Right from the beginning of part 2 I thought it was weird the car could do a flaming burn out in mid air, let alone with the wheels bent over flat.

FFS dude, I am not hellbent on coming at you. You're being way more aggressive than I am.

So honestly, I don't know what you're so bent out of shape over. Yeah, I use sarcasm. So fucking what? Sarcasm is a perfectly valid, perfectly "adult" form of expressing opinions.

I also don't know why you're taking this personally. I haven't insulted YOU at all (unless you count that jibe about NZ gardens, which you brought up first).

I genuinely think the USA would be a better place if you all calmed the fuck down about guns, and from my interactions with the pro-gun people, I am genuinely glad that I don't have to deal with that shit. Those are honest reactions.

If I DID have to deal with that shit (i.e. if I was living in the US), my reactions would be a lot less polite.

But FWIW, I agree that we've had lots of positive interactions on the sift, and yeah, I would generally consider you to be one of the smarter people on here, even if we don't always agree on things. So you may consider this the typical non-apology of "I'm sorry you feel that way, but I'm not sorry for arguing my case".

There just doesnt seem to be enough to be gained either by leaving or by staying in at this stage. A lose-lose situation.

Britain has avoided adopting Schengen rules and the Euro, so there is little it can complain about regarding the EU, really.

There is also little to cheer for, the Euro and Schengen area are not working as intended, rules are bent and broken at will, the "democratic" political process is at best incomprehensible, but apparently skewed toward unelected clerks applying social engineering solutions to imaginary problems.

Really leaving (not bindingly decided in this referendum) would lead to short term chaos and economic loss for both the EU and Britain. With what long term gains, exactly?

Democracy should be used to pick representatives who make responsible decisions, not to vote about what mood people are in on a given day.

The spikes needed to be like the ones they made on Mythbusters. Those were bent, sharpened hollow tubes and as soon as tires hit those they got shredded, whereas the non-hollow ones just stuck into the tires and self-plugged the holes they created, as what happened here.

@bareboards2 Ma'am, I apologize both for the factually untrue statement, which I made without keeping with proper English debate/conversation etiquette, and also for assuming a gender for you title without proper evaluation.

To make clear my position, as I believe many, if not all of you here (@PlayhousePals @newtboy @Januari @bareboards2) mistake my position and/or personal political siding...

Firstly, I DO NOT like Trump, his policies, his manner, his monomaniacal bent towards the topics he figures are worth his time to address, not much of anything, actually.

Secondly, yes, I am conservative, and for a young male in British society, this leaves me at rather an odd way with those of an opposing political bent, particularly those of the Liberal/Progressive variety(Liberal less so, as it is an off-take of Libertarianism). I believe that effectually bending society over backwards to meet the stresses of a brave new world is a brash and undeveloped concept. I believe the perfect society is a logical one, where all that are able are held to an advantageously high level of acumen, education, etiquette, state of public dress, etc. I do not believe in the idea of "Utopia", as basic human psychology(which I have the equivalent of the american bachelors degree in) denies the facet of a cohesive human culture/society.

Thirdly, I arrive in support of Trump not out of a liking for him or his policy, but an awareness of what the enaction of his policies would bring. This awareness is spawned by the awareness of the state of the American Political Establishment, as is governed by people with power beyond reckoning, the face of which happens to be Hillary Clinton. Trump's policies, if allowed to be implemented, would cause such as rift in the political establishment/climate, as well as the hearts and minds of the American people, as to bring about change.

So, in effect, I support Trump for the very reason many of you don't, the Chaos that would almost inevitably ensue. A chaos that would likely go unnoticed, as such shifts occur without common knowledge...

Or... You could vote for a woman who has on more occasions than is accountable, broken Federal Law, covered up her husband's brutalization of women, and God knows what else, and only manages to escape prison because she is one of the sharpest tools the totalitarian American political establishment has...

Leafy...

Just, Leafy...

Always seems to put an insufferably hideous bent to everything he comments on. Not to mention his general lack of respect for anyone or anything, and his "I can say anything I want because its the internet and no-one is going to do anything about it" attitude towards commentary.

Other than that, the internet is quite a lovely place, just take the Sift for example:)

The fireman and cop are basic necessaries for any government. It benefits all.

