>> ^DerHasisttot:

Somehow i highly distrust all this libertarian propaganda... why? Because it clearly is propaganda.
And they all seem like giant douchebags.

I understand that position, I agree that these folks tend to reek of "fuck you", but this guy is generally accurate in his description of how bitcoin works.

The real compelling application, which he didn't bother to mention, is that the transactional cost is extremely low and the system security is extremely high. If the market growth stabilizes to a slow deflationary curve against the USD, then it will become useful for what it was designed for, allowing people to make digital transactions of funds with a very small non-percentage transaction cost.

I am currently running a few GPGPU servers on the bitcoin network, which while not as profitable as straight speculation at least is a realistic stable business model which is not dependent on beating a bubble burst.

Somehow i highly distrust all this libertarian propaganda... why? Because it clearly is propaganda.



And they all seem like giant douchebags.





I know my opinions are not defined or founded by much fact, but reason.tv seems like a giant pile of horsemanure.

How is this currency safe from hackers? Who is the source making the money?

>> ^imstellar28:

@<a rel="nofollow" href="http://videosift.com/member/guymontage" title="member since July 18th, 2009" class="profilelink">guymontage
Who said you have to be an engineer? What I said is I very much doubt anyone in this thread is qualified to comment on the consequences of a plane hitting a skyscraper. To think you can just waltz in here and quote "Inertia" because you heard it in 8th grade science class is just ridiculous.
What argument is rcyhan making? The guy in the experiment started with the hypothesis "thermite can cut steel" and then conducted an experiment and proved that yes, it can cut steel. What is not scientific about that? As far as I understand it, that is the exact implementation of the scientific method. The fact that the conclusion is "widely known" (rychans words) has no bearing on this video. Clearly, it is not "widely known" if a mainstream television show is conducting experiments and concludes that thermite can not, in fact, cut steel.
Everyone on the internet thinks they are an expert, but who in this thread even has a college degree much less one in civil engineering? Even if someone has a degree in civil engineering who has the experience with skyscrapers or even the particular design of this tower? It's retarded to think anyone here is anything even resembling an expert on the physics of this particular situation.


My physics went up to a minor on my undergraduate degree. Even in high school though the potential energy of millions of tonnes of concrete at a certain height is already taught. That is more energy than any bomb or load of jet fuel anyone can get their hands on, and it's all rigged to unload itself straight down.

The truther that are idiots are the ones insisting that the planes weren't the cause of the collapse. If you distrust and loath the government enough to believe they were behind the attacks, if you are a rational, scientific person you will conclude that the government organized the plane crashes to take out the towers. All the insistence that was merely a cover for explosives already planted inside is insanity. If the government wanted to commit the act, they would just plant the explosives and set them off. It wouldn't have even been the first time terrorists tried to use explosives to collapse the buildings. The ONLY thing adding the planes into the mix would do is make it infinitely more prone to failure and discovery.

Then you have the unscientific beliefs that people trumpet as reasons they believe the towers were rigged beforehand:
-Jet fuel can't melt steel! Meanwhile commercial steel furnaces are widely sold that are designed to do exactly that.
-The buildings collapsed at near free fall speed, no resistance! Go see the explosives free building demolition video here on the sift. Same speed of collapse, with just the upper supports pulled out by some cranes outside.
-Everyone knows the planes couldn't have been enough to collapse the buildings! Meanwhile, 10's of thousands of engineers the world over didn't bat an eye at the finding that the fires could cause the collapse. That's a lot of professionals in on the conspiracy.
-Blocking investigation of the real story! Meanwhile google scholar is filled with endless numbers of publicly available journal articles that speak to every loony idea the conspiracy crowd can throw out there.

If you believe the government worked with someone to crash planes into the towers that's one thing. If you believe the whole idea that the planes couldn't possibly have caused the collapse and the government must have wired it with explosives before hand, you believe something idiotic and need your head shaken.

@RedSky, I haven't answered your question because I'm not sure I know the answer. I'm not sure it's fair to assume its the result of firearms just because a gun was involved. There's motivation to consider. Some feel one-sided and one-size-fits-all government legislation and protectionism keep them poor, limit opportunity and ultimately disenfranchise them.

