I got my glider license in air cadets when I was 17 and I've been a passenger in a winch launch but have never piloted one myself. It's a fast but short ride. Very cool. Thanks for posting.

Hmmm.. Google suggests that the "Pacific Bless" is a cargo ship... it does have a lot of cranes on it. Either way, a wreck would have sucked.
Also note: That loud clattering in the video is the anchor chains spooling out. The smoke you see at the front of the ship is coming off of the anchor winches.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

Dual Unit Mars Balloons - that's gold. >> ^Fletch:

@dag

Thanks for the link - I've reviewed a lot of this stuff too though I appreciate more information even if it is delivered with a heavy dose of condescension.

Disagreement is not condescension. I don't think you're insane. I just think you're wrong.
[Here's a link for you. Be sure and attach your idea for Dual Unit Mars Balloons to your resumé. I'm sure they will be very interested in your ideas.]
^THAT'S condescension (just an example, of course).

Egos and personalities involved in science? Why would I ever think that - everything we do or say or write comes from a completely rational base right?

We are talking about NASA, not science in general, although I'm sure there are egos aplenty at NASA as well. But I find it very unlikely, ridiculous even, that a mission that has been purposely over-complicated just to satisfy said ego(s), in the face of budget constraints and time considerations, would even make it off the drawing board, much less all the way to Mars. That's just not the way missions are conceived, planned, and realized there.
As I mentioned, the only major difference between this landing and the previous rover landings is the winch instead of the balloon due to the size of Curiosity. I don't see the over-engineering. It's Mars. It's far away and it has little atmosphere for braking. If NASA could just hire some miners, retrofit the Shuttle with indestructable skin and gravity, and then send them to Mars with minimal training, they wouldn't need the winch.

@dag

Thanks for the link - I've reviewed a lot of this stuff too though I appreciate more information even if it is delivered with a heavy dose of condescension.

Disagreement is not condescension. I don't think you're insane. I just think you're wrong.

[Here's a link for you. Be sure and attach your idea for Dual Unit Mars Balloons to your resumé. I'm sure they will be very interested in your ideas.]

^THAT'S condescension (just an example, of course).

Egos and personalities involved in science? Why would I ever think that - everything we do or say or write comes from a completely rational base right?

We are talking about NASA, not science in general, although I'm sure there are egos aplenty at NASA as well. But I find it very unlikely, ridiculous even, that a mission that has been purposely over-complicated just to satisfy said ego(s), in the face of budget constraints and time considerations, would even make it off the drawing board, much less all the way to Mars. That's just not the way missions are conceived, planned, and realized there.

As I mentioned, the only major difference between this landing and the previous rover landings is the winch instead of the balloon due to the size of Curiosity. I don't see the over-engineering. It's Mars. It's far away and it has little atmosphere for braking. If NASA could just hire some miners, retrofit the Shuttle with indestructable skin and gravity, and then send them to Mars with minimal training, they wouldn't need the winch.

I can't find a video, but the Canadian Navy lands in weather worse than that because of a very simple toy (that you yanks refuse to adopt because you didn't come up with it).

The helicopter dangles a strong cable, with a hook up, about 10 metres long. Ship's crew feeds the cable to a winch, pilot gives full up-lift while the winch drags him down. Perfect landing every time. The nickname for the device is a Bear Trap, but I'm not sure if that's the official name.

>> ^deathcow:

contrast with
http://videosift.com/video/The-extreme-limits-for-landing
-helicopters-on-moving-ships

That was fun to watch, but I wonder why the landing process is so complicated? A parachute that deploys a platform with booster rockets which in turn lowers the rover with a winch? Seems like at least one of those should be unnecessary.

>> ^BoneRemake:
Before all you smarty pants start squaking about a quad or ATV or whatnot, that is not the sound an atv motor makes.
Just from a couple views it seems to be a reach forklift, but I ... I dunno this seems kinda odd that it'd bend the frame like that... again I watched it, seems normal now that I am focused, the transmission linkages are at the bend points. Seems real to me !


It's a logging cable skidder. Basically a winch on wheels. It laughs at 5 ton trees.

Not to mention the chains can break and the guy is sitting in an unprotected cab, or something on the wheel itself could snap.

Or the damage it could do the machine if it didn't come free at some point...something has to give somewhere.

Either that ground was sloppy muddy when they drove into it, or they spun their wheels until they got stuck so bad they had to do this. Better off to stop and get some other kind of machine/truck or winch system to pull you.

This is one of those things you learn when you work in dirt......if the ground is suspect, walk it before you drive through it. If it won't hold you, it's not going to hold the machine. And don't park machines where you can't get to them with other machinery to pull them free if the ground turns to mush under them during the night or after a storm...if there's no stable looking parking options.

