Patrick Stewart has to be one of the most well spoken people I have ever heard. almost too well spoken for our sound byte craving society to get it.

I'd up vote that twice if I could. Good sift.

wow, that's powerful

*femme

Adding video to channels (Femme) - requested by smibbo.

How many children of abusive parents are as successful as Stewart, you think? [Edit: Not so sure "spearheading" is the best word for a campaign designed to reduce domestic violence.]

Having a father with an inability to control his anger,who sometimes lashed out at my mother physically, had a profound effect on me. I think it hindered my ability to experience security and intimacy with men for a long time.

Even now, a man only has to raise his voice in an angry way around me and it throws me back to feeling like a helpless six year old.

I've worked hard on this stuff. Still working on it.

I wish i could promote this one.
Mr. Stewart may be an actor, but is a man, like us all. And this man has a talent that everybody should be able to acquier : being able to express his feelings so they can be understood.

*promote

Thank Monsieur Bakalex for the friendly suggestion.

Promoting this video back to the front page; last published Wednesday, January 16th, 2008 2:23am PST - promote requested by kronosposeidon.

I liked this video, but have to disagree with him on one thing.
I don't want to see my government be more responsible for helping to stop domestic violence.
I don't think that's government's place.
I want to see more of the decent men in this world (which I have in recent years learned that there are more of than there are shit-heads) step up together as they find themselves neighbors or friends of men who beat their wives.
I would have loved to see the men peeking from the windows of their cars or houses, the men standing across the street when I was being abused...step up and beat the living daylights out of my ex. It's something men need to do for other men, I say.
Women can't defend themselves the same way men can (basic physiological differences unless of course the woman has a black belt...) and I like the idea of decent men putting indecent men in their place/teaching them some manners.
But that's just me.

Sadly, I know what he is talking about first hand.

Only I was old enough to defend my self.

Laura, there are some situations that a person cannot in any way defend themselves physically, with out the use of a weapon.

A Black belt:

Yudansha is a honor that denotes the martial artists length of training, not necessarily their skill.

The worst thing you can do is "beat up" someone that abuses someone else. Where is the abuser's rage directed after that? Right back at the person they were abusing.

*quality

Boosting this quality contribution up in the Hot Listing - declared quality by kronosposeidon.

*dark *talks *fear *british

Adding video to channels (British, Dark, Fear, Talks) - requested by calvados.

Tags for this video have been changed from 'patrick stewart, amnesty, violence, women' to 'patrick stewart, amnesty, violence, women, domestic' - edited by calvados

>> ^laura:

I liked this video, but have to disagree with him on one thing.
I don't want to see my government be more responsible for helping to stop domestic violence.
I don't think that's government's place.
I want to see more of the decent men in this world (which I have in recent years learned that there are more of than there are shit-heads) step up together as they find themselves neighbors or friends of men who beat their wives.
I would have loved to see the men peeking from the windows of their cars or houses, the men standing across the street when I was being abused...step up and beat the living daylights out of my ex. It's something men need to do for other men, I say.
Women can't defend themselves the same way men can (basic physiological differences unless of course the woman has a black belt...) and I like the idea of decent men putting indecent men in their place/teaching them some manners.
But that's just me.


This sentiment is so misguided. Violence is a terrible thing, but to say that the response should be more violence, by a mob no less, is even worse. We don't live by mob rule, we live in a civilised society. Men are no more able to defend themselves than women. Every fight has a winner and a loser (I use the term winner loosely as I really think there are only two losers) be it between a woman and a man or between a man and a man. And what happens if the man doing the beating is the biggest guy around? What happens if he has friends who think the same as him? Is it OK then?

Mob rule is best left to the animals, we're better than that. You can't fight violence with violence. Shame on you.

Shame on me? Excuse me?

Have you ever been beaten to within an inch of your life while people stood around and watched, waiting all civilized-like for 'someone else' to help you?

I sure hope not, because it isn't civilized at all...and that's what happens in a majority of cases. In my case, the police found him, jailed him, let him out a couple of days later and he was even MORE pissed at me and violent. A restraining order is nice and civilized, too...but it's just a piece of paper that will never stop a determined angry fist or trigger finger.

When you figure out and implement a perfect solution to domestic violence that actually works, I'll be the first to pat you on the back. In the mean-time, STFU. Please. (See, I'm civilized too.)

>> ^robbersdog49: This sentiment is so misguided. Violence is a terrible thing, but to say that the response should be more violence, by a mob no less, is even worse. We don't live by mob rule, we live in a civilised society. Men are no more able to defend themselves than women. Every fight has a winner and a loser (I use the term winner loosely as I really think there are only two losers) be it between a woman and a man or between a man and a man. And what happens if the man doing the beating is the biggest guy around? What happens if he has friends who think the same as him? Is it OK then?
Mob rule is best left to the animals, we're better than that. You can't fight violence with violence. Shame on you.