It's a loaded question, because it requires a lot of discussion that won't easily fit into a yes or no answer. I'll just say statism creates victims. It's a system that must steal to legitimize itself, and by majority vote polices morality (sin tax, prohibition on prostitution, drug laws, etc). We've seen the militarization of the police thanks to heavy funding from the Pentagon.

Maybe the police state is paranoid of its armed citizenry and uses excessive force more than necessary? Maybe incidents are quickly escalated by the police and there's a growing distrust from the less fortunate neighborhoods?

I never disagreed with the Fear channel. Heck, it was in the original description of the video! I am surprised any one would downvote your choice.

In reply to this comment by blankfist:
>> ^blankfist:

fear controversy


Finally got a downvote for this comment. Before the sensitive busybodies on here go on a rampage, I'd like to point out the fear channel description:

A place for videos exhibiting examples of fear, the use of fear to control and oppress, the use of fear to convince and motivate, fear of differences, terrorized people and animals, paranoia, distrust, fear of death, and phobias.

>> ^blankfist:

fear controversy


Finally got a downvote for this comment. Before the sensitive busybodies on here go on a rampage, I'd like to point out the fear channel description:

A place for videos exhibiting examples of fear, the use of fear to control and oppress, the use of fear to convince and motivate, fear of differences, terrorized people and animals, paranoia, distrust, fear of death, and phobias.

That bit about the census being used against Japanese Americans is true. The way this story is positioned, it sort of made it sound like 100% of the things the right says is completely made up. Many times, it obviously is. But that particular event...the census being used against Americans...is true.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_9066
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_American_internment (citations at the bottom of the page, if you distrust Wikipedia)

Lest anyone think I'm defending Ms. Bachman or Fox News, I'm most certainly not. I'm merely stating that that particular sound byte she uttered is true. I cannot help that.

This ugly truth serves us all best if we remember it...and that might be difficult hearing it embedded among the lies revealed by Rachel Maddow's story.

>> ^HugeJerk:

It's a dupe unfortunately. I can't do the invocation though.
http://videosift.com/video/World-of-Warcraft-Cataclysm-Cinematic-Intro


I'm really beginning to distrust siftbot's ability to detect a dupe.

>> ^mkknyr:

I'm sorry, but as much as I dislike Glenn Beck, this clip smacks of the same fear-mongering and out-of-context manipulative sound bites that make me distrust Fox News. There's no discussion, there's no reasonable discourse here. It's pure emotion, and I won't accept it as an intellectually honest perspective.


I do agree with you and noticed it myself while viewing.

Positive Criticism: for those that don't are as keen, could you cite an example or two of media perversion from this clip? I'm curious of what discussions it might bring up.

I'm sorry, but as much as I dislike Glenn Beck, this clip smacks of the same fear-mongering and out-of-context manipulative sound bites that make me distrust Fox News. There's no discussion, there's no reasonable discourse here. It's pure emotion, and I won't accept it as an intellectually honest perspective.

I agree with a lot of what you say, and like I said in my reply -- it's common for the extremists on either side to be the loudest voices -- despite the fact that they're a vast minority.

There is no true "news" anymore, no matter which channel (or website) you visit, there is an ever present slant, being it right or left leaning, and some sort of agenda in play. The only TRUE method of absorbing news today is to listen to what both sides have to say, and coming to the middle ground on our own (which I try to do). For example, many sifters, diggers, or reddits will either love one opinion maker -- or hate them -- there is [almost] no middle ground. Example: Bill O'Riley is a XXXXX (you can fill in the blank), or the opposite occurs: Bill O'Riley is awesome! Same applies to Maddow, or Olbermann, etc. Fact is, Bill O'Riley is neither a XXXXX or awesome, he's just a person giving HIS opinion, some of which people will disagree with. But like anyone, there ARE things [people] will agree with him on, whether [they] like it or not. In either case, the truth lies somewhere between what Olbermann says and what O'Riley says for the sane people, as both have an agenda, clear or not. These tea-partiers are no different. Instead of getting annoyed by them, or hating them, or calling them all morons, you have to listen to what they have to say, and pick out the rational thoughts they have, not the ones infected by fear or hate. There ARE some things the tea-partiers say that makes sense, whether we like it making sense or not doesn't matter.

