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Buttigieg Shuts Down Loaded Fox Question

newtboy says...

Yes they are, and that's why Biden is ahead by double digits.

Only if he cheats and gets republican governors to replace the vote with pro Trump electors.

Elitist? Lol. Bobby, my wife and I together make under $35000 a year, and live in a county with zero cities.... pretty damn far from elitist territory. Derp. So delusional.

No they aren't. 7 votes almost accidentally lost by one new poll worker who was instantly fired is hardly proof of cheating. What Trump said in the debate was 100% more lies and bullshit. Look it up.

🤦‍♂️

bobknight33 said:

The American people are watching and listening, not the the fake news but to what really is going all.

Trump will win in a land slide.

Keep pushing you elitist propaganda, no on is buying it except you blue cities.
Dems are cheating via mail in votes.

Cat Caught Cheating

Janus says...

Meh, looks simple enough. I'll play the role of buzzkill and Captain Obvious.
The two cats laying together clearly know each other well and trust each other. The third cat they either don't know, or they know that it is not friendly. However, it manages to get quite close in this video without them noticing. The striped cat finally notices it, jumps up and hisses, and runs off. The black cat is confused at first, then looks around and also notices the other cat, and likewise hisses and runs off. Most likely a territorial dispute.

People do like to attribute human behavior and drama to animals.

Mordhaus (Member Profile)

newtboy says...

More of a police action at this point I thought, but yeah, we didn't "win" yet, no mission accomplished, and now bounties on their heads. That said, we are in control of most areas aren't we? So the guerrilla fighters aren't winning either, they're losing territory but holding out.

None of my guns are sniper capable, my best bet at accomplishing anything would be my shotgun, and I doubt I could pump it fast enough to shoot twice, old and broken as I am, so I would be out quick too. Not what I would call a successful resistance.

I think if the military is part of a government takeover/crackdown, we don't have the slightest chance. The best we could do is identify ourselves as dissidents in need of quick execution.

But that's just like, my opinion, man. :-)

Mordhaus said:

Yet we are still at war in Afghanistan and policing other middle eastern countries. Sometimes all it takes is a few people with the will to not submit.

I know I would not live long in such a fight, I'm too old and I am disabled. But as long as we have the right to own semi automatic rifles with high capacity clips, we still can pay lip service to an armed public that can dismantle a tyrannical government. Take that away and you basically remove even the slightest chance that we as a people can challenge the government.

Ku Klux Klan Member interview-Chris

StukaFox says...

I've always wondered why these idiots think they're going to win a real race war. What're they gonna do -- pick up their pea-shooters and drive into the inner cities to stir shit up? Yeah, great plan, Chuckleheads. You just put yourself in enemy territory with an enemy who has been in more gunfights than you've had tranny wank fantasies. I've seen bangers in action and it's a scary fucking sight. They don't run. They stand in and fight. That drive-by shit is brilliant asymmetric warfare tactics -0- and they're GOOD at it. They're perfectly happy killing one another over some shit that happened 10 years ago, so what do you think's gonna happen when you start threatening their families and friends? And god help you if they capture you alive.

If there is a race war, I know which side my money's on.

newtboy said:

I like how he says the way they're preparing for the upcoming race war they know is near is by driving truckloads of guns to black neighborhoods and handing them out. Lol. What a great plan.

What is QAnon? If You Don’t Know, Now You Know

newtboy says...

Interesting ramblings having nothing to do with my post about Q and news coverage, and mostly dead wrong.

Let me fix those....
Lost a boatload of jobs leaving us with highest unemployment rates since the great depression and the largest number of businesses closing.

Lowering taxes but raising spending, giving us the highest debt and largest deficit ever.
Include emergency spending and this year added well over $7 TRILLION to the debt. Each man woman and child owed $88000 before this year's insane over budget spending in the neighborhood of $7 Trillion that's been reported (which means it could be trillions more in hidden spending). He is running America like a business, and he likes to strip businesses of all cash and assets, putting them in his own pockets, bankrupt them, then walking away leaving his partners ruined. America is nearing bankruptcy, is in massively more debt despite his promise to not only end deficit but end the debt term one. Instead he tried to double it and pocketed hundreds upon hundreds of millions in illegal business he directed the government to do with Trump companies, something no president has ever attempted but Trump's term has been non stop hatch act violations from day one, so he illegally stole hundreds of millions from hard working Americans, again.
Largest GDP drop ever in history, meaning the worst economy ever, not the best.
The deficit this year will be the largest since WW2, more than double the huge Obama 09 deficit that stopped the Republican recession of 08, 18% of GDP.
https://www.thebalance.com/us-deficit-by-year-3306306
The debt is 136% of gdp...up 32% under Trump in just 3 years, the Deficit is up 15%. The country reaches a tipping point if the ratio is more than 77%...it's 136%. 77% is when lenders begin to worry whether it's safe to buy the country's bonds. They think the government may not be able to pay back its debt. Under Trump they're fairly certain we won't even try.

