Some people's point of view seems to be Nihilism: give up, it's hopeless, they're all corrupt liars, we're doomed no matter what, do nothing.

Others say: yeah 'bama is flawed but of the 2 available optons given to us by the power elite, he represents the last best feeble hope for humanity. Sux but that's all there is.

Ah, so it goes or comes as it were.

The harbinger of punctuation nihilism...
The high priest of Yhatzee...
The Dark Lord of the Sift...

What will come if we let him get to 66666?

We must ban him now! Or we are doomed, I tell you! Ban him, before his powers grow to strong. Will you wait till he slays Dag with mind bullets? The borders on his cold, dark prison called Canada are crumbling with every vote you cast.

Will you continue to hope that one will come to challenge his dominion over us?

Bcglorf, why don't you admit it: Reagan, I agree, sucks, but Juan Cole rules, at least with regard to all things Arab/Middle-East.

Re Libya, not only Cole realises that European sanctions against Libya had, in great part, already been lifted in 1999 (in return for owning up for Lockerbie), so to whom should Gadhafi have turned, if not to the US (who had stuck to their embargo)? Not to mention the fact that Libya had given up supporting terrorism long before that date.

If you really think Hitchens is that cool, try to find anything that supports his 10 points of "positive accounting" in the article Cole responds to:

overthrow of Talibanism and Baathism and exposure of highly suggestive links [I don’t know about those suggestive links, but the Taliban seem to be alive & kicking], a capitulation offered not to Kofi Annan or the E.U. [capitulating to Kofi Annan or the EU, that would be a novelty...], agreement by the United Nations that reform is necessary and overdue [war was waged on Iraq to make the UN realise it needed reform?], showing that Chirac and Schröder were cheating [is anybody willing to explain this to the Iraqis?], the ability to certify Iraq as actually disarmed, rather than accept the word of a psychopathic autocrat [Hans Blix a psychopath?], the encouragement of democratic and civil society movements in Egypt, Syria, and Lebanon [videosifters in any of those countries, please respond], the violent and ignominious death of thousands of bin Ladenist infiltrators [I guess, just arresting, or even killing them, wasn’t enough], training and hardening of many thousands of American servicemen/women in a battle against the forces of nihilism and absolutism [videosifters in the military, what do you think?]. Actually, I can agree (a little bit) with his # 7: the immense gains made by the largest stateless minority in the region--the Kurds--and the spread of this example to other states.

(www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/995phqjw.asp?pg=2)

I was a bit defensive for the underdog here because I am a former Christian. I suppose I would call myself agnostic now. Thanks for the polite and sincere replies.

In reply to this comment by shuac:
>> ^swampgirl:
The "Atheists' Experience"? oh please.
Atheism shouldn't be an "experience" at all, but the absence of "Experiences" I thought. You live, you observe, you learn, you appreciate, you age, you die... the end.

We have all the same experiences as reverent people. We live, we observe, we feel awe, we love, we have children. We just don't attribute any of it to an entity in which we do not believe.

A show?? ... for atheists? Guys like these are as annoying as right wing fundies. Why do they feel the need to evangelize? Cause that's what this looks like to me.
Here are some guys that feel the need to make atheism into some form of lifestyle that needs promotion.... a belief system. The way they are promoting this absence of belief that brings purpose and meaning in their lives....how is this different from what religion is doing for others? ... practically speaking here...

You can call it a belief system if you like, but that's not what it is. Atheists do not believe in an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent being. Period. Is this show different than religion prosthelatizing (sp)? Probably not.

That they care so much to go to these lengths to debunk Christianity says there's some baggage in their pasts

Atheists only feel the need to debunk Christianity when a Christian quotes the bible at us. And then it's pretty easy debunking because the bible is not well thought out (IMO). However, by-and-large, we don't go around shoving our views in your face. If you do not wish to hear such things, don't watch the show. For example, I've never seen the 700 Club. Not once.

bitter about something? Why the chip on the shoulder? Why showcase some poor fella that may not be bright, but is sincere?

They cannot control who calls in. And yes, the delight the hosts take in showing this guy up is a little over the top. That wouldn't necessarily be my style. But then, not all reverent people are exactly the same as each other.

You aren't providing a service other than showcasing your over educated, over privileged and yes at times... arrogance.

Well, I think they're providing a great service and will likely continue to do so. They're currently on their 550th show, or there-abouts? Not a bad run.

Enjoy your lack of belief fellas. Celebrate that intellect of yours. BUT Let the other people have their beliefs while you use those big smart brains of yours on something more productive.

I'd be glad to close my mouth forever so long as my country (USA) does not go too far: sanctioning prayer in school, creationism in science, and...oh yeah...war in the name of god. Stopping such activity is fairly important to us.

Guys, let it go. Go cure cancer, write music, invent the flux capacitor... just enjoy your life before its over.

We will.

I'm so gonna get flamed now aren't I?

I don't flame. I'm too old for that shit. But overall, I feel I'm being pretty civil.

Atheists get angry when atheism is categorized as a religion. Understandable. You do see why don't you?

Yes, which is why we don't see it as a religion.

IMO the reason is because so many atheists feel the need to organize and promote it as a belief system.

No, we don't.

So much seeking of validation..needing it.... is NOT believing in anything enough?

Don't confuse atheism with nihilism. The reverent's favorite claim is that "atheists believe in nothing." Uhh, no. We believe in all the things you believe in: just not god. We do not feel we need religion to be moral people.

What a sad world it would be if the ONLY reason people didn't go around killing each other and stealing is out of a fear of god. We're already good. We don't need a book for that.

Why all this attention seeking behavior and needing to be 'right' about it?

That's a good question. Probably because we feel threatened. See above for the thing about prayer, creationism in science, and holy wars.