Oh, and I tend to ramble, too. Mostly because I like intelligent conversation.

The problem with the media, and the government today (either side), is that you will often see this, and I use this example because it's at the forefront of politics right now.

Republicans are often (almost always) accused of being an elite class of rich people protecting an elite class of rich people. You will often hear democrats regurgitate this, as if they're the voice of the middle class/under class people, which is what they market themselves as.

The problem I have with that is simple: Everyone in Washington (and I mean EVERYONE) and everyone that has a TV show (like Olbermann/Maddow), are VERY rich people. These very people ARE the elite they are supposedly protecting us from. So it's very insulting to me when they try to talk as if they're one of [us] (middle class). I've been to a few political events in my life that are non-party events (both Democrats/Republicans in attendance). It's quite amazing how much hate they spew at each other in the spotlight/on television, and now friendly they all are behind closed doors.

The republicans and democrats almost all universally care about one thing -- votes. And why wouldn't they when they're all paid hundreds of thousands of dollars per year to "fix" all the nations problems when all they end up doing is breaking it more with every change they make [for our sake]. Not to mention the back end 1 million plus dollar book deals they all end up having when they do get voted out and/or leave.



Sorry for rambling.

>> ^peggedbea:

hmmmm, i realize it's a geographic phenomenon and an example of a very vocal minority. but this phenomenon is having an impact on everything else (see the recent texas state board of education decisions), and i believe, a detrimental one at that.
and sure the only exposure to the media i have is through the internet, but it's also very sporadic and i'm generally pretty good at realizing hyped up bullshit when i see it.
let me clarify this last bit. i don't think they're misguided because they fear, hate, distrust the government. honestly, i think most of the time not trusting politicians is warranted and wise. BUT the trust they put in sources that intentionally misguide them("they" being the dozens of people that claim tea party affiliation that i have every day exposure to) is what i think is "misguided fear and distrust".
and yes, "authority" was just a device to emphasize that i speak to dozens of people with tea party affiliation every day, my family get-togethers are dominated by political conversations with tea baggers weekly, i hear loads of first hand "tea bagging nonsense" daily. i'm very curious, very friendly, and work a job where i go into peoples homes and a side effect is forging relatively intimate relationships with the whole household, so when my families are having these discussions (daily), i listen, and ask questions respectfully and try to seem unbiased. my experience is not from sensational news sources, but from the mouths of a movement i find misguided and threatening. my friends and family and neighbors and clients are scared. they tell me they're scared. and they're being scared by sources they trust and shouldn't and that makes me sad.
i think the most damning evidence that this far right, very vocal minority, is actually something to worry about is the texas state board of education. it was slowly infiltrated over the last decade or so by young earth creationists and the christian right. they planned it this way intentionally. the sources that fund the political campaigns of far right christian groups intentionally set their sites on the texas board of education because of the impact decisions in texas have on the rest of the country. the board of education votes every 10 years on new textbooks and new curriculum standards. because of how huge texas is, textbook publishers usually just sell whatever books texas orders to most of the other states in the country. this year the vote came up and and extreme far right political/religious agenda won. now, they have dictated the educational standards of an entire generation, very nearly nation wide.
also, another thing that makes me shudder is my city recently did a multimillion dollar renovation to the science museum. millions of those dollars came directly from oil and gas companies (that also silently fund the tea party movement). we now have a science museum in a major city that is largely dedicated to energy with zero mention of conservation, pollution or climate change. and almost zero mention of alternative sources of energy production in the future.
so my overall points being that, 1. i know,literally, dozens of people that claim tea party affiliation and i don't think any of them stupid or crazy. (but i think the movement as a whole is very stupid and very crazy and very deceptively steered, not individual people) 2. i don't think just because nationwide news outlets sensationalize things, that we can discount the very very real impact this extremely far right, mostly religious, and extremely loud minority is having.
but.. i ramble too.

hmmmm, i realize it's a geographic phenomenon and an example of a very vocal minority. but this phenomenon is having an impact on everything else (see the recent texas state board of education decisions), and i believe, a detrimental one at that.

