“ It’s your insistence that Jewish people, and the existence of Israel, have always fundamentally been invaders that I was objecting to as it is so intensely at odds with factual history.”
No…it is at odds with your position and is not what I said.
It is factual history that fighting age European Jews came armed and forcibly displaced the natives after being offered sanctuary for their most needy. It is not factual that I claimed it was ever thus. That is clearly not what I said, I said for 10+- years they were getting along as refugees, then started coming in HUGE numbers illegally and taking over.

Those are facts.

I also mentioned a native Jewish population that were not refugees or invaders. Some of them supported the invading Zionists, some didn’t. I’ve never heard of one who opposed them.

“ You gave a brief nod on not being a scholar of Palestinian history, but then proceed to just count all Jewish refugees as good as Zionist aggressors from day 1(or close enough), and the local Arab population as nothing but pure, kind caring victims of these invaders.”

Not even close to true, I said many stood behind the Zionists when they started coming en masse, and didn’t say but seemingly few to none of the native Jews opposed them. I also was clear that at the beginning the refugees acted like refugees, not invaders….I mistakenly gave them more time being grateful than you say they were, according to you Palestinians position is they began the invasion in the 20’s….and theirs is the opinion I care about. I never claimed ALL Arabs were welcoming, but the “nation” as a whole (despite being not self ruling at the time) welcomed a huge number of refugees considering their own population. Way more than elsewhere.

Edit: Britain, who facilitated this invasion, only took in 80000 European Jews in the decade before and during the war, and they were only given transit visas to stay temporarily until they found other accommodations. All of England took in fewer Jewish refugees in all pre war history than Palestine did….England took in 80000, most on temporary visas, Palestine took in 60000 permanently in 1935 alone, and 130000 in 33-36.
Pre-immigration Palestine had about 700000 people. In 1944 European Jews ignored the 1500 visa limit per year and came by the hundred of thousands per year after already completely overwhelming the native population.
Palestine was forcibly invaded by a foreign population exponentially bigger than the native population while Britain kept them too weak to oppose it physically.
That’s an invasion…not on day 1. 🤦‍♂️

“ without being able to writeoff Israel as invaders from day 1, nuance enters the calculus and suddenly the conflict is flooded with shades of grey ”

Again, I said day 3, not day 1, and went on to say that meant 10 years later. Get off your high horse and READ buddy.

I guess I’ll stop here. If you aren’t going to read what I wrote and insist on arguing red herrings you made up yourself, you can do that alone.

Nothing you’ve said changes or excuses the fact that masses of armed violent invaders came to take the land from the natives by force and were successful. The exact date this happened is not only y highly subjective, it’s completely besides the point.
Nothing you’ve said changes or excuses the inhuman treatment they’ve subjected the innocent native civilian population to for 70 years…but you’ve tried.
Nothing you’ve said changes or excuses the intentional targeting of trapped civilians by the military….serious war crimes Israel commits daily.
Nothing you’ve said even hints that you consider Palestinians worthy of consideration themselves, possibly not even human status, definitely not peaceful existence.

Bye

“ my solution would be every able bodied Jewish man and woman join the French (or Polish, Russian, British) army and fucking fight…”

I agree that’s the noble thing to do, but I can’t condemn the ones that choose to seek safety in numbers with Jewish Palestinians as exclusively invasion minded aggressors. My 6 million tag was maybe a bit sharp, but you also know that the Nazi’s took Paris and as much as it sucked to be French or European under Nazi occupation, you also know adding Jewish to that carried a lot of extra consequence and danger to your family.

My POV is agnostic of everything save Isreali people today having a right exist as a nation. Which at this point from my POV leaves 1947 as somewhat academic.

It’s your insistence that Jewish people, and the existence of Israel, have always fundamentally been invaders that I was objecting to as it is so intensely at odds with factual history.

You gave a brief nod on not being a scholar of Palestinian history, but then proceed to just count all Jewish refugees as good as Zionist aggressors from day 1(or close enough), and the local Arab population as nothing but pure, kind caring victims of these invaders.

