Who Owns Oregon? Some Historical Context

From YT: In which John discusses the occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge in Southwestern Oregon by armed civilians, and what the history of this land can tell us about private and public property in the United States, and how land came to be owned in America.
CORRECTION: Oregon's capital is Salem. I am a grapefruit.

RFlagg Edit: Note two annotations don't show up. One his correction about Portland being the Capital of Oregon, which he also notes in the description, and one when he gives the wrong direction... I believe he said South Eastern when he meant, and had been saying South Western.
siftbotsays...

Self promoting this video and sending it back into the queue for one more try; last queued Tuesday, January 5th, 2016 3:30pm PST - promote requested by original submitter RFlagg.

newtboysays...

So, if anyone reading this knows a Paiute, it is your civic duty to convince them to go on their local news and have them, without any coordination with the 'militias', thank the 'militias' for joining the fight to return all this Federally held native American's land to it's rightful owners, in this case the Paiute, but in all cases the natives.
That should end the standoff.

RFlaggsays...

He noted it in the description and an annotation... apparently annotations like that don't show up on embeds, probably due to some vids being spammed with them.

He even joked about it on his Twitter...
If I could learn the difference between east and west and memorize my state capitals, I might become a halfway decent vlogger some day.

LukinStonesaid:

Good video, I would like to offer a correction: Portland - not the capital of Oregon.

scheherazadesays...

Technically, the constitution allows the "United States" to own land. It does not name the government as an owner.

The government of the United States is not the United States. Being a republic, the United States is its citizens.

The government is a manager/caretaker of state's (people's) property, not an owner of property in and of itself.

Technically, the government doesn't even have any authority of its own. It's strictly a body that executes the state's (people's) will, and it does so by the state's (people's) authority - not its own authority (hence the Democracy part). (Officially, the government does nothing of its own accord - hence why in court it's 'the state vs whoever', not 'the government vs whoever').

So, technically, there is no 'government property' - there is only state (people's) property.

Actually, the reason that 'eminent domain' is 'eminent' (i.e. obvious - aka 'obvious domain') - is because the land has always belonged to the state - because the state is the only authority. You never actually own your personal land, you're simply entitled to be the sole occupant. You can buy/sell that right, but the land always has, does, and always will, belong to the state. So under eminent domain, the land is not actually taken from you, because it never belonged to you, hence why the state's domain is eminent (obvious).

In any case, land has this weirdness to it, where all land is state land, and everyone is the state, and no land is private, and all that ever happens is people are bestowed an authority to exclusively manage/reside on a given plot that they never really own. In any case, that authority ends up being functionally equivalent to actual ownership. The phrase 'if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck' comes to mind, because when you have a body of case law that treats property as if private property actually exists, then in a sense, it does exist for all practical purposes - so there is a disconnect between the practical nature of 'land ownership' and the official/ideological nature of 'the state (the people) having authority over all at all times'.

Also, this is why you can't have an allodial land title in the U.S.. So long as it's still U.S. land, it can never truly be privately owned. It's simply incompatible.

Interestingly, way back when before the U.S. was founded, private ownership of land was associated with monarchy - where some royal(s) individual(ly) literally owned the country. The path of events that eroded royal authority and empowered lower levels of society, was the same path that eroded [true] private land ownership, because it introduced the concept of inherent ownership/rights of some other groups (e.g. the people).

-scheherazade

Truckchasesays...

If we all shame each other hard enough for long enough everything will turn out fine. No physical action need be taken.

Note: this comment, while posted here, can be considered on most posts for the foreseeable future. Feel free to re-post; no accreditation requested or required.

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