Any time you can ignore court orders and be fined nearly $40k a day in fines for 6 years with no jail time or even escalations in fines you have proven the controlling agency has no real authority.
Guaranteed there’s more to this than she’s saying, and a reason it was illegal to move the waterway…like this “ditch” was really a natural stream and he destroyed “messy” wetlands and the stream habitat and maybe an endangered species because he didn’t like them.

Edit- Close…he dug a pond on a stream going through his property without federal permits (he got local permits but those don’t cover waterways), dumping the spoils where they would get washed downstream. He refused to talk to the EPA or mitigate the stream contamination and just ignored them and ignored the courts for years, and racked up huge fines…which were waived in the end and he was forced to plant trees to stop erosion and temporarily fence it off to keep his livestock away from his stock pond (making it useless).

In the end this is a story of wishywashy government UNDERREACH @bobknight33, not tyrannical government overreach…it’s an obstinate asshole getting away with blatantly and intentionally ignoring the law and the courts and his downstream neighbors and a government agency that let him do it with no real repercussions. What was your point? That Republicans thumb their noses at laws and order? 😂

You certainly drank the RWNJ Kool-Aid didn't you. What a lame excuse for a human being you are. I'm certainly glad your kind are an endangered species these days....

So these dickholes are throwing fireballs down an entrance to a beautiful natural wonder home to several endangered species of bats. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellhole

Someone should drop these redneck fucks down there.

Special for the kid.. not so much for the gorilla who gets to spend the next 35 years locked in a 20x20 ft. room with nothing to do but watch the humans and wait for that next meal that consists of.. salad.

I get it, zoo's do good zoological work, they protect endangered species and (usually) do all they can to make that 35 year stay in a 20 ft. square room something more than the prison that it is.

A latex balloon bio-degrades about as fast as an oak leaf. A birds' most-likely smart enough not to swallow one whole.
No lady, you are passionately mistaken. It takes less time for the latex to degrade in salt water the temperature being a non-issue. Admittedly though, it's a waste of helium and a balloon for the sake of video game software and it might choke a few seagulls, none of which will be missed, as San Fran has seen such an explosive rise in their numbers since being placed on the over-protected list, that they are encroaching on the habitats of less fortunate and more endangered species.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/31/san-francisco-seagulls_n_3672793.html

Fucking Californians. Heads-shoved-up-one's-own-ass-disorder seems to flourish there like barnacles on a ship's hull.

That's the point. The zoo gave a rat's ass.

They didn't want it to end up in a circus.
They didn't want it used in a breeding program.
They didn't want to take up valuable space that could have been used for another more genetically useful giraffe.

Yeah, it seems cold and calculating, but there are reasons behind the decision.

What I'm unclear about is why we need giraffes in zoos in the first place. They're not an endangered species, so I don't see the need for a breeding program.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-26118748

"Joerg Jebram, who oversees the European endangered species programme for giraffes, told the AP news agency: "Zoos could design new giraffe facilities, but many don't have that option.

"A young bull could theoretically be sent to an all-female group as stud, but experts prefer a larger, more mature male for that, and Marius didn't fit that bill.

"A final option is sending the giraffe to a zoo that doesn't participate in the EAZA-led breeding programme, but that could leave the giraffe or its offspring being sold into worse circumstances, such as those of a circus or private collection."

Copenhagen Zoo had turned down offers from at least two other zoos to take Marius and an offer from a private individual who wanted to buy the giraffe for 500,000 euros ($680,000).

Bengt Holst, Copenhagen Zoo's scientific director, said it had turned down an offer from Yorkshire Wildlife Park in the UK, which is a member of EAZA, because Marius' older brother lives there and the park's space could be better used by a "genetically more valuable giraffe"."

So yah. Who knew that the guys who made caring for animals their like, profession and stuff might actually have some like, reasons. and stuff. I know, I know, it doesn't make as great a headline as "Zoo murders and mutilates innocent giraffe in front of children. also aidsrape."

>> ^deathcow:

shoulda speared that big boy


Pretty sure this is a Goliath Grouper, which is a critically endangered species.

