What?

Nice you FINALLY have come around to the fact that Biden won not only the election but also the electoral college and the presidency....but things are far from fine thanks to the inconceivable incompetence from the last administration.

The Trump pandemic, thanks to zero leadership and seeming intentional sabotage by the outgoing administration, is the worst it’s ever been, things aren’t fine. It is the absolute wrong time to “open up and go about your business “. That’s simply asinine. It’s time to enforce stay at home orders and public masking, social distancing, etc by arresting and putting anti maskers and idiots who won’t social distance in prison. Put them in the Maricopa tent prison, feed them green bologna. Sorry, the prison hospital is full, just don’t be sick. That methodology worked in other countries, maybe because their government didn’t support and encourage anti maskers, anti social distancers, COVID deniers, didn’t give up on control in favor of disasterous herd immunity (except Sweden who abandoned it), nor did they encourage the civil unrest, attacks on government officials, super spreader events, refusal of all public health orders, and denial of the virus.

Nice that you’ve FINALLY come around to the truth that the Trump pandemic is real, not a hoax, not a mild flu. It only took nearly 500000 dead Americans to convince you. Of course, you’ll never admit you were wrong no matter how many are dead because of those mistaken beliefs.

This is a nationwide issue, not a state issue. The federal government needs to divert funds, manpower, facilities, ppe, equipment, logistics, vaccines, testing, and training. Operation warp speed failed on every count.

Since not getting treatment is a national public health issue as well as a personal issue, it is a federal issue. Poor people not getting testing or treatment spreads disease to everyone, not just to more poor people you don’t care about. This means yes, the fed should pay for medical treatment as a public health expense, especially since this public health disaster was exacerbated if not caused by the total failure of the federal government to act. Korea was infected the same day, they barely had an issue compared to the US.

Because you simply can’t get a funeral nationwide, and have no choice but to use the few facilities that will accept a body no matter the cost or service, and because this is a federal health emergency, this is a federal issue.

States have been BEGGING for this assistance and more for almost a full year now, your implication that states just need to ask for help is a proven falsehood. The federal government under Trump actually worked against states procuring their own supplies while telling them to procure their own supplies. Repeatedly, when states found the supplies they needed, the federal government would confiscate them, then hand the supplies over to private businesses to resell them to the states to the point that states stopped telling the fed they had found supplies and shipped them in secret to avoid having them stolen. We can only hope Biden has dismantled that ridiculous system the Trump administration set up.

I don't think that word means what you think it does. It does not mean "trumpster", they are NOT conservative.

No, today's "conservatives" are not people of law, respect, or respect for the law. That's a lie you tell when the law is on your side and discard the instant it isn't. Conservatives only respect the law when it's on their side, and disrespectfully ignore it whenever it isn't. Let's talk mask mandates just to start. "Conservatives" are all for the right to refuse service over sexuality, political affiliation, and privately race, but when it's the right to refuse service to dangerous morons that refuse to follow public health guidelines suddenly refusing service is violating their rights and warrants violent outbursts, up to and including kidnapping a governor....Those aren't liberal Karen's throwing violent tantrums, they're Trump's "good people" and he loves them....your conservative heroes.

"Conservatives" just attacked the government of the United States with bombs, fire bombs, guns, tasers, hand ties, and a hanging noose set up. To do this, they murdered one officer and injured 60 more. Hardly respecting the law. Pretty much the opposite of patriotic.

In the last 4 years, every single instance of domestic terrorism was perpetrated by "conservatives". Every attempted assassination. Every cowardly mail bomb. Almost every death threat against representatives, including right wing representatives that simply weren't in close enough lock step with Trumpler.

Lol...try feeding your patients, they won't get so thin.

The rest of us, +- 4/5 of the country, have had our patience worn thin by the hypocritical infantilism from the right, led by the biggest spoiled rotten baby to ever hold office (but never win an election). He is the absolute best at getting impeached....congratulations.

"Conservatives" demean, debase, lie, cheat, bully, and even commit treasonous terrorism to get their way, and turn on anything and everyone who doesn't go along....like how they just turned on the USA because it elected the other guy.

Now, after 4 years of legislating unilaterally with absolutely zero interest in bipartisanship, not even including Democrats in discussions over legislation much less letting them have a say in them, they suddenly want nothing less now that they aren't in power. Fuck you bitches, bitch, whine, moan, and cry me a river. Better not fight, though, you don't know how to do it legally, and can't control the majority that want war with America....and you fuctards kill more of yourselves than your enemies when you fight.