Put another way, if Trump paid for his 2020 spending instead of raising the debt exponentially, every man, woman, and child would have a tax bill for $20000 just this year alone, with zero reduction in debt.

Caving in to China after praising them for their Covid response, he's not fighting back over anything. He can't even get a trade deal done after tossing out one we had, this has cost hundreds of Billions in pure wasted money for his ego. China is expanding as we contract in ability, economic strength, and even territory.
He's pro Russia, he's destroyed American manufacturing, education, mail, infrastructure, international standing, trade, and debt. He talks pro American, he doesn't lead or govern that way. He's pro Trump, and has no other loyalties.

The military didn't need a whit of rebuilding, it was quite well funded before, and he inherited the best prepared, best funded, best armed (with the most ammunition despite his lies), largest (measured by equipment, not soldiers), and most inclusive military. He's screwed them repeatedly, by repeated last minute redeployment, cutting benefits, ignoring Russia's bounties on American soldiers and the deaths those payments caused, tossing out decorated soldiers while pardoning and reinstating murderous anti American sadists (stripping them of honor), and now he's screwed up their medical system by screwing up the USPS, delaying their medicine, and killing some veterans in the process, way more than Benghazzi.

Yeah, you are bat shit crazy, ignoring facts constantly to praise Trump over his destruction of our national status on every front.
Just nuts, Bob. You must pretend 2020 didn't happen to believe even one of those lies.

bobknight33 said:

Creating shitload of jobs,
lowering taxes for people and corporations,
having the best economy in our life time.

Fighting back against China.
Being PRO America.
Rebuilding the Military

Yea bat chit crazy,

Al Franken Draws USA Freehand

Buttle says...

Once you throw in Puerto Rico, you have to do Guam, and the US Virgin Islands, and American Samoa. I probably missed one; is Kwajalein a territory or just a 99 year lease?

BSR said:

Pencil me in for "Impressed" also.

That should be a requirement for any presidential candidate. He could have thrown in Puerto Rico for extra credit.

Confrontation in America

moonsammy says...

That was super interesting, particularly seeing SO much commonality between the protestors of the late 60's / early 70's and the last few years. Same shit, different century. I stopped watching a bit early as it seemed to have veered hard into "but of course everyone would be happy if only they Jesus'd" territory, but up to that point was excellent.

newtboy (Member Profile)

StukaFox says...

Newt,

This is in response to your comment on my statement about Biden needing to lose in '20.

I recently wrote this as a reply to one of my readers (I write under a number of different names in other places).:

Dear <name>,

>I took some time to absorb what you wrote. It's a lot to juggle. The Atlantic has an article in the July-August issue on the worst and best case scenario in CLO defaults. I'll read more.

I read the article you mentioned, and while it's certainly good, it also misses a very important point that explains the mess we're in: the collapse of Lehman and Bear-Stearns, while catastrophic in their own ways, were not the nightmare that caused the Fed to freak out in 2008 -- AIG was. Had AIG gone under and the counterparty default contracts triggered, we'd be on the barter system right now. We came within hours of not having an economy in the western world. The $700b ($.7t) the Fed coughed up to stop this from happening calmed the panic, but did nothing to resolve the underlying issues. These issues continued to compound during the 2011-2020 stock run-up and now we're at the point where the Fed is throwing trillions of dollars at every piece of bad debt they can find just to keep the whole thing from imploding into an economic black hole. It is important to note that in September '19, the credit markets started freezing because of the debt that was already on the books then, -before- CV-19 started rolling, and it took $3t just to get them unlocked again. Absolutely nothing has gotten better since then, and I would argue things have gotten dangerously worse.