and sure the only exposure to the media i have is through the internet, but it's also very sporadic and i'm generally pretty good at realizing hyped up bullshit when i see it.

let me clarify this last bit. i don't think they're misguided because they fear, hate, distrust the government. honestly, i think most of the time not trusting politicians is warranted and wise. BUT the trust they put in sources that intentionally misguide them("they" being the dozens of people that claim tea party affiliation that i have every day exposure to) is what i think is "misguided fear and distrust".
and yes, "authority" was just a device to emphasize that i speak to dozens of people with tea party affiliation every day, my family get-togethers are dominated by political conversations with tea baggers weekly, i hear loads of first hand "tea bagging nonsense" daily. i'm very curious, very friendly, and work a job where i go into peoples homes and a side effect is forging relatively intimate relationships with the whole household, so when my families are having these discussions (daily), i listen, and ask questions respectfully and try to seem unbiased. my experience is not from sensational news sources, but from the mouths of a movement i find misguided and threatening. my friends and family and neighbors and clients are scared. they tell me they're scared. and they're being scared by sources they trust and shouldn't and that makes me sad.

i think the most damning evidence that this far right, very vocal minority, is actually something to worry about is the texas state board of education. it was slowly infiltrated over the last decade or so by young earth creationists and the christian right. they planned it this way intentionally. the sources that fund the political campaigns of far right christian groups intentionally set their sites on the texas board of education because of the impact decisions in texas have on the rest of the country. the board of education votes every 10 years on new textbooks and new curriculum standards. because of how huge texas is, textbook publishers usually just sell whatever books texas orders to most of the other states in the country. this year the vote came up and and extreme far right political/religious agenda won. now, they have dictated the educational standards of an entire generation, very nearly nation wide.

also, another thing that makes me shudder is my city recently did a multimillion dollar renovation to the science museum. millions of those dollars came directly from oil and gas companies (that also silently fund the tea party movement). we now have a science museum in a major city that is largely dedicated to energy with zero mention of conservation, pollution or climate change. and almost zero mention of alternative sources of energy production in the future.

so my overall points being that, 1. i know,literally, dozens of people that claim tea party affiliation and i don't think any of them stupid or crazy. (but i think the movement as a whole is very stupid and very crazy and very deceptively steered, not individual people) 2. i don't think just because nationwide news outlets sensationalize things, that we can discount the very very real impact this extremely far right, mostly religious, and extremely loud minority is having.

but.. i ramble too.

This is a geographical phenomenon. Where I live, there are nothing but far left liberals that bother protesting, holding signs in the streets, etc. However, I never hear a peep out of what I'd consider the common every day democrat (such as my parents), their honest thoughts, etc. It's always the extremes that have the loudest -- and usually most annoying -- voices.

Also, keep in mind that if the only exposure you have to the news media and pop culture is through sifting (or the Internet), than you are only seeing the most sensational of the sensationalized, and the most popular of pop culture.

You completely lose me, however, when you say people are misguided because they fear, hate, or distrust the government. To top it off, you claim to say this with authority? Far be it for me to correct you on this, but no, you don't. You simply say it because you can, and it's of your opinion, and the word authority doesn't belong anywhere in the sentence. Now, I realize you worded it that way to add emphasis, but there are better ways to add emphasis other than to elect yourself the authoritative voice of reason on VS. Keep this in mind, the reason that this country (and many others) exist, is because of this misguided distrust, fear and hate of governments the world over. Sometimes this distrust, fear, or hate is within reason and is counter-detrimental and necessary. I'm not saying it is or not, as I do not know yet. But time will tell.

