when parents feel the need to resort to this extreme, then it's obvious to me that the parents are shitty role models to begin with.

the dad seemed to only care about the money he lost not working.

The kids get these ideas from their parents in the first place, so hrm, wonder who mommy was sneaking in at 3am?

This idea that parents are somehow helpless at preventing their kids from doing this stuff in the first place is ridiculous.

all this does is teach kids to not get caught

>> ^bareboards2:

It cracks me up, the men who are piping up about what they think the point of the vid is.
Why not just believe a woman who is telling you?
It's like a dogwhistle. Set at a pitch that men can't hear. You can see the face all puffed out with the effort of blowing the whistle, but you don't hear a dang thing. Even if a woman is standing there, pointing at the whistle and saying -- there is a whistle sound for me.
Trust me. This video is not aimed at men. It is aimed at young women who have crappy role models in the world and get really crappy messages from their media.
I agree with @Jinx about everything he wrote -- except for the first paragraph. Missed the target there. No PSA is going to hit 100% of its target, so the "every girls" is silly on the face of it. And he's going to have to believe me that this isn't just "a funny youtube video about slutty halloween." Tweet, Jinx. Tweet.

I don't disagree. It can be a video with a message. It can also just be a funny youtube video. I found it entertaining and it sure wasn't aimed at me. I guess what I'm trying to say is there is more than just whistle we can't hear.


also, tweet?

It cracks me up, the men who are piping up about what they think the point of the vid is.

Why not just believe a woman who is telling you?

It's like a dogwhistle. Set at a pitch that men can't hear. You can see the face all puffed out with the effort of blowing the whistle, but you don't hear a dang thing. Even if a woman is standing there, pointing at the whistle and saying -- there is a whistle sound for me.

Trust me. This video is not aimed at men. It is aimed at young women who have crappy role models in the world and get really crappy messages from their media.

I agree with @Jinx about everything he wrote -- except for the first paragraph. Missed the target there. No PSA is going to hit 100% of its target, so the "every girls" is silly on the face of it. And he's going to have to believe me that this isn't just "a funny youtube video about slutty halloween." Tweet, Jinx. Tweet.

Wow...I totally misread your post then.

There really is/was a problem with wage slavery, sometimes referred to as truck systems. But I think the only times I've heard about it recently were in regards to companies who bring illegal immigrants over (seems to be usually from Asia), and then manipulate pay and fees to make sure the immigrants can never get out of their "contract". It's definitely scummy, but it's not business as usual in America.

In this video, it seems the term "wage slavery" is pretty much BS, used just to help drum up emotions and try to get the word-of-mouth equivalent of webpage hits.
>> ^Yogi:

>> ^Stormsinger:
#1) I don't think slave owner's opinions of what's horrible and what's not is something I really give a shit about...they're not exactly role models when it comes to ethical behavior.
#2) The tactic of "keeping everyone striving to gain wealth forgetting everything but yourself", isn't really relevant to what I said, or even the general thrust of what I said, is it? At least I don't see how it has anything to do with the efficiency of specialization...
#3) I quite like the idea of labor-owned corporations. I think it makes far more sense than "capital-owned corporations". The only reason capitalists have such an unbalanced stranglehold on the economy, is that money is more liquid than labor...thus it's easier to bribe the legislators into passing laws that benefit the wealthy.

1. That was kinda the point. They're sooo horrible that they think Wage Slavery is demeaning, so how good must wage slavery be? It's just an example, that a lot of people agreed with back in the day.
2 and 3 I was just bolstering what I'm saying, Wage Slavery is bullshit and American economic culture is bullshit.

>> ^Stormsinger:

#1) I don't think slave owner's opinions of what's horrible and what's not is something I really give a shit about...they're not exactly role models when it comes to ethical behavior.
#2) The tactic of "keeping everyone striving to gain wealth forgetting everything but yourself", isn't really relevant to what I said, or even the general thrust of what I said, is it? At least I don't see how it has anything to do with the efficiency of specialization...
#3) I quite like the idea of labor-owned corporations. I think it makes far more sense than "capital-owned corporations". The only reason capitalists have such an unbalanced stranglehold on the economy, is that money is more liquid than labor...thus it's easier to bribe the legislators into passing laws that benefit the wealthy.


1. That was kinda the point. They're sooo horrible that they think Wage Slavery is demeaning, so how good must wage slavery be? It's just an example, that a lot of people agreed with back in the day.

2 and 3 I was just bolstering what I'm saying, Wage Slavery is bullshit and American economic culture is bullshit.

#1) I don't think slave owner's opinions of what's horrible and what's not is something I really give a shit about...they're not exactly role models when it comes to ethical behavior.

#2) The tactic of "keeping everyone striving to gain wealth forgetting everything but yourself", isn't really relevant to what I said, or even the general thrust of what I said, is it? At least I don't see how it has anything to do with the efficiency of specialization...