In an odd coincidence, the NYT ran an article today about the looming bankruptcy crisis. They're calling for 30-60 days before things start imploding, but I'll stick to my estimate of ~90 days. There's some talk about extending the $600 benefits (we'll see) and chatter about another stimulus check, but that's kicking the can as well as telegraphing how bad things really are. When the Republicans are getting behind free money, you know we're in some uncharted territory. For all intents and purposes, Modern Monetary Theory (MMT) -- the reason the Fed is backstopping debt and printing money like crazy -- is the hill the US economy will live or die on. Should the US dollar come unpegged as the world's de facto currency or should inflation begin (and there's already worrying signs this is happening), that's game over.

Please don't take anything I say as the Word of God; please do your own research and come to your own conclusions. Everything I've said is an opinion based on my education, experience and way of thinking. Your mileage may vary.

Here is the article I mentioned: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/18/business/corporate-bankruptcy-coronavirus.html -- might be paywalled, but clear your cookies for the NYT and you should be able to read it.


>Frankly, it's the physical danger in my area of the States that concerns me. There are the guns and bullying. During some BLM demonstrations in the Midwest, locals were standing around with semi-automatics. I drive a Prius for the fuel efficiency. Pick up trucks enjoy tailgating, trying to intimidate me. This behavior isn't going to change with a change of President but will get worse is we don't change. This ideological push to takeover the country instead of ruling by compromise started around the same time we came to the US in 1981, Reagan's first year. I was so shocked when I heard talk radio for the first time; this wasn't the country I had left in the 1970s.


And now we come to the giant pile of sweaty dynamite that's just waiting for the right shock to set it off. I could give you a prolonged lecture about how this all started in 1978 with California's Proposition 13, or how David Stockman's tragically prescient warnings were blatantly ignored, but Haynes Johnson does a far better job at this than I ever could in his 1991 book "Sleepwalking Through History", as does Kevin Phillips in 2006's "American Theocracy". Honestly, at this point, the prelude is academic. The reality of the situation is that a large swath of adult Americans are appalling ill-educated, innumerate and devoid of even the most basic critical-thinking skills. These people are now locked out of the Information Economy. They lack the most basic skills required to compete in the 21st century job market and thus will watch their standard of living sink into the abyss. These people are not blind to this fact because they're living with the reality of their situation every single day. They're totally without hope, cut off from all avenues of control over their own lives and they feel utterly abandoned by the very people who're supposed to be helping them. The reason you're seeing bullying and behavior like that is because these same people are totally removed from any avenues of recourse and the only people they can take their anger out on are people like you and me. Their anger is being stoked on a daily basis. FOX News and the GOP are experts at this and have a host of boogeymen to keep the anger from being pointed their way: ANTIFA, BLM (black Americans have always made a perfect target), "coastal elites" and, of course, Liberals.

Trump's election was a warning, not an outlier. Trump was the primal scream of these people and Liberals and the Democrats as a whole chose not to listen because they found the sound so abhorrent. The rage will only get worse and the number of people enveloped by this rage will only grow as economic conditions worsen. At this point, it no longer matters who wins in '20. Winning the election will be like winning the deed to the World Trade Center one second after the first jet hit. The damage has already been done and no steps are being taken to repair it; if anything, people are actively making it worse either through ideological blindness, deliberate malfeasance or outright stupidity. It took almost 50 years to get to this point and the endemic issues will not be undone in a single generation, much less a single election. Until the people who voted for Trump feel a sense of real hope, a sense of control over their lives and a genuine expectation of recourse for their grievances, they will keep right on voting for Trump, or people like him.

My unfortunate suspicion is that this country will rip itself to shreds long before those reforms are enacted.

Side note: the fundamental difference between the United States and Europe is that European history has forced the nations of Europe to live with the consequences of their actions. Not so the United States. Europe has suffered for her sins. Not so the United States. The two bloodiest wars in human history were fought on European soil. Not so the United States. The United States has never faced true suffering, nor has it ever had to live with the ramifications of its own actions. Both these facts are about to change and a nation whose character is built on a mythology of individual action and violence is going to have to face reality. The people of this nation are not prepared for this and they will not like it.

Second side note: many people are erroneously comparing the current situation to the Wiemar Republic. This is a lack of historical understanding. A more apt comparison would be to Spain in late 1935.


>As for re-opening, we could have gotten some control if the "leader" had simply donned a mask and used realistic thinking. People could go back to work more safely, wash hands, stay a certain distance. But his hubris led the way, so now we'll have a roller coaster for months and years that will affect the economy even more. France is a good comparison because they were unprepared also, having slashed the public healthcare budget for the last twenty years. But when they laid down the rules, troops patrolled the streets to be sure they were followed. So far, they've flattened the curve (for now), and used different economic incentives, such as paying part of employees' salaries to keep them employed.

