I had two kinds of experiences with this stuff. One is a incredible laughing hysteria (like seen here), where I didn't know why I was laughing after about 30 seconds into the experience. The second would be change of gravity, opening my mind and thoughts, having conversations with the universe, shortly after that realizing I was talking with my Television for 2 minutes... The worst thing was that it talked back, so I thought.

To adress the first few posts. It's not a hard drug, there is no case of salvia junkies or such, you can literally buy this stuff legal... since ever. But I wouldn't recommend anyone who isn't strong minded and in the right mental state at the time of consumption. Salvinorin A is the strongest hallucinogen we know of, although it lasts only 5 minutes. And if you try something like that always have somebody with you who is sober. You will thank him later, while he will hate you a little bit for the shit you did.

The founder of the Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies (MAPS) believes research on MDMA, known commonly as the club drug ecstasy, could lead other hallucinogenic drugs to gain medical acceptance.

“I think MDMA is going to be the psychedelic that leads the way towards opening the door to other psychedelics, because they’re more challenging,” Rick Doblin said in an interview. “And so just the way that MDMA can help the individual deal with a past trauma, MDMA can help our society deal with the trauma of the sixties” when the drugs were abused and outlawed. Via Raw Story.

>> ^Stormsinger:

>> ^chingalera:
Dubstep has the capacity to set up some fundamentally deleterious vibrations in a human body at high volumes. Been to quite a few venues in my city, varied settings, and most have one thing in common: Poor sound engineering and too much Db for the space....
The evolution of Dj's styles goes hand in hand with the kind of durgs available and popular nowdays-Less pot and hallucinogens and more pharmaceuticals and bathtub amphetamines has created an evolutionary path for the sound. The music was more creative and ethereal, beneficial to the psyche when the majority of the crowd were high on natural drugs.
The genres' turning to complete shit IMO, sort of like rap and hip-hop did (although in a much shorter amount of time) and this time I blame the drugs first, and the idiots who abuse them next-
Dubstep it seems bees morphing into an un-listenable schizm whose fans are as hollow and vapid as the creativity it takes to rub two cuts together and drop an angular, hypnotic beat in the "release all bowels" range of hearing

You know...you could just say, "I don't like it." No need to get all hipsterish on us.


Gad. I had no idea my opinions could be considered hipsterish!!.....i feel like I need to wash now

>> ^chingalera:

Dubstep has the capacity to set up some fundamentally deleterious vibrations in a human body at high volumes. Been to quite a few venues in my city, varied settings, and most have one thing in common: Poor sound engineering and too much Db for the space....
The evolution of Dj's styles goes hand in hand with the kind of durgs available and popular nowdays-Less pot and hallucinogens and more pharmaceuticals and bathtub amphetamines has created an evolutionary path for the sound. The music was more creative and ethereal, beneficial to the psyche when the majority of the crowd were high on natural drugs.
The genres' turning to complete shit IMO, sort of like rap and hip-hop did (although in a much shorter amount of time) and this time I blame the drugs first, and the idiots who abuse them next-
Dubstep it seems bees morphing into an un-listenable schizm whose fans are as hollow and vapid as the creativity it takes to rub two cuts together and drop an angular, hypnotic beat in the "release all bowels" range of hearing

You know...you could just say, "I don't like it." No need to get all hipsterish on us.

Dubstep has the capacity to set up some fundamentally deleterious vibrations in a human body at high volumes. Been to quite a few venues in my city, varied settings, and most have one thing in common: Poor sound engineering and too much Db for the space....

The evolution of Dj's styles goes hand in hand with the kind of durgs available and popular nowdays-Less pot and hallucinogens and more pharmaceuticals and bathtub amphetamines has created an evolutionary path for the sound. The music was more creative and ethereal, beneficial to the psyche when the majority of the crowd were high on natural drugs.
The genres' turning to complete shit IMO, sort of like rap and hip-hop did (although in a much shorter amount of time) and this time I blame the drugs first, and the idiots who abuse them next-

Dubstep it seems bees morphing into an un-listenable schizm whose fans are as hollow and vapid as the creativity it takes to rub two cuts together and drop an angular, hypnotic beat in the "release all bowels" range of hearing

I've been on both sides of this debate. I have a history of addiction within my family, and I've seen some of the worst drugs can do, particularly escapist drugs. With regards to hallucinogens however, I think they can be a valuable experience to have. Usually people come out of it with a different perspective on themselves and their relationship with others. It's very common. There can also be dark periods, but those often have their value as well.

