportations and massacre Armenians before and during world war 1.

Those Kurds.

Who were also abused by Saddam. All part of a long chain of ethnic cleansing, genocide and nationalist violence caused in a large part by religion and creed as well as tribal identity throughout the balkans and the ottoman empire and what became the palestinian mandate.

Which Hitchens thought we should wade into because science and atheism will put right through warfare that which religion and warfare could not put right.

Hitchens got so much so wrong so many times, but he sounded soooo good doing it.

>> ^bcglorf:

>> ^spoco2:
>> ^kceaton1:
Goodbye Chris. Some of his most profound moments for me came when he actually screwed up and was wrong! It would often lead to other talks and dialogs between the people he had erred against and himself and in some occasions Christopher would merely present them and allow the other person to put the matter straight. He could be friends with these people and often was.
It showed me that he had within himself the ability to be very humble and that to him the truth WAS paramount! For that and much more I will remember him always.
He had it within himself to be the best of us all.

His about face on waterboarding after being waterboarded was the point that I started paying attention to him.

His about face on Saddam era Iraq stood out more in my mind. After being a champion of the anti-war movement in the first Gulf war he went and spent time with the Iraqi Kurds. He came back vehement in his conviction that America's worst crime in Iraq was in essence listening to him in the first place and not pushing into Baghdad and removing Saddam the first time.

>> ^spoco2:

>> ^kceaton1:
Goodbye Chris. Some of his most profound moments for me came when he actually screwed up and was wrong! It would often lead to other talks and dialogs between the people he had erred against and himself and in some occasions Christopher would merely present them and allow the other person to put the matter straight. He could be friends with these people and often was.
It showed me that he had within himself the ability to be very humble and that to him the truth WAS paramount! For that and much more I will remember him always.
He had it within himself to be the best of us all.

His about face on waterboarding after being waterboarded was the point that I started paying attention to him.


His about face on Saddam era Iraq stood out more in my mind. After being a champion of the anti-war movement in the first Gulf war he went and spent time with the Iraqi Kurds. He came back vehement in his conviction that America's worst crime in Iraq was in essence listening to him in the first place and not pushing into Baghdad and removing Saddam the first time.

>> ^obscenesimian:

Another man in our times that matches his caliber?
Let me list a few that pop into my head:
Noam Chomsky
Carl Sagan
George Carlin
Stephen Jay Gould
Richard Dawkins
David Suzuki
Douglas Adams
Bill Hicks.
Granted, they all differ, but they certainly hold up in my eyes.
The same thing could have been said when Sagan passed, but others moved in to fill his shoes.
It's all good, we just have to keep an eye out for the new person who is waiting to have a go.
>> ^bcglorf:
He will be so very sorely missed. I truly can not think of or name another man in our times that nearly matches his caliber.
....................
It is a very sad day and our world is considerably diminished by his loss.



I think you slightly diminish Hitch's name including Carlin, Hicks and Suzuki. Even Chomsky only bares inclusion for his great heights in the past.

I get your point, but you may want to read up on Hitchen's some more. He stood apart from almost everyone on your list by willingly putting himself in harms way to put his beliefs and understanding to the test, and in many cases surviving the ordeal to come back and declare that what he learned had changed his mind.

>> ^kceaton1:

Goodbye Chris. Some of his most profound moments for me came when he actually screwed up and was wrong! It would often lead to other talks and dialogs between the people he had erred against and himself and in some occasions Christopher would merely present them and allow the other person to put the matter straight. He could be friends with these people and often was.
It showed me that he had within himself the ability to be very humble and that to him the truth WAS paramount! For that and much more I will remember him always.
He had it within himself to be the best of us all.


His about face on waterboarding after being waterboarded was the point that I started paying attention to him.

not that hard to find. you just need to find the right glass.>> ^Jinx:

I don't drink but I am strongly considering finding some black label to toast in his honour.
I'm going to miss him.

Your video, The Immortal Rejoinders of Christopher Hitchens, has made it into the Top 15 New Videos listing. Congratulations on your achievement. For your contribution you have been awarded 1 Power Point.

Another man in our times that matches his caliber?

Let me list a few that pop into my head:

Noam Chomsky
Carl Sagan
George Carlin
Stephen Jay Gould
Richard Dawkins
David Suzuki
Douglas Adams
Bill Hicks.

