From wikipedia: Janet Napolitano is the United States Secretary of Homeland Security in the administration of President Barack Obama.

*promote

Self promoting this video and sending it back into the queue for one more try; last queued Sunday, November 28th, 2010 1:35pm PST - promote requested by original submitter blankfist.

But, she didn't actually suggest body scanners for trains, ships and buses, did she? This is another example of Fox News stepping over the line between exaggeration and simply lying about shit.

http://www.thenewamerican.com/index.php/usnews/politics/5311-janet-napolitano-considers-advanced-screenings-for-mass-transit

Even the Fox News website got it right originally. Compare this to the impression you just got from the video:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/11/25/body-scanners-headed-trains-ships-mass-transit/

*lies

>> ^entr0py:

But, she didn't actually suggest body scanners for trains, ships and buses, did she?

You're right. She did not. But if she did install the backscatter x-rays and 'gate rape' pat down procedures at bus stations, train stations and ship ports, would it really change your opinion of her in the slightest? And why are Democrats now laying down and claiming "this is the world we live in" instead of protesting this for the civil liberties violation that it is?

Ugh, but the point is still valid - where the fuck does this end? This is going to get very oppressive for US Citizens - this is waay too much - TSA needs to go (or radically change) - this is not the answer...

How many Terrorists has the TSA caught?

Yea...

Fullbody x-ray (nude 'scatter type') scanners at mall, now!!

I'm fine with it, so why aren't you.

So I get arrested for showing my genitals on ships, trains and buses, and I get arrested if I don't let them look at my genitals on ships, trains and buses?

Funny, I was just reading the Gorgias Socratic Dialogue yesterday. This is just chopped full of rhetoric, "These are the times we live in", which is of course, meaningless...when has their not been violence and injustice in the world, but it sure sounds nice.

Rhetoric is to politics what pastry baking is to medicine, and what cosmetics are to gymnastics. -Socrates

Just let the airlines handle security, that way you choose how much of an illusion of safety you need in order to step on a plane. And whether or not you want to get groped/scanned before you go on board.

I wonder why this issue is getting so much attention in the corporate media. Is this all leading towards something? Perhaps privatization of the industry with contracts going out to corporate campaign patrons?

>> ^dystopianfuturetoday:

I wonder why this issue is getting so much attention in the corporate media. Is this all leading towards something? Perhaps privatization of the industry with contracts going out to corporate campaign patrons? If that happens, I called it first.


Perhaps, but I think it has more to do with they get to show people and talk about people being naked...a lot. That sells by the truckloads. It just happens that what sells is actually relevant for freedom for a change...unlike the normal indulgence of Celebrities and Politicians.

hmmmmm....

Who benefits over the TSA controversy?

The civil liberties fight over airport body-scanning and patdowns is tainted by corporate interests. It's time to follow the money

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2010/nov/26/air-transport-theairlineindustry

Congressman Seeks to Ditch TSA for Private Firms, Some of Them Campaign Donors

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/11/19/airports-consider-congressmans-ditch-tsa/#ixzz16huP7lCLhttp://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/11/19/airports-consider-con
gressmans-ditch-tsa/

>> ^dystopianfuturetoday:

hmmmmm....
Who benefits over the TSA controversy?
The civil liberties fight over airport body-scanning and patdowns is tainted by corporate interests. It's time to follow the money
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamer
ica/2010/nov/26/air-transport-theairlineindustry
Congressman Seeks to Ditch TSA for Private Firms, Some of Them Campaign Donors
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/11/19/airports-consid
er-con">http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/11/19/airports-consider-congressmans-ditch-tsa/#ixzz16huP7lCLhttp://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/11/19/airports-cons
ider-con
gressmans-ditch-tsa/


Isn't their money in the scanners for someone already though? And if it wasn't the government, by nature it would be private firms, right? If they government wasn't involved with regulating those firms it wouldn't have implied power to install its "buddies" either. If it was completely left up to airports, and their partners, the airlines, and their primary customer, the traveler, I would say it would most likely be a better process overall. Did you see that other sift about the bomb dogs? Seems like a pretty neat solution, depending on the effectiveness.

You are right though, we want to avoid another Goldman Sachs level corporate scandal of the TSA...err should I say MORE of a scandal, or furthers scandal.

^It's win/win for corporations who profit off of both roles, villain and hero. Lobby the government to give you huge contracts to build invasive scanners, then criticize the government for using invasive scanners, then propose the government privatize airport security.

Corporations profit from corruption and then use the corruption they funded to justify giving themselves more power, which also gives them more ability to create more corruption, which they can then use to justify giving themselves more power.... rinse and repeat until plutocracy is achieved.

>> ^dystopianfuturetoday:

It's win/win for corporations. Lobby the government to give you huge contracts to build invasive scanners, then criticize the government for using invasive scanners, then propose the government privatize airport security.
Corporations profit from corruption and then use the corruption they funded to justify giving themselves more power, which also gives them more ability to create more corruption, which they can then use to justify giving themselves more power.... rinse and repeat until plutocracy is achieved.


Heheh indeed, doesn't it seem like the solution would to be to keep government sponsored corruption out, and let airports decide what is best for them and their passengers? It seems like the only way to break the cycle of which you speak.

At least forcing corporations to have to take that extra step by bribing the government slows them down a little. Deregulation just cuts out the middle man.

Corporations will do what they please with or without a corrupt government standing in its way. The only way to break the cycle would be major campaign finance reform and the reversal of the mind-bogglingly corrupt and unethical 5 to 4 Supreme Court ruling that gives corporations unlimited, anonymous influence over our electoral process.

