Wolfenstein: The New Order - E3 Trailer

"Taking place in 1960, Wolfenstein: The New Order depicts an alternate timeline -- one in which the Nazis won World War II and took over the world... and only B.J. Blazkowicz can stand up to them. Learn more in our new E3 trailer featuring new gameplay footage..."

From http://www.shacknews.com/article/79528/wolfenstein-the-new-order-trailer-focuses-on-changed-history ...
ChaosEnginesays...

Do you mean the news where every day countries/states are legalising gay marriage? Or the (admittedly old) bit where the U.S. has a black president? Maybe it's where most civilised countries allow women the means to control their reproductive cycle?

Look, I get that there's some Bad Shit (tm) happening, and yes, you could argue that many of those 14 characteristics are being fulfilled.

But come on, you are literally invoking Godwin!

I'm not saying you shouldn't rail against the Bad Shit, but we're not fighting the Nazis. Things aren't that bad...

gharksaid:

you mustn't have been reading the news lately

Fletchsays...

I think some of us, in light of recent events, just thought it was kind of funny.

ChaosEnginesaid:

...
But come on, you are literally invoking Godwin!

I'm not saying you shouldn't rail against the Bad Shit, but we're not fighting the Nazis. Things aren't that bad...

gharksays...

Yes those are good points, however one thing I've found in my studies (in part, sitting through an ethics class every week for the past 2 years) and elsewhere is that the Nazi regime is used as a way of objectively describing what 'bad' is and contemporary examples are overlooked. The main examples of this 'bad' are the way in which they conducted human research, the genocide they committed and the fear they instilled in their own population to be obedient through the SS, propaganda etc. Of course there are many other examples but those are a few of the main ones. The issue I always have sitting there listening to these lectures is that we are turning a blind eye to what is happening in the world today, it's easy to understand why if you do a bit of thinking on the matter, but most people don't seem to be able to do that, or they are simply too scared to talk about it for fear of reproach.

So to start with, I could name countless things that America (and other countries such as the UK/France etc) has done over the past 50 years that would make any rational person cringe if they hadn't known about it previously, however you can find those things out yourself with a little research on the internet, so there's no point listing them here (and I'm sure you know many of them already anyway). I think what is important is why these things don't seem as objectively bad to you as what's been done in the past. The answer would have to be pretty complex, however I think one reason is that things are not done as overtly these days. Wars are often waged by proxy, or people are led to 'buy in' to the excuses that are often given to begin wars, change leaderships etc.

I mean, it's easy to think, ,OK so the Nazi's sent around death squads to ensure people were obedient and that's objectively bad, but how does one quantify how immoral or unethical it is to watch/listen to and record almost the entire world's digital communication exchange between individuals and groups and then have the ability to send drones with bombs on them to kill anyone they feel like (with an unknown amount of collateral damage) without fear of reproach. No reproach being literal, the US has ~half the worlds military expenditure after all.

Now you might say, well nobody is knocking on my door making sure I'm pro-Obama and killing my entire family if I'm not, however I think the thing people often overlook, and it comes back to my previous two points. These things are happening in other countries and they are often by proxy, so to fully comprehend the level of immorality the US has sunk to, one first has to educate oneself on all these events, then one has to have enough empathy to care about the events and people involved, then one has to be educated enough in morals and ethics to be able to make some measurement as to how bad they are.

In my opinion it's a tall order to get most people to understand/learn all these things, most people are too worried about keeping their jobs, looking after their families or friends etc. Even those that meet all those requirements won't all agree that these things are bad, and even if they know they are bad, they are too fearful to speak their mind about it, or perhaps they have a specific agenda (i.e. someone like Jay Carney who is paid to spout BS for the president all day). There are lots of ways things can be justified, and lots of angles that can be taken in arguments.

So I guess my point is that despite the fact things are not as bad for you as they would have been under the Nazi regime, that doesn't mean millions of people in dozens of countries are not being oppressed in similar ways to what they would have been back then. the US doesn't precisely meet Emilio Gentile's definition of a Fascist state, however it meets many of the criteria, and I think if you look at the big picture (primarily what's happening in countries that the US wants resources from) you can see that @Fusionaut's remark wasn't too far off the mark.

ChaosEnginesaid:

Do you mean the news where every day countries/states are legalising gay marriage? Or the (admittedly old) bit where the U.S. has a black president? Maybe it's where most civilised countries allow women the means to control their reproductive cycle?

Look, I get that there's some Bad Shit (tm) happening, and yes, you could argue that many of those 14 characteristics are being fulfilled.

But come on, you are literally invoking Godwin!

I'm not saying you shouldn't rail against the Bad Shit, but we're not fighting the Nazis. Things aren't that bad...

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