At this point, the pace of re-opening is a difference between very bad and much worse. Had $3t been used to pay the yearly salary of every American, we could have saved lives and the economy, but we didn't. The history of 2020 will be littered with "what-ifs". However, the first thing you learn when studying history is that what-ifs are useless because things are what they are and you can't change that. It's already obvious we're going into a second wave. If previous pandemics are any indication of what's to come, this second wave will be many times worse than the first. The wait for a vaccine is indeterminate, but if we're going for herd immunity, ~70% of Americans will need to catch the virus. To date, ~1.5% have. If the US population is ~330 million, ~230 million will need to catch the virus. Call the mortality rate 2%, that means ~4.6 million Americans will die. That's a lot of dead Americans and grieving families.

Take care,

(my actual name)

Definition of "cool as a cucumber"

blacklotus90 says...

Depends on the type of bear and why it's advancing / whether it's attacking! Generally it's good to calmly make yourself known and look large, as you say. This one already seemed aware and curious, but not necessarily threatening, so provoking it probably wouldn't be a great idea. It's a myth that running or trying to move away will activate a chase, especially if the bear is in territory with food - moving away while watching the bear and grouping together to seem larger was the right thing to do. Should the bear actually attack: If the bear's black, fight back (and/or call its bluff charge). If it's brown, lay down (play dead for brown or grizzly bears).

SFOGuy said:

Blueberries for Sal in real life!

I thought the National Park Ranger approved thing to do was turn, make yourself as big as possible, waving your hands and flaring out your jacket (Dad? Dad, can you put the phone down and help me here?)---and then make some noise---but not to back down or turn your back.

However: not actually an outdoorsman.

Anyone?

Why This British Crossroads Is So Dangerous

moonsammy says...

I would thing a strategically placed, fairly large mirror would correct a fair amount of the problem. Suppose that starts getting into "too expensive" territory pretty quickly though, with inevitable vandalism and whatnot.

Why The Right Wing End Game Is Armageddon

newtboy says...

That depends on which bible you mean....there are many.

Really? Lost to history?! Hardly....lost to the ignorant and uneducated maybe, but even atheists like me know full well Jesus the man was a Jew, and definitely not a European or "white". Roman/Italian artists knew this, but worked for a Roman church so portrayed him in their image.

Genetic purity?! Lol. I guess that means no one has EVER become Jewish, you're either born one by two pure Jewish parents or not. Hardly reality, and would reject nearly every person in Israel (or elsewhere). Just because there is a long standing religious/cultural taboo against marriage outside the culture, it still happens, as does conversion. Racial/genetic purity is a fallacy debunked by genetic testing.

Prophecy is a leap. No prophecy has been correctly interpreted until AFTER the events supposedly prophesied occurred. It's ridiculous to go back after the fact and claim "see, now that I know exactly how to interpret the unclear prophecy I couldn't decipher before, it's a 100% perfect prediction" but never be able to predict the future. That's the same nonsensical logic mediums use.

The second temple was also the third, since the true second temple was originally a rather modest structure constructed by a number of Jewish exile groups returning to the Levant from Babylon under the Achaemenid-appointed governor Zerubbabel. However, during the reign of Herod the Great, the Second Temple was completely refurbished, and the original structure was totally overhauled into the large and magnificent edifices and facades that are more recognizable. Logically, the third temple was the one destroyed by Romans, the second replaced by Herod but the new one was still called the second temple anyway. (To avoid contradicting prophecy? ;-) )

If the dome of the rock, the second most holy place in Islam, is destroyed, expect Jerusalem to follow soon after, as that will definitely start a religious war between nuclear powers.

Herodotus is credited with using the term Palestinian first, in the 5th century BCE as an ethnonym, making no distinction between Arabs, Jews, or other cultures inhabiting of the area. Romans adopted the term as the official administrative name for the region in the 2nd century CE, "Palestine" as a stand-alone term then came into widespread use, printed on coins, in inscriptions and even in rabbinic texts.