>> ^dystopianfuturetoday:

At least forcing corporations to have to take that extra step by bribing the government slows them down a little. Deregulation just cuts out the middle man.
Corporations will do what they please with or without a corrupt government standing in its way. The only way to break the cycle would be major campaign finance reform and the reversal of the mind-bogglingly corrupt and unethical 5 to 4 Supreme Court ruling that gives corporations unlimited, anonymous influence over our electoral process.


Doesn't that just place the power into the hands of people who can throw you in jail though? I mean, a robber baron might be able to rip you off, but he can't lock you up...or fine you for not buying his product. Governments tend to be one of the main factors in companies abilities to gain captured audiences as well. Like what I consider the first big monopoly of a non-natural resource was the East India Company, which was a government sanctioned monopoly. In our current day, some of the most power forces on the planet started as government sanctioned monopolies..and some still are; the cable and phone companies. Sure they got broken up once or twice, but states and municipalities still make it illegal in many areas to run new cable. As a result, their power blossomed into the media super giants that control a great deal of the worlds information. That power is slowly being undermined by things like NPR, Real News Network, and various other small label news outlets.

My main point is that government intervention has the guise of being the only solution to social problems of domination by wealth. But in reality, you are only trading domination of wealth for domination of liberty AND wealth...over time. The entropy of that system is worse than of us getting pissed at the railroads, and either using and developing new technology or bocotting, ect.

>> ^dystopianfuturetoday:

I wonder why this issue is getting so much attention in the corporate media. Is this all leading towards something? Perhaps privatization of the industry with contracts going out to corporate campaign patrons?


I'm so glad you discovered this sudden interest in corporate donations in politics. Let's look at those contributions: http://www.followthemoney.org/database/IndustryTotals.phtml

Looks like Republicans and Democrats are leading the race with a large majority. And which party are you defending again?

GeesusFreak: There are plenty of private prisons. Once you drown democracy in the bathtub, business will be free to make up their own laws, and lock up who ever they want for whatever reason they desire. You take so much for granted.

blankfist: you are so caught up in partisanship. We need corporate money out of all politics, out of libertarian/right wing front groups, and out of Republican/Democrat/Libertarian campaigns. Also, do you see how corrupt your own ideology has become. At one point you were against corporate power, and now that I've finally convinced you that your ideological influences are heavily funded by corporations, you've tossed that integrity out the window, falling back on the sad and disappointing sentiment, 'It's OK because everyone else is doing it too.'

Do you and G. notice that corporations use the same arguments you do, about government and tyranny and deregulation and self regulating markets? Does this not give you even a moment of pause or self reflection? If we all agree that corporate influence is corruptive, then why do you two parrot their talking points as if they were your own?

Is it possible that you've been manipulated, that marketing executives have figured out what makes you tick, and bent you to their will with self serving pie-in-the-sky rhetoric about liberty and individuality? I can't understand why anyone would argue against representative democracy? If the power doesn't rest with citizens, then who? Do you realize what life was like before democracy? Kings, Dictators, Dukes, Chiefs, Barrons and emperors? You take so much for granted.

This government is the result of 30 years of deregulation, easing of campaign finance laws and the realization of foolish market concepts like trickle down economics. The government we have is a direct result of the types of ideas you both champion. This is the government you deserve.

@dystopianfuturetoday, not that I'm defending the "Libertarian Party", but I don't think there's a comparison between the corporate donations in your party and those in the LP. Your go-to argument is the Kochs and Cato. Good one.

You claim the "liberty movement" is corrupted by corporate dollars, but I don't see it. Believe me, it's not that the Voluntaryists don't want and NEED some major funding. They'd take it from Halliburton if they offered. But honestly, isn't your new rhetoric really the kettle calling the pot black?

Of course you don't think there is a comparison, you are a partisan in denial.

*citation needed

>> ^dystopianfuturetoday:

GeesusFreak: There are plenty of private prisons.

^Expect an invoice for my research assistance services.

(From wiki)

Private prisons in the United States today

Private companies in the United States operate 264 correctional facilities, housing almost 99,000 adult offenders.[13] Companies operating such facilities include the Corrections Corporation of America, the GEO Group, Inc, and Community Education Centers. The GEO Group was formerly known as Wackenhut Securities.

Corrections Corporation of America (CCA) has a capacity of more than 80,000 beds in 65 correctional facilities. The GEO Group operates 61 facilities with a capacity of 49,000 offender beds,[14]

Most privately run facilities are located in the southern and western portions of the United States and include both state and federal offenders.[13]

I thought you might be referring to that, but that isn't really what we were talking about. We were talking about private people writing up their own warrants for your arrest and throwing you in jail. Short of debtors prisons, which were still run by the government as a legal response to debt, there isn't a case were private people could kidnap you or fine you for not using their product.

>> ^dystopianfuturetoday:

^Expect an invoice for my research assistance services.
(From wiki)
Private prisons in the United States today
Private companies in the United States operate 264 correctional facilities, housing almost 99,000 adult offenders.[13] Companies operating such facilities include the Corrections Corporation of America, the GEO Group, Inc, and Community Education Centers. The GEO Group was formerly known as Wackenhut Securities.
Corrections Corporation of America (CCA) has a capacity of more than 80,000 beds in 65 correctional facilities. The GEO Group operates 61 facilities with a capacity of 49,000 offender beds,[14]
Most privately run facilities are located in the southern and western portions of the United States and include both state and federal offenders.[13]