abort palin.

Tags for this video have been changed from 'Obama, abortion, ban, funding, pro choice' to 'Obama, abortion, ban, funding, pro choice, mccain, sarah palin, pro life, pro choice' - edited by doogle

>> ^vairetube:
abort palin.


Sadly, abortions are illegal during the 183rd trimester.

the supreme courts strongly need to nail down the definition of life, person, alive and citizen. until then i have to say that a living person has citizens rights, but i don't know what that means.

Abort Religion!

religion: because we dont want you to think for yourself

Now liberal secularists are opposing incest?!

>> ^rgroom1:
the supreme courts strongly need to nail down the definition of life, person, alive and citizen.

Row v Wade is as clear as possible on Person, which is someone born. The only issue here is weather someone who can survive if born should be born, and therefor gain this right, that's what the whole late term abortion issue is.

The law is clear on citizenship by birth or naturalization.

Life & alive are immaterial, killing cows is legal after all.

Person-hood is a fundamentally religious doctrine, it does not fit well with reality or objective criteria, as long as our society demands the maintenance of the illusion of person-hood we will suffer with the intractable consequences of that absurdity.

^Our society as it exists now is predicated on each of us being accountable individuals . What I think you're hinting at with "the illusion of person-hood" is that we don't have free will, and while I agree in the strictest sense of the word, our society exists as if we have free will. If it did not, we could not have a law and we could not hold anyone accountable for their deeds.

Again in the strictest sense of it, then yes, no one of us is accountable for what we do, because we are determined by chemical reactions, background radiation and so on, but we exists as if we do choose for ourselves and for now, I don't think it would be wise to change that.

(The argument could be made that we are only determinable by something that would exist outside the universe, because by being inside the universe this prediction would break itself with paradoxes.)

What I think I'm getting at is that when something is given "rights" is completely arbitrarily determined by us, whether it is when it is conceived or born (or at 18) is not really relevant from on objective standpoint, we just have to decide on any given compromise. I'm not sure that you can make a general rule for when a baby can never/always survive birth, because it depends on the baby and the mother's health and many, many factors. The best thing that policy can do is to give guidelines and let the doctors and mother (and to some extent father) decide in the individual cases.

Also, I think the distinction between "pro-choice" and "pro-life" isn't really right. Pro choice does not mean anti-life, but pro life does mean anti-choice. "Choice" is the whole deal here, not "life". Should you have the choice or not? It's not "Do you want your baby to have life or not?"

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5jvOwH_9ERzim87XGxxfOJlpOuSfA

WASHINGTON (AFP) — President Barack Obama on Friday overturned an eight-year ban on US government funding for family planning organizations which carry out or facilitate abortions overseas, a White House official said.

Oh I see, the same liberals that oppose killing terrorists overseas heartily approve of paying for irresponsible foreigners' abortions.

Any policy that restricts abortion during the first trimester is totally indefensible. After that maybe you get into a gray area.

good job Obama, let more millions of innocents die, that's the liberal way

>> ^quantumushroom:
Oh I see, the same liberals that oppose killing terrorists overseas heartily approve of paying for irresponsible foreigners' abortions.


Oh I see, Iraqis = terrorists, and family planning and giving out condoms = paying for irresponsible foreigner's abortions.

>> ^BillOreilly:
good job Obama, let more millions of innocents die, that's the liberal way


Yes, lets do everything we can to protect the sanctity of life of a collection of undifferentiated cells, yet start needless wars which costs the lives of millions of innocents. Because Jesus forgives us when we murder Muslims, but not when it's Christian embryos. That's the conservative way.

Supreme court decisions are meaningless. Law is meaningless. Presidential edicts are meaningless.

Everything you need to know on abortion is this: Human rights derive from human consciousness; unborn children don't have it; abortion is 100% morally neutral; those who oppose the human right to authority over ones own body and life are criminals; all pro-lifers should be executed. If you want to torture them a bit first, that's totally fine too.

>> ^quantumushroom:
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5jvOwH_9ERzim
87XGxxfOJlpOuSfA
WASHINGTON (AFP) — President Barack Obama on Friday overturned an eight-year ban on US government funding for family planning organizations which carry out or facilitate abortions overseas, a White House official said.
Oh I see, the same liberals that oppose killing terrorists overseas heartily approve of paying for irresponsible foreigners' abortions.


Yes, you'd much prefer that the children were born and raised in poverty instead.

>> ^gwiz665: What I think you're hinting at with "the illusion of person-hood" is that we don't have free will.

The claim I am making is much broader than that. "person" is an arbitrary preferential category, which is predicated on the old concept of "soul". When you break it down a "person" is one with a "soul", which means , in effect, one of "us".

The problem with this is clear, we have no mechanism for determining who fits in this category, but we still demand privilege on the basis of being in the category ourselves. When we want to kill others, human or not, we de-personify them, we call them vermin, or animals, or terrorists, while maintaining that we, or any arbitrary glob of "soul" containing cells, as persons, should not be killed arbitrarily.

Since the category is not objectively meaningful it's impossible to argue with these claims, anybody can be in or out of the group, and no basis exists for distinction. Person-hood is a broad example of special pleading, one which is rarely challenged, because most humans depend on the tribal exceptionalism which it provides.

>> ^BillOreilly:
good job Obama, let more millions of innocents die, that's the liberal way


Ever had a wank? Millions of potential lives by the sock-full.

I am personally against abortion as a method of birth control, but I sure as hell am not going to abstractly and unilaterally tell someone else to do in their own personal situation.

"We are killing babies; we need to stop that."