#3) I quite like the idea of labor-owned corporations. I think it makes far more sense than "capital-owned corporations". The only reason capitalists have such an unbalanced stranglehold on the economy, is that money is more liquid than labor...thus it's easier to bribe the legislators into passing laws that benefit the wealthy.

>> ^hpqp:

Not comparable; models are starved by the fashion industry ("either you're a twig or you're fired/not hired" starved), whereas I doubt the network is pressuring this woman to be overweight. It would still be totally wrong to send an email to a model telling her she shouldn't be on tv/a podium because she's unhealthily skinny; that's still a personal attack.
>> ^SDGundamX:
[...] I'm a bit disturbed at the idea that pointing out that someone is overweight is somehow now "bullying." Is pointing out that so-called "supermodels" are too skinny also bullying? [...]


Seriously? You'd be against someone telling a clearly underweight supermodel that she's a role model for millions of young girls who are dangerously trying to emulate her--some through purging and others through diet pill abuse? That's bullying the supermodel? How about when a sports athlete gets caught driving drunk or engaging in other unethical behaviors (say, sending unsolicited pics of his private parts to females). Am I bullying him by sending him an email telling him how millions of kids look up to him and he needs to think about how his behavior affects them?

As others have already aptly pointed out, this was a private email. His concern seems to be with the message she's sending young female viewers. The proper response would have been the one I mentioned above--replying to his email and smacking him down about how his conception of being a proper role model only considers appearance and nothing else. Instead she went all hysterical publicly. Over one email. If this guy was sending emails every week, or if she were getting these kinds of emails from a host of people regularly, I'd see the need to do what she did.

Now, you're right--some people's obesity is medically-induced (blood-sugar issues, thyroid problems, etc.) but for the vast majority of Americans it is a lifestyle problem--too many calories and not enough exercise. Just to be clear, I'm not saying these people (of which I am one) are lazy--I'm saying they've made a choice to prioritize things other than their health. That is indeed their right and they shouldn't be disparaged for that, but at the same time we shouldn't pretend that there aren't any consequences (both to the individual and society) to that choice. And we certainly shouldn't call people who point out those consequences "bullies."

Again, just my 2 cents though. You and I don't see eye-to-eye on lots of issues (Islam, male circumcision, etc.) so I don't really expect us to agree on this issue either.

I don't know what to say except again that it's pretty obvious you don't know the first thing about eating disorders.
How exactly does the American obesity problem equals the "normalization" of it? That's like saying the normalization of Ebola is a problem in Africa.

I'll give you this much, your idea of dealing with a problem is definitely an effective one.
Making a person super self-conscious about their physical appearance is a very effective way of having them change it. The problem here is that you to understand that effective doesn't necessarily equal good/positive.
Your idea of the proper way to deal with these issues is a scary one, more so for the fact you don't even realize what the implications of it are.


>> ^scannex:

>> ^NinjaInHeat:
Take a second to think about how TV "role models" usually look (or people "in the public eye" as scannex puts it).
What planet have you been living on where the "normalization of obesity" has become a problem?

>> ^scannex:
The normalization of obesity is a problem.



Oh, I don't know... how about this planet? Where the USA is the fattest developed country in the world?
Your text to link...
So yes... "F cking seriously".
You must be daft if you cannot discern between healthy weight, a supermodel and someone who is obese. Being underweight is dangerous as well, and you drawing the conclusion as to that is what we are after is silly.
This was a private letter SHE made public. You say that the opinion is that she is too fat to be on TV. Not the case, and not the suggestion of the letter. This PRIVATE letter was a plea to this woman's sensibilities in fashion less sugarcoated than she is used to.

1.Yes you are.

2. Choosing to continue smoking and choosing to not take steps to get your weight under control and or stop overeating are well paralleled as demonstrated above. Feel free to argue it.

3. Being overweight in the playground DOES make them more likely to die of heart disease in later life.
Here's a quote for you.
“This is incredibly important,” said Jennifer L. Baker of the Institute of Preventive Medicine in Copenhagen, who led the research, being published today in the New England Journal of Medicine. “This is the first study to convincingly show that excess childhood weight is associated with heart disease in adulthood, or with any significant health problem in adulthood.”

To you point about it being his business etc... You know what, you're right. It isn't his business.
Does that matter? Not a whole lot. In fact he IS doing her a favor.
Hurting her feelings however unkind may be an important catalyst in getting her to change her habits.
Vanity is an INCREDIBLY powerful driving force for people.

In my view, someone who knows there is a problem and chooses to ignore it is a bigger (although perhaps socially nicer) coward.

Oh and people get away with comments like that in public all the time. I don't know what fantasy world you live in where no one chastises anyone, must be nice.

