Ex-Islamist explains the growth of extremism vs democracy

Very interesting - albeit somewhat optimist - talk about the difficulties of spreading democracy versus extremism.
marinarasays...

http://www.khudipakistan.com/faq/

spreading democracy and western culture into pakistan.

this guy runs a crappy little political organization that purports to save globalism from islamists. Why the hell would you want to save globalism?


At Khudi, we tend to prefer the latter. That’s why we organize conferences and workshops around the country, inviting people from disparate backgrounds to foster a culture of healthy discussion and debate
....
Khudi also runs an inter-university campus magazine, distributed at universities across Pakistan, providing students with a chance to air their views without fear of reprisal.


what an idiot. I read this http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article2459969.ece
about Maajid's polarizing youth, but apparently his big solution are free magazines and communications workshops.

this is an english man mucking about at politics in pakistan.

he'd do better to spend his time to learn arabic than to convince some rich pakistanis that they should love the west

hpqpsays...

I don't know anything about this person other than what is in the video, but your critique doesn't seem to address anything he says. Ad hominem?

Personally I find what he says about democracy being presented as only one political choice quite interesting, especially when one looks at the two-party system in the US, which is veering dangerously towards "theocracy" vs. "democracy".

edit: the language of Pakistan is Urdu, not Arabic.

(p.s.: the second link you provide doesn't work)

>> ^marinara:

http://www.khudipakistan.com/faq/
spreading democracy and western culture into pakistan.
this guy runs a crappy little political organization that purports to save globalism from islamists. Why the hell would you want to save globalism?


At Khudi, we tend to prefer the latter. That’s why we organize conferences and workshops around the country, inviting people from disparate backgrounds to foster a culture of healthy discussion and debate
....
Khudi also runs an inter-university campus magazine, distributed at universities across Pakistan, providing students with a chance to air their views without fear of reprisal.

what an idiot. I read this http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article2459969.ece
about Maajid's polarizing youth, but apparently his big solution are free magazines and communications workshops.
this is an english man mucking about at politics in pakistan.
he'd do better to spend his time to learn arabic than to convince some rich pakistanis that they should love the west

marinarasays...

not ad hominem. just because I disagree w/ you doesn't make it ad hominem.
the link works here in the usa

i'll just let you correct me on the Arabic in pakistan, even though i never meant to imply that Arabic was used in Pakistan, only that Arabic was used in islamist social movements

hpqpsays...

1) I never said I agreed with what this person says, just that it was interesting.

2) You did not address his arguments as presented in this video, only what you perceive as his goals.

Did you even watch the video?

>> ^marinara:

not ad hominem. just because I disagree w/ you doesn't make it ad hominem.
the link works here in the usa
i'll just let you correct me on the Arabic in pakistan, even though i never meant to imply that Arabic was used in Pakistan, only that Arabic was used in islamist social movements

marinarasays...

nothing personal hppq. just don't tell me something is good when i pretty much know it is bullshit.

http://www.quilliamfoundation.org/acatalog/Books.html

look at the materials they are publishing;
the first on the list is a book that purports to combat islamists by training people to use the english language to not reinforce stereotypes about the muslim countries.

they would have you replace the word:

‘Muslim’ (country) or ‘non-Muslim’ (country), it may be more
appropriate to talk of ‘Muslim-majority’ or ‘predominantly Muslim’ countries


this is bullshit. don't even tell me it's not bullshit. If you're going to tell me this bullshit is going to even slow down an islamist, you're talking bullshit.
Reason #1 why it's not going to work, is the only people who are going to use that language are the political chattering class. Who aren't even relevant. To anything.

BTW, bullshit is an objective concept.
I suppose Maajid Nawaz probably does have an idea that isn't total bullshit, but I can't identify it.

bcglorfsays...

>> ^marinara:

http://www.khudipakistan.com/faq/
spreading democracy and western culture into pakistan.
this guy runs a crappy little political organization that purports to save globalism from islamists. Why the hell would you want to save globalism?


At Khudi, we tend to prefer the latter. That’s why we organize conferences and workshops around the country, inviting people from disparate backgrounds to foster a culture of healthy discussion and debate
....
Khudi also runs an inter-university campus magazine, distributed at universities across Pakistan, providing students with a chance to air their views without fear of reprisal.

what an idiot. I read this http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article2459969.ece
about Maajid's polarizing youth, but apparently his big solution are free magazines and communications workshops.
this is an english man mucking about at politics in pakistan.
he'd do better to spend his time to learn arabic than to convince some rich pakistanis that they should love the west


Right, this 'idiot' clearly doesn't understand the situation as well as yourself.

This British Pakistani born man who spent years working with a major Islamic extremist organization obviously knows nothing about Islamic extremism in Pakistan.

You later deny this, but your snide(but poorly researched) remark about learning Arabic is CLEARLY because you didn't even know Pakistan's national language.

You haven't cared enough to study a thing about Pakistan, but while you snipe away here in ignorance, this man is honestly putting his own life at risk every day for his cause. Go find an online Pakistani paper and follow it's stories. You'll find moderate leaders and activists are regularly murdered. More over, not only are they murdered, but the nations lawyers refuse to prosecute the murderers and instead stand in solidarity with the murders 'bold' stand against blasphemy.

This guy even mentions the grossest such example in his talk, former Primer Minister Benazir Bhutto's assassination, but you again seem too ignorant of anything in Pakistan to grasp the significance.

Stop flooding the thread with unhelpful complaining and find something to support the horrific struggle faced by moderate Pakistani's against the extremists that are killing them every day.

Yogisays...

>> ^marinara:

nothing personal hppq. just don't tell me something is good when i pretty much know it is bullshit.
http://www.quilliamfoundation.org/acatalog/Books.html
look at the materials they are publishing;
the first on the list is a book that purports to combat islamists by training people to use the english language to not reinforce stereotypes about the muslim countries.
they would have you replace the word:

‘Muslim’ (country) or ‘non-Muslim’ (country), it may be more
appropriate to talk of ‘Muslim-majority’ or ‘predominantly Muslim’ countries

this is bullshit. don't even tell me it's not bullshit. If you're going to tell me this bullshit is going to even slow down an islamist, you're talking bullshit.
Reason #1 why it's not going to work, is the only people who are going to use that language are the political chattering class. Who aren't even relevant. To anything.
BTW, bullshit is an objective concept.
I suppose Maajid Nawaz probably does have an idea that isn't total bullshit, but I can't identify it.


I agree...mostly because hpqp is a fucking moron.

hpqpsays...

Oh Yogi, if this goes on we're gonna have to elope!

>> ^Yogi:

>> ^marinara:
nothing personal hppq. just don't tell me something is good when i pretty much know it is bullshit.
http://www.quilliamfoundation.org/acatalog/Books.html
look at the materials they are publishing;
the first on the list is a book that purports to combat islamists by training people to use the english language to not reinforce stereotypes about the muslim countries.
they would have you replace the word:

‘Muslim’ (country) or ‘non-Muslim’ (country), it may be more
appropriate to talk of ‘Muslim-majority’ or ‘predominantly Muslim’ countries

this is bullshit. don't even tell me it's not bullshit. If you're going to tell me this bullshit is going to even slow down an islamist, you're talking bullshit.
Reason #1 why it's not going to work, is the only people who are going to use that language are the political chattering class. Who aren't even relevant. To anything.
BTW, bullshit is an objective concept.
I suppose Maajid Nawaz probably does have an idea that isn't total bullshit, but I can't identify it.

I agree...mostly because hpqp is a fucking moron.

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