Right! Because if there is one thing we know about China, it is that power is not concentrated in the national government. And when it comes to communist governments, you can almost always be certain that there is not an outsized number of civil servants.

Job 4:18-19

If God places no trust in his servants, if he charges his angels with error, How much less in them that dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation is in the dust, which are crushed before the moth?

Satan perfectly obeyed God until he developed a desire to have the worship that God had for himself. How that developed, I don't know, but it isn't a sin to be tempted; it's a sin to act on it, thought or deed. Jesus was tempted in every way, yet without sin.

"Unless a cop kills a black"? Unless a person working for you kills a citizen. Do you really not see the difference between a criminal committing murder and a civil servant paid by your tax money to protect people shooting people? That's why it's political - because these people work for you.

1. Was he filming people's children at a playground? No, he was filming adult public servants in public. Please stop coming up with red herrings that have nothing to do with this situation, it just shows you know you have no leg to stand on with your argument.

2.God damn right I'll protect you if you're attacked for just filming people in a public place. Are you the kind of person who would see someone attacked by a crazed mob and just walk away?! I'm not.
And yes, I'll stand up and support your right to be acting legally and reasonably in a public place, and I'll even put in for your defense fund for a portion of the enormous settlement you'll get from the city.
Now, if you wear a trench coat and nothing else and act like a child molester while you do it, handing out lollypops and asking the kids to accompany you to the men's room, I'll think you're getting attacked for looking/acting like a child molester, not the filming, then you're on your own.

I make reasonable allowances for what I will call a hero, I never made allowances for what's a legal right. I think one need not exercise one's rights in the most disruptive way possible to exorcize them. That said, if the restaurant owner in your scenario doesn't want to kick out open carry people for scaring 'families', that should be their right too, and then they're (the owner and the carrier) both slightly heroic.

In this case, if he's doing nothing illegal, the cops should go do something productive, not get violent because someone is guilty of contempt of cop, which is not a crime. They always say they're understaffed and there's too much crime to deal with, then why are 2 cops wasting so much time on someone legally not answering their questions or producing ID AND NOTHING ELSE WRONG? That seems impractical in the extreme.

There is a HUGE difference between behavior that, while allowed, is bound to scare some people and/or cause panic and behavior that simply annoys a public servant who's abusing their authority in the first place, not actually doing their job. No one can reasonably be afraid for their life of someone that won't answer their questions, nor is it a crime. No crowd has ever run in panic because a mime (or group of mimes) walked into it's midst....maybe in disgust, but not panic.

It is always appropriate, practical, socially accepted, and constructive to your life to tell any officer that you won't answer any question at all (including 'what's your name' if that's legal in your state) without written blanket immunity from the DA, notarized and codified by a judge, for any and all crimes you may have committed or may be committing...and not a word more without a good lawyer present. That's the advice both my father's and brother's high priced lawyers gave me, I'll take it.

You do not HAVE to talk to a police officer. You MAY have to show ID depending on the state, but in most cases you do NOT have to show ID unless you are driving or were recently driving a vehicle. At the time he began walking he was not currently being detained for a crime.

If you follow the video link, you will see there is an abundance of information, including legal statements from the state AG that indicate that the officers had NO LEGAL CAUSE to arrest or detain the person filming and were incorrect in charging him with OoJ.

What happened here is that the cop got pissed that someone was filming him, decided he wanted to toss his weight around a bit, and then got further pissed off when his posturing was ignored. He is a cop, damnit, and people should quake in their boots when he is talking to them.

That is the problem with our police officers today. They have this idea that they are special and should be treated as such, when in reality they are simply public servants, OUR servants. We pay their salary to, thoeretically, protect and serve us. We do not pay them so we can serve them and kneel at their beck and call.

There are still officers out there that believe that way, but they are scared or unwilling to out the majority who do not. Until they do, they are no better in the end. For instance, the SGT who showed up on scene could have said that this was incorrect procedure, apologized, and punished the fucker who started it. But no, gotta stick to the thin blue line and back up the fuckup who got pissed about being filmed. Now they all get in trouble, more respect is lost for police, and the county will likely get sued. All because one guy got pissy about being filmed.

This was his comment about the video.

“Who are the officers?”
Officer Aymee Race (badge #6856), she works for the Utah Transit Authority Police Department. Name and badge number are given in the video because it's in the public interest. The officers in the video are public servants acting unlawfully.

“You brought it on yourself! You wouldn’t have been given a ticket if you would have just politely complied!”
I knew that if I stood up for my rights they were going to give me a ticket (or worse), but $50 is a small price to pay for my dignity. “The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppose.” –Fredrick Douglas

“You set up the video! You went there to harass the cops!”
No. I didn’t. This is my only youtube video, and frankly I wish it had never happened.

“You should never insult police officers! You’re only going to make them mad and get it worse!”
You’re the problem with America. Bootlicking cowards like you make me sick. You all deserve the government you have.

“You should never give an officer your I.D.! “
Utah is one of the few states with a show me your papers law. I had a busy schedule that day and I couldn't afford to be arrested. But thanks for the amateur legal advice.

“You’re grammar is horrible and discredits your point!”
I’m not very computer savvy so I had a cheap Bangladeshi freelancer edit the video through skype. I didn't even take the time to review his work. I didn't notice it had posted and gone viral until months later.

“Did you sign the ticket?”
Yes, with the words “by coercion” written next to my signature. Like I said, $50 is nothing, and I had very important things to do that day, I couldn’t afford to be arrested.

“Is the UTA private property or public property? Why are police working security?”
Both unfortunately. The UTA is a great example of crony-capitalism. It’s a tax payer subsidized private company.

A note from the owner of this channel:

Since this video first went viral I have received many death threats and I’m sure the officers involved have received death threats. I was once a very outspoken anarcho-capitalist, but as time has passed my political views have matured. All I want now is to tend to my business and live my life. All the anti-police violence is not conducive to freedom. Things are getting bad. And it’s only going to get worse. A lot worse. I want nothing to do with it. When the shit hits the fan I'll be watching the U.S. government and the revolutionaries have at it from my laptop on the beach in Tahiti. I'm not going to support changing an evil system for a slightly less evil one (or a worse one). A real revolution is a philosophical one, once a revolution becomes violent it is already lost. And frankly the human race has let me down. I know now that human beings are just not ready for peace. What are human beings fit for other than being ruled? It is what it is. I’m now a social darwinist, I'll support whoever benefits my business and my family. ..and political instability is not beneficial to either one. Anarcho-Capitalists like to compare livestock to people and say that animals (humans) would be able to live free without the farmer (ruling class). Well, I disagree; some species of animals are so stupid, so domesticated, that they would starve without the farmer. And I think that is the case with 99% of the human species. Human beings need government, and they usually get the government they deserve. Don’t get me wrong, I do have empathy for the people being oppressed, but I now understand the ruling class, I see were they’re coming from. Again, I want nothing to do with politics. I’m not a social activist. All I care about is my business and my family. So please leave me alone.

If only the Japanese would get on with making cheap robot servants, the problem of restricting population will be solved. What ever happened to Asimo? It was climbing stairs well over a decade ago, why isn't it changing grandpa's depends yet?

Jesus, is there actually someone at the top of this thread arguing in favor of a public servant using the powers we gave him to get blowjobs from citizens?

Jesus: yes, son there absolutely is. Somebody up there is trying to argue that our police force should be free to use their position of power to get favors from ordinary citizens that they otherwise wouldn't, whether through threats, promises, or lies. As long as the police occasionally do their job, they should be free to abuse our trust the rest of the time.

But Jesus, what is sexual misconduct then, if that isn't it?

Jesus: Fuck if I know, son.

Can't it be both?
I think people use the tools they're given, and if you give people tools of war to do civil servant work, it can't go well.
That said, I agree 100% about the training and oversight part being more important, but something's better than nothing.

Sounds like a lie to me....to paraphrase how I see it going.....

God -Abraham, I now require you to sacrifice your son to me if you are to be granted my favor and receive salvation.
Abraham -Weren't my servants, and flocks, and crops enough, Damn it?
God -You dare question my wishes, do as I say or be damned for eternity.
Abraham -OK, fine...I'll do it.
God -Just kidding, it was only a test and you passed. Sorry for the whole 'destroying your entire life' thing.
Abraham -Great. Thanks loads, god. You're a true friend for not making me destroy the single last thing you had left me in life and only making me believe I had to.

Since he did not HAVE to sacrifice his son, god lied to him, tricked him, and ultimately totally fucked him. When ever I discuss this with religious people, they insist you not look at it from Abraham's viewpoint, and ignore the apparent hatred and distain god showed this pious man. I refuse.

Over here, the union of railroad engineers is currently showcasing what a union was supposed to be doing, and almost the entire establishment is fuming. You just got to love how a proper strike reveals so many of them for what they are: corporatists who couldn't give a shit about workers.

"How can such a small group of people exploit their positions to grind an entire country to a halt? How can they hold us hostage like this?"

Ironically, it's the same people who (partially-)privatised our railroad in the first place. Railroad engineers used to be civil servants, no risks of strikes there.

The press is demonising them, brass from both government parties is demonising them, laws are proposed to practically strip them of their right to go on strike...

All major unions have been in bed with corporations for so long now that people barely remember what it looks like when a union fights for its members. They used to fear union leaders like Otto Brenner (Otto the Great, Iron Otto), now they're playing golf with his successors.

Some system where the wealth of the lowest paid worker was linked to the companies net profit would be nice. If their going to argue that whole "trickle down" thing they can only complain so much when we legally manacle them to their staff!

Or perhaps a national minimum wage based on a fraction of the highest earners.

Or going really crazy perhaps outlaw anything but co-operatives/shared ownership with staff. (that one is probably too complicated and problematic to be practical I fear)

I might suggest a similar system for politicians too i.e. they get paid as much as their poorest citizens, or some sensible fraction of that number. (including private assets to discourage corruption)

Maybe even go the whole hog and make politicians and high ranking civil servants utterly dependant on the state i.e. no significant private property and a state issued lifestyle which matches that of the poorest.

Too Extreme perhaps but if we meet them somewhere in the middle...

The Libertarians and Anarcho-Capitalists would probably go mental, but then how would we tell?

ooooh shit.nice one @ChaosEngine!
since many here have already pointed out some nice perspective and historical context,allow to just add two points to this fine thread:

1.the real question has little to do with race.that is a canard that is shoved down our throats constantly and while many still buy into that bullshit,many of us are waking up to the fact we are having are chains jerked.the problems do not lie with race or culture but rather between the powerful and the powerless.

2.i hate to break to those folks who identify with the term "white" but that term is just a politically manufactured term created in the mid the late 1600's,that term had never been used before...ever.the term was politically created to manipulate poor european indentured servants to identify more with their much more privileged and wealthy european plantation owners,in order to dominate and control a growing african slave population.

thats a lil tidbit they tended to leave out in american history but without it the civil war doesnt make a whole lot of sense.

i mean think about it:we were taught that the civil war was basically about states rights.
yes..the states right to have and keep slaves and continue into the newly appropriated land (actual STOLEN,from mexico).

so how do you get a poor,penniless white person to go fight a war so their wealthy counterparts can keep their slaves?which would directly affect their employment options and henceforth keep them jobless and penniless.

you convince them the color of their skin is what matters most!
a political ploy that worked brilliantly.

I'm curious, you say you have used force, but not these kinds of force. What kind of force have you used? What I see left (of the obvious) is wrestled with, kicked, and/or tazed, but that doesn't mean you have or have not done these or other forceful acts.
My point about counseling is if cops use force it was either necessary (because they or others were in immediate danger) and they should receive counseling so they don't start thinking all people are dangerous criminals that should be treated as such, or it was not necessary and they should receive counseling because they're a bully and/or coward with deadly weapons and a danger to all of us. Either way, counseling seems appropriate for each and every time 'force' is used. (The same should go for security of any kind, but they aren't public servants so I have less standing or reason to complain about them.) I know that's asking a lot, but it seems proper, reasonable, and healthier for all.