>> ^Jinx:


Oh, I'm making hyperbolic conclusions and then you equate smoking to being overweight? Being fat in a playground doesn't make the kids more at risk of heart disease.

so I guess you're right then. I dont get it. I don't get why her weight is your business if its not some wrong headed belief that she is a poor role model (that at least seemed to be the point of the email no?)
There is no easy solution. I'm not suggesting we ignore obesity or its health risks but there are right ways of tackling problems and there are the futile ways. If it was as fucking easy and emailing fat people to point out that they are fat and oh, here are the health risks then, err, why are people still overweight? So stop pretending that this email is in any way helpful. At best its tactless, at worst its cruel. Now, if I had a family member with weight problems I would consider it my place and indeed my duty to not just confront them about it, but also help them maintain a healthier lifestyle. I'd hope they'd do the same for me, but a stranger who is unwilling to invest any assistance to me beyond their critique? Fuck that. Mind your business.

>> ^scannex:

>> ^Jinx:

Nobody is suggesting that there is not a problem with obesity in America (or really most of the 1st world tbh). The solution is not to write rude emails pointing out the obvious though. Even though she decided to "go public" I still don't really see why its my business. Consider walking up to somebody in the street and making the same comments. Would you not expect to get slapped? and a poor role model? Please, as if some 6 yr old is gonna see her on TV and aspire to be fat. Get real.

So what is the solution? Ignore it? That tactic was working great for her and her health so far I'm sure.
You don't get it. It isn't about aspiring to be fat. That's a hyperbolic conclusion you are drawing to further your point. Normalization and idolization are not synonyms.
Oh, and consider walking up to a woman smoking while pregnant on the street, or hey, a little less extreme, in a playground to give them a piece of your mind. Happens every day. People voicing their opinion is a pretty common thing, hence our stupid discussion under a video.

Oh, I'm making hyperbolic conclusions and then you equate smoking to being overweight? Being fat in a playground doesn't make the kids more at risk of heart disease.


so I guess you're right then. I dont get it. I don't get why her weight is your business if its not some wrong headed belief that she is a poor role model (that at least seemed to be the point of the email no?)

There is no easy solution. I'm not suggesting we ignore obesity or its health risks but there are right ways of tackling problems and there are the futile ways. If it was as fucking easy and emailing fat people to point out that they are fat and oh, here are the health risks then, err, why are people still overweight? So stop pretending that this email is in any way helpful. At best its tactless, at worst its cruel. Now, if I had a family member with weight problems I would consider it my place and indeed my duty to not just confront them about it, but also help them maintain a healthier lifestyle. I'd hope they'd do the same for me, but a stranger who is unwilling to invest any assistance to me beyond their critique? Fuck that. Mind your business.

>> ^Jinx:


Nobody is suggesting that there is not a problem with obesity in America (or really most of the 1st world tbh). The solution is not to write rude emails pointing out the obvious though. Even though she decided to "go public" I still don't really see why its my business. Consider walking up to somebody in the street and making the same comments. Would you not expect to get slapped? and a poor role model? Please, as if some 6 yr old is gonna see her on TV and aspire to be fat. Get real.


So what is the solution? Ignore it? That tactic was working great for her and her health so far I'm sure.

You don't get it. It isn't about aspiring to be fat. That's a hyperbolic conclusion you are drawing to further your point. Normalization and idolization are not synonyms.

Oh, and consider walking up to a woman smoking while pregnant on the street, or hey, a little less extreme, in a playground to give them a piece of your mind. Happens every day. People voicing their opinion is a pretty common thing, hence our stupid discussion under a video.

>> ^NinjaInHeat:

Take a second to think about how TV "role models" usually look (or people "in the public eye" as scannex puts it).
What planet have you been living on where the "normalization of obesity" has become a problem?


>> ^scannex:
The normalization of obesity is a problem.




Oh, I don't know... how about this planet? Where the USA is the fattest developed country in the world?
Your text to link...

So yes... "F**cking seriously".
You must be daft if you cannot discern between healthy weight, a supermodel and someone who is obese. Being underweight is dangerous as well, and you drawing the conclusion as to that is what we are after is silly.
This was a private letter SHE made public. You say that the opinion is that she is too fat to be on TV. Not the case, and not the suggestion of the letter. This PRIVATE letter was a plea to this woman's sensibilities in fashion less sugarcoated than she is used to.

My 2 cents.

The writer of the email was clearly being condescending. I mean, he asks her what kind of role model she thinks she is to young girls as if being a good role model is based solely on appearance and not, for instance, on things like the fact that she's a highly successful working mom.

On the other hand, I'm a bit disturbed at the idea that pointing out that someone is overweight is somehow now "bullying." Is pointing out that so-called "supermodels" are too skinny also bullying?

All in all, I think the whole thing is a bit over-dramatized. All I can think of when I watch this vid is this clip.