However, like many drugs they have their dangers. First of all, you had better be in a safe environment, and it's good idea to have a "trip sitter" (so long as they understand the place your head is headed). I've heard of too many kids thinking they can fly or getting themselves arrested, etc. Also, if you are someone predisposed to mental illness (particularly psychosis) it's a good idea to stay away. For some people one trip too many is something they never come back all the way from.

I wasn't sure if you were serious or not, but I'll bite -

Everyone was a slacker at some point. When you were a young child you did very little to help the family. When you did start to have responsibility you didn't understand why at first and only did the things because you were told to.
Its a gradual change into a person who understands that certain things have to be taken care of for, your own sake and, the sake of your family. To think someones life is automatically fucked up because they are a slacker is disgenuine.

Are you implying that between say 13-23 you didn't too stupid irresponsible things that would make others worry about you for your own selfish pleasure? I doubt anyone could deny they were more selfish than not during part of their life.

I am not saying drugs are required to make drastic realizations. If your daily routine has little or no changes you will always think in the same basic pattern and it takes some external event to change this. It could be a new job, a new love, a death etc. Taking certain drugs lets you control when these changes in perception occur rather than being a slave to fate.

No where in my original reply did I say anyone (myself or others) had to depend on drugs to make decisions. I stated two basic ideas - drugs can help you to make changes and that everyone should experience them at least once in their life. I also didn't say that the single time the person did them would create some epic change.

Something happened to you that caused a strong sensitivity to what I said. Maybe it was me telling you what to do, maybe someone you knew used drugs and became a loser, maybe my speech pattern reminds you of someone bad. I can't say what it is but if your strong reaction is genuine then I am sorry to dig up such anger.

Not all drugs are created equally. I would like you to view this chart http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a5/Drug_danger_and_dependence.svg Notice that LSD has a lower dependency than pretty much everything, including nicotine and caffeine.
Secondly the average dosage is between 60 and 180 MICROgrams. Do you understand how small that is? It is essentially impossible for it to be adulterated. You could mix it with drain cleaner and and the amount you are ingesting would not cause damage.
The industry accepted lethal dose is 15,000 micrograms, which would be FIFTEEN PAGES of paper you would have to ingest. I don't think you could fit that all in your mouth

I am not convincing you personally to take it but be aware that a significant scientific breakthroughs in business/technology/science have taken place while the person was on some form of drugs. You should also be aware that most artists (both audio and physical) use drugs to create the inspiration for the works you enjoy.
One time I figured out why fire on the head of a match is the shape that it is and how the flame is constructed. Months later I explained how I perceived it to someone qualified and they said even though I lacked the proper technical terms I had gotten it right. I was very happy about that.

Like I said previously, not all drugs are created equally. LSD does not make you feel anything extra, it only enhances what you are already seeing or feeling. It gives you the ability to super focus on details you overlooked previously or zoom out and take a large amount of data in at once then process it.

I think my reply will be lost on you but hopefully someone else is reading this and will gain something from it. If it means anything to you I have taken acid only twice in the last two years.


>> ^schlub:

Since when is not deciding to being a slacker a revelation? Your life/lives must be pretty fucked up if you depend on hallucinogenics to make your life decisions for you. This notion that drugs expand your mind or make you see things more clearly is complete and utter bullshit.
>> ^braschlosan:
Because of LSD my little brother had the revelation to start doing well in his final year of high school and try to make his parents life easier.
Then while in his first year of college he had the revelation about many parts of life and decided to study hard and play hard too. Now he has fun on the weekends and is getting great grades. The combination of the two has given him infinite self esteem.
During the summer break after his first year of college he had another LSD revelation about taking drugs. Now he rarely takes them (in high school he was a big pothead and E-Tard), when he does take them its planned out ahead of time for a special event. He's not even 20 yet and has a "wise" outlook on just about everything.
I have had similar life altering changes because of LSD that I'd rather not share here,
I agree with Enoch.
>> ^enoch:
for those who may be a tad uptight hallucinagenics should be mandatory.
if only once in your lifetime.

