@geo321, I think honesty and truth are political assets, not liabilities, as long as you are adept at showily breaking through the lies and strawmen of your opponents.

The real problem with Kucinich and Paul is they both have trouble relating to people. They're both so wrapped up in a shell of ideological righteousness that they forget they need to actually be able to build a bridge between what they believe and what generally non-political people believe and understand.

For example, both have a desire to effectively recall all US troops from everywhere and massively cut the military budget. I'm at least open to the idea, but usually they both go past what even I would think is sane, and they don't make any attempt to persuade. Both just give simplistic reasons for why they'd do this Kucinich makes a bluntly moral argument (Peace is strength), while Paul makes essentially the same bluntly moral argument with different aesthetics (our military is meant for defense only).

Neither acknowledges that people who're open to the idea (like me) need some persuasion before they're willing make that kind of radical shift in our foreign policy in one fell swoop. It seems to me that you could get a lot more people to follow you by just saying "we want out of Iraq and Afghanistan, and to generally take an approach to foreign policy that emphasizes diplomacy" in your official platform, but then make clear in your speeches that "one day" you'd like to see all the troops come home from everywhere, and that you think America should take on the role of being the world's friend, not police man.

You need to rally people behind you, not just shout "I'm right, vote for me!" at people.

Doesn't seem to be a fake.
http://rawstory.com/2009/09/video-appears-to-show-us-troops-kidnapping-protester/

Officials with G20 security released the following statement to Raw Story and other media outlets:

“Military members supporting the G20 Summit work with local law enforcement authorities but do not have the authority to make arrests. The individuals involved in the 9/24/09 arrest which has appeared online are law enforcement officers from a multi-agency tactical response team assigned to the security operations for the G20. It is not unusual for tactical team members to wear camouflaged fatigues. The type of fatigues the officers wear designates their unit affiliation.

Prior to the arrest, the officers observed this subject vandalizing a local business. Due to the hostile nature of the crowd, officer safety and the safety of the person under arrest, the subject was immediately removed from the area.”

War crimes and rogue behavior are nothing new, they happen in every war. Of course, acting like a barbarian outside of the rules of war is what terrorists aka "insurgents" do. How odd that these Blackwater guys are judged Guilty-In-Advance by the same libmedia hard at work trying to give subhumans caught on battlefields attacking US troops "rights" and legal protections reserved for real soldiers.

Taking a few mercenaries to task is not enough! It's important that all of Christianity be blamed because the accused may or may not consider themselves Christian "holy warriors". The accused could just as easily have believed the enemy were disguised Martians, but there's a huge diff between "Christian crazy" (pure evil!) "Muslim crazy" (not evil, just culturally 'different') and crazy but useful (Olbyloon).

The icing on the cake for the Olbyloon is yet another chance to blame Bush for something, as if Bush or Rumsfeld personally ordered Blackwater to commit war crimes.

Is there a story here? Sure. Is it that the entire Iraqi war was a cover to distract the world from the actions of a few mercenaries who were somehow going to kill all Muslims by themselves?

Anything to take people's minds off the Obama Recession.

>> ^NetRunner:

I think if you set aside questions like "should we be there" and "when did removing the Taliban become our problem" and "what good does it do to send our military abroad to kill people" and so on, I agree this does seem like a much more effective way to execute this particular conflict.


It sounds trite but "making the best of the shit sandwich someone left you" is the best way I can think to describe it. It would be easy to just say Bush fucked up and pull the troops. That leaves a wide open area for the Taliban to walk back in to saying "Hey man, those US guys just killed your family, blew up your house, knocked down your mosque and ran over your dog on the way out of town, you have nothing left to lose, come and blow up shit over there to make them pay for it!"

Staying around to clean up the mess that has been created and effecting real change (which is an onerous responsibility given that the US is in a bit of a spot of bother atm financially) will, as Cenk notes, win hearts and minds. It's hard to create suicide bombers to use against the US when the locals remember that US troops liberated them from a oppressive regime and helped rebuild and get them back on their feet. Further, other Arabic-Asian countries see these actions and they will be mollified and moderated. The extremist will have a hard time finding support if the bulk of the population has a more reasonable/moderate view of the US promoted by your current actions.

>> ^quantumushroom: Sorry. I respectfully disagree. Can't hide a proposed moral stance behind secrets of national security.

So you are arguing that all scientific studies about truth telling under duress, and false confessions have been cooked by the Democrats?

Science is no longer apolitical, if it ever was. Lies about secondhand smoke killing 50,000 people per year and gloBULL warming scares have proved this well enough.

Obama can solidify your hypothesis about torture never providing valuable information by releasing all pertinent Gitmo waterboarding data. He hasn't. WHY? He only has a 1 in 3 chance of being proven wrong.

I don't really care if the CIA thinks that torture is effective ( they seem to be taking the opposite position, but that is equally irrelevant ). I am asking for evidence that torture, studied under scientific controls, as a system of extracting usable information, works on humans. The evidence I have seen strongly suggests it does not.

Well, as I've said many times, and probably will again, these captured folks are not enemy soldiers and therefore deserve no military/legal protection, possibly with the exception of those not caught outright fighting against US troops on the battlefield. I'd rather the ones still out there not be reassured that they won't be tortured if captured.

If you seriously believe torture "doesn't work" then you might find yourself agreeable to the idea that we not go through the trouble of bringing these clowns to "jail" for 3 hots and a cot, and instead simply kill the bastards where we find them, as brutally as possible. That might deter a few of the next "martyrs".

Al Faw palace is BIG... It's a little creepy that the US troops are using it.

QM again attempts to relate WW2 with GWOT, never mind that one was a war against states bent on world domination fought on a global scale with multiple allies.

While the other is a war on abstract concepts like 'terror' and 'evil', with a few international allies, which has no end game and no objective other then ending 'evil' allowing for continuous warfare and aggression using the terror misnomer.

I believe QM is desperately needed in the front lines to tell the US troops who exactly is a jihadist throat slitter, an insurgent, freedom fighter, mujaheddin or a northern alliance soldier. This would be invaluable.

The Palestinian attacks are directly a result of Israel actions over 60 years.

And whats with the straw men arguments? Moral relativists? What next are you going to call Reza a liberal? LOL stop trying to package someones ideas into a format that takes away from the point they are trying to make.

>> ^Farhad2000:
>> ^Mashiki:
No one is an atheist in a foxhole.

Philip Paulson disagrees.


Actually, lets look at it differently since the world isn't black, and white as much as people like to try.

We can look at that quote, and compare it to my comment. The belief that there is no god, or higher power holds true. The fact that you're facing your own morality is the true test of ones mettle. It doesn't matter whether or not you believe in a higher power or not. The saying that I gave above applies as such:

When faced with death, you look to whatever you're faced with, and make the view with whatever you seem to believe in. No more, no less. Whether that's a higher power, or to nothing at all. While you realize that everything in your life can be for naught, and you're powerless in it. Welcome to the wonderful world of 'reading' more then what actually exists in a sentence.

Some would call that philosophy.

>> ^rottenseed:
>> ^Mashiki:
No one is an atheist in a foxhole.

You Christians and your love of bestiality...

Amazing how someone can take a comment, out of context to place their own view upon it. Perhaps you're simply covering up for your own moral weakness with projection?

Not to mention, without even knowing someone they attempt to take a high ground believing someone to be of a religious background, stumbling blindly in the dark, falling on their own narcissistic personality.

>> ^Farhad2000:
>> ^Mashiki:
No one is an atheist in a foxhole.

Philip Paulson disagrees.

"I suffered through horrifying moments, expecting to be killed. I was convinced that no cosmic rescuer would same me. Besides, I believed life after death was merely wishful thinking. There were times when I expected to suffer a painful, agonizing death. My frustration and anger at being caught in a dilemma of life-and-death situations simply infuriated me. Hearing the sound of bullets whistling through the air and popping near my ears was damned scary. Fortunately, I was never physically wounded." - Philip Paulson

>> ^Mashiki:
No one is an atheist in a foxhole.

You Christians and your love of bestiality...

>> ^nerbula:
sometimes I get conflicting emotions when I see stuff like this, I get made because of what they are doing and raping there brains with but then I get to see them in the church praying/singing with there hands in the air and eyes closed and I laugh, sometimes uncontrolably. How stupid does that look, talking to santa for more presents when your a full grown adult.

Welcome to Videosift. Coffee and donuts will be served at intermission. Please read your welcome pamphlet to get yourself up to speed.

>> ^Mashiki:
No one is an atheist in a foxhole.


Philip Paulson disagrees.

Your video, Al Jazeera: US Troops Urged to Evangelize in Afghanistan, has made it into the Top 15 New Videos listing. Congratulations on your achievement. For your contribution you have been awarded 1 Power Point.

The U.S. government on Monday agreed to release a Yemeni surgeon who reportedly treated al Qaida wounded at Tora Bora in Afghanistan under a new review ordered by President Barack Obama meant to empty the prison camps here by January 2010.

Ayman Batarfi, 38, had told a military review panel in 2005 that he was a humanitarian worker who found himself at the battle of Tora Bora in 2001 while Osama bin Laden was in the area, according to a Pentagon transcript. He said he'd met bin Laden while the doctor was burying the dead from American air assaults, but that he did not respect the al Qaida leader, who he called "a coward."

(source)

It was during that same battle that US troops were ordered to stand down and not to shoot if they saw Osama bin Laden.