I'M CALLING FOR A TOTAL TRAVEL BAN ON "CONSERVATIVES" and a moratorium against hiring them for any government job until we can figure out what the hell is going on.

Bob, don't use words you don't know, like ilk. You invariably use them wrong and just look foolish and uneducated. Just because it's a small word doesn't mean it's for you or your ilk.

Never heard a more spoiled two year old sounding statement in my life. It boils down to 'If we can't get what we want all the time, we're burning down the country....because we love it and are the only real patriots. ' Disgusting self centered stupid bratty babies you are. You're like abusive spouses that, now that the divorce is nearly final, are planning the kidnapping, rape, and murder of your loved one and children because you and no one else loves them, so no one else will have them....and you think you're the sane ones.

If WE keep pushing!? After 4 years of your non stop shoving party you're suddenly against it?! Eat a bag of baby dicks and send me a review.

Bring the fight, pussy, and enjoy gitmo if you survive. You babies aren't the only ones who can shoot, and the rest of us have the law, the international community, patriotism, police, and army on our side. You have the Q Shaman, Putin, some fired bad cops, and actual crackheads (like advisor to trump, Mr my pillow).

By that assessment, every drug dealer, thief, and Nigerian prince should have the same right to “protest” by physically trapping police in their place and blocking traffic without repercussions.
He could not legally be open, so he was being a criminal to get the money to pay these people and bills, just like a heroin dealer.
He was being stopped from breaking the law and causing a deadly public health hazard. His reaction, break more laws and fight police. My question is, why didn’t they throw him to the ground when he refused to comply and argued and then taze or shoot him when he resisted? Sadly, I only see one reason, he’s a white guy. I think if he were black 1. Bob would no longer see this as a hero standing up for his rights but a thug flaunting the law and “fighting” police and 2. The police would react quite differently.

agreed.

I would add that science/doctors have been pushed out by the administration from day one, to the point that they use it to attack biden ("he's going to listen to the scientists!")

also, the inconsistency he is referring to for example in restaurants and flights, is entirely driven by economics, not science. Those are two of the hardest hit industries worldwide, you have a president who has made it clear he prioritises business over public health, of course they made some theatrical protocol to make it seem safer when really, its not.
(same in my country, and having a bakery myself have had to do the same stupid dance).

Pointing at the survival of christie, trump or any other celebrity, no matter how overweight, old or whatever, is not analogous to the experience of normal people who cant afford that level of treatment, most wouldnt have access to it even if they could afford it. not to mention that we dont even really know long term effects for survivors, including importantly how long the immune response lasts.

That whole segment just came off as the typical selfish "i dont think this will kill me, lets get back to normal" BS. Weve known for a long time now that what makes coronavirus dangerous isnt its mortality rate, its the combination of a long asymptomatic incubation period and airbone transmission that make it highly contagious, when hospitals collapse the mortality rate spikes.

I actually agree that we have to learn to live with this because i dont think a vaccine is nowhere near close to ready for global deployment, but i thought his arguments were terrible and his focus selfish.

***finally anecdotal experience here in Chile, 3 friends have gotten covid-
44 year old, former national team field hockey, good shape
41 year old, former point guard national team basketball, good shape
38 year old, professional poker player, overweight bordering on obese.

the 44 year old was in the hospital for 12 days, no ventilator, felt aches and pains for a solid month after going home
the 41 year old was in the hospital for 28 days, ventilator (and the induced coma that comes with it), still feels physically drained
the 38 year old had a fever for 3 days and never went to the hospital, is feeling fine

Between different strains and different body/blood types, comparing one case to another doesnt seem to work

Every trump chump rally has been a super spreader event.

According to public health officials in five different cities in three different States, Donald Trump's rallies have in fact been super spreader events for COVID-19 and the health officials looked at the hospitalization rates in their areas, the number of people hospitalized with COVID-19, the number of new COVID-19 cases and through contact tracing, were able to determine that these were people who attended Trump's rally or have been in close contact with people who attended Trump's rallies.
These were two in Pennsylvania, two in Minnesota, and one in Wisconsin. These took place several weeks ago, kind of before the really big rally blitz that he has been on the past 10 days.