Since when is not deciding to being a slacker a revelation? Your life/lives must be pretty fucked up if you depend on hallucinogenics to make your life decisions for you. This notion that drugs expand your mind or make you see things more clearly is complete and utter bullshit.
>> ^braschlosan:

Because of LSD my little brother had the revelation to start doing well in his final year of high school and try to make his parents life easier.
Then while in his first year of college he had the revelation about many parts of life and decided to study hard and play hard too. Now he has fun on the weekends and is getting great grades. The combination of the two has given him infinite self esteem.
During the summer break after his first year of college he had another LSD revelation about taking drugs. Now he rarely takes them (in high school he was a big pothead and E-Tard), when he does take them its planned out ahead of time for a special event. He's not even 20 yet and has a "wise" outlook on just about everything.
I have had similar life altering changes because of LSD that I'd rather not share here,
I agree with Enoch.
>> ^enoch:
for those who may be a tad uptight hallucinagenics should be mandatory.
if only once in your lifetime.

For the reasons that I agree with you and believe you are correct, I have achieved a Masters degree in transpersonal psychology and a doctorate in clinical psychology in the hopes of working clinically with these powerful psychoactive sacraments.

For the time being, I serve as the Executive Director for the Association for Transpersonal Psychology and am in collaboration with the Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies, both of which are worth supporting and participating, if only for the cognitive liberties both organizations represent!

(feel free to contact me off-line with questions.)>> ^CreamK:

Very interesting take. Amphetamines are a ticking time bomb for your heart that is true. you can use them for years without noticing anything wrong and you may just drop dead at any time. Every time you take them you are cutting your life expectancy. They do have some therapeutic use but the fact is that pulse and blood pressure shoot so high that it's dangerous.
LSD and MDMA are much better for therapeutic uses, i've experimented with both, first recreationally but after realizing their potential have found them to be good tools. With LSD you can decrease depression for long periods of time, we are talking about months. MDMA is good for traumatizations, it enables the person to talk about his/her issues in a non-judgemental way, it kind of detaches the emotions from that trauma and gives closure. Both should be studied really carefully, i truly believe that hallucinogens are the answer to a lot of problems created by the modern high paced world and the lack of spirituality.

Very interesting take. Amphetamines are a ticking time bomb for your heart that is true. you can use them for years without noticing anything wrong and you may just drop dead at any time. Every time you take them you are cutting your life expectancy. They do have some therapeutic use but the fact is that pulse and blood pressure shoot so high that it's dangerous.

LSD and MDMA are much better for therapeutic uses, i've experimented with both, first recreationally but after realizing their potential have found them to be good tools. With LSD you can decrease depression for long periods of time, we are talking about months. MDMA is good for traumatizations, it enables the person to talk about his/her issues in a non-judgemental way, it kind of detaches the emotions from that trauma and gives closure. Both should be studied really carefully, i truly believe that hallucinogens are the answer to a lot of problems created by the modern high paced world and the lack of spirituality.

Very well stated. The devil's bell (which it's called in Ecuador and which name I like more than the others) has strong mythology about it, but it is apparently so difficult to extract the Datura from it, that most people I talked to about it just sort of laughed me off. I've spent more than two months traveling in both Ecuador and Colombia, six of those weeks studying with a leading northern Andean ethnographer. When you're on the road, it's a lot of fun to talk about these kinds of extreme phenomena, but for the most part, it's touristy b.s. The plant is much more famous for the hallucinogenic tea that can be made from the flowers themselves, which is also fatal if prepared incorrectly. Btw, Datura is the same compound that produces the infamous Vodou zombies in Haiti, made famous by Harvard ethnobotanist Wade Davis's "The Serpent and the Rainbow."

Vice loves to sensationalize this kind of thing, and I'm frankly a little annoyed at the characterization of the current political atmosphere in Colombia. Even the U.S. State Department's travel.state.gov, which is notoriously over-sensitive, has only qualified warnings about the dangers of traveling in rural areas. Colombia is a lot safer than the introduction to this story has painted it. Total disservice to the country and culture that gave this journalist his story. But Vice likes to dirty it up to sell mags to hipsters.