I think you are confused about the history, here's a primer...
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_and_Judaism_in_the_Land_of_Israel

The area was populated by various people's including Jews until the Jewish–Roman wars of 66–136 CE, during which the Romans expelled most of the Jews from the area (well, really they arguably left voluntarily because they refused to be second class citizens barred from practicing their religion freely) and replaced it with the Roman province of Syria Palaestina, the Arabs were already there, not invaders or immigrants. When Assyrians (Mesopotamians) invaded in circa 722 BCE, they ruled empirically, meaning only the Jewish ruling elite left, returning in 538 BCE under Cyrus the Great....so no, the Arabs didn't just settle after the Jews were dispersed.

It's patently ridiculous to say the Arab nations were unprovoked, Jewish illegal immigration led to a hostile takeover of the region by illegal immigrants with rapid expansion of their territories into their neighbors continuing through today. The Jews defeated the Arabs thanks to American backing and exponentially better hardware. It was only their right if might makes right, and the Arab nations are under no obligation to let them keep what they stole any more than the Jews were obligated to let the Arab nations retain control in the first place. If Iran, Syria, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, or any combination can take it, by your logic they have every right to do so.

I do agree, in the end there will be more conflict until the area becomes uninhabitable....largely because every religion's prophecies end with them in control, and no one wants to admit it's all nonsensical iron age tribalism at work.

Why The Right Wing End Game Is Armageddon

shinyblurry says...

The bible was written almost exclusively by Jews, both the Old and New Testament. Jesus was a Jew and so were most of His apostles. The events of the majority of the books in the bible happened in Israel. Christianity is a Jewish religion. So, it shouldn't really surprise anyone that the bible has a lot to say about the Jews. Where they came from, how they got there, and what happens to them in the future.

Christian support for the Jews is a relatively new phenomenon. During the reign of the Catholic church, Jews were persecuted by Catholics and forced to convert to Christianity. The Jewishness of Jesus was lost to history; this is why you see much of the art during the middle ages depicting the Lord as a European man.

What changed is that the Jews returned to the land of Israel in 1948, something that many scholars of time past assumed was impossible. The general teaching was that God had broken His covenant with the Jewish people because they rejected Christ and that the church was now the new Israel. This is called replacement theology.

Yet, the Jews did return to their own land, a unique event in all of history. Never before had a people group been displaced from their own country, scattered all over the world for thousands of years, and then regathered to their original land with their cultural and genetic purity intact. This is a true miracle which anyone can plainly see is evidence of the hand of God working in the Earth on behalf of His chosen people.

The video makes it seem like the idea of Israel being integral to end times prophecy is some kind of leap, yet anyone who has studied the bible seriously knows that nearly everything predicted about the end times revolves around Israel, and particularly Jerusalem. There are numerous prophecies in the Old Testament stating plainly that God will scatter His people and gather them back to Israel in the last days.

The scripture predicts that the Jews will build a third temple. At this moment the Dome of the Rock, the golden domed building you see in photographs of Jerusalem, stands in the place where the third temple must be built. You could sum up the entire tension in the middle east in two words: "Temple Mount".

Not only are the Jews ready to rebuild their temple in a moments notice, they have created all of the implements of the temple and have been training priests to serve in the temple. The scripture declares that for end times prophecy to be fulfilled there must be a third temple. I can confidently predict that this will happen sometime in the future and the Dome of the Rock most likely be destroyed.

I also wanted to mention one other thing. The name "Palestine" was given to the area by the Romans. The Palestinians are not a people group, they are Arabs who settled in the area after the Jews were dispersed around the world. The video really does you a disservice by neglecting to mention the fact that it was the Arab nations that attacked Israel unprovoked on multiple occasions and the Jews against all odds defeated them. It was their right to take that territory and they are under no obligation to return it.

In the end, there will be much more conflict in the middle east, all revolving around the Jews and Jerusalem in some way. You may doubt the scripture but you will see this unfold with your very eyes. One day a charismatic man will come on the scene who will negotiate a peace in the middle east between the Jews and the nations of the world. He will seem at first to be someone who can solve all of our problems but eventually he will establish a one world order and rule the world with an iron fist. He will go into the Jewish temple and declare himself to be God. This is who the bible calls the Antichrist.

So, if you want to know where we are at in the end times, watch Israel and Jerusalem. Jerusalem is Gods prophetic time clock. When you see the Dome of the Rock being replaced by the temple, know the Lord is near, even at the doors.

Back-To-School Essentials | Sandy Hook Promise

harlequinn says...

It is relatively easy to get a quite common pre 1986 machine gun.