He may singlehandedly be responsible for the second wave that's starting, Friday was the worst day for infections and hospitalization, Saturday was the second worst. You morons are killing yourselves off for Trump, and those that can get into a hospital and survive the ICU have an average $80000 bill, not including those that require lifelong care from brain damage or lung failures.

I hope Biden makes owning a maga hat the one pre existing condition that invalidates covid coverage, and insurance companies deny you all.

A leader calms the nation AS THEY LEAD, they calm by explaining the problem and outlining the solution, not by saying nothing's wrong, the virus is a hoax, take no precautions, don't wear masks, go back to work, come to my rally, do everything the worst way possible for public health so hundreds of thousands die, just don't be scared....it's ok to die.

Other nations were honest, treated citizens like adults, and solved their pandemic issues. Trump wasn't, Trump didn't, we have 4% of the world's population and 25% of covid deaths and rising fast. His non plan to pretend nothing's wrong cost 180000 lives SO FAR, and estimated to more than double by Xmas.
Trump called for Obama's resignation because two Americans got Ebola.

Does the nation seem calm? Does it seem United? Does it even seem led? Fuck, the delusion, bob, you're so spun you say insanity like there's no racism in America and Democrats are the racists.

Cranial rectosis is real, Bob. Get checked.

So stupid, Bob, it's not fake just because you aren't outraged your president lied to you and made you a liar along with him. So much for your nothing burger, everything he told you about Covid was bullshit, just like I told you then, and you're mad at me for saying so, not him for lying and killing 180000 Americans by misleading them into deadly behavior.

Trump's covid "response", Trump's economy, Trump's unemployment numbers, Trump's (total lack of a) plan, his new idea is (probably unconstitutionally) offer 1/2 the relief needed contingent on bankrupt states coming up with another 1/6 from thin air....a plan blatantly designed to fail, but Trump will claim he tried and states just didn't want the money because they hate Trump and want to make him look bad. 🤦‍♂️

So yes, it's Trump's fault people don't have money to pay their bills nor any way to earn it. Leaders in other countries infected at the exact same time as the U.S. actually led and S Korea and New Zealand never had the issues we did and didn't have to lock down long at all. We had leadership that actively made things worse, not better, spread misinformation constantly, contradicted itself daily, and insanely conflated ignoring and denying public health emergencies with freedom and civil rights.

Longer than necessary? What states have met the required two weeks of consistent low numbers and a solid declining infection rate that even Trump says are the minimum guidelines for opening?

Buddy, you've never read the constitution, and wouldn't comprehend it if you did. You probably think Trump suspending payroll taxes is constitutional because he's the one trying it.

Yes, 3-5% death rate with up to 15% disabled for life is definitely worth closing businesses and keeping them closed.....unless morons like Trumpsters continue to ignore the recommendations and extend the shutdown indefinitely.

Precondition groups? You mean anyone with a pre-existing condition which makes them more susceptible? You're implying those without preexisting conditions are safe, utter bullshit. They aren't. BTW, obesity is a preexisting condition that covers >40% of America all by itself, being overweight covers >70%....and it's just one of dozens.

Can't go to work if it's closed. Can't safely reopen until infection rates decline, rates won't decline until morons stay home long enough without attending rallies and parties. Duh. After Sturgis, expect the second wave nationwide in two weeks extending shutdowns for months at least, fucking morons.

Gov cheese ran out now because Republicans want billions-trillions in unrelated payoffs, pork, pet projects, and tax cuts to consider continuing them, after grifting billions from the last, totally unregulated handout to businesses,... your brother is coming to live with you soon. If everyone got the extra unemployment and every business shut down and people stayed home, we could be like S Korea, but with Trump's (total lack of) leadership we have become a worldwide pariah, unwelcome around the world, and with 4% of the population we have 25% of infections and deaths and rising.
You said you work largely from home. We're you lying then, or are you being intentionally dishonest, misleading people now by hiding it?

If you say all lives matter in response to black lives matter, you're a racist blinding yourself to the truth that in many ways black lives don't seem to matter to authority. It's like sitting at a big table where everyone but you gets served dinner, and when you mention that your dinner matters you get answered with an angry "all dinners matter" but no food.

You can't commit crimes, dumbass. How moronic are you?

