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Tim Harford: What Prison Camps Can Teach You About Economy

Trancecoach says...

Haha!

If everyone's a babysitter, well, that's not a genuine division of labor, is it? And if money can only buy babysitting, well, that's not really money, is it?

And free markets don't work by agreeing through contract how much a currency will buy. If you restrict currency to one "babysitting" unit only, then, of course you'll have problems. You don't need to "print" more of these tokens. Deflation will invariably take place instead in an actual market, not in one where you have to contractually "centrally control" the value of each token.

And of course, a prison camp is not a free market. No entrepreneur can simply start supplying the goods and services needed.

The prison camp does not represent a "free economy," but only a prison camp economy.

I don't think either of those two examples are useful in any real way, but what exactly did you think you'd learn from them?

This isn't "how an economy works," but it's maybe how a non-divisible "currency" works in a one product/service "market;" or how a food embargo works.

P.S. If you really want to understand how economies work, you should read Mises' "Human Action" (PDF) and stop being lazy, thinking you'll learn something from these short youtube videos. (Once you hear Krugman mentioned, it's enough to know that everything that follows is about as rooted in reality as a kindergartner's fingerpaintings.)

This video's always worth revisiting...

enoch said:

sometimes the best explanations are the most simple.
that was excellent.

If this is American teacher education, we're all doomed...

newtboy says...

Once again, the neocon answer is dismissiveness and insult, with no logic, reason, or facts.
You certainly don't have me pegged, sir. I'm not a dumb kid of today, nor did I spend much time in public schooling. 1290, 3.5, 138 and graduated...sorry to disappoint or confuse.
Your comprehension of my position is appallingly incorrect, and knee jerkingly insulting to boot.
I have both been taught, and learned from experience, that capitalism is not the best answer to every problem, nor is liberalism (not that they are opposites or related). Neither is evil or good, those are things only people can be. Neither is a panacea.
Educators want nothing of the sort...you are describing baby sitters.
Wow, amazing that you aren't chanting "We're #1" like most neocons mindlessly do. I'll give you props for that little victory. I agree, our position is sad, more so when you consider the cost we pay for that result, and the costs we will pay because of it.
I do think you are (redacted) wrong that any TEACHERS want this kind of mind numbing chanting or dumbing down of their students...I do agree there aren't enough teachers teaching, and too many babysitters in their place. I also think this is due, in large part, to the lack of respect and compensation available to a public school teacher....you've already shown the former quite clearly, and your political affiliates have seen to the latter.
You seem to have convinced yourself that, since I don't go along with your narrow train of thought, that I'm all for, and 100% behind the current education system, I never even hinted at that straw man arguement. What I did say is that capitalist business always does the least work possible to get the most pay out, and that's not what we want for our tax dollars, especially not our education system. As was said before, this particular flaw is an issue caused by for-profit privatization with not enough regulation, which if it must be politicized is a right wing baby.

bobknight33 said:

The American Government education system is an anti education system.
Kids today get a less quality education than before.

I don't mind these dumb kids today because it means added job security. You are too dumb to know better. Someone needs to serve me lunch and sweep my floors.

You must be one of them. You were taught and firmly believe that Liberalism is good and capitalism is evil and must be destroyed. The fact of the matter is the exact opposite, Liberalism is evil.



And yes educators do want this dumbing down of students. They have been doing this for years. Finally the education is controlled by union controlled liberals. They have been in control for decades. We are not #1 or 8th, we are down in the middle of the pack down at 20. For all the money we spend per child and to be in 20th place.

http://www.breitbart.com/InstaBlog/2013/11/15/Mom-Furious-After-Son-Makes-Honor-Roll-With-C-s-and-D-s

http://worldtop20.org/

Another Top 10 Most Paused Movie Moments (Mature)

GISMO! ~ (1977)

High School Student Goes Off On Teacher About Education!

enoch says...

bravo for this kid stating a very serious issue with teaching and one i agree with but i think his ire may be directed at the wrong person as @Yogi suggested and @JiggaJonson implied.

i substituted for a brief span a few years ago.
the reason my time was brief was not due to the kids,they were fantastic but rather it was the draconian and administrative bullshit i had to put up with.the school system was not looking for a substitute "teacher" but a babysitter.a warm body to sit in class and watch kids become catatonic. reading "packets" and qwell any form of disruption.

i was "officially reprimanded" three times due to actually engaging the classes i was substituting.my crime was not the fact i was covering material the absent teacher had already gone over recently but rather that i was talking and engaging the students.

seriously? it still boggles my mind.the teachers who i covered were appreciative of my efforts but the school only wanted me to keep the seat warm.

interestingly enough,those very same teachers convinced me to volunteer my time to tutor troubled teens who are constantly in ISS (in school suspension).thanks to a new principal who helped push through the massive paperwork and help from these teachers this may become an actual program.we have enlisted two more teachers who have come out of retirement and hope to have more tutors soon who are willing to donate their time.

the irony in all this is that the we (the tutors) have huge latitude in how we teach these troubled teens while vetted teachers have huge restrictions.

so generally speaking:its not the teachers.its the system.

aaronfr (Member Profile)

Cat Saves Child From Mom

Unsung_Hero says...