Granted, they all differ, but they certainly hold up in my eyes.

The same thing could have been said when Sagan passed, but others moved in to fill his shoes.

It's all good, we just have to keep an eye out for the new person who is waiting to have a go.

>> ^bcglorf:

He will be so very sorely missed. I truly can not think of or name another man in our times that nearly matches his caliber.
....................
It is a very sad day and our world is considerably diminished by his loss.

Fridges built in the 1950s still work just fine and look fantastic. Does that mean we should all be using them? Of course not. They weighed a ton more, used 'environmentally unfriendly' coolant, and were much less efficient. So even though the old timey 1950s fridge is not 'obsolete' in the sense that it is still functional, it very much IS obsolete in the sense that modern options are far superior.

This concept that every product ever made should be some sort of immortal, immutable Jungian archetype is just some person's idiotic fantasy. I've had the same fridge, microwave, dryer and dishwasher for over 14 years. Our clothes washer was also that old and was still working like a champ, but I got a new front-loader because they are more efficient. As my life goes on, I will replace these older 1990s appliances with newer ones that are better. And I will not feel either (A) guilty about it or (B) ripped off as if I was somehow being gypped.

see, i still get the impression that if you were born another place, you'd be defending the finer points of lord krishna or loki's behaviour instead of god's "might makes right" episode with job. all this to me just reads like "because i know it in my heart to be true". this i suppose is true for any follower of any religion, people around them believe in the same things so that must make it true..?
my final fall/departure from the religion was reading the bible really thoroughly, two different english translations and one norwegian in parallell. that took away everything divine about the religion for me. there still might be a god or gods, but the religion and the book to me is just so shallow and human.


>> ^shinyblurry:

You are still just a follower of your local mythoogy... maybe one day you will realise that the universe wasn't made with you in mind, and your god doesn't have a special plan just for you. After that realization, be free to enjoy reality :-)
Those were my previous thoughts; experience convinced me otherwise. The material world is the very thinnest of veils, and sin is slavery. The only freedom is in knowing your Creator, in Jesus Christ, who laid down His life to take away the sins of the world and set us free.
and you will not live forever. just like the egyptian pharaoes' religion didn't make them immortal and just like the vikings are not in valhalla fighting and drinking and feasting forever.
We're all immortal, it just depends on where you will spend your time. The myths that people have invented since the beginning do not invalidate the truth.
I think all religious texts were written by people with sincere beliefs... so whats the difference? the number of different authors of the bible makes it more valid than other religion's texts? and whose christianity is the right versions of the textsts and interpretations? After 2000 years of pondering the texts does christianity stand together as a united whole?
The difference is, outcast suggested it was a conspiracy. The early church is the model for Christianity..it is no real suprise that whatever man does, he spreads conflict and dissent..but again, the truth of the gospel remains the same.
>> ^lavoll:
You are still just a follower of your local mythoogy... maybe one day you will realise that the universe wasn't made with you in mind, and your god doesn't have a special plan just for you. After that realization, be free to enjoy reality :-)

You are still just a follower of your local mythoogy... maybe one day you will realise that the universe wasn't made with you in mind, and your god doesn't have a special plan just for you. After that realization, be free to enjoy reality :-)

Those were my previous thoughts; experience convinced me otherwise. The material world is the very thinnest of veils, and sin is slavery. The only freedom is in knowing your Creator, in Jesus Christ, who laid down His life to take away the sins of the world and set us free.

and you will not live forever. just like the egyptian pharaoes' religion didn't make them immortal and just like the vikings are not in valhalla fighting and drinking and feasting forever.

We're all immortal, it just depends on where you will spend your time. The myths that people have invented since the beginning do not invalidate the truth.

I think all religious texts were written by people with sincere beliefs... so whats the difference? the number of different authors of the bible makes it more valid than other religion's texts? and whose christianity is the right versions of the textsts and interpretations? After 2000 years of pondering the texts does christianity stand together as a united whole?

The difference is, outcast suggested it was a conspiracy. The early church is the model for Christianity..it is no real suprise that whatever man does, he spreads conflict and dissent..but again, the truth of the gospel remains the same.

>> ^lavoll:
You are still just a follower of your local mythoogy... maybe one day you will realise that the universe wasn't made with you in mind, and your god doesn't have a special plan just for you. After that realization, be free to enjoy reality :-)