You can't (edit: or shouldn't, I guess you still can in most places) go to church because Covid is real, not a fake virus as some morons insist. I wish these deniers would sign a petition denouncing and refusing any medical treatment for covid related issues, then go party with each other making sure to shake hands and kiss each other ceaselessly. Put your health where your mouth is...or don't you believe the dangerous bullshit you spout?

Peaceful protesters don't carry bricks, those are Boogaloo boys looking to start riots. Peaceful protests at capitals protesting masks and shutdowns aren't what happened, heavily armed violent takeovers of federal buildings to denounce public health measures and threaten public officials with lynchings and mob murders is what happened....but with no feds sent in after them like was done preemptively in Portland.

Protests in the streets by mask wearing, social distancing people is not a major risk factor, indoor Trump rallies without masks or social distancing ARE a major risk factor, and sparked outbreaks.

So much nonsense and ignorance in such an annoying package is almost impressive.

The choice, ignore all health professional advice and gather in large close groups without any social distancing during an accelerating deadly pandemic or lose all federal funding to your already criminally underfunded school system.

There is no carrot, just stick.

This type of blackmail or extortion has never been done to schools in this all or nothing way to force parents and children to ignore life and death public health issues for imagined political points.

Let's not forget his executive order due this morning, drafts of which now released show him contradicting the first amendment to the constitution and directing the FBI, FTC, FCC, and DOJ to harass, punish, fine, and censor private businesses if they fact check HIS lies on their private platforms in any way....or apparently if the Whitehouse makes any complaints about them...and directed all federal agencies to not advertise on any platform the Whitehouse deems "unfair" (so soon the government will only advertise on OAN).

Where are the right wing 2a nutjobs now? They often claim the 2a exists to protect the other amendments...get to it people. If you don't go armed to the Whitehouse to protest this direct violation and decimation of the constitution, you are admitting that argument is bullshit and so is the 2a. You people went armed to state government buildings to forcefully protest public health orders because you were told they might violate your rights somehow. This time there's no "might" about it, Trump declared an executive order that is a direct, blatant, undeniable violation and attack on the constitution so clear even you can see it without Glen Beck telling you it is one.

Nope.
Trump denied there was any danger from the beginning, no significant or hazardous infection in America, and insisted it would miraculously disappear by April. Last week he suggested ending stay at home orders next weekend! Batshit crazy and criminally ignorant at best, intentional attempted mass homicide at worst.

Trump didn't stop flights from China, airlines did. Trump restricted travel for non citizens (except family of citizens) coming from China Jan 31, well after most flights were cancelled, and only when faced with the uniform recommendation of the career public health officials at HHS.

What preparations? They seemed to start those last week, not in February, and certainly not before. Most temporary hospitals are still in the planning stage, not built or stocked, and completely unstaffed. Stockpiles were not full or being filled. It seems they weren't even making plans, just denials.

The racist part was Trump and his subordinates calling it the Chinese flu and Kung Flu.

The loudest and latest one saying it was like any flu and not a problem was Trump, here's a clip of that from less than one month ago, try again.

https://youtu.be/xcDq1jUAuI4

Trump should not have dismantled the systems in place that made us more prepared, nor should he have underfunded and defunded the health programs and organizations so vital right now, nor should he have ignored the impacts other countries were suffering and, instead of preparing, downplayed the unfolding crisis while dragging his feet on any responses, or refused WHO tests that worked in S Korea in favor of nonexistent American tests that at first didn't work at all, couldn't be mass produced so are STILL in short supply, and now seem to give false negatives 1/3 of the time because the manufacturer donated $1.5 million, but he did.

China lied and minimized (sounds familiar) until mid January, yes, but Trump dismantled the CDC Pandemic Preparedness program that was designed to protect us from exactly that likelihood...that is their M. O.. Remember, the whistle blower went public in mid December, but Trump and co. ignored it, accepting China's obvious lies. The CDCPPP could not only have verified his claims, but could have sounded the alarm earlier. (Think Brad Pitt in WWZ)

Trump calls the Chinese liars and thieves, then bases his policies on what they tell him with no method or effort to confirm it, then denies any responsibility?! Trump STILL called it the flu less than 1 month ago. Who is he blaming for hiding the truth from him until then?

Check you state

https://covidactnow.org

to check the date of point of no return of overrunning you local hospitals

CovidActNow.org was created by a team of data scientists, engineers, and designers in partnership with epidemiologists, public health officials, and political leaders to help understand how the COVID-19 pandemic will affect their region.

