Seth Meyers on Orlando and Trump

Our late night "comedians" are becoming important voices in this election cycle.
harlequinnsays...

In contrast to the implication from Myers, saying "I don't want congrats, I wan't toughness & vigilance" is not spreading bigotry or misinformation.

I'm in favour of firearm regulation. But there are plenty of countries with ready availability of AR15s to vetted people showing that it is the vetting process and the demeanor of the populace that are the major factors in criminal activity with legal firearms (illegal firearms used in criminal activity being a different thing). Focus should be on regulating firearms away from criminal and crazy people.

bareboards2says...

@harlequinn Nothing says we only do one thing.

And the rest of us have a problem with the "I don't want congrats" line not because of bigotry or misinformation. We people who are paying attention to this narcissist see it as appalling bad taste that Donald makes this tragedy so baldly about how great he is. So soon after the event.

It is astounding to me that this needs to be explained. It is almost as if false narratives are being created here. Almost as if deliberate misdirection is being attempted.

Or maybe it is true misunderstanding, and the difference between bigotry and narcissism is truly something that can't be distinguished.

Well, now you know, right?

harlequinnsays...

If you're appalled at him then you more than likely have confirmation bias.

I'm going to guess that there is not much that Trump says that doesn't greatly irk you.

I don't think narcissism (love of oneself) or bigotry (intolerance of others) can be easily mixed up. On the other hand the label of bigot is often misused.

bareboards2said:

@harlequinn Nothing says we only do one thing.

And the rest of us have a problem with the "I don't want congrats" line not because of bigotry or misinformation. We people who are paying attention to this narcissist see it as appalling bad taste that Donald makes this tragedy so baldly about how great he is. So soon after the event.

It is astounding to me that this needs to be explained. It is almost as if false narratives are being created here. Almost as if deliberate misdirection is being attempted.

Or maybe it is true misunderstanding, and the difference between bigotry and narcissism is truly something that can't be distinguished.

Well, now you know, right?

ChaosEnginesays...

Trump obviously agreed with you, because having fulfilled his narcissistic asshole quota, he felt he'd been letting his bigotry game slide, so he remedied that.

*related=http://videosift.com/video/Trumps-Response-to-the-Orlando-Shooting-A-Closer-Look

harlequinnsaid:

If you're appalled at him then you more than likely have confirmation bias.

I'm going to guess that there is not much that Trump says that doesn't greatly irk you.

I don't think narcissism (love of oneself) or bigotry (intolerance of others) can be easily mixed up. On the other hand the label of bigot is often misused.

harlequinnsays...

In response to that link:
Revoking press passes to private events is not bigotry.
Vague innuendo is not bigotry.
Not wanting radical Islamists in your country is not bigotry.
Putting a temporary travel ban on foreign nationals from entering your country as a protective measure is not bigotry.
Being possibly wrong about Muslims protecting other radicalised Muslims within the American community is not bigotry.
If he is wrong, being wrong is not a "bigoted lie".
Appointing Supreme Court judges who may possibly (at their own discretion) overturn previous rulings is not bigoted.

ChaosEnginesaid:

Trump obviously agreed with you, because having fulfilled his narcissistic asshole quota, he felt he'd been letting his bigotry game slide, so he remedied that.

*related=http://videosift.com/video/Trumps-Response-to-the-Orlando-Shooting-A-Closer-Look

newtboysays...

In response to your response.....the definition....
Bigotry-intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself.
Bigot-a person who strongly and unfairly dislikes other people, ideas, etc. : a bigoted person; especially : a person who hates or refuses to accept the members of a particular group (such as a racial or religious group)

1) It is bigotry if they're revoked based on race, religion, sexual preference, difference of opinion, or any other groupings.
2) It is if it's bigoted innuendo.
3) Not wanting to allow Muslims (specifically Middle Eastern Muslims) into your country because you unfairly purport that they're all radical Islamists is bigotry.
4) Assuming the worst about Muslims as a group is bigotry.

It's a bit funny, because all the things you mentioned could be listed as examples of bigotry in the dictionary.

If he's wrong, and he knows it, about something disparaging he said about some group, that's a "bigoted lie".

As for the Supreme Court nomination (not appointment), you are technically correct with your statement, but not your meaning, his "litmus test" for acceptable nominees would be bigoted if it starts with "they must revoke the rights of [group X that I disagree with so doesn't deserve equal rights]".

harlequinnsaid:

In response to that link:
Revoking press passes to private events is not bigotry.
Vague innuendo is not bigotry.
Not wanting radical Islamists in your country is not bigotry.
Putting a temporary travel ban on foreign nationals from entering your country as a protective measure is not bigotry.
Being possibly wrong about Muslims protecting other radicalised Muslims within the American community is not bigotry.
If he is wrong, being wrong is not a "bigoted lie".
Appointing Supreme Court judges who may possibly (at their own discretion) overturn previous rulings is not bigoted.

harlequinnsays...

I already defined bigoted farther up the thread.

But again, back to the Oxford:

Bigot: A person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.
Bigotry: Intolerance towards those who hold different opinions from oneself.

Even dictionary.com gets it right this time. I don't know where you got your definition of "bigot".

1) It wasn't any of those though.
2) It wasn't bigoted innuendo though.
3) Not wanting to allow radicalised muslims who will engage in criminal behaviour into your country (which is what this is about) is not bigoted (just as you aren't considered bigoted for not wanting criminals engaging in criminal behaviour in the community). Making a temporary ban until you can institute a more rigorous vetting process is not bigoted. I.e. he accepts non-radicalised Muslims and their views, but they will have temporary visa restrictions until a better vetting system is in place.
4) Assuming the worst about a group is not bigotry. Being intolerant of the group's views is.