I will state again, that is ahistorical propaganda and NOT what actually happened. And for my POV, its enough generations back as to be Academic, but for your POV it is fundamental because without being able to writeoff Israel as invaders from day 1, nuance enters the calculus and suddenly the conflict is flooded with shades of grey because lots of parties all contribute to the bloodshed, and many with reasonable motivations from both sides yet too.

Please find me any reputable sources to refute the reality of 1920-1940s Palestine:
-Mass Jewish immigration fleeing European oppression raised tensions between Jewish and Arab Palestinians.(as one must expect)
-Arab palestinians were already chaffing and resisting British colonial rule(as one must expect)
-These tensions led conflict, initially more ‘civil’ with the Arab majority trying to refuse all business, sales and trade with all Jews.
-Escalation followed throughout that time, but in drips and drops and NOT a ‘surprise the Zionist army has arrived’! style of aggression

The violent escalation was a fight here, a beating there. Little individual fights, escalating into deaths. Retaliations slowly grew, with each side exchanging small escalations.

-the culmination of this was eventually all out civil war, and the Jewish side immediately accepting a UN mandated 2 state solution

-this culmination coinciding with the end of WW2 and revelations of the true extent of the holocaust can’t be ignored, it certainly shaped the Jewish mindset in the conflict.

-Their mindset was pretty clearly not inaccurate either, as the immediate response of all neighbouring Arab nations was a declaration of war on the new ‘state’, with bold claims of how quickly the Jews would be swept into the sea. The confidence was so high, a call was sent it for ALL Arab palestinians to abandon and flee the entire region of Palestine to better enable the complete cleansing of the land.

The above is all pretty much inarguably factual, and I’d bargain you could get an Arabic and Israeli scholar together to more or less agree on those facts which is saying alot.

——
Propaganda from both sides would like to declare that the Arabs harboured deep Nazi sympathies, and thus Israel was pure and true in all it did. Or from the other side, more or less your narrative of Zionist bad guys launching invasion from day 1(ish).

Both though are just sprinklings of half truths, with anti-British resentment naturally breeding some leanings towards the axis, and even genuine Nazi cleanse the Jews believers. And absolutely Zionists featured prominently within the Jewish population. Neither of those partial truths though make the propaganda of either side true, but instead just an incomplete and intentionally biased picture.


Again, please find me sources demonstrating I’m terribly wrong on all that, but the only ones I can find are clearly biased and the accurate accounts paint the picture above, the propaganda very, very clearly copies the real story more or less with just deletions of inconvenient bits

Wonder what kind of bargain the kid made with mom

"Do my homework for one month and an extra hour before bedtime? Swear to God mom?"

To those attempting to ban Bobby, I believe it takes a siftquisition to ban a star powered member. That means talking to @dag and @lucky760 then stating your case for his removal, then I think he gets a chance to defend himself. It’s not as simple as typing “ban”…fortunately.

@bobknight33…as I warned, this kind of blatant *snuff is clearly against sift rules, and has led to multiple people wanting you permanently removed. It would be smart of you to kill this offending video before you are actually banned. What will you do without the sift to abuse? Don’t push it that far, it’s clear you’ve intentionally stirred up the hornets nest with this inappropriate snuff film, and clear the sift is done with you being insultingly inappropriate by posting graphic videos of children being murdered.

Maybe I can save you a shitload of trouble maybe not, I’ll try….*kill *discard…nope, didn’t work…you have to save yourself.

So in the title they used a "2" in place of "to". That sure saved time, space and energy. This is the kind of stuff that makes me want to rip my hair out and set myself on fire!

Liberals tend to focus on issues that actually impact kids. Yea like teaching how to have any kind of sex ---



These children are too fucking weak to possibly stand up... They are --- They don't know all the right from wrong ..

You so full of it. You more gullible than a 5 year old

Local business men just giving Menendez gold and cash -- why just because then like him? How naive.


Thanks to Republicans rewriting the rules on bribery to protect the Trumps - Quit getting you news from school teachers.. They are brainwashed leftest. Full of propaganda.

Trump was caught with hundreds of stolen top secret --
He is the POTUS -- Only POTUS can take documents.. Not Senator Joe Biden, VP Pence etc. -- Witch hunt

The worst kind of person to hear from is a cultist propagandist -- That is you -- supporting a feeble Joe Biden no matter what. Worst POTUS ever.