Zoos for breeding endangered species are, generally, acceptable. But zoos for people to stare at trapped animals is unnecessary and cruel. Zoos make many animals psychotic and, like birds in cages, I hate them.

Braken Bat Cave Meshweaver (Cicurina venii)
http://ecos.fws.gov/speciesProfile/profile/speciesProfile.action?spcode=J01D

To find a Braken Bat Cave meshweaver was a discovery of another kind altogether, akin to “stumbling on a new Galapagos Island in terms of the biological significance of the region,” said biologist Jean Krejca, Zara's president.

After the spider was collected in a bottle, it was dissected for it to be identified, Krejca said. Collecting and killing an endangered species is allowed for that purpose if done by someone with a federal permit. No other spiders have been spotted in the hole where the one was found.

Read more: http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/article/Tiny-spider-is-a-big-roadblock-3849198.php#ixzz26qYn1CWL

oh my gosh... the mighty lion. unleash 10000 on north america and they'd eat all the dumb people.


There is a very good reason the lion is an endangered species and humans populate every square inch of habitable land on this planet. Cats - 0, Humans - 1.

>> ^VoodooV:

gee, shiny resorts to harassment? color me shocked!
I'm sorry, but ill say it again, people like shiny need to be kicked out of here. It has nothing to do with conservatism or religion, these people simply don't contribute to civil discourse. I know plenty of conservative/religious people who are capable of engaging in civil debate and discourse, Shiny or QM, and others aren't among these people
They drop their talking points and move on to the next sift. That's not debate, that's not discourse. And you certainly can't have rational discussions with someone who no matter what, thinks you need to be saved and doesn't view you as an equal human being and him and his god are always correct and you're always wrong. It's not conducive to rational discussion and quite frankly, it's simply not healthy, period.
And yes, it is trolling.
Remember that even though they seem to be an endangered species, there are actual rational right wingers out there. You may disagree with them, but they can actually debate civilly without regurgitating Fox News or Theistic propaganda.


This is such an old response and thread, but I thought I'd say it anyway as I really want it said in here.

I've met, actually, a great many people that are very set in their theistic mindset, but like you said they also don't think I'm going to burn in a pit of fire come the end of time; in fact quite a few of them would be morally outraged if such a thing occurred--as they literally know, like me, that the difference between believing in God and not, is merely a thought away (or you could say, one neuron connection/pathway away).

There are a few that believe in fire and brimstone type things, but they only--typically--reserve it for the greatest of crimes (like an Adolf Hitler or Pol Pot). Even fewer still that believe that there is a harsh judgment remaining for a lot of people, but they tend to believe that there is a way to "return" or to repent there--in the "lake of fire" and come back a new person.

BUT, the ones that think there IS a hell, absolute and horrifying in all it's glory, these are ALSO the very same people that cannot have a rational discussion with you. It's very strange. It's as though their ability to actively decide whether actions in play are moral or not are by definition an unanswerable question until they have been told by someone ELSE what that answer is: either the Bible, other religious members, or talk show hosts, and you get my picture. THESE are the dangerous people.

It reminds me of the story in the Old Testament, in Numbers 15:32-36 (for those that wish to read it). Now I know many *newer* religions, get around this stuff by saying they use the New Testament (it has it's fun stuff too, but for now, let's just do this one) due to Christ's Salvation and his, yada yada yada yada yada--I heard this for a long time myself as a Mormon and in some Catholic services I went to.

This guy collects what is essentially firewood on the Sabbath (this was back in the day when not having a fire active in your house/hut/tent/whatever at night could literally mean death--in case you've never been out camping/hiking, fires are VERY important and are a DAMNED LUXURY with our matches, steel wool, sleeping bags made to hold in heat, and other items that make a night in the wilderness go by--gently and one could say comfortably fun).

Instead of just collecting this firewood, making a meal and going to bed, this guy gets caught for working on the Sabbath and is taken to Moses and Aaron. So we all know what that little commandment this is, the one EVERYONE disobeys now (It goes by either of these two definitions and there are more versions--trust me: Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. -OR- Keep the sabbath day to sanctify it, as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee.). So God buzzes Moses on the iGodphone™ and tells Moses the bad news, or well the good news and the bad news. The bad news is that "unnamed villager" will be taken outside the encampment, with what sounds like most of the people and then stoned to death. The good news, is they get to stone someone (sorry, but back then and with the regularity of which stoning happened I really think people enjoyed it when these edicts came on down...)!