Uh, no, sunshine. "We" are not.

I don't care so much about the abortion side of this. I DO care that little Barry has now opened the spigot for his liberal-whacko lobbyist groups to funnel billions of US taxpayer dollars to foreign organizations during a time when every penny of tax money should be staying home to solve our own issues.

But there - what else can we expect. Obama is an idiot. There isn't a single thing he's doing that doesn't run absolutely 100% counter to common sense. Economic turmoil? Hey - nationalize the banks and spend money on overseas abortions. Big 3 car companies teetering on the edge or ruin? Hey - let's slap them with a bunch of new fuel standards they can't possibly meet and force them to retool all thier factories! National economy on the brink? Hey - let's cap and trade coal and raise EVERYBODY'S fuel bills! And if the economy collapses? Hey - it was Bush's fault! Ex-Guantanamo terrorists showing up in Al-Queda videos? Hey - let's close Guantanamo and 'not say' what we're going to do with them.

It has only been 1 week and Obama has done just about everything wrong it was possible to do wrong. Combine him with the certifiably insane Nancy Pelosi and the doormat Harry Ried and America is royally screwed.

>> ^Winstonfield_Pennypacker:
I don't care so much about the abortion side of this. I DO care that little Barry has now opened the spigot for his liberal-whacko lobbyist groups to funnel billions of US taxpayer dollars to foreign organizations during a time when every penny of tax money should be staying home to solve our own issues.
But there - what else can we expect. Obama is an idiot. There isn't a single thing he's doing that doesn't run absolutely 100% counter to common sense. Economic turmoil? Hey - nationalize the banks and spend money on overseas abortions. Big 3 car companies teetering on the edge or ruin? Hey - let's slap them with a bunch of new fuel standards they can't possibly meet and force them to retool all thier factories! National economy on the brink? Hey - let's cap and trade coal and raise EVERYBODY'S fuel bills! And if the economy collapses? Hey - it was Bush's fault! Ex-Guantanamo terrorists showing up in Al-Queda videos? Hey - let's close Guantanamo and 'not say' what we're going to do with them.
It has only been 1 week and Obama has done just about everything wrong it was possible to do wrong. Combine him with the certifiably insane Nancy Pelosi and the doormat Harry Ried and America is royally screwed.


I'll reply in order;
1. i dunno about your banking system, someone else take care of this one

2. So because america is suffering at the moment (as is everywhere else), obama should allow them to pollute and produce polluting machinery without regard for standards? That'll do wonders for the earth, how will your economic recession seem when we ruin the planet for the human race? You'll be cursing obama on your deathbed for not sorting out pollution when he had a chance. That's not even considering how other countries will say "typical america, not conforming, not caring about the rest of the world (and itself)"

3. Cap and trade coal? Dunno what you mean here, i'm english so i need better setups. Although capping fuel-mining will not seem like a stupid idea in 20 years time when it's potentially one of the most rare and prized commodities on the planet.

4. Everybody's fault except the people who ultimately have to suffer

5. Guantanamo was an illegal prison, might as well call yourself terrorists if you're gonna hold innocent people against their will for years of their precious lives.

>> ^dannym3141:
>> ^Winstonfield_Pennypacker:
I don't care so much about the abortion side of this. I DO care that little Barry has now opened the spigot for his liberal-whacko lobbyist groups to funnel billions of US taxpayer dollars to foreign organizations during a time when every penny of tax money should be staying home to solve our own issues.
But there - what else can we expect. Obama is an idiot. There isn't a single thing he's doing that doesn't run absolutely 100% counter to common sense. Economic turmoil? Hey - nationalize the banks and spend money on overseas abortions. Big 3 car companies teetering on the edge or ruin? Hey - let's slap them with a bunch of new fuel standards they can't possibly meet and force them to retool all thier factories! National economy on the brink? Hey - let's cap and trade coal and raise EVERYBODY'S fuel bills! And if the economy collapses? Hey - it was Bush's fault! Ex-Guantanamo terrorists showing up in Al-Queda videos? Hey - let's close Guantanamo and 'not say' what we're going to do with them.
It has only been 1 week and Obama has done just about everything wrong it was possible to do wrong. Combine him with the certifiably insane Nancy Pelosi and the doormat Harry Ried and America is royally screwed.

I'll reply in order;
1. i dunno about your banking system, someone else take care of this one
2. So because america is suffering at the moment (as is everywhere else), obama should allow them to pollute and produce polluting machinery without regard for standards? That'll do wonders for the earth, how will your economic recession seem when we ruin the planet for the human race? You'll be cursing obama on your deathbed for not sorting out pollution when he had a chance. That's not even considering how other countries will say "typical america, not conforming, not caring about the rest of the world (and itself)"
3. Cap and trade coal? Dunno what you mean here, i'm english so i need better setups. Although capping fuel-mining will not seem like a stupid idea in 20 years time when it's potentially one of the most rare and prized commodities on the planet.
4. Everybody's fault except the people who ultimately have to suffer
5. Guantanamo was an illegal prison, might as well call yourself terrorists if you're gonna hold innocent people against their will for years of their precious lives.


1. Asking others on LiberalSift to answer a question, eh? Well said.

2. Our policies should be governed by what other countries think. Well said.

3. You're English? I'm sorry.

4. You're right, terrorists should never be made to feel any pain of any kind. Well said.

5. I agree, we should become a police state like your country, and let only the criminals and terrorists have guns. Oh wait, with Obama, we're already on our way there. Well said.

If the unborn are considered alive from the moment of conception, then we should be able to claim them as tax deductions BEFORE they leave the womb.

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