Their behavior follows a similar pattern of those in organized religions.

I'll agree with you there. It is similar. We're OK with that.

>> ^swampgirl:
The "Atheists' Experience"? oh please.
Atheism shouldn't be an "experience" at all, but the absence of "Experiences" I thought. You live, you observe, you learn, you appreciate, you age, you die... the end.

We have all the same experiences as reverent people. We live, we observe, we feel awe, we love, we have children. We just don't attribute any of it to an entity in which we do not believe.

A show?? ... for atheists? Guys like these are as annoying as right wing fundies. Why do they feel the need to evangelize? Cause that's what this looks like to me.
Here are some guys that feel the need to make atheism into some form of lifestyle that needs promotion.... a belief system. The way they are promoting this absence of belief that brings purpose and meaning in their lives....how is this different from what religion is doing for others? ... practically speaking here...

You can call it a belief system if you like, but that's not what it is. Atheists do not believe in an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent being. Period. Is this show different than religion prosthelatizing (sp)? Probably not.

That they care so much to go to these lengths to debunk Christianity says there's some baggage in their pasts

Atheists only feel the need to debunk Christianity when a Christian quotes the bible at us. And then it's pretty easy debunking because the bible is not well thought out (IMO). However, by-and-large, we don't go around shoving our views in your face. If you do not wish to hear such things, don't watch the show. For example, I've never seen the 700 Club. Not once.

bitter about something? Why the chip on the shoulder? Why showcase some poor fella that may not be bright, but is sincere?

They cannot control who calls in. And yes, the delight the hosts take in showing this guy up is a little over the top. That wouldn't necessarily be my style. But then, not all reverent people are exactly the same as each other.

You aren't providing a service other than showcasing your over educated, over privileged and yes at times... arrogance.

Well, I think they're providing a great service and will likely continue to do so. They're currently on their 550th show, or there-abouts? Not a bad run.

Enjoy your lack of belief fellas. Celebrate that intellect of yours. BUT Let the other people have their beliefs while you use those big smart brains of yours on something more productive.

I'd be glad to close my mouth forever so long as my country (USA) does not go too far: sanctioning prayer in school, creationism in science, and...oh yeah...war in the name of god. Stopping such activity is fairly important to us.

Guys, let it go. Go cure cancer, write music, invent the flux capacitor... just enjoy your life before its over.

We will.

I'm so gonna get flamed now aren't I?

I don't flame. I'm too old for that shit. But overall, I feel I'm being pretty civil.

Atheists get angry when atheism is categorized as a religion. Understandable. You do see why don't you?

Yes, which is why we don't see it as a religion.

IMO the reason is because so many atheists feel the need to organize and promote it as a belief system.

No, we don't.

So much seeking of validation..needing it.... is NOT believing in anything enough?

Don't confuse atheism with nihilism. The reverent's favorite claim is that "atheists believe in nothing." Uhh, no. We believe in all the things you believe in: just not god. We do not feel we need religion to be moral people.

What a sad world it would be if the ONLY reason people didn't go around killing each other and stealing is out of a fear of god. We're already good. We don't need a book for that.

Why all this attention seeking behavior and needing to be 'right' about it?

That's a good question. Probably because we feel threatened. See above for the thing about prayer, creationism in science, and holy wars.

Their behavior follows a similar pattern of those in organized religions.

I'll agree with you there. It is similar. We're OK with that.

Combination of the drink and the heroine withdrawal. Gross. Definitely one of the most honest, while at the same time darkly entertaining, no-holds-barred depictions of drug addiction and gleeful nihilism ever caught in film. Trainspotting hits the nail on the proverbial head in that respect.

This video highlights the absurdity of the discourse, wherein the presidential candidate is supposed to be the best but is not allowed to know it (because knowing it would be the "elitism" boogeyman).

Elitism, inasmuch as it is just acknowledging the truth, deserves no opprobrium. Any candidate who doesn't think he is among the best this country has to offer should get the fuck out of the race for president. Anti-elitism is feigned quality-nihilism, while at the same time insinuating self-contradictorily that the anti-elitist is better than the elitist. Anti-elitism is the adult form of the bully beating up the teacher's pet.

Quantumushroom:

You are comparing two things that have no relation.

Atheism does not make a statement one way or another on the intrinsic value of life. Atheism merely states a disbelief in the existence of God. That's it.

Atheism has nothing to do with Nihilism.

You also claim that religion believe in the intrinsic value of life. I think that is a highly debatable point.

The responses to this sift alone prove absolutely nothing. If you are going to base your assessment of the rationality of humanity on the responses of a handful of people to an animated cartoon, then you have some serious rationality issues yourself.




Is there anyone out there capable of actually making a substantive point in the favor of religion, or are all of you going to speak in hyperbole and generalities that mean absolute jack shit?

The generic religious view that all life has value--flawed and unrealized though it may be--is superior to the nihilism that so often is found holding hands with atheism.

The enraged responses of many at this sift proves humans--including atheists--are ruled by primitive emotions, thinly veiled by reason.

And English "humor" is enough to make anyone agnostic.

Chogs, I'm one of your more potent fans, but I too don't know what your point is here.

Are you implying the crash was faked?

It's more comfortable for some to believe that the same evil old White men they've been trained to hate since grade school "planned" 9/11. It's safer to believe an evil element in an otherwise civilized world caused this than the murderous nihilism of islamofascists.

Too bad for the daydream believers, because the islamos ARE responsible, and should be utterly annihilated from the face of the earth.

As I said the other day, QM was likely one of the kids who had to ride the short bus on the way to school. My guess is he licked the windows the entire way.

Oh, and if you can give me one example of a policy supported by the left that relies on moral nihilism, I'll give you a lolly.

nihil... ronald...