>> ^Payback:

What I really find telling is, the driver of the loader has NO IDEA how to drive it. One of the FIRST things you learn is how to crab-walk it sideways.
Bucket down, front wheels up
twist, move rear wheels forward
bucket up, front wheels down
twist the other way, wheels back
Repeat.


Thank you... Same with the mention of chalks. Same with the mention of using the bucket. Same with the comment that lets people know that THESE are usually the things you call in to pull/winch someone stuck. Same with the realization that everything happening in the video = tax payer money being used (paying both state workers-maybe three-to screw this up; although, that may be a utilities truck "trying to pull him out").

It completely confuses me how they haven't taught basic maneuvering on how to get these things unstuck or get things unstuck--I can almost guarantee that most farmers (whether they've been in the snow or not; at that weight mud might be worse than snow) that use one regularly know what to do.

I also must give @jmd an honorable mention for saying what I was thinking the whole time. If you see something like that get on the phone to the local PD and get out there and get the information (trust me; that driver may be hard up for cash, but that is no excuse to "possibly" cause mayhem with their work/payments for months). Also, the lady across the street is yelling just fine what the hell is his problem? He's basically muttering the whole time until his last sentence (then decides to either go out there and get dressed or goes back to sleep). Maybe that street has great acoustics.

As for the firing bit. Look at the complete negligence shown in this video. To me it shows: no common sense, can't ask for help (as said way up top--I'm sure they'll handle him gingerly for most likely totaling a vehicle--or he could have asked for help), gets a second car involved, HUGE waste of tax-payers money from this one stupid event (I'll wager that this little event will cost anywhere from 10k low -if the SUV frame is pulled to far out of alignment- and 30k high--most likely this is about 16k'ish, overall) and one more if he didn't call the cops himself. If you need the job, do IT RIGHT. You can't EVER use that as an excuse to not do the job given to you; especially so when it concerns near pre-meditated negligence all caught on camera. The fact that they did do the initial, possibly no damage, bumper hit should have been the stopping point. When they decided to keep going and said "fuck it", that is a fire-able offense. On the spot .

Last part that I find funny. That thing is heavy as hell. I'm not too sure what those guys thought they'd accomplish by trying to "pull" it out. Winching it out is at the least what you would do. Instead, what really frees the heavy-machinery is it using that SUV as friction for the tires. All they did was pull it sideways into it.


This made me think TSA employees are acting well-reasoned in bad-conditions...

(Longer than I wanted what I wanted it to be, oh well. BTW, this did go national atleast on CNN and the Weather Channel. ....So many things you can do to get yourself in that situation: salt/sand/gravel mixtures in front & back, shovel, metal/rubber tire wedges, @Payback's comment, @ridesallyridenc comment, @BoneRemake's comment, @Porksandwich's comment, it goes, on, and on, and on, and on.... )

>> ^BoneRemake:

The tow truck would of have/should of have had Tire chalks, he could of have put those in place and used his winch to pull the front end loader. And yes they have chalks for mud and snow, they grip into the snow/ice/mud like fish hook barbs, and resist the truck from being pulled backwards via the winch.

The tow truck would of/should of had Tire chalks, he could of put those in place and used his winch to pull the front end loader. And yes they have chalks for mud and snow, they grip into the snow/ice/mud like fish hook barbs, and resist the truck from being pulled backwards via the winch.

When I drove truck, I preferred the old winch and sling system for repo work. The damage caused to the vehicles were the responsibility of the cockroach delinquent owners. Gave me a good feeling when I could cause grief to some fucktard who bought a car beyond his means. You could tell the ones. Corvette driver living in low income housing or a basement suite, etc etc. Anyone who "lost their job" or suffered some sort of setback usually made a deal with the financing company to either keep their ride by paying interest only for a while, or got something cheaper. I would totally toast anyone who would try to hide their car or park it hard.

You won't find this sort of tech on anything other than repo or parking lot impound trucks. AAA trucks are designed for safety of the vehicle, not speed of getaway.

It looks like they're trying to break the winch on the side of the whaling ship, I presume if they disabled the winches the whaler wouldn't be able to haul in their catch and would have to return for re-fitting before they could go out again.

>> ^mxxcon:
now i'm guessing here, but that looked way too long to be an chain falling into the water.
i think it's looped

I was wondering the same thing, actually. I suppose the yellow-yellow-red-yellow-yellow links could be distance markers on a full chain, but I suspect that's where the chain is looped for testing the winch.

Burn her! She's a WINCH!