its not a bombing run, they are movie set explosions, burning fuel of some kind, which is why there is no shrapnel. Plus, jets dont drop bombs flying sideways.

>> ^WKB:

Such a shame he stepped down. He was a real force of honesty in the senate house. While he may have resorted to lies to prevent his private life from being exposed, which is a shame and is hypocritical, he has done more to expose actual lies that effect this country than most if not all of his colleagues.
Lie and it causes innocent civilians and US Troops to die? Fine... just a misunderstanding... of course. Lie about your underwear and cause no damage outside of your personal life? BURN THE WITCH!1! Absurd. If you are a non US citizen, rest assured that the US cares MUCH more about some dudes underwear than you or your child being ripped asunder by our very own shrapnel.
If he had to step down... WHY oh WHY could he not at least have made David Vitter an example of this hypocritical nonsense in the same breath. He had such courage in his active senate career as congressman... If only he could have displayed the same on his way out.

Fixed.

Such a shame he stepped down. He was a real force of honesty in the senate. While he may have resorted to lies to prevent his private life from being exposed, which is a shame and is hypocritical, he has done more to expose actual lies that effect this country than most if not all of his colleagues.

Lie and it causes innocent civilians and US Troops to die? Fine... just a misunderstanding... of course. Lie about your underwear and cause no damage outside of your personal life? BURN THE WITCH!1! Absurd. If you are a non US citizen, rest assured that the US cares MUCH more about some dudes underwear than you or your child being ripped asunder by our very own shrapnel.

If he had to step down... WHY oh WHY could he not at least have made David Vitter an example of this hypocritical nonsense in the same breath. He had such courage in his active senate career... If only he could have displayed the same on his way out.

I guess it depends on what type of round is needed. Kinetic rounds are meant to apply maximum force to the smallest possible surface area of a heavily armored target, usually composite armor where conventional rounds are ineffective. The sheer impact force alone and resultant heat and shrapnel, not to mention pressure wave that would likely suck any fleshy humanoids within (after turning them into a viscous red paste) right out the exit hole Alien Resurrection style, would probably do the trick.

Or so I vaguely recall being told from a friend with related experience 'blowing shit up' in an M1A1. I might be a bit off on the particulars. Or he might've been just 'making shit up'. >> ^Asmo:

I'd say the final round will need to be able to deliver the force to the target, so they'll want something that won't punch through, but transfer all of the force of it's arrival in to the target.

non lethal? what about all of that fucking shrapnel

>> ^ridesallyridenc:

I've been in one of these. It's scary as hell; when the hailstones hit the ground, they shatter and ice shrapnel flies everywhere. The baseball-sized stuff rips branches out of trees, etc. It's violent and loud and scary and awesome.


Oh my god. You've seen something like this?!

I've been in one of these. It's scary as hell; when the hailstones hit the ground, they shatter and ice shrapnel flies everywhere. The baseball-sized stuff rips branches out of trees, etc. It's violent and loud and scary and awesome.

" Hey cletus, just yew stand their with ur picture taker, dont worry about shrapnel flying towards your head"

I was waiting for one of them to say something along that line... I dont know whats going to happen but were going to keep our self un protected !

>> ^GenjiKilpatrick:

If you look at 0:42 there seems to be shrapnel damage to the concrete wall.
So despite the abnormal shape, iii'm guessin' those weren't just for practice.. =/
>> ^Drachen_Jager:
>> ^charliem:
>> ^Drachen_Jager:
That's not a "grenade". That's a "practice grenade" I doubt if either of them would have been seriously injured even if they hadn't moved, it's just a little bang and some smoke.

Looks like a real grenade to me.
They dont go off with giant plumes of fire, just a small puff of smoke and death.

I've thrown hand grenades so I know what they, "go off like". Look at it at 0:07 does that look like a normal hand grenade to you? 'Cause it looks like a training grenade to me.



Oh, you got me... I didn't watch that far. I guess the other shot of the grenade was file footage or something.

If you look at 0:42 there seems to be shrapnel damage to the concrete wall.

So despite the abnormal shape, iii'm guessin' those weren't just for practice.. =/

>> ^Drachen_Jager:

>> ^charliem:
>> ^Drachen_Jager:
That's not a "grenade". That's a "practice grenade" I doubt if either of them would have been seriously injured even if they hadn't moved, it's just a little bang and some smoke.

Looks like a real grenade to me.
They dont go off with giant plumes of fire, just a small puff of smoke and death.

I've thrown hand grenades so I know what they, "go off like". Look at it at 0:07 does that look like a normal hand grenade to you? 'Cause it looks like a training grenade to me.

You know that delightful red spray that shoots out of someones body when a projectile traveling at high speeds hits them? Or the wonderful mixture of shrapnel, shit, and intestines when someone blows up? What about the arterial splatter that is caused by severing the Carotid artery?

Well these guys don't get to witness that first hand, they see it through a CRT or LCD there's no direct threat to their lives; unlike an infantryman. Who's to say that the target is legit? The boss, well how about that Milgram_experiment? How do you know you made a righteous kill? Because someone told them so? I'm sure that will put a whole new spin on the Nuremberg Defense. The fact of the matter is this, it's fucking complicated. Made more complicated by the fact that they are pulling the trigger from the comfort of they're god damned arm chair.

It's a lot like lethal injection. Lethal injection makes it easier for a killer to kill. Make no mistake about it, if you take part in killing someone, even if it is lawful you are still a killer.

But, it is noted that even drone pilots get PTSD, and for good reason. They get to go home like nothing fucking happened. In my mind that makes it worse.

http://trueslant.com/jefftietz/2009/04/16/a-day-in-the-life-of-a-drone-pilot/
http://www.crunchgear.com/2008/08/09/pilots-of-predator-drones-suffering-ptsd/

Footage of what a predator drone sees, caution I didn't watch it all but someone probably died. It's liveleak.com after all.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=7bb_1210698031

>> ^zor:
It could be a plastic flash bang 'grenade' for all we know. Or a grenade that uses loose shrapnel and a soft body. I guess the grenade we all think of as the basic grenade is the pineapple shape cast from iron or steel. It will crack like ice and will not appear to expand without breaking even in the very slowest motion because it is a very very hard metal.

Right. The whole premise of those is to break at the seems sending hard metal square shrapnel in all directions.

It could be a plastic flash bang 'grenade' for all we know. Or a grenade that uses loose shrapnel and a soft body. I guess the grenade we all think of as the basic grenade is the pineapple shape cast from iron or steel. It will crack like ice and will not appear to expand without breaking even in the very slowest motion because it is a very very hard metal.

Nope, no terrorist attacks in the USA 2000 - 2008. Though there was quite a bit of state sponsored terrorist attacks in Iraq from 2003 on.

April;30 0 0 United StatesElettsville, Indiana The Earth Liberation Front (ELF) claimed responsibility for causing over $500,000 in damages to construction equipment in Elettsville, Indiana. Fourteen pieces of logging and construction equipment were destroyed by the perpetrators, who filled gas tanks with sand, cut fuel and hydraulic lines and set a tractor-trailer filled with wood chips on fire. Graffiti found at the scene read, "Go develop in Hell," "ELF" and "This machine is evil." The equipment was being used for a state-run project to build a four-lane highway in the area. In their written statement, the group writes, "the government and developers are mad with greed and there will be no limit to what they destroy until we take away the profit from their schemes."[48]

# United States United States, September 11: Attacks kill 2,997 , and many more later from exposure to toxic dust in a series of hijacked airliner crashes into two U.S. landmarks: the World Trade Center in New York City, New York, and The Pentagon in Arlington, Virginia. A fourth plane, originally intended to hit the United States Capitol Building, crashes in Somerset County, Pennsylvania, after an apparent revolt against the hijackers by the plane's passengers.

# United States United States: Anthrax attacks on the offices the United States Congress and New York State Government offices, and on employees of television networks and tabloids.


# United States United States, May: Luke Helder injures 6 by placing pipebombs in mailboxes in the Midwest. Motivation to protest government control over daily lives and the illegality of marijuana and promotion of astral projection

# United States United States, July 4: An Egyptian gunman opens fire at an El Al ticket counter in Los Angeles International Airport, killing two Israelis before being killed himself.
# Israel

United States United States, October: John Allen Muhammad and Lee Boyd Malvo conduct the Beltway Sniper Attacks, killing ten people in various locations throughout the Baltimore-Washington Metropolitan Area from October 2 until they are arrested on October 24.


March 3 0 9 United States United States: Mohammed Reza Taheri-azar, an Iranian-born graduate of the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, drives an SUV onto a crowded part of campus, injuring nine.


July 28 1 5 United States USA:A woman was dead and five others were hospitalized this afternoon after a shooting at the Jewish Federation of Greater Seattle building in downtown Seattle by a man who declared he was "angry with Israel."[10]

August 30 1 16 United States United States: An Afghani Muslim hit 19 pedestrians, killing one, with his SUV in the San Francisco Bay area.

October 26 2 United States A pair of improvised explosive devices are thrown at the Mexican Consulate in New York City. The fake grenades were filled with black powder and detonated by fuses, causing very minor damage. Police investigate the connection between this and a similar attack against the British Consulate in New York in 2005.[105]


July 27 2 7 United States Knoxville, Tennessee. Knoxville Unitarian Universalist church shooting, Jim David Adkisson kills 2 people and injures 7 in Knoxville, Tennessee.

17 1 4 United States Dalton, Georgia An explosion at a personal injury law firm in downtown Dalton, Ga., injured four people, including at least one lawyer, and resulted in the death of the apparent bomber in what a federal law enforcement spokesman described as a suicide attack.[212]

December 12 2 2 United States Woodburn, Oregon. Woodburn police Capt. Tom Tennant, and Oregon State Police bomb technician Bill Hakim were killed, and Woodburn Police Chief Scott Russell was critically injured after a bomb exploded at the West Coast branch of Wells Fargo in Woodburn. Customer Service Manager Laurie Ann Perkett was taken, and later released from the hospital after being hit by shrapnel. The explosion happened just before 5:30 p.m. while Hakim and Tennant were trying to open the bomb, which Hakim felt confident was not a bomb. Officers were on the scene investigating a bomb threat called in to the bank at 10:19 a.m., when the explosion occurred. Joshua Turnidge and his father, Bruce Turnidge were charged with the murders.[314]

>> ^Drachen_Jager:
I can foresee a problem if they keep using the same anvils metal fatigue will eventually cause one or both of them to explode sideways sending some bits of shrapnel out.
Other than that it looks like fun!

oooooo...that's a good point. Hahaha, hopefully they make a trip out to the ol' anvil depot once in a while.