SO, I've seen this tale said many a time and I CANNOT believe the amount of heads I see move up and down while this is repeated. They LITERALLY agree with cold-blooded murder in the first-degree, for GATHERING FIREWOOD!!! In the damned ages BEFORE the Dark Ages-life SUCKED! You NEEDED FIRE!!! It wasn't a question of maybe I'll skip it tonight it was a matter of when do I start it up--every night! So you can see why people like this can be dangerous as someone from on high that they think is their leader gives them what essentially is a crime, they don't think to long about it--they act, and carry out whatever truly horrifying act it was.

This has been abused by many Cult leaders, like the "Alien Comet riders" or also known as Heaven's Gate in California or something even MORE horrifying like Jonestown (something that was horrific--there are some GREAT documentaries on this to watch,; I suggest looking for them) or something semi-recent like (straight from wiki), "The 778 deaths of members of the Ugandan group Movement for the Restoration of the Ten Commandments of God, on March 17, 2000, is considered to be a mass murder and suicide orchestrated by leaders of the group.", so you can see while large religions don't do these WILD events they DO slowly in fact do smaller and incrementally increase their crimes.

You might ask what crimes, but it is literally crimes that we can point to that are AGAINST the VERY FABRIC of your own teachings. Use the Golden Rule in your life and get rid of the authority driven craziness, it will only lead you to sadness, if you're a zealot--fight it within yourself.
--------

So, anyway, what I'm saying is that I very much agree that there ARE many people that are theistic believers (not just Christan ones mind you) that are GREAT to talk to and many times you don't even have to argue with them you can have laid back conversations with them--it's amazing who you run into.

BUT, for the people I mentioned they are nearly lost causes. I don't know exactly what their problem is but it does have something to do with the fact that they MUST be told a "truth" by a "high-ranking-official" for them to change a stance. They are TRUE believers, ZEALOTS to their cause and dangerous.

A little bit the same as you said @VoodooV, but I thought I'd add a few more nails into that coffin.

gee, shiny resorts to harassment? color me shocked!

I'm sorry, but ill say it again, people like shiny need to be kicked out of here. It has nothing to do with conservatism or religion, these people simply don't contribute to civil discourse. I know plenty of conservative/religious people who are capable of engaging in civil debate and discourse, Shiny or QM, and others aren't among these people

They drop their talking points and move on to the next sift. That's not debate, that's not discourse. And you certainly can't have rational discussions with someone who no matter what, thinks you need to be saved and doesn't view you as an equal human being and him and his god are always correct and you're always wrong. It's not conducive to rational discussion and quite frankly, it's simply not healthy, period.

And yes, it is trolling.

Remember that even though they seem to be an endangered species, there are actual rational right wingers out there. You may disagree with them, but they can actually debate civilly without regurgitating Fox News or Theistic propaganda.

Why even Ron Paul?

Sure I agree with him on foreign policy and social issues, but everything else he's a complete lunatic and/or amoral.

What's that? I knowingly sold you something that was harmful? too fucking bad.

For a long time I thought if I had to vote for a Republican, I could vote for him. I can't say that anymore. They're *all* lunatics this year.

There was once a time I could have supported McCain, but you certainly couldn't say that during the 2008 election. They're all doubling down on crazy. Moderate Republicans are an endangered species. It's like they honestly didn't learn their lesson with Palin and it's like they're intentionally trying to lose. Buddy Roemer was amazing on Bill Maher a few weeks ago but even he has given up on trying to steer the Republicans more moderate.

Fuck this two party system...may it burn in hell.

>> ^nock:

Aren't these things protected by the Marine Mammal and Endangered Species Acts? Pretty sure you aren't supposed to get within a certain radius. I'm also pretty sure he's within that radius.


I don't know the specific law in the US, but in other countries the rule has been that you are not allowed approach the animal, but once it approaches you, you're fine.