I don't think that's the mom. I saw this video a while back and the description was that she was a babysitter for the kid. Which makes more sense because the cat was protecting his owner from the outsider.

Cat saves child from mom

Sage Francis "The Best Of Times"

calvados says...

http://lyrics.wikia.com/Sage_Francis:The_Best_Of_Times

It's been a long and lonely trip but I'm glad that I took it because it was well worth it.
I got to read a couple books and do some research before I reached my verdict.
Never thought that I was perfect. Always thought that I had a purpose.
Used to wonder if I'd live to see my first kiss.

The most difficult thing I ever did was recite my own words at a service
Realizing the person I was addressing probably wasn't looking down from heaven.
Or cooking up something in hell's kitchen, trying to listen in or eaves drop from some another dimension.
It was self serving just like this is.

Conveniently religious on Easter Sunday and on Christmas.
The television went from being a babysitter to a mistress.
Technology made it easy for us to stay in touch while keeping a distance,
'til we just stayed distant and never touched. Now all we do is text too much.

I don't remember much from my youth. Maybe my memory is repressed.
Or I just spent too much time wondering if I'd live to have sex.
Fell in love for the first time in 4th grade but I didn't have the courage to talk to her.
In 8th grade I wrote her the note but I slipped it in someone else's locker.

Considered killing myself 'cause of that.
It was a big deal. It was a blown cover.
It was over for me. My goose was cooked.
Stick a fork in me. The jig is up.
I blew my chances, the rest is history, our future was torn asunder.
It became abundantly clear that I was only brought here to suffer.

At least I didn't include my name.
Thankfully I wrote the whole note in code
And it had 10 layers of scotch tape safety seal making it impossible to open.
Plus, it was set to self destruct.
Whoever read it probably died…laughing.
I wonder if they lived long enough to realize what happened.

A year later, I came to understand that wasn't love that I was feeling for her.
I had someone else to obsess over.
I was older. I was very mature.
I forged my time signature while practicing my parents autograph 'cause I was failing math.
Disconnected the phone when I thought the teacher would call my home.

I checked the mailbox twice a day at the end of a long dirt road.
Steamed open a couple envelopes like I was in private detective mode.
If you snoop around long enough for something in particular you're guaranteed to find it.
For better or worse that's how I learned that it's best to just keep some things private.

It was the best of times. It was the end of times.

It was the best of times. It was the end of times.
I was always on deck, I was next in line.
An only child with a pen and pad writing a list of things that I could never have.
The walls in my house were paper thin.
Every squabble seemed to get deafening.
If my memory serves me correctly I made it a point to void and forget some things.
Probably to keep from being embarrassed.
Never meant to upset or give grief to my parents.
Kept my secrets…hid my talents…
In my head, never under the mattress.

Therapy couldn't break me.
Never learned a word that would insure safety.
So I spoke softly and I tip toed often.
The door to my room was like a big old coffin.
The way that it creeked when I closed it shut.
Anxieties peaked when it opened up.
As if everything that I was thinking would be exposed.
I still sleep fully clothed.

It was the best of times.

It was beautiful.
It was brutal.
It was cruel.
It was business as usual.

Heaven. It was hell.
Used to wonder if I'd live to see 12.

When I did I figured that I was immortal.
Loved to dance but couldn't make it to the formal.
Couldn't bear watching my imaginary girlfriend
Bust a move with any other dudes.

Tone Loc was talking bout a "Wild Thang"
But I was still caught up in some child thangs.
Scared of a God who couldn't spare the rod.
It was clearly a brimstone and fire thang.

Pyromaniac. Kleptomaniac.
Couldn't explain my desire to steal that fire.
Now I add it to my rider.
Like "Please oh please don't throw me in that patch of brier!"

It was the best of times. It was the end of times.

The school counselor was clueless 'cause I never skipped classes.
Perfect attendance. Imperfect accent.
Speech impediment they could never really fix
And I faked bad eyesight so I could wear glasses.

Considered doing something that would cripple me.
I wanted a wheelchair. I wanted the sympathy.
I wanted straight teeth so then came braces.
4 years of head gear helped me change faces.

It was the best of times. It was the end of times.

Now I wonder if I'll live to see marriage.
Wonder if I'll live long enough to have kids.
Wonder if I'll live to see my kids have kids.
If I do I'm gonna tell 'em how it is.