I understand why you feel like you do. The system is, in a lot of cases, ineffectual. That doesn't mean that it's ok to organise mobs. If can't understand why mobs are a bad way to run things then you have some real problems.

This whole video is about why violence is bad, not about why some violence is bad.

So yes, shame on you for not realising that advocating violence is a bad thing. The more you say violence is ok, as long as it happens to someone else and not me, the worse the world will get. If you really want violence to stop then you are going to have to make that your goal, an end to all violence.

I understand revenge, I just don't think it's right.

The man that hit you did so because he found himself in a situation that he couldn't deal with. He reverted to his base instincts and lashed out. This has left you in a situation you couldn't deal with, so you are reverting to your base instincts and lashing out. Ts the same response. You'll claim it's ok in your case because he started it. I'm sure if we were to ask him he would say you started it by doing whatever it was that wound him up. I'm not saying he's right, not at all. But this is why we have courts. This is why we have trials. So that we can sort out who is right and who is wrong. So the right person gets punished. Mobs don't do that, they just punish regardless. They punish on hearsay.

Bad things have happened to you. But that doesn't give you the right to do bad things to others. Domestic violence has touch my family too, so don't be too quick to assume you're the only one who knows what they're talking about here.

^ First of all, I never used the word nor the concept "mob". The fact that you have, repeatedly, says something about your psyche.
Secondly, you really are a dick. You know how you say that "mobs don't do that, they just punish regardless"? Well I have news for you: some people don't do that, they just hurt regardless. They hurt on the hearsay of the voices in their heads, if anything at all. You have quite the little arrogant stance there to even remotely assume anything at all about the circumstances of my abuse, much less attempt to "explain" it.
You are obviously young, naive, and have never been unjustifiably violated. I hope for your sake that some day you grow up. In the mean time, Fuck You, I'm done with you.

"The man that hit you did so because he found himself in a situation that he couldn't deal with. He reverted to his base instincts and lashed out."

"This has left you in a situation you couldn't deal with, so you are reverting to your base instincts and lashing out. Ts the same response. You'll claim it's ok in your case because he started it. I'm sure if we were to ask him he would say you started it by doing whatever it was that wound him up."

------------------------------

As a psychotherapist, I find your assumption of the ability to accurately assess the motivations and actions of someone based upon such a brief description both immature and naive.

My advice to you is to interact with persons your own age,and leave home now and save the world while you still know everything.

I agree completely with Patrick Stewart. My mother was beaten to within an inch of her life by a man who was so governed by jealousy that if she said hello to the milkman he assumed she was having an affair and would beat her for it. She told me once in passing that she left when she did because she was afraid that he was going to be as vicious with me as he was with her. I asked her why she wasn't as important as me, but she never answered.

I spent most of my childhood hungry and alone - mom had to work more than full-time hours to feed and house and clothe me. (This was in the mid to late 60s; back than only sluts got divorced and women certainly weren't paid anything like equal wages. They still aren't, but that's another topic.) I saw her literally once or twice a week. I grew up certain that the abuse, the subsequent divorce, poverty and societal rejection were all my fault. Not because it was proven to me, but because that's the way children think. Developing minds cannot think some things through. Spend some time reading the research about developmental stages of cognition and that will become crystal clear.

My father's abuse showed me a) those you trust most will hurt you, and badly, and that if they haven't yet you should do something so that it happens now and not just sit around, tense as shit waiting for something that you know is inevitably going to happen; b) that love is just a word and fists and feet are the real power; c) men in power are hurtful and therefore are not to be trusted and d) that women in power are not to be trusted because they're never around.

So. Lots of violence and self-destructive behaviour as a young man because of the impossibility of trusting anyone or anything. I couldn't trust the people around me who were more powerful (emotionally, physically or politically) and I couldn't trust those around me who were less powerful because I'd seen what happens to the weak. Even better, I couldn't trust myself because I'd been the one who had done whatever it was that had started the whole thing off. What fun!

Eventually, being an essentially thinking person I figured out that it wasn't my fault, that mom left because dad was a breathtaking asshole and not because I'd done something so horrible that they had to split up. However, understanding something and having it be an essential part of your personality are two very different things. It's roughly akin to the difference between learning a second language as a child and learning one as an adult. The language(s) you learn as a child are part and parcel of your cognition and strongly inform your worldview. Learning a language as an adult means that you need to remember how to speak that language. With practice, you might get to the point that you can think in that language, and you might even be able to carry on a good conversation, but you're never going to fool a native speaker of that language. Fluency comes with practice and intent.

It may seem like I'm whining a bit here, but after reading the comments above, I have to let you folks know something. Abuse fucks up your children for life. The lessons you learn as a kid don't just go away because you want them to. It's like trying to forget a language when it's the only one you know how to speak.