Santos blind spot-- Sure he is a joke and should be kicked out but same with Fetterman... Yet yo fail to see it..

No sir.
Menendez was caught with cash and gold, seemingly from local businessmen, but not yet a smoking gun proving it was from bribes. Thanks to Republicans rewriting the rules on bribery to protect the Trumps, he got off last time. He might again.

Trump was caught with hundreds of stolen top secret documents after twice swearing he had returned every classified document he ever took….with HIS fingerprints on them, and those of his assistants, foreigners, press, likely even random visitors to Maralago that found them (definitely photos of that). His son in law was caught selling classified info to Saudi Arabia for $2 billion he still has. His daughter took $36 million in bribes from China during trade negotiations she still has. Trump made deals with multiple foreign nations to use his properties at way above market value like the LIV tour as a thanks for protecting the prince from murder charges, many going unused but paid for like entire floors in his hotels rented out for months or years but never occupied by the Saudis…there’s way more evidence of Trump bribery than Menendez, and Menendez is certainly guilty based on the evidence …but with mountains of red handed evidence on 91 charges and dozens of convictions already you still think there’s nothing on Trump, because you refuse to see. There is none so blind..

Hilarious. The left thinks it’s shit doesn’t stink?!? 😂 Just more silly projection, every single accusation is an admission, friendo.

The worst kind of person to hear from is a cultist propagandist that refuses to consider reality if it might hurt their cult or its rapist charity thief, liar, fraud, and total failure of a businessman they call leader (all already proven in court so not libel or slander) and constantly regurgitates the ridiculous debunked lies he’s been told to believe without ever investigating their veracity. This describes you, sir.

Conversely, I posted the news of Menendez being indicted, and showed you how this as yet unproven criminal behavior is treated by the left, like criminal behavior unacceptable in leadership…unlike how like criminal violent treasonous coup behaviors, stealing top secret highly classified military dossiers, attempted election fraud, rape, bribery by foreign governments (exponentially more than here to himself and his family), another attempted election fraud, massive tax fraud, illegally profiting from the office by directing government business to his businesses, stealing campaign donations, etc (91 more felonies and counting) are treated by the right. There’s way more evidence against Trump on each and every one of these charges, and dozens of convictions already, but you just deny it all because it’s inconvenient, not because there’s a shred of evidence to support you.

With infinitely less evidence, the left is calling for Menendez’s removal because even the appearance of impropriety from leadership hurts the nation, but for the right that’s unthinkable, it’s what’s good for Trump that always comes first, what’s good for the individual politician second, what’s good for their family third, what’s good for their donors fourth…the nation isn’t on the list anymore so they intend to shut it down again with no thought to the cost or harm or hardships that will cause.

But let’s get past your complete blind spot about Trump…compare the response to Santos. Now what’s your excuse for the diametrically opposed responses? Why does the right continue to stand with thief, liar, and fugitive Santos when there’s zero question about his guilt on a dozen charges?

BTW- Trump’s lawyer, Habba, says it’s just fake news, not one bit real but a pure fake distraction from Hunter Biden (who himself is a distraction from her client).
So what’s your choice…he’s a total criminal with overwhelming proof or it’s a fake distraction like Trump says?

I do.

Bob was caught red handed, with the smoking gun.
Fingerprints on the envelopes full with cash in his suit jackets hanging in his closet, from the people who bribed him. Let along the gold bars and all the other evidence.

Trump --- all that there is there is a belief of some crime (s). No smoking gun, no red handed evidence. This will play out in court and probably appealed.


Before you post your stupid diatribe, Think.
I know you think you can. You are right but only as a hard leftest elitist whose think their shit don't stink. IE the worst kind of person to hear from.

As ever, Newt, thank you for the effort you put in to debunking this. It's not great that I'm relying on an amphibian to vet my sources, and I certainly give disclaimers when I repeat this kind of stuff, but at this stage I open these stories just to see your rebuttal.

Yes, I just said I come to see your rebuttal. Own it.

