I remember, when i sat my 5th for (year 11) certificate exam for English... one of the questions was to draw a picture.
(true story)

Very last point is something I also think.

I guess so.

We are exposed to MORE problem solving, not exactly NESSISARY problem solving.

>> ^aceofkidneys:
I guess so.
We are exposed to MORE problem solving, not exactly NESSISARY problem solving.


Necessary.

>> ^aceofkidneys:
I guess so.
We are exposed to MORE problem solving, not exactly NESSISARY problem solving.


Oh I thought the last point was that Americans are saving more retards...?

We're certainly building a society that allows dumb people to survive, if not thrive (although maybe not flourish.)

Then again, we do need to fill out the ranks of the proletariat if we're going to have enough backs with which to support our great capitalist society.

Is QI on BBC America? I have to get that channel! This show is brilliant!

I've taken 2 IQ tests (administered by a professional, not the web-based ones etc.) in my lifetime. Both were when I was going to public school in the USA.

The first was when I was about 6-7 years old. I don't remember the event at all. My parents thought that I should be in the "gifted" program at the school, and the entry requirement was that you score at or above 120 on an IQ test. So, I took the test and got a result somewhere around 110-115, which wasn't enough to get me into the program.

I was always pretty nerdy and academic, and getting good grades was quite easy for me in any subject that I was interested in. Also, on nation-wide standardized tests like the Iowa Test of Basic Skills, I would consistently score in the 99th percentile. My parents thought that something must have gone wrong with my original IQ test, and wanted the school to re-test me. The school consistently gave the response that IQ tests are accurate and a person's IQ does not change over time, so a retest wouldn't accomplish anything.

When I was about 12-13, the school finally gave in and decided to let me retest. However, the entry requirements from the test had gone up in the meantime, and I would have to score above 130 IQ to get into the program.

I remember elements of the test from that time around. It seemed pretty bizarre.

I remember a "puzzle" that was made out of 4 cube blocks. All of the surfaces were blank white, except for the top sides which had a picture of an apple divided into the 4 pieces. Basically, an extremely easy jigsaw puzzle; no interlocking nubs, just 4 squares of equal size containing 1/4 of the picture. These cubes were placed on a table with the picture side facing up. The pieces were separated by about 3-4 inches, but not rotated or skewed at all. So, upon looking at them I could clearly see that by simply moving them together the "puzzle" would be complete and the apple would show. My tester told me to put together the puzzle and remember that time was a factor in the scoring, so I reached over and slid the 4 pieces together to show the apple. Probably all in under a second.

In another section, the tester would say vocabulary word that weren't particularly difficult or obscure, and ask me to describe or define them in my own words. Some of my friends recalled having difficulty with that, but it seemed easy for me.

One part I remember as being difficult for me was a series of pictures with something missing or incorrect. As examples I remember a cartoon fish that had relatively good detail but no gills, and a pair of shoes that were identical except one had eyelets around the holes for the laces and one did not. I remember that it was somewhat tough for me to figure out what they were going for in several of the pictures.

Anyway, this time around, I easily broke the entry barrier of 130 IQ and was allowed into the gifted program. I think that I actually scored above 140, but they wouldn't tell us our exact result at the time, and I have forgotten what it was revealed to be when I got the paperwork after I graduated. The school was quite surprised that my result was different than the first time I took the test, particularly by such a large margin. They said that I must have been sick, very nervous, or tanked the test on purpose when I was younger, although I don't remember any of those elements being a factor.

I relate this story not to brag (I don't really feel any "pride" in my IQ results, but being in the gifted program at school was nice for doors it opened), but to provide some background for my personal thoughts that IQ tests are not anywhere near as consistent or relevant as many would have us believe.

I read something about IQs that I hadn't really thought of before. If you look at a distribution of IQs:

http://i45.tinypic.com/dyumad.gif

You see that:
68 out of 100 people have an IQ between 85 and 115
2 out of 100 people have an IQ above 130
2 out of 100 people have an IQ below 70

And if you note what an IQ score represents:
70- Mentally Disabled
80 Borderline
90 Low Average
100 Average
110 High Average
120 Gifted
130+ Genius / Very Superior

You find that the average person, at an IQ of around 100, has something in common with roughly 68-95% of their peers. Someone in this group can, at least on some level, identify with the vast majority of people around them. To them, the world is more or less homogeneous, consisting for the most part, of people just like themselves. From their perspective, it is only a few people that stick out: the mentally disabled and the geniuses. People you hear about but rarely meet.