Beating the shit out of an abuser doesn't do anyone any good. Except that the abuser isn't abusing right there and then. Sitting back and saying 'oh where are the cops when you need them' without doing anything is cowardice and doesn't do anyone any good. Stopping it before it happens by teaching children that it is never acceptable is what will prevent it from being the illness that pervades our world. The best way to teach children is to lead by example.

Stopping those who do abuse their partners is no mean feat. I mean, what if they're fine with the language they speak? What if they don't want to learn another language? Do you force them? Put them in institutions or some such crap?

Only those willing to be sufficiently self-aware are going to get past it, and that doesn't happen when there's no overarching societal pressure to stop it. Talking about it is what exposes it, and stops it.

Here we are, having a conversation.

Bye now.

Well, it seems pretty clear that the sift is pro violence, that the best way to end violence is with violence.

As for the use of the word mob:

I would have loved to see the men peeking from the windows of their cars or houses, the men standing across the street when I was being abused...step up and beat the living daylights out of my ex. It's something men need to do for other men, I say.

Would you like to tell me another word I could use to describe all these men getting together to beat up the man you don't like?

I find the number of pro violence votes here pretty disturbing. But it's ok because the psychotherapist has made a childish comment in support of revenge beatings, so that must be fine.

See y'all, good luck with those issues.

is it it possible to double vote this, don't want to say why

The car stops in front of robbersdog49's house. A woman gets out and a man gets out, runs around the car and begins to beat the shit out of her. As he hits and kicks her, robbersdog49 peaks cautiously out his window watching, as he calls the police so that in 10/15/20 minutes later the police will arrive and save the woman. Brave of you robbersdog49. The courts will certainly make everything right.

There be no shame or blame especially to the victims of violence.
Expecting intervention by another shouldn't be too much to hope for.
It could stop an assault.
I imagine anyone would be satisfied with that.

>> ^Don_Juan:

The car stops in front of robbersdog49's house. A woman gets out and a man gets out, runs around the car and begins to beat the shit out of her. As he hits and kicks her, robbersdog49 peaks cautiously out his window watching, as he calls the police so that in 10/15/20 minutes later the police will arrive and save the woman. Brave of you robbersdog49. The courts will certainly make everything right.


Hmmm. No.

You're missing the point somewhat. I would certainly go and help. I'd try to stop the violence. However, this is very, very rarely the way domestic violence rears it's head. It's more often something that happens behind closed doors. Others may know it's going on, not because they watch it, but because of marks, bruises etc. Someone is only clumsy enough to fall down the stairs once or maybe twice in their life. If it's happening more often there probably something wrong.

What Laura says should happen, and the bit I have an issue with, is that all the blokes around should get together, find the abuser and beat him up. Not wait till he hits her again, because they all know what's going on. Just go and give him a taste of his own medicine.

However, what happens if they're in the middle of a difficult divorce? What happens if she self harms and blames it on him (I have a good friend who has been a victim of this)? Are we to assume that this group of men looking for a fight are going to understand this and do the right thing, or are they more likely to just beat the innocent guy up anyway, just to be on the safe side?

Everyone here seems to have a very easy view of domestic violence. You all seem to see it as very black and white. It's not. Violence is a blunt instrument that's simply not suited to dealing with a complicated issue like this. I've given just one example of where an innocent person could be badly hurt by a violence against violence system. It just an example and I'm not in any way saying this is what has happened with anyone here. There are countless other examples too. What if the woman is the person being violent and the husband is responding in self defence? I'm sure a lot of people will say this doesn't happen. I wish I could live in your world because I've known this happen. The same woman who figured out she could bruise herself and blame it on him. He tried so hard to make the relationship work for their kids. How would your violence system deal with that?

I will always try to stop a fight, to stop the violence happening before my eyes. Nowhere have I said I wouldn't. That's not the same as getting revenge, that's the bit I have a problem with. So, let's stick to the facts here Don.

I never got the impression from Laura's comment that she meant men should act out revenge on abusers in their neighbourhood. What she's talking about is people acting on a sense of social responsibility, neighbourliness, a sense of community, a sense of connectedness to those living around them, a sense of caring about what happens to the neighbours, which I have to say is very seriously lacking in suburban life.

I think that a big reason why abusers do bad things is because they believe they can get away with it. I agree with Laura-we shouldn't rely heavily on some govt campaign (these can be such a waste of time and money) which trys to address the problem of domestic violence. People need to feel connected with each other, regain a sense of caring about each other. Feel the confidence to act when they see something bad happening and get the support from the rest of the community to make an effective change.

In Papua, families act out revenge on perpetrators, often with fatal results. I don't think Laura is suggesting anything like this and neither would I, but perpetrators need to feel a sense of their place in a wider society and that's the crux of the issue. Families so often live in isolation from their wider community. The family bully knows that.