>> ^peggedbea:

i wish i could feel that way that "the news media sensationalizes" this stuff, but my reality is that
1. i dont own a television to get sensationalized by. literally the only exposure i have to the "news" media and popular culture is through my sporadic bouts of sifting (i'll go 2 weeks and watch a bunch videos or i'll 2 months and watch 1), or whatever my facebook friends post and i chose to watch.
2. i live/work for/am related to/ very literally surrounded by people with this world view constantly. there is at least one tea party rally at least once a month here. there are right now, literally, 6 tea bagger signs in peoples front yards on my street alone. i do realize this is kind of a very loud minority movement. and that in other parts of the country, or the world at large, this just seems like a few people who are being pumped up by the media to look like dumbshits for profit. but the reality in, what i imagine is most of the southern states, is that this shit is absolutely everywhere. and it is having an extremely real impact on legislation and education, especially in texas (which will impact the education of 46-48 other states because of its sheer size, spending power, population and influence). the growth and popularity of this movement, particularly in texas, is having a very real and lasting and detrimental impact on what will eventually be the rest of the world. (with the dumbing down and godifying of educational standards, which has already happened, and the intense popularization of climate change denial, and making science denialism a populist movement).
and while i love the people i know who buy into this, and empathize with the fear and misguided hatred of the government, i can say with some authority that this world view is absolutely, detrimentally, batshit. and one that feeds and thrives and exploits ignorance and fear.
>> ^hPOD:
As for the other guys comment about tea baggers and sanity, he/she needs to understand that just because someone has a different view of life/set of opinions than he/she does, doesn't make them insane, retarded, stupid, or otherwise. I'm so sick of this kind of crap on Sift and other such boards. Not for nothing, but the media loves to sensationalize the idiocy of society. You almost never see a regular democrat/liberal, republican/neocon or tea bagger in the news...you always see the extreme idiot that makes them all look stupid.

In reply to this comment by Shepppard:
@enoch

I respect your opinion, I'm not defending the police for what they did, I'm defending them in the sense of "Until we know what provoked them, I'm not judging them."

I dislike videos that have been edited together in this sense, very quick scene change from peaceful protesters, to who knows what or how long the camera's been off.

i totally agree and i stated as much.
i was just pointing out the history and the abuse of power.
when we consider that when it comes to video..and editing (which i agree with you) we may never get a full or complete story concerning events of abuse that transpire.
my take is to always be on the side of caution,which i think you would agree evidenced by your comment but i have a healthy distrust of authority and those who wield power.so i tend to side with the people with the broken bones and bloody noses.what can i say?i am an anarchist.

seems we agree on the major points and i thank you for your response.
you have always been a voice of reason here on the sift.
i admire that.
till next time.
namaste.

I don't have any answers on a better way to deal with cops. I was just commenting on what I felt as I watched this video.I know its best just do as you are told by the police. I also know that doesnt always make it right. I have had some bad dealings with the police, never any major trouble, but enough to know that they can be liars and power tripping dickheads who know they can getaway with almost anything. I think its sad that we all know that cops are bad news, and are instructed to learn how to deal with it.
"we know that if you run, cops will shoot you" is a good example, running is now a capitol offense that requires deadly force? Running is a bad idea, curling up in the fetal posistion and pissing youself is the safest action when the police approach. (and No, i dont really reccomend it). >> ^longde:
Except we know that if you run, the cops will shoot you.
I see the disconnect here. Let me explain. The people in this video trust the cops and the legal system much less than you. Their objective is to leave any police encounter alive, with limbs intact, and without some arbitrary felony thrown at them.
So, they're not hoping for the best, they are trying to prevent the worst.
For all your cynicism, I haven't heard any better ways from you to deal with cops. What advice would you give these people.>> ^csnel3:
I think we all watched the same video. I admit I question things more than normal.
This rang of a video that the authorities would like to play for all the children everyday at the beginning of school. They tell you you have rights, this is comforting, then they tell you the proper way to be arrested and or released, depending on what the police decide to do with you. Wrong or right, just follow these steps and the police will have an easier time with you, and maybe you will recieve some kind of repreve, or not.
I know that the police will lie to us, and do whatever they want, regardless of our rights. I also know they will lie to each other, the court system, and the media, to be able to do and say anything they want. For the most part, once they are in control of you, it doesnt matter what you say about your rights. The video even states that the cops hate people who say they have rights and be prepared for the shitstorm if you go down that road. It's better to shut-up and obey.
I always try to be polite and cooperate, even though I really dislike and distrust the police.
Sometimes I just feel, Rights or not, Run!! Serpintine!Serpintine!Serpintine! dont look back.go go go.
Or just do as this vid says and hope for the best.