Still, totally entertaining and somewhat informative. Nice find.>> ^legacy0100:

lol I don't know about this one. Vice reporters are often a bit naive at times...
Still this was very well Directed. Had great atmosphere and pacing. Very good.

This exists all over Australia.
People use it for it's hallucinogenic effects.
I've never heard of refining it into a power though.
I believe the popular way is to twist and compress the flowers in a tea towel and suck on the tea towel to get the flower sap (for want of a better word).

"Scopolamine has been used in the past to treat addiction to drugs such as heroin and cocaine. The patient was given frequent doses of scopolamine until they were delirious. This treatment was maintained for 2 to 3 days after which they were treated with pilocarpine. After recovering from this they were said to have lost the acute craving to the drug to which they were addicted."


hmm sounds like ibogaine treatment .. and LSD works to treat alcoholism ... shake that brain up and see where the chips resettle .. electroshock minus the electro

"While it is occasionally used recreationally for its hallucinogenic properties, the experiences are often extremely mentally and physically unpleasant, and frequently physically dangerous; so repeated use is rare"

I remember this in middle school as being a catalyst for one of my first experiences with LSD25-saw it in the 7th grade, tripped in the eighth-Believe it or not, in Dallas Texas 1979, our science teacher conducted a discussion on the film after as she did each time she presented one. I was one of the kids that raised their hands affirmative if they had either known anyone, or had themselves had any experience with hallucinogens.(That, for all you here who think Texas is full of back-woods hicks bereft of any ideas of, or use for, critical thought).

Disease rates

"During the past two decades, an explosive growth in both the prevalence and types of sexually transmitted diseases has occurred. Up to 55 percent of homosexual men with anorectal complaints have gonorrhea; 80 percent of the patients with syphilis are homosexuals. Chlamydia is found in 15 percent of asymptomatic homosexual men, and up to one third of homosexuals have active anorectal herpes simplex virus"

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrezDb=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=2242700&ordinalpos=4&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_Resul
tsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

Higher rates of AIDS - 63 percent of new cases

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5424a2.htm


Drug use

Among homosexual men, ages 18 to 25: 79.2 percent have used marijuana; 75 percent have used psychotherapeutics for nonmedical reasons; 65.2 percent have used stimulants such as dexedrine and benzedrine; 62.5 percent have used inhalants such as amyl or butyl nitrate; and 50.2 percent have used hallucinogens such as LSD. Rates among lesbians: marijuana, 82 percent; psychotherapeutics, 58.8 percent; stimulants, 52.9 percent; inhalants, 41.2 percent; and hallucinogens, 41.2 percent. Comparing current usage to national usage, homosexuals were found to use drugs with greater frequency: "Among adults aged 18-25, 16.5 percent of men and 9.1 percent of women have used marijuana in the past month, compared with 37.5 per-cent of gay men and 23.5 percent of lesbians."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1615476/

20 times higher rate of meth use (quoted from LA Times article)

http://www.narth.com/docs/methuse.html

Domestic violence

"Rates of battering victimization among urban MSM are substantially higher than among heterosexual men and possibly heterosexual women. Public health efforts directed toward addressing intimate partner battering among these men are needed."

http://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/abs/10.2105/AJPH.92.12.1964

http://www.springerlink.com/content/r130ql0471892435/

Depression, suicide, mental health

LGB people are at higher risk of mental disorder, suicidal ideation, substance misuse, and deliberate self harm than heterosexual people

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18706118

Findings support recent evidence suggesting that gay, lesbian, and bisexual young people are at increased risk of mental health problems, with these associations being particularly evident for measures of suicidal behavior and multiple disorder.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10530626