"Don't listen when they tell you that these are your best years.
Don't let anybody protect your ears.
It's best that you hear what they don't want you to hear.
It's better to have pressure from peers than not have peers.
Beer won't give you chest hair. Spicy food won't make it curl.
When you think you've got it all figured out and then everything collapses…
Trust me, kid…it's not the end of the world."

Cat Defending Child from Mother?

Shipping Container Home for $4K-single mom makes it happen

Shepppard says...

>> ^longde:

The attached article says in the comments that she does have electricity.
I don't have a TV at my house. And we don't let our toddler use any electronics. What's wrong with a shelf full of books and games?
>> ^Shepppard:
I've just got too many questions about this.
Does she still go to school?
Does the kid go to school?
Does she work?
If she does go to school or work, what happens to the kid when she's gone?
(as stated) whose land is she on?
Honestly, I get it. She's doesn't want to conform to the "ideal" form of life. But how far can you go without upsetting your child?
If it were just her, yeah, I'd be fine with it. Novel concept, but no electricity? Granted, you don't need a t.v., you don't need a computer, but it almost seems like the child is going to be oddly out of place later in life because she's being denied those things now.
Who knows, maybe during the day when the kid is hopefully with a babysitter or something she gets her fix.. but her talk of moving the "house" to a barge and just sailing.. Honestly, it's sounding like she's being more selifish then anything.
Edit: it says in the linked story that she's a Babysitter (thus why the other children are there).
Now I'm curious if she's using whatever credentials she went to school for and that's a side job, or if that's her only job.



Toddler to me sounds like a very young child, that's different then one that seems to be 8-10. She can obviously read, But denying your child anything, specifically things that are considered staples of life in the modern age seems like it's just going to either A) Give them a disadvantage later in life, or B) The child will start to harbour resentment towards the parents for not being given something that could have been provided.

However, I'll also assume that your child goes on play-dates? And if they ARE old enough to go to school, then they'll learn all about computers and technology there.

The one we see in the video however doesn't seem to go to school, and therefore is either going to be home-schooled, or no schooled (Just basically learns what mommy sees fit to teach). And when she's older, that's going to be a serious disadvantage.

Shipping Container Home for $4K-single mom makes it happen

longde says...

The attached article says in the comments that she does have electricity.

I don't have a TV at my house. And we don't let our toddler use any electronics. What's wrong with a shelf full of books and games?

>> ^Shepppard:

I've just got too many questions about this.
Does she still go to school?
Does the kid go to school?
Does she work?
If she does go to school or work, what happens to the kid when she's gone?
(as stated) whose land is she on?
Honestly, I get it. She's doesn't want to conform to the "ideal" form of life. But how far can you go without upsetting your child?
If it were just her, yeah, I'd be fine with it. Novel concept, but no electricity? Granted, you don't need a t.v., you don't need a computer, but it almost seems like the child is going to be oddly out of place later in life because she's being denied those things now.
Who knows, maybe during the day when the kid is hopefully with a babysitter or something she gets her fix.. but her talk of moving the "house" to a barge and just sailing.. Honestly, it's sounding like she's being more selifish then anything.
Edit: it says in the linked story that she's a Babysitter (thus why the other children are there).
Now I'm curious if she's using whatever credentials she went to school for and that's a side job, or if that's her only job.

Shipping Container Home for $4K-single mom makes it happen

Shepppard says...

I've just got too many questions about this.

Does she still go to school?

Does the kid go to school?

Does she work?

If she does go to school or work, what happens to the kid when she's gone?

(as stated) whose land is she on?

Honestly, I get it. She's doesn't want to conform to the "ideal" form of life. But how far can you go without upsetting your child?

If it were just her, yeah, I'd be fine with it. Novel concept, but no electricity? Granted, you don't need a t.v., you don't need a computer, but it almost seems like the child is going to be oddly out of place later in life because she's being denied those things now.

Who knows, maybe during the day when the kid is hopefully with a babysitter or something she gets her fix.. but her talk of moving the "house" to a barge and just sailing.. Honestly, it's sounding like she's being more selifish then anything.

Edit: it says in the linked story that she's a Babysitter (thus why the other children are there).

Now I'm curious if she's using whatever credentials she went to school for and that's a side job, or if that's her only job.

Phoebe has a request

Batmanning -- the head injury version of Planking

Crosswords says...

Perhaps its a sign I'm getting old but I find planking to be the most retarded 'activity' fad in recent memory. I get the feeling it was invented by a babysitter tired of dealing with some hyperactive idiot children. 'LETS PLAY THE PLANKING GAME! You just lay as stiff and still as you can for as long as you can!!'



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