This tool is built to enable political leaders to quickly make decisions in their Coronavirus response informed by best available data and modeling.

We built this tool to answer critically important questions such as:

What will the impact be in my region be and when can I expect it?
How long until my hospital system is under severe pressure?

Yes, they have lower rates. But the point isn't that the rates are the same (they're not), the point is that the rates are low enough to not have an immediate fear of them. An immediate fear would be unwarranted and irrational.

E.g. you probably don't fear dying every time you hop into a vehicle because it has a relatively low risk of killing you (even though the risk is much higher than that of being killed in a homicide by firearm). Having an immediate fear of it would be irrational.

You probably don't fear dying in a general accident (i.e. including all work place and public accidents together). Even though it represents about 170,000 deaths a year (an number so large it makes the topic of firearms deaths look like a joke), it is still a relatively low risk. Having an immediate fear of it would be irrational.

This is not to suggest that these things are not to be respected. We must try and reduce all mortality and morbidity. But you need to be effective at it. This is public health. You choose the method that will have the largest effect.

For example, you will have a bigger effect restricting sugar intake to reduce diabetes deaths, which outnumber homicide by firearm deaths by about an order of magnitude.

The majority of the 40k firearm deaths consist of suicides. There is an important distinction between homicide (the topic) and suicide. Don't mix them up if the topic is homicide by firearm.

Go look at what is actually killing people:

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr68/nvsr68_06-508.pdf

Thanks for the good questions.

a) yes
b) yes
c) no
d) yes
e) n/a

If you exclude suicide, the USA doesn't have a staggering rate of gun deaths. It is high compared to some other western countries, but on a world rate it is still very low.

When looking at public health (which is the reason for reducing gun violence) you need to be pragmatic. What will actually give a good outcome for public health? In this case there are about a half a dozen things that kill and maim US citizens at much higher rates than firearms do.

E.g. you are much more likely to be killed in a car crash than murdered by someone with a firearm. Cars by accident kill more people in the USA each year than firearms do on purpose. That's some scary shit right there. Think about that for a second, cars are more dangerous than firearms and people are not even trying to kill themselves or someone else with one. So as an example, you'd be better off trying to fix this first.

Or fix the suicide rate in the US. People aren't in a happy place there.

Obesity kills more people. Doctor malpractice kills more people. Etc. But these are hard issues to tackle that will cost billions or trillions. The low hanging fruit is firearms.

Free health care and mental health care, a better social security system, and various other means would all have magnificent outcomes on everyday life in the USA. But again, they cost a lot and require a paradigm shift.

Have you ever encountered interpersonal violence against you (i.e. had someone attack you)? Or have you maybe worked in a job where you often come into contact with people who have been attacked? I find people change their mind after they realize that they were only ever one wrong turn away from some crazy bastard who wanted to hurt them badly.

Machine guns are firearms. You can buy pre 1986 machine guns in the USA (I'm not sure what form you have to fill out). The 1986 cutoff is fairly pointless.

I don't consider bazookas, grenades, mortars, etc. firearms. To me a firearm is essentially a rifle that fires cartridges. But if the US government considers them as firearms then that is what they are for legislative purposes.

I believe there is case law regarding what scope of arms they were referring to in the 2A and the result was any common firearm. This currently includes almost all pistols and rifles, both automatic and semi-automatic (with the exception being automatic guns must have been made before 1986 - I believe this limit should be removed).

I'm very much against restricting semi-automatic rifles. There are no good reasons for restricting them. It is unconstitutional. They are not the "weapon of choice" for mass shootings, pistols are. The lethality of them in mass shootings is the same as that of pistols (someone ran an analysis just recently). This last point surprised me a little.

https://www.reddit.com/r/gunpolitics/comments/d7ypcv/no_mass_shootings_carried_out_with_semiautomatic/

I'm for background checks (i.e. for second hand sales which are the only sales left without a background check) as long as the service is cheap and no records are kept (i.e. it isn't used to create a de-facto registration database).

Public health wise, talking about firearms is a red herring. If I were to drop a bucket load of money into stuff in the USA it would be into making health care and mental health care cheap and available and reducing poverty. This would have more affect on mortality and morbidity rates then any gun legislation will. And yes, I would give fully subsidized health care to the poor.

By now you should be asking yourself what planet someone comes from where they support the 2A and free health care at the same time.