However, if you look at the distribution of IQs you find that the difference between average and mentally disabled is only about 25 points - 75 to 100. Incidentally, the difference between average and genius, or very superior, is also 25 points - 100 to 125.

Thus, the life of someone with an IQ of 130 or greater is much different. They can only identify, at least on some level, with less than 2-14% of their peers. To them, the world is also homogeneous, but they are the ones on the outside looking in. An individual with an IQ greater than 130 perceives life very much like an average person would if they were in a room with 100 people, and almost all of them...85%...were either borderline or mentally disabled.

>> ^imstellar28:
...
Thus, the life of someone with an IQ of 130 or greater is much different. They can only identify, at least on some level, with less than 2-14% of their peers. To them, the world is also homogeneous, but they are the ones on the outside looking in. An individual with an IQ greater than 130 perceives life very much like an average person would if they were in a room with 100 people, and almost all of them...85%...were either borderline or mentally disabled.


I don't really think it seems that way, at least not to the magnitude that your wording suggests. I'll assume that my 2nd IQ test was correct, and that I'm somewhere in the range of IQ 135-145. Just writing this sounds arrogant, but I have never felt like I am alone in a sea of stupid people or anything like that. I think what really happened with me is that I took the relative ease with which I can learn or remember academic-type information for granted.

In high school and college, I took courses which are typically seen as being "hard" - for example, I took Engineering Physics and Calculus 2 in my first semester at college. I never took notes in any class, and I basically never studied or read a coursebook outside of class, but I would generally get good grades pretty easily (my university GPA was 3.4). I think what I tend to fail to recognize is the gap between the effort that I put into getting those scores and what people with lower or average IQ put into it. Basically, I'm lazy - a failing which I take full personal responsibility for, but I think that government education programs like No Child Left Behind increase the incidence of that problem among high-IQ students.

I also had a good friend with an IQ that I know was significantly higher than mine; maybe 155+. On the things that really made me buckle down and work hard to understand, he would still be breezing through. I'm very glad that I had that experience, because it is good to learn that no matter how good you are or how easily you seem to be able to work things out, there is always somebody out there who can make you look like a confused idiot.

Letting the retarded criminals live and executing the smart ones sounds like a very bad idea in the long run.

>> ^jwray:
Letting the retarded criminals live and executing the smart ones sounds like a very bad idea in the long run.


How else would you cut down on the criminal mastermind population? The clever ones are more likely to either find a legal technicality out of prison, or hatch a really ingenious escape plan. Then you're stuck with the problem of potentially running into a really clever mass murderer on the streets, one who can not only outwit the law, but find very clever ways to kill you that you have no hope of thinking your way out of. The retarded mass murderers are harmless by comparison.

70- Mentally Disabled
80 Borderline
90 Low Average
100 Average
110 High Average
120 Gifted
130+ Genius / Very Superior

Revised

70-Christian/Muslim
80-Assholes that cut you off on the freeway
90-Your boss at work
100-The hot girl that you know is way dumber, but you feign interest in because she's so hot
110-The kind of cute girl that reads books and likes culture and shit but is a few pounds over weight so you hang out with the "100" IQ girl
120-Your friends
130+-You, Einstein, Schrodinger, Heisenberg, etc.

>> ^imstellar28:
Thus, the life of someone with an IQ of 130 or greater is much different. They can only identify, at least on some level, with less than 2-14% of their peers. To them, the world is also homogeneous, but they are the ones on the outside looking in.

Or they can just drink a lot and fit in nicely. Well, in spurts at least.

I guess I'm a genius then. At last, confirmation!
>> ^imstellar28:
I read something about IQs that I hadn't really thought of before. If you look at a distribution of IQs:
http://i45.tinypic.com/dyumad.gif
You see that:
68 out of 100 people have an IQ between 85 and 115
2 out of 100 people have an IQ above 130
2 out of 100 people have an IQ below 70
And if you note what an IQ score represents:
70- Mentally Disabled
80 Borderline
90 Low Average
100 Average
110 High Average
120 Gifted
130+ Genius / Very Superior

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