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Yeah, right

Felix culpa is a Latin phrase that literally translated means a "blessed fault" or "fortunate fall". As a religious term it refers to Adam and Eve's fall and the loss of the Garden of Eden, known theologically as the source of original sin. The phrase is sung annually in the Exsultet of the Easter Vigil: "O felix culpa quae talem et tantum meruit habere redemptorem," "O happy fault that merited such and so great a Redeemer." The medieval theologian Thomas Aquinas[1] cited this line when he explained how the principle that "God allows evils to happen in order to bring a greater good therefrom" underlies the causal relationship between original sin and the Divine Redeemer's Incarnation.

The phrase "Oh happy fault!" is used in colloquial English, especially among intellectuals.

The important thing here is that God doesn't punish you. If God is the ontological ground of being denying God would be like committing suicide, metaphorically speaking.

^that would be true only if all of the following were true:

1) a deity had set up a system in which the good people go to 'heaven' and the bad go to 'hell' (this isn't the case with Christianity, in which merely "repenting" one's "sins" may be enough to earn a free pass);
2) if the deity had set up a clear and unambiguous set of rules as to what is "good" and what is "bad" (this isn't the case with Christianity, since the good ol' book has expressly said killing defenseless infants and women can be a good thing, while working on a holiday has been a deadly offense);
3) the deity gave every citizen of the world, regardless of where they were born, equal opportunity to 'see the "right" path', which isn't the case with Christianity, if one is born, well, anywhere in the Eastern hemisphere;
4) the deity and the religion weren't made up thousands of years ago by superstitious fools in order to better control the masses.

i must admit, i got a good laugh about it. But, again, this is a very elementary understanding of it all. This IS the sift so I'm not surprised

Ahh, throwing the "there's so much to understand/interpret in god's work, non-believers will never understand it" card again.

Bovine manure. There's nothing to understand, there's only stuff to "interpret" whichever way suits you and calling it "enhanced understanding". The Bible is exactly equally as ridiculous as Ron Hubbard's nonsense; lord xenu's DC-7 spaceships are equally as ludicrous as a man surviving inside of a whale for several weeks. Only difference is the bible's more obscure, so that if a new bunch of people appear wanting to justify their new ideas/lifestyle, they can always "interpret" some parts/passages in one of the most ambiguous books ever written to their benefit.

>> ^smooman:
i must admit, i got a good laugh about it. But, again, this is a very elementary understanding of it all. This IS the sift so I'm not surprised


so.. what IS the sift (to you)?

^a community predominately made up of left leaning liberals and atheists whose company I enjoy

EDD to claim that deeper understanding of a book written by dozens of authors, belonging to cultures vastly different than yours, thousands of years ago is not necessary really just paints you as the bullheaded, imbecile you are.

So instead let's not take any time to study it and just make fun of the silly stories contained therein for we are intellectual giants!

Ahh, throwing the "there's so much to understand/interpret in god's work, non-believers will never understand it" card again.


You're right, you will never understand it but not because it's far too deep and complicated but because you won't lift a finger to TRY and understand.

smooman, first of all let me say that I genuinely believe it's better NOT to try understanding the ideas of folks that you see are deluding themselves rather than presumptuously assuming one knows everything about one's opponent in a debate. I confess to the former 'offense', while you're guilty as charged to the latter.

Now, I hate having to say this, I'm ashamed of it, but - I understand you. And I hate it, me understanding you and all the other religious folks on the planet. You are simple. You're so utterly simple, and it doesn't matter in the slightest which 'teachings' one might base their life on, the delusion will still be simple. Want to know with what authority I'm saying this? Mine. I WAS christian. I've read the bible cover-to-cover. Have you? I've read various other works on christian theology. That was more than 10 years ago - and somehow I guess I just missed the memo to remain stupid and ignorant while I was growing up. So yeah, you can bet your sweet ass my understanding of christianity exceeds that of some 80% US christians, so I do feel extremely confident in saying odds are I understand christianity a lot better than you do.

The difference between us is that I understand why it consists mostly of fairy tales, old dogma and false beliefs as well as how I could interpret selected 'lessons' from the scripture to my life to make me feel better (if I could delude myself sufficiently), while your understanding appears to be limited with the latter. Who's fault is that? Well for one, our civilization's for not having rejected organized religion in the first place and also your parents'/whoever indoctrinated you.

I find it slightly humorous you think me simple. It's evident that there really is no use in having a conversation with someone who has a hardon for blanket statements.

"And I hate it, me understanding you and all the other religious folks on the planet. You are simple"

I get it. You're jaded. We've all been there. Some abandon "faith" and some find renewal. That doesn't mean that either one of us is better than the other for it, however, it's painfully obvious that you think you are far superior than I because I still "believe in fairy tales".

Yes I've read the Bible in it's entirety. Many of the books I've read over and over.
Yes I've read non canonical books on theology. Tons of CS Lewis. Free Choice of the Will. City of God. The Gospel of James. Some OT Apocrypha in college and many, many more.
I was a theology major in college.

So who's guilty of presumptions? The difference is you went one way, I went another. That's it. Neither of us is more intellectually grounded than the other based on this.

But vent away, I'm listening.

If you don't want to pay your taxes, you free to spend a week with the pain monster.

some day i plan on writing something about how i "fell" from christianity, mostly for own sake, to clear up and sort through my thoughts of the process.
but I am pretty sure it was the other christians ive met in my life that led to my.. release. and also reading the bible again as a grown up was hugely dissapointing. as a book of wisdom and philosphy i think it is very primitive. and then comparing what christians say they believe in with whats in the book, even more dissapointing.

it really is disappointing and even sad that the Christian ethos is love and yet you rarely see that from the church today. Ironic isnt it? The greatest adversary of Christianity is Christians. Something I strive to reconcile everyday.



If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing.

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears. When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put childish ways behind me. Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.
1 Corinthians 13

God created free will.

Therefore ANYTHING that results from that free will is God's desire.

WIN!

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Promoting this video back to the front page; last published Sunday, March 22nd, 2009 4:45pm PDT - promote requested by eric3579.