No, since they aren't bigotry, they couldn't be used as examples in a dictionary.

Saying disparaging things about a group is not bigotry. E.g. someone could say "I fucking hate Australians, they suck". That's not bigotry. Or, "All Australian's are dicks". Also not bigotry. Now on the other hand if they said, "I don't accept the views or opinions of Australians", then that is bigotry.

newtboysaid:

In response to your response.....the definition....
Bigotry-intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself.
Bigot-a person who strongly and unfairly dislikes other people, ideas, etc. : a bigoted person; especially : a person who hates or refuses to accept the members of a particular group (such as a racial or religious group)

1) It is bigotry if they're revoked based on race, religion, sexual preference, difference of opinion, or any other groupings.
2) It is if it's bigoted innuendo.
3) Not wanting to allow Muslims (specifically Middle Eastern Muslims) into your country because you unfairly purport that they're all radical Islamists is bigotry.
4) Assuming the worst about Muslims as a group is bigotry.

It's a bit funny, because all the things you mentioned could be listed as examples of bigotry in the dictionary.

If he's wrong, and he knows it, about something disparaging he said about some group, that's a "bigoted lie".

As for the Supreme Court nomination (not appointment), you are technically correct with your statement, but not your meaning, his "litmus test" for acceptable nominees would be bigoted if it starts with "they must revoke the rights of [group X that I disagree with so doesn't deserve equal rights]".

newtboysays...

Maybe, but you don't get to define words. The dictionary does, that's where I cut and pasted the definition from.

1)difference of opinion. Absolutely was that.
2) It was clearly outright bigoted statements and implications, and innuendo.
3) Perhaps, but his plan is to not allow ANY Muslims in. That's the definition of bigoted. Putting everyone on prison until you can figure out how to determine who's criminal....bigoted. he does NOT accept that non-radicalized Muslims exist, he blames them ALL for not turning in the 'radicals', painting them all as radical. You know he CLAIMS there's no vetting system in place at all for refugees, completely ignorant of the truth which is that it's incredibly hard and takes around 2 years for a refugee to be accepted.
4)wrong.

OK, since you can't understand the language and want to fight over dictionary definitions you don't understand, this conversation is over.
Enjoy your ignorance and naiveté.

harlequinnsaid:

I already defined bigoted farther up the thread.

But again, back to the Oxford:

Bigot: A person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.
Bigotry: Intolerance towards those who hold different opinions from oneself.

Even dictionary.com gets it right this time. I don't know where you got your definition of "bigot".

1) It wasn't any of those though.
2) It wasn't bigoted innuendo though.
3) Not wanting to allow radicalised muslims who will engage in criminal behaviour into your country (which is what this is about) is not bigoted (just as you aren't considered bigoted for not wanting criminals engaging in criminal behaviour in the community). Making a temporary ban until you can institute a more rigorous vetting process is not bigoted. I.e. he accepts non-radicalised Muslims and their views, but they will have temporary visa restrictions until a better vetting system is in place.
4) Assuming the worst about a group is not bigotry. Being intolerant of the group's views is.

No, since they aren't bigotry, they couldn't be used as examples in a dictionary.

Saying disparaging things about a group is not bigotry. E.g. someone could say "I fucking hate Australians, they suck". That's not bigotry. Or, "All Australian's are dicks". Also not bigotry. Now on the other hand if they said, "I don't accept the views or opinions of Australians", then that is bigotry.

harlequinnsays...

You cut a definition from somewhere that doesn't fit common usage of the word. The common usage of the word defines the definition. Dictionaries record the common usage.

The statement the interview quoted, in the clip in question, was not bigoted.

The clip in question does not reflect your assertion. In it he says he only wants to disallow radicalised Muslims, allowing the rest to enter the country.

I'm right, but you're entitled to disagree.

I'm glad you're exiting the conversation. You show a deep disregard for facts and can't perform a nuanced analysis of a simple video clip. You have an evident loathing of Trump (whom I don't care for one way or another) and do not demonstrate objective thinking.

newtboysaid:

Maybe, but you don't get to define words. The dictionary does, that's where I cut and pasted the definition from.

1)difference of opinion. Absolutely was that.
2) It was clearly outright bigoted statements and implications, and innuendo.
3) Perhaps, but his plan is to not allow ANY Muslims in. That's the definition of bigoted. Putting everyone on prison until you can figure out how to determine who's criminal....bigoted. he does NOT accept that non-radicalized Muslims exist, he blames them ALL for not turning in the 'radicals', painting them all as radical. You know he CLAIMS there's no vetting system in place at all for refugees, completely ignorant of the truth which is that it's incredibly hard and takes around 2 years for a refugee to be accepted.
4)wrong.

OK, since you can't understand the language and want to fight over dictionary definitions you don't understand, this conversation is over.
Enjoy your ignorance and naiveté.

newtboysays...

Go away, please.
I want nothing to do with you, you are not entertaining, informative, or pleasant.
Stop quoting me incessantly and find someone else to pester.

harlequinnsaid:

Welcome back!

Lol, I knew you couldn't leave!

I'm going to leave it here anyway. I think we've both made our points.

harlequinnsays...

No, I'll do as I please.

Your reading of this, or interacting with me is your choice. If I'm pestering you, then you're equally pestering me.

That I am any of the things you've listed is only because you fail to comprehend anything outside of your extremely narrow world view.

You wrote "This conversation is over."

Looks like you were wrong. It'll only be over for you when you stop. Remember, my actions don't dictate whether you continue or not.

It seems to me you want the last word.

Go on then. Eat your heart out.

newtboysaid:

Go away, please.
I want nothing to do with you, you are not entertaining, informative, or pleasant.
Stop quoting me incessantly and find someone else to pester.

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