Life expectancy of homosexuals

"In a major Canadian centre, life expectancy at age 20 years for gay and bisexual men is 8 to 20 years less than for all men. If the same pattern of mortality were to continue, we estimate that nearly half of gay and bisexual men currently aged 20 years will not reach their 65th birthday. Under even the most liberal assumptions, gay and bisexual men in this urban centre are now experiencing a life expectancy similar to that experienced by all men in Canada in the year 1871"

http://ije.oxfordjournals.org/content/26/3/657.abstract

Statistics on Amsterdam

According to a study in the Netherlands where homosexuality has been accepted and mainstreamed for years, homosexual behavior significantly increases the likelihood of psychiatric, mental and emotional disorders, negating the mindset that society’s lack of tolerance of homosexual behavior and lifestyle produces these psychoses Youth are four times as likely to suffer major depression, almost three times as likely to suffer generalized anxiety disorder, nearly four times as likely to experience conduct disorder, four times as likely to commit suicide, five times as likely to have nicotine dependence, six times as likely to suffer multiple disorders, and more than six times as likely to have attempted suicide.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11146762

That covers all of my claims. I think you'll find all of the evidence I have provided is from unbiased sources. This refutes the claim that homosexuality does not harm anyone. It clearly harms the individual, the community and society at large.

Here are some more statistics that I don't have direct links to. .

An Amsterdam study found that the average homosexual relationship lasts only 18 months and that "men in homosexual relationships, on average, have eight partners a year outside those relationships." By comparison, more than two-thirds of heterosexual marriages in America last longer than ten years. Maria Xiridou et al.,

"The Contribution of Steady and Casual Partnerships to the Incidence of HIV Infection Among Homosexual Men in Amsterdam,"
AIDS 17, 7 (2003): 1029-1038.

Ricky Behaviors:

Researchers from the University of California, San Francisco found that thirty-six percent of homosexuals engaging in unprotected oral, anal, or vaginal sex failed to disclose that they were HIV positive to casual sex partners.

"Some With HIV Aren't Disclosing Before Sex; UCSF Researcher's 1,397-person Study Presented During aids Conference," The San Francisco Examiner (July 15, 2000)"

A CDC report revealed that, in 1997, 45 percent of homosexuals reporting having had unprotected anal intercourse during the previous six months did not know the HIV serostatus of all their sex partners. Even more alarming, among those who reported having had unprotected anal intercourse and multiple partners, 68 percent did not know the HIV serostatus of their partners

Gay and Bi Men Less Likely to Disclose They Have HIV," GayHealth News (July 18, 2000).

Promiscuity

A.P. Bell and M.S. Weinberg, in their classic study of male and female homosexuality, found that 43 percent of white male homosexuals had sex with 500 or more partners, with 28 percent having 1,000 or more sex partners.

A. P. Bell and M. S. Weinberg, Homosexualities: A Study of Diversity Among Men and Women (New York: Simon and Schuster, 1978), pp. 308, 9; see alsoBell, Weinberg and Hammersmith, Sexual Preference (Bloomington: Indiana University Press, 1981)

Paul Van de Ven et al., "A Comparative Demographic and Sexual Profile of Older Homosexually Active Men," Journal of Sex Research 34 (1997): 354. Dr. Paul Van de Ven reiterated these results in a private conversation with Dr. Robert Gagnon on September 7, 2000

In their study of the sexual profiles of 2,583 older homosexuals published in Journal of Sex Research, Paul Van de Ven et al., found that only 2.7 percent claimed to have had sex with one partner only. The most common response, given by 21.6 percent of the respondents, was of having a hundred-one to five hundred lifetime sex partners.

Survey Finds 40 percent of Gay Men Have Had More Than 40 Sex Partners," Lambda Report, January/February 1998, p. 20.

A survey conducted by the homosexual magazine Genre found that 24 percent of the respondents said they had had more than a hundred sexual partners in their lifetime. The magazine noted that several respondents suggested including a category of those who had more than a thousand sexual partners.[11]

M. Pollak, "Male Homosexuality," in Western Sexuality: Practice and Precept in Past and Present Times, edited by P. Aries and A. Bejin, pp. 40-61, cited by Joseph Nicolosi in Reparative therapy of Male Homosexuality (Northvale, New Jersey: Jason Aronson Inc., 1991),

In his study of male homosexuality in Western Sexuality: Practice and Precept in Past and Present Times, M. Pollak found that "few homosexual relationships last longer than two years, with many men reporting hundreds of lifetime partners."

David P. McWhirter and Andrew M. Mattison, The Male Couple: How Relationships Develop (Englewood Cliffs, New Jersey: Prentice-Hall, 1984), pp. 252, 3.

>> ^curiousity: