Sometimes I kinda wish the ethnic minorities did leave just to watch white supremacist 'murica implode on itself.

Do you know who "those people" are? I don't.

There are some people whose ideology is easily identified and most likely well-entrenched: KKK, white supremacists, nazis, take your pick. They are difficult to talk to and even more difficult to persuade.

I happen to live near a popular gathering spot for nazis (real nazis, not just someone you don't like) and have tried many times over the years: it's no bueno.

But that's only the hard core, a fraction of the ~60 million votes for Trump. If you put all of them into the corner of shame and refuse to interact with them, much less try to understand their point of view, you'll never know their reasoning for voting the way they did. You'll only push them away, reinforcing any feeling of being left behind or ignored by the, for a lack of a better word, liberals. That's no bueno either. Want to see how that turns out? Look at the state of Brandenburg in Germany.

You can either try to breach their echo chamber in an attempt to convince them of your perspective or you'll end up with either an even more divided country than before or a second Trump presidency (or Trump 2.0). It's an uncomfortable thing to do, but looking at the emergence of safe spaces, trigger warnings, blatant groupthink and whatnot on certain university campuses, some people seem to have become outright allergic towards differing opinions -- that's highly unhealthy for a society.

The President does have enough power to totally sink us IF they're volatile enough. Simple incompetence in a president doesn't sink us. However, that can cost lives. 1,833 people died officially from Katrina, although obviously not that many were directly from the utter incompetence of the Bush administration. 4,500 Americans have died in Iraq during the invasion and subsequent occupation. These things don't "sink" the US completely, but they're VERY consequential.

But Trump is incompetent AND volatile. Bringing both of those qualities to the table as president, and you've got much much bigger issues.

Finally, I absolutely do not get the charges of personal corruption against Hillary Clinton, especially when compared to Donald Trump. Hillary Clinton, so far as I can tell, is an agent who is operating within a system that has been corrupted, and not personally by her. The system needs to be reformed. She's done things to win within the system that you'd ideally not do. But I don't get how she is personally corrupt.

But you speak as if Clinton is the competent but corrupt one, and Trump is the incompetent but non-corrupt one, which blows my mind. How is the only way you can be corrupt is through accepting campaign contributions? How is Trump University not an indictment of how corrupt Trump personally is? How is it not corrupt to appeal to white supremacists? How is it not corrupt to name call, incite your supporters to violence, and dismiss women because they must be on their periods? How is it not corrupt to have your daughter make a speech at the RNC and then tweet how to buy the dress she was wearing, so she could make some coin?

Because one of those forms of corruption is being potentially corrupted by a corrupt system, but they're at least trying to reform that system. Hillary Clinton is the one against Citizens United, officially calling for a constitutional amendment to get rid of it. Has Donald Trump?

I don't think HRC will be a great president. I don't particularly like her much. However, she is qualified to be President. She's done nothing illegal, which is the hallmark of whether someone is corrupt.

And don't kid yourself about our government's ability containing a fascist. The Weimar Republic's government had structures in place to prevent the rise of Hitler, too. They had separation of powers. The government was one of the most democratic governments in the world. Fat lot of good that did.

I'm not saying necessarily that Trump is the next Hitler. But I am saying that there are enough similarities that I can't vote for him, and the mere fact he got a major party's nomination is scary beyond all reason. And voting for someone like that proves out their blueprint for future candidates across the board for offices in the executive, legislative, and judicial branches at all levels of government.

As much as I don't like HRC, Trump is easily the worse major party's nominee in a very very very long time.

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If 'unequivocally disavow' are 'pretty complicated words' to Trump, he's completely unqualified for office.
But he actually asked him to 'unequivocally condemn' Duke, not 'disavow', then went on to dumb it down farther and said 'and say you don't want his vote, or the votes of white supremacists'. Trump replied clearly that he knows nothing about David Duke or white supremacists, so he won't even discuss them. The Duke part is a blatant lie, he's publicly condemned David Duke in the recent past. Condemning or not condemning white supremacists requires no additional information, unless you simply don't know what white supremacy is, which in itself is also a disqualifier for any high office.
At the time of the interview, there was no problem with him understanding anything or bad communication/equipment, only later when his answer bit him in the ass.
I knew that at some point this catch 22 of either being caught agreeing or disagreeing with blatant racists and white supremacists would catch up with him, because taking either stance alienates 1/2 his supporters and makes him lose the election.

That's just plain wrong. Black people can ABSOLUTELY be racist, they can even be racist against black people.
http://videosift.com/video/Chappelle-Black-white-supremacist
Black people can even perpetrate institutional racism...just see 'blackpeoplemeet.com' who's policy is to exclude non-black people as proof they can do it.

Please note the actual definition of the word below, and that your limited definition is the secondary one, not primary. The primary definition describes the most common usage, the secondary one describes institutional racism, which is a side effect of the those in power holding to the primary.

Racism: noun
1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human racial groups determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to dominate others or that a particular racial group is inferior to the others.
2. a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.
3. hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

I think it's pretty apparent by the articles below, he's a professional troll. I'm sure fox knows what he is and has him around cus hes good for ratings. Kinda surprised TYT got sucked in. Hmmm maybe they are just as bad as the rest of the media when it comes to checking out who and what they are reporting on OR maybe they know and are doing it for the clicks. That would be disappointing but not surprising.

"It became irresistible to goad people and corner them into conversations about controversial politics because they were so hysterical and easy to anger," McInnes wrote, trying to explain how he had been misquoted as a white supremacist in a news article because of a prank he'd pulled. "Plus, incendiary political statements garnered endless publicity for us, and playing with mainstream media became a fun game."

The full article tells the story i think
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/gavin-mcinnes-interview-im-not-796177

A letter he wrote to gawker long ago on his antics
http://gawker.com/013468/letter-to-gawker-from-gavin-mcinnes

So...the feds holding property they've held at least since 1907 as a wildlife refuge, or surroundings they've purchased since then, and leasing it to people like these at ridiculously low prices is 'creeping into our lives' and 'overgrowth of government'?
Um...yeah...how does that work?
These people committed arson on federal land DURING A WILDFIRE and were found guilty, and are sentenced under federal MINIMUM guidelines, not given the max, and these Bundy people are finding that an overreach of government...how?
The cognitive dissonance in their last statement would be hilarious if it wasn't an actual mindset so many people AGREE with when talking about white groups, but scoff at as self serving drivel when applied to black groups.
THESE people think the law is rigged against them? What should the Black Lives Matter people think when it's PROVEN the law is rigged against them, and it's their LIFE at stake, not their right to do whatever they want on other people's property, including arson, without consequence.
And can you imagine the terrified outrage on Fox if a group of armed BLM (Black Lives Matter) people took over a BLM (Bureau of Land Management) office, like these nutjobs did? Now consider the ridicule if they did it to 'protest' the mandatory sentencing of a convicted arsonist....who's black.

Oh...interesting to find out this as well....
-Many of the tactics and talking points being used were popularized in the 1970s by the white supremacist group Posse Comitatus. This group promoted the “Christian Patriot” movement, advocated the formation of “Citizens Militias,” helped forge an idiosyncratic reading of the Constitution, said the county sheriff was the highest elected official that should be obeyed, and opposed federal environmental restrictions.

Sweet Zombie Jesus!

This was also not the only man involved, and not the only concern that applied. This quote is his, not that of half a nation.

While I agree that the south had racist and white supremacist behaviors, I simply point out that the north was little better.

Both were plenty racist, and both cared a lot more about their money/power than they did about slaves. Rich white people in charge today don't give 2 shits about poor black people, I find it very unlikely that the rich white people in charge way back then cared any more.

Let me illustrate the 'champion of liberty' spin with an unrelated example :
Take the ww2 pacific theater for example. Japan teaches WW2 as a war to free Asia from western colonialism. U.S. teaches WW2 (pacific) as a war to free Asia from imperial expansion and oppression by Japan. Both are telling the truth, and both are full of crap. For neither was altruistic in their motivations, but both spin themselves as champions of liberty. For you will always have people on your side if you tell them you are standing up for liberty. (A concept well illustrated in The Prince - one of the earlier 'game theory' (from before it was called that) studies of governance.)

On a side note,

Keep in mind that slaves from Africa were usually purchased from black slavers.

And just a few generations ago, my own great grandparent's era, they and their peers were white peasant property of local white counts.

Things are not really all that 'black and white' (no pun intended).

-scheherazade

http://videosift.com/video/Black-Man-Vs-White-Man-Carrying-AR-15-Legally#comment-1872048
...damn. this comment is sooo unbelievably succinct, Lantern, it hurts..

Do you realize what this comment implies?

Did you forget to check that /Sarcasm box?

No?

Because I find it EXCEEDINGLY difficult to believe that YOU, @lantern53, genuinely ACTUALLY care to investigate the close ties between racism & Law Enforcement/"Criminal Justice"?

Ironic cause yer a cop. /s [see tongue in cheek.]

You don't care one bit about the suffering of "others" who you can't relate with.

You live inside a happy little bubble that protects you from dealing with "other people's problems"..

Get it?

You know good and well racism is ever-present.

You've even admitted more or less in your recent comments to me "racist isn't ending anytime soon, so get over it Genji"

You know exactly how police "became institutionally racist", Lantern.

You're a police officer, and yet you disparage black people & culture repeatedly & intentionally as in the manner/style that a racist or white supremacist, etc would.

You see the same events, unfairness, racism, abuse of authority, etc. etc. etc

You just choose to ignore that reality, because it doesn't match up with your little fox news bubble.

"I've got boot straps! Why don't you just use yours?!"
Lantern said to the Shoeless man..

Hence why you NeoCon-artists [see, it's like when you say Lib-tards. hokey, isn't it.] are ruining the country.

Based on the book The Rebel: The Outlaw Josie Wales, written under a pseudonym by Asa Earl Carter, a White supremacist. There was a This American Life (http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/527/transcript) which goes into AEC and The Education of Little Tree. It's interesting how, based on that, AEC's pecular point of view comes across quite clearly in this clip--the distrust of Blue Coats, the disdain for government, and even viewing the Native American as a "Noble Savage".

Get me started on pretentious children's names ....Lets share, shall we??

From bad to worse with three ratings, 1 being wannabe beat generation, 3 being, the only cure for you is checking-into a bar fight for some inexpensive therapy and the only hope for your kids being foster homes with white supremacist lesbians.

It's a contest people, submit entries below

1 g Sky, b Helms
2...

What? Nazis? Really?
Are the homos spraypainting yellow crosses on doors in your town again?

Stop acting like you're a victim here. If the gay community could ruin anybodys livelyhood they'd start with the republican party or foxnews (both are doing fine) and not some shitty baker. What might ruin these businesses is not knowing their countries laws (you can't refuse service to select individuals and you can't sell whiskey to 10 year olds no matter what your gods have to say about it) and alienating customers with their douchebaggery. People don't want cake from a homophobe the same way they don't want drinks served by white supremacists or drycleaning from somebody who thinks rape is a crime made up by ungrateful sluts who should've dressed less like whores.

If your community thinks you're an antisocial idiot, it will shun you. They only thing that has changed is why people consider you unworthy of their business.

As I said, the wedding cake business isn't something everybody is cut out to stomach.

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6 more comments have been lost in the ether at this killed duplicate.