IMO this isn’t taking science or philosophy seriously. It’s making arguments based on nonsense like living floating brains in space being a possibility, or the ridiculous idea that in infinite time everything will eventually happen….which is silly.
I don’t think even everything that COULD happen would happen even if it were given an infinite amount of time (which is not a reality either)….and certainly not things that are impossible like sentient disembodied brains in space.

I dislike this pseudoscience masquerading as real scientific theory. It’s not even real philosophy…it’s the kind of thing mediocre physics students think about when they’re tripping balls then write Marvel comic books about.

Science better please. 🤦‍♂️

All right then. If you're really into that kind of thing I recommend my favourite episode: series 2, episode 9: How To Recognise Different Parts Of The Body. You'll be most interested in number 14.

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x85pj5d maybe start watching at about 6:26.

Oh bewby…triggered much? ”I know you are but what am I” is not an adult reply. 😂

Be proud! Your hero the rapist is the absolute best president ever at being indicted. He beat the long standing record 4 times now! In fact, he’s the only record holder in our history. Congratulations! 😂

You idiot…Republicans dismissed the charges against Hillary because after a dozen inquiries and investigations and wasting hundreds of millions they had absolutely nothing, no crimes. They tried time and time and time again, but could come up with nothing, not even enough to get Barr to charge her, even when they held all 3 parts of the federal government. She had a few unlabeled classified documents that were not shown to the public that were classified AFTER she had them in her possession. Trump stole top secret classified folders clearly labeled that they could not be removed from secured facilities then kept them unsecured, showed them to anyone he could, then lied and hid them repeatedly, violating multiple court orders to keep them illegally. There’s no comparison.



Hunger? Are you trying to say Hunter? No charges have been dropped, you utter ignoramus. The tax charges may be moved to DC or California courts from Delaware. A special council was just empaneled, nothings being dropped or slow walked. Why do you insist on making yourself a laughing stock with these just dumb lies? It’s just so dumb…we aren’t as ignorant as yourself…when you make up nonsense and lies we all know it, dummy. It’s pretty easy…if you say it, it’s guaranteed to be wrong, and 99% likely to just be another lie. PS-Trump appointees are overseeing his case, not democrats.
Are you even aware that Biden could pardon Hunter at any point and all charges would be moot? Do you think Trump would have waited this long, or would he have pardoned his children before charges were filed? We all know the truth, I just wonder if you can admit it.

Every charge is a serious felony, every charge will be proven conclusively. These aren’t the kinds of charges the right makes where you make up some nonsense and just insist it’s true with no evidence just sour grapes…these charges come with mountains of proof….not 17 phantom recordings and the word of hostile spies, but PROOF.

41 counts 19 defendants, 30 unindicted co conspirators (who have all likely turned or would be indicted)…and RICO, so if one committed a crime, they’re all guilty. Many of the 30 have admitted their crimes, and apparently 1/3 of those indicted are looking for a deal to turn. There’s a literal paper trail, email correspondence setting up the multiple crimes, video proof, coconspirators testimony admitting they arranged, planned, and committed crimes at Trump’s direction….he’s absolutely toast. Because of the RICO charge, I f any of them are convicted of just one charge, they’re all guilty and Trump will die in prison because no one can pardon him from charges in Georgia. 😂

Cry more MAGA tears, friendo. Your hero the rapist is going to prison, not the whitehouse. Your cult is ending. Better stock up on flavorade, the time is coming soon when you’ll be called on to force feed it to your family before you chug it for Trump. I know you will when he asks, so get your affairs in order. The time is coming soon.

Today’s MAGA scandal…Manly Traitor Green’s staff were caught running a fake charity for the victims of the Palestine train derailment, but were simply pocketing the money.

Sound familiar? It’s why Trump can’t be involved in any charity now, he ran the same kinds of fraudulent charities for wounded soldiers and pocketed the money. 😂

I was pretty happy to see that he wasn't combative and just complied. He also notified his superior immediately. Seems like he knows how to act like an adult.

Admittedly my bar is pretty low for these guy's and I'm sure he could get up to all kinds of shenanigans later, but what was in the video seemed pretty good in comparison to a lot of these reports.