So, some smartass went and reinvented the wheel ...

newtboysays...

Great! But how does it do with large side forces, like cornering at high speed? If they do well, perhaps this is a way to eliminate suspension in electric vehicles, reducing weight but keeping a smooth ride. That would be a big leap forward!
I've seen something similar with maybe 20 curved 'spokes' (looking like a turbine from the side) that was tunable, made harder or softer by adding/removing 'spokes'. The issue with them was the spokes created lots of resistance...like turning a turbine.

AeroMechanicalsays...

Looks brilliant, but I do have to say I've seen a lot of variations on the theme of integrating the suspension into wheels or tires that was going to revolutionize everything over the years and yet it never has come to pass. At $1000 a set, they'd have to be pretty damn incredible to be worth it. I'd buy some if I was stupid rich though because they're cool looking if nothing else.

jubuttibsays...

I think that at best this would be applicable only to the very lightest of electric vehicles (something in the "motorcycle" weight class, even half a ton is probably too heavy), and I have my doubts about even those, even when completely disregarding the sideways forces.

With a system like this you do not want more than a few cm (about an inch, at a guess) of suspension travel from when the car is lifted in air to the car at rest (= 1G vertical load), just from the weight of the car compressing the springs. If you have more the springs (which the loops naturally are) have to compress a lot with each revolution, which strains them, heats them, isn't good for rolling resistance, etc.

If we assume a 1000 kg car with a 50/50 weight distribution, to get about 2 cm of suspension travel the spring stiffness would be about comparable to a high level GT racing car. Comparing to high level sports cars, the street going Porsche 911 GT3 RS car, which is regarded as a pretty stiff, racy and track oriented vehicle has something in the region of three times that much travel, a normal commuter car can have way over 10 cm due to soft, comfort oriented springs.

So you can't spring a proper car with just these because it'd require it to be too stiff (also I can foresee shock absorption issues). Another problem is the 360 degree springy nature of it. You really don't want car tyres to move much aside from up and down. These have the problem that when you brake, the forces will try to push the axle forwards in relation to the wheel (i.e. the wheel moves backwards while braking), and the reverse when accelerating. You'd be (possibly) drastically changing the wheelbase of the car during acceleration and braking, which could have catastrophic results for handling in extreme situations. Many if not most cars these days are capable of braking at over 1 G, as long as they have decent tyres, so the front-back movement could be bigger than the up-down movement.

So yeah, doesn't really sound like a workable solution as the ONLY spring system on a car. Having some springiness in the tyres (either in the wheel itself of just having larger profile tyres, like we used to back in the day) can be helpful for comfort and even handling in some cases, but springing the car only via the wheels isn't a good idea, you really want to be able to control the wheels better than that.

newtboysaid:

If they do well, perhaps this is a way to eliminate suspension in electric vehicles, reducing weight but keeping a smooth ride.

newtboysays...

OK, I don't disagree on any point, except the assumption that an electric car MUST be a 1000KG fully loaded passenger car.
I was thinking more of the non-highway legal, neighborhood kind that might weigh 200lbs.+- where saving 75-100 lbs would make a huge difference, and minimal suspension would still be OK.

jubuttibsays...

Yeah, "applicable only to the very lightest of electric vehicles". Something like that would at least have a chance of working. Basically something like a Segway, an electric bike, a small cart/kart/trike, something like that. Though how much of a weight save compared to loss of driving dynamics/stability/safety you'd get is a bit iffy, the suspension bits in a 200 pound vehicle are already very light.

But yeah, something like that might work.

newtboysaid:

OK, I don't disagree on any point, except the assumption that an electric car MUST be a 1000KG fully loaded passenger car.
I was thinking more of the non-highway legal, neighborhood kind that might weigh 200lbs.+- where saving 75-100 lbs would make a huge difference, and minimal suspension would still be OK.

SquidCapsays...

Also, this thing deforms each spring as it rotates. Some of this movement is turned in to heat, that is a netloss of energy that can be avoided with simple up-down traditional spring system that only generates heat when the body of the vehicle moves in relations with the tires... Not when you are just rolling on a smooth, flat surface.

Nice idea but can only work on small tires, further making the driving experience horrid. Larger tires, up to a point, gives you much less resistance, you can keep rolling forever on them. With this one, you peddle all the time.

jimnmssays...

I'm pretty sure I saw this design or something similar a few years ago. Also, does anyone remember the Tweel? I first saw that about 10 years ago, and it was supposed to be the end of pneumatic tires on cars.

Quit trying to re-invent the wheel and give me the flying cars I was told I would be driving by now.

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