From your point of view socialist aspects can and should be just about anything. Food distributions, incomes, housing, sexual bents.

democratic socialism. is just short step to Socialism. It is like Obama care is just a stepping stone to single payer ( government) system.

Government does nothing efficiently. Every one know this, Why would anyone want to give them more control?

@ChaosEngine

i do not see anyone here defending anything.

now maybe we can view stephen's commentary "dismissive and belittling" as @entr0py pointed out,but i think the deeper issue was prefaced quite succinctly by stephen in his characterization of american,and western societies,as being "infantilized".

where words have become the final bastion of totality in communication and are judged strictly on a word by word basis.so much so that some on the left have been pushing harder and harder to have certain words removed from our lexicon,because they represent negative thoughts/feelings/actions or they may represent a trauma,or horrific violent memory for some people.

but this is the wrong approach.
excising words will not erase those feelings/thoughts/emotions.this will just force people to come up or use different terminology to express those feelings/thoughts.actions that once had words to at least to attempt to express those horrors and/or offenses.

which will just equate to a whole new slew of verbiage being found offensive and in dire need of being castrated from our collective vocabulary.

yet the left (extreme left i grant) appears hell bent on not only attempting to control speech but to also judge those who DO use speech that they find offensive.

this is censorship with prejudice and to claim otherwise is the lie.

just look at your first comment.
you "used" to like stephen fry's opinion,until he became callous and dismissive with what?

words.

but do you REALLY think his attitude and compassion towards those who have suffered emotional trauma is truly dismissive?

well..i do not think so.i have spoken to you enough times to have a modicum of understandings in regards to you,as a person,that you have far more depth of character.

yet it is the WORDS that have hung you up.

look man,words are inert.they are things that are only given life,meaning and context when we add our own subjectivity to them.

words are inadequate.they will ALWAYS be inadequate.
which is why we admire and praise those of us who have a command of words that can reach into our own understandings and extract meaning in a way that blossoms like a spring flower and can create worlds in which we can play,and even share with other people.

i am intimately aware of this deficiency.i do not have an economy of words,and only on rare occasions can i relay,convey and express with ANY form of reductionism.

i struggle to express not only my opinion,but the intent,humanity and compassion of my opinion.

if the extreme left gets their way,the tools we have to express ourselves becomes lesser.

and in the process,WE become lesser.because the tools for dissent,debate,discussion and even..ironically..to expose the more venal and bigoted of our society,will have been reduced to words that offend nobody.

there is danger here,and no good will come from it.no matter if the intent sounds just and the goal compassionate.

freedom of speech is the right to speak freely.
to espouse our opinions,philosophy and yes,our bigotry and prejudice,with legal immunity,but NOT social impunity.

so while we have a right to free speech.
we do not have a right to not be offended,and maybe we need to be offended sometimes.to shake us from our own self-induced apathy and our adoration of digital hallucinations.

so when the westboro baptist church says the most hateful,vitriolic and disgusting admonishments,all in the name of god.
we can be offended by them,and then ridicule them relentlessly.

would stripping words from the english language prevent this group from espousing their own brand of hate?

of course not.they would just find new words.

so what do we do then?
make words illegal?
criminally libel?

so don't judge mr fry too harshly.
he is just pointing to the dangers of controlling speech and the new trend of the perpetually offended.

the extreme right attempts to control morality,and there is serious danger in that practice.
the extreme left attempts to control how we communicate,and hence how we interact,and there is great danger in that as well.

Are you used to people taking your argument seriously when you refer to them as "bed wetting cry babies"?

And when you bring up Suey Park as a " harassment vs ridicule " argument, you conveniently leave out the death and rape threats.

If you think someone saying "that word bothers me" is making it "unacceptable to say words", by all means: die on the hill that words have no power and any word is fine, language and sensibility doesn't change with time.

I look forward to you adding: faggot, nigger, kyke, whatever other bit of nasty language you can imagine to your daily vocab and get incredibly bent out of shape about your free speech and ability to use what words you want without offense when someone says they're offended by that.

And I think I do understand about comedians being thin skinned. Because someone saying "that's offensive to me" sends them (and you, apparently) into a death spiral of hyperbole, calling people cunts and babies, and likening them to the gestapo.

Me thinks you've been "triggered".

But hey, since you seem less interested in rationale and more about getting red, nude, and mad online, I'll let you have whatever last word you're going to scream at me after this.

