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CEREAL
"Snoop onto them..."
NIKON
"...as they snoop onto us!"

Soooo whaddya do, stand outside 9800 Savage Rd Fort Meade, MD and toss bottles and bricks at the windows?
Americans could do what the Brits did when their poncy government ass-fucked them and lay down and take it like a bitch, I suppose.

Oh hai, in the opening 10 minutes this guy rattles-off the addresses of the largest of the heads of the Babylonian hydra...I imagine an army of Rastafarians mounting a frontal assault, mon!

@criticalthud
Yeah, I've been accused of that, but I blame that on the "arguing on the internet" aspect of things, rather than my actual mindset. For instance, as much as I talk up Medical Science, I still don't trust doctors, and in the last 10 years, have only visited to A) get a Physical Examination required by a job, B) get a prescription for a PT, C) Get innoculated for one of the bird/swine flu, as I had been sick for a week after spending a weekend at a "Gamer Convention" (PAX), where there were many confirmed cases.

But, while I don't trust doctors, I actively campaign against "Alternative Medicine", as I've seen many people hurt by it. I've seen one person poison themselves after getting food poisoning, because "like cures like", and I've had one friend commit suicide after they were convinced that the anti-psychotic medicine they were taking wasn't "natural", and quit it.

Whenever I think of alternative medicine practitioners and their criticism of Proper Medicine, I have one quote that sticks in my head, courtesy of The Big Lebowski:
"You're not wrong, Walter. You're just an asshole"

Sure, Medical Science can be improved. But you can't improve it by removing the science. You improve it by removing the politics. Remove the kickbacks from big pharma. Remove the groveling and begging for research funds. Remove the Actual Politics of Insurance and Medicare and Medicaid and VA Benefits. Remove the Actual Politics of the 'War on Drugs".

Those are the problems in our current medical community. But rather than attempting to solve the actual problems that we all agree on, most naturopaths are just treating the symptoms... working on the edges of society, and contributing to the distrust of the individual doctors, rather than the overhaul of the entire system.

And there are certainly many types of naturopaths. Of those that I've met (my wife spent three years in a "Traditional Western Herbalism" school, so I've met quite a few), most have problems differentiating between an idea and a fact. An unsettling amount believed that herbalism is effective because the ancient aliens that brought us to earth also brought us a dramatic and intelligent plant-system which was created to diagnose and treat all of our illnesses.

They believe that through meditation, they are able to connect to this awareness, and this awareness is what will tell them what to give their patients.


It's not the individuals I have a problem with, it's their poor education that I have a problem with. Some NPs can overcome the disadvantage of their environment that de-values scientific method and fact-gathering. Many MDs can overcome the disadvantage of years of de-valuing their own intuition.

But acknowledging the similarities between the two ignores the actual harm that is caused by alternative medicine. Alternative medicine shares the same risks as Proper Medicine, with the same chances of mis-treatment.... but it removes any chance of surgery or active treatment to cure issues. It removes the huge base of shared understanding, and replaces it with a very small base of folklore that has been accumulated through "give the patient this plant, if they don't die, it must have cured them".

are you an md? if you are, the number of patients you see, the treatments you can provide, and what drugs you deal are dictated by insurance and pharmaceutical companies, and you have no choice but to comply while you pay off your 200k in loans.
Do you know what iatrogenic death means, or what the rate of iatrogenic death is? check it out....
There is plenty of quackery in the western md world.

as for Chiropractic, at least they are attempting to address the most glaring hole in western medicine: the rather obvious relationship between the structure of the body and the function of the body.

And when it comes to somatic/structural issues - which make up over 50% of hospital visits, and of which the western world treats with drugs or surgery, the chiro's at least have some of the theory correct, it's just their methodology that is fucked.

But, as for fundamental quackery, let's look at how the western world treats kids. First, hook them on sugar, then call them ADHD and give them methamphetamine salt (Adderol), followed by Ambien cause they can't sleep, followed by Prozac caused they are depressed cause they can't sleep, ...all the while they are raiding mom's medicine cabinet for the oxycontin or whatever opiate derivative they can find.
yeah, it's a JOKE. But we were trained to bow to authority, call the doctor god and worship the white coat and piece of paper on the wall.

I mean, for fuck's sake, listen to the side effect list of any major drug out there. really? that's "health care". bullshit.

Western md's shine in trauma, which was learned from our spirited attempts to have a continual state of warfare. for that they are top-notch. Anti-biotics were a huge deal, but all they've learned to do since the advent of penicillin is to make analogue after analogue, and they've stuffed so many people full of anti-biotics for just about every malady, that we are becoming genetically resistant to them as a species.
health care. yup.
how many of you out there can even afford this type of "health care"?
but please, do some research and go on for hours.

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You bet your bippy ... though you neglected to mention my MD from Harvard Medical School!

So glad to hear this. Cheers ole cum! I just recently missed a show where they preformed along with 3 other but kinda similar bands for $7 in Norfolk VA. The promoter seen that on the book of faces that said that I probably could not make it. He offered to foot the bill for the person who would travel with me to see them. I still had no takers. Mind you that when I seen them a few years ago, The same promoter was at this dive bar in Virginia Beach VA. When we walked into the place he asked us who we were there to see and my friend said "My friend wants me to see Ceremony." The dude said that they were about to hit the stage(late but perfect timing.) He then ask us where we were for and my friend said "Baltimore MD." It was a 5 hour trip man(I really love this band). The dude said "Whoa! You deserve a beer!" and bought us a pitcher of suds. This is a really cool click of musicians in the Mid Atlantic states. You need to clone yourself so I can take you to super cheap but fucking awesome shows.

Certainly a lot of people making these claims come across as crackpots, and one of the people (Price) I cited in my comment on that page certainly really was a crackpot... that said though, the population studies of Londoners before/during/after WWII rationing, the Nurses Study, and the non-crackpot analysis of Price's data all come to similar conclusions... eating too much processed food, fat, salt, sugar, and highly refined carbohydrates will essentially poison you. If you stop poisoning yourself in this way, the human body has a remarkable ability to heal itself. I don't know if stop poisoning yourself to reduce symptoms of poisoning really counts as a cure, but the end result is still healthier.

Exercise helps too, but diet is a good starting point.

Watching that vid, I did wonder what agenda the guy was pushing, but decided there was nothing really false in what he was saying and upvoted.

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