The whole process is cheap. $200. Fill out a ATF form 4 and attach a passport sized photo. There are only a few questions to answer (that take up about 2.5 pages). This took about 30 seconds on google to find out. It is not more difficult to pass this background audit than that of a federal agent. I've looked into applying to be a federal agent and their process is an order of magnitude more stringent.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/form/form-4-application-tax-paid-transfer-and-registration-firearm-atf-form-53204/download

"What you, me, or others consider firearms means nothing."

You asked me what I considered a firearm. I answered both my personal opinion, and then specifically said that what the government considers a firearm to be is what it is. I'm surprised you seem to have missed this.

Registries are a step towards being able to confiscate guns en-masse. If you know who has what it is much easier to take it away from them. This sentiment is well documented on pro-gun forums.

"It doesn't take any money to ban certain firearms, certainly not a boatload"

Very true. I was tempted to point this out but I didn't. I believe that this is one of the core reasons they want to do it. It makes you think they are doing something when they aren't, and it costs sweet fuck all compared to say, spending money on anything else that will genuinely improve the average man's lot.

'your off hand assumption that, without your derisive "warning", he would be "dumb" enough to make an assumption'

Now that's the thing about warnings, you aren't assuming the behaviour of anyone. You only know it is a possibility that you don't want to happen. You don't know if it will happen or not. So you put up a warning. That's how warnings work.

But hey, this is your house right? Make no mistake, you've stamped yourself all over videosift like a dog marking its territory. Outsiders who don't comply with your way of thinking basically aren't welcome.

newtboy said:

At best that leaves only the rare pre 1986 automatics already in private hands, only in some states (totally illegal under any circumstances in many other states), only if you can first pass an expensive background check more stringent than the one federal agents must pass. Sounds like some serious regulation to me.

What you, me, or others consider firearms means nothing. I gave you the law as written, it includes those, they are illegal, so there are effective regulations on firearms already....that doesn't mean they're sufficient. Those words are different words, that's why they're spelled and pronounced differently. Speed limits are effective laws, but not sufficient to regulate vehicle use.

Why do so many firearms lovers fear being on a registry? I've always found that insane, like every other purchase you make isn't tracked or something. There's no purchase privacy anymore, for anything.

It doesn't take any money to ban certain firearms, certainly not a boatload, and not the ocean of cash health care costs. That's a red herring. All it takes is for representatives to vote the way their constituents want them to by 98%.
Perhaps in that sense it would take money, because in order to get them to vote as the people want, campaign finance reform is necessary, and that will cost money, but it's the best thing our country could possibly spend money on.

I support a slightly modified second amendment and universal health care. My interpretation allows for regulations, registration, universal background checks even for family transfers, bans of certain types, seizure from violent convicts and mental patients (impossible without a registry, btw), etc. Yes, I understand that's not how the constitution is written today, but the constitution is a living document. In California, we have most of that as state law already, including an outright ban on fully or selectively automatic weapons.

Btw, you suggest....Try to make people feel welcome.
I was responding in kind to your off hand assumption that, without your derisive "warning", he would be "dumb" enough to make an assumption about you. Then you go on to say making assumptions is dumb. Care to rethink? Had you been more thoughtful and less derisive in making that point I likely would have ignored the hypocrisy.

Temper tantrum

AeroMechanical says...

No (personal) offensive intended to parrot owners, and yes they're pretty, but I just don't understand why you would want to bring a loud, ill-tempered vicious little territorial monster like that into your home.

My theory is that they are just a little bit too intelligent and independent to get on with the whole "being a pet" thing.

George H.W. Bush, American War Criminal

newtboy says...

No sir.

I'm addressing his comment about the invasion of Iraq happening because of "Saddam's campaign of genocide against his own people and his conquest of Kuwait." when that's absolutely not how the invasion was sold to us by W. That's only partially how Desert Shield was sold by Sr. (Keeping in mind the gassing had happened years earlier), but that didn't remove or even target Saddam and barely went into Iraq, so clearly wasn't designed to remove him from power or stop his atrocities, just to stop his expansion into our allies territories.

The invasion of Iraq and direct targeting of Saddam was by W, not Sr. and are what led to the current state of the region far more than any result of Desert Storm...what I thought he meant by "blaming Sr. for Iraq"....I read that as 'blaming Sr. for the current state of Iraq and the region'.
I may have misunderstood what he meant by "blaming Sr for Iraq", but I can tell the difference between bushes.

My_design said:

Wrong Bush.

"That's what she said!"



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