Criminal are shooting citizens every day. You only get bent when the criminal is as you say is a cop.

To use Chicago as an example:

In Chicago a person is shot every 3 hours and murdered every 17 hours. Where is the outrage? National news coverage? CNN, MSNBC, FOX? Where is Al Sharpton, Obama, Rahm Emanuel.

2015 Year To Date
Shot & Killed: 377
Shot & Wounded: 2136
Total Shot: 2513
Total Homicides: 426

If political leaders cared this would stop.

So I state again . No one cares unless it has a political spin.

http://heyjackass.com/category/2015-chicago-crime-murder-stats/

A person working for US killing a criminal ( when needed, Michael Brown) is doing his job. No that is protecting the citizens.

You see 1 cop killing 1 black and get all bent out of shape but when black kill black no one cares. You tell me where is the justice in that thinking?

Your mirror is bent. Even your door looks skinny in that mirror. Should we feel sorry for you, now that you are free to do something useful and positive with your life? Shoot a horizontal video of something nice!

I found a quarter the other day . . . that's pretty exciting, right? I mean, 25 cents and everything. It had Washington on it, so it might be really old. It was just right there on the sidewalk, didn't even need SCUBA gear or anything. Bent over and picked it right up. Yup, a quarter. Daaaaaaamn, 25 cents!

Except I wasn't offended. I was curious.

Funny how a simple question gets some folks bent out of shape.

Remember I said that some women aren't feminists in my original post. I also said no judgment. I also said I was curious.

What part of that shouts that I am offended?

I am honestly curious.

Mordhaus got it. He just answered my question.

Let's ignore for the moment what led to this current mess within the Eurozone. You point out, correctly, that Greece is too poor to service its debt. And yes, for the German government to do whatever is required to get back their loans is to be expected. However, Greece was incapable of servicing its debt five years ago. Yet the subsequent programs, all supported or even demanded by the German government, reduced Greece's ability to pay back at least portions of its debt. At the end of the day, goods and services are what it's all about. And by dismantling the Greek economy, nevermind the Greek society, they actively undermined what they publicly claimed to be working for: a self-reliant Greek economy, capable of financing the needs of Greece. And capable of paying back what is owed.

The question inescapably poses itself: was it done intentionally or are they blinded by ideology?

One doesn't have to be as far left as I am to see that it didn't work, doesn't work, and never could have worked. Even the likes of Krugman and Stiglitz are perfectly clear about it.

Varoufakis, as you note, has been just as clear about this at least since late 2010, when he published the first draft of his Modest Proposal with Stuart Holland. There was a very good discussion about it in Austin in 10/2013 under the topic "Can the Eurozone be saved?" Participants included Varoufakis, Tsipras, Flassbeck, Holland and Galbraith, amongst others. I submitted a short clip back then.

His argument that Germany won't see a dime when Greece is shoved off a cliff, as correct as it is, never had any bite to begin with. The German government, and large parts of parliament, are operating in a parallel universe, economically. Over here, mercantilism is the road to success. Monetarism works. Surplus good, deficit bad. Saving good, spending bad. Everyone should have a current account surplus.

It's horseshit by the gallons, and it's the official economic policy of the largest economy in the EU.

And we're not even getting into the political aspects of it. Throwing a member of the EU into debt bondage, suspending its democracy to please the gods of the market... that's a travesty and a half. Yet it's also inevitable if they insist on going down the road of neoliberalism.

Worst of all, Greece is just the canary in the coal mine, as Varoufakis likes to point out. Greece had plenty of issues before they joined the EZ, but when they chose to adapt the same currency as a much larger economy hell bent on competitiveness, which is the favorite euphemism for Germany's beggar-thy-neighbour policies, they were doomed to be crushed. The rest of the PIIGS are next in line, unless this whole mess explodes beforehand. Maybe Rajoy's Franco-esque repression techniques fail, maybe le Pen wins in 2017, who knows. Maybe Schäuble finds the 100k of bribes that he conveniently forgot about back in the '90s and chokes on them.

Last but not least, 208 billion Euros – that's the projected current account surplus of Germany this year. That's 208 billion Euros of debt foreign economies have to accumulate, so that the German public and private sector can run a combined surplus of €208b. That's the elephant in the room. Systematic undercutting of the inflation target through suppression of unit labour costs and a dysfunctional focus on exports.