Professional economist here (hence, perceived as right wing) who began studying economics due to concern about climate change (hence, perceived as left wing).

[1] The classic statement of when markets 'work' is the 'first fundamental theorem of welfare economics'.

[2] 'work' in this sense means 'leads to a Pareto-optimal outcome', which means an outcome in which no one can be made better off without making someone worse off. This is a low standard: an outcome in which I have everything is Pareto-optimal.

[3] the conditions for the welfare theorems are generally not satisfied in practice. Here, as alluded to in the ad, carbon emissions are 'externalities': if an oil company sells you gas, which you then use, both of you are better off, because you're assumed to have taken into account the effects of your exchange, and decided to proceed; other parties have not, so may be worse off.

[4] in general, failure of the welfare theorem conditions isn't enough to make the case for government intervention: the outcome may still be 'constrained' efficient - meaning that, given the inherent constraints in the problem (e.g. asymmetric information), the market outcome is Pareto efficient.

[5] again, even if it is, you may not like the particular constrained efficient outcome the market yields (e.g. I get everything).

[6] in the case of externalities, the theory is pretty well established - if we want efficient outcomes, we need to align the private and social costs. There are two basic market-based tools for doing that: quantity tools (e.g. carbon permits) and price tools (e.g. carbon taxes). Which performs better depends on the sort of market imperfections.

[7] obviously, we will never have a perfect estimate of the efficient price or quantity of carbon to emit in a given year. Equally obviously, to me at least, this is a classic case of an externality with a well developed body of theory pointing in the direction of some level of controls.

[8] in my experience: people familiar with the economic theory tend not to be 'pro-market' or 'anti-market': they tend to want to understand how the market can be used to deliver societal objectives and, when it can't, how to correct its imperfections.

Idiots—all who believe any of this is untrue or unimportant. Oil is the death nail of any ecology, without which economies simply cannot exist.
(Saying oil is the life blood of any economy is like saying “Plants crave Brawndo, it’s got electrolytes.”. Plants can survive on Brawndo temporarily, but quickly fail.)

Change to green is coming, but far too slowly. Market forces and “scientific debate” (read-misinformation campaigns) have been manipulated by enormous industry pressures and coffers to keep it from being mainstream. (You likely STILL think Solar and wind aren’t economically viable when they both have been for decades, and still deny climate change even though the oil industry knew for a certainty it was a real and existential threat in the 70’s, but industry supplied misinformation has duped you time and time again into being on the wrong side of the science, ecology, economy, and/or sanity.)

Because market forces are artificiality manipulated and driven by industry whose existence depends on staying Crude (as opposed to Going Green), government edict is not just necessary, it’s an overdue urgent imperative.

FTFY.

The last 3 major recessions were under and 100% due to Republican “leadership”, the last 3 economic booms were under Democratic leadership. Democrats caused the last budget surplus the country will likely ever see, actually paying down the debt until Bush fucked it all up.

Who’s causing downward economic spirals again?

The idea that Republicans are better on the economy is just ignorant belief in propaganda. Consistently the economy does better under democratic leadership and spirals down under Republicans….usually directly because of their policies like in 08 and 2020. Both 100% caused by Republican policies (like banking deregulation or Covid denial), policies opposed by the left.

This has been the case for decades.

Republicans spend like drunken sailors, then cry poverty the instant democrats hold the purse strings.

Trump took the healthy economy off a cliff to the worst economy, employment, and gdp in history. It took him <4 years….and was responsible for over 1 million unnecessary deaths of Americans because of his lack of response to Covid. Downward spiral?! Trump put us in rocket assisted free fall. Biden accelerated the crawling failing economy into an upward spiral.
Obama and Biden spent a lot, but in 4 years Trump spent far more than their 10 years combined while lowering the amount the government brings in on multiple fronts (so increased the debt and deficit in two ways, spending more while making less), and Obama inherited a recession and left a boom, Trump inherited a boom and left a recession….Biden inherited economic collapse, active terroristic sedition, horrific unemployment, and pandemic…all 4 issues are better today than they were on Jan 20, 21.

The inflation reduction act, Bobby. That’s what’s being done.
Also student debt forgiveness.
Edit-Also raising interest rates, finally. Can’t blame Biden for the federal reserve’s hesitation, however….he doesn’t control them and can only make suggestions.
That’s the answer.
Almost every Republican opposed it (them) and voted against it (them), nearly every Republican then went home and took credit for it (them) and said it (they) was a great thing for their constituents (but pretended they hadn’t been against it (them) with every fiber of their being because it’s (they’re) really popular)….just like they did with the infrastructure bill.

Higher interest rates ARE helping, just not enough yet. It definitely should have started earlier than March…. .25% interest rates were just insanely low. Inflation has lowered, but as you well know, Trump’s administration just printed over 1/5 of every dollar in 2020….just made 20% more dollars while gdp went to -32.9% and unemployment skyrocketed to unheard of levels. This causes 20% inflation or more all by itself…Joe’s administration kept that below 10% miraculously.

If bankruptcy boy was still running the economy, we would have 20% inflation, more oil infrastructure sold to the Saudis (they bought the biggest refinery in America in secret under Trump and cut production), higher gas and oil prices, no infrastructure funding, no inflation plan, Ukraine would no longer exist, NATO would still be impotent, ….bankrupting a country is much worse than bankrupting 6 businesses. Trump did both.

Thanks Biden….

P.S.- Nice deflection from the undeniable hypocrisy the video is about. Way to completely ignore the right now taking credit for the popular and helpful Biden legislation they all opposed….praising it, explaining what a great thing it is for their states, economy, and constituents while pretending they didn’t ALL vote against it out of pure spite which outweighs any wish for America to succeed. Their sudden love for the law they diametrically and insultingly opposed is absolute proof they oppose beneficial legislation simply to avoid letting Biden succeed.

Edit: Will you ever get tired of begging for attention for being 100% wrong 99.6% of the time?

I think the truly scary part is that our emissions today continue to have an effect on the climate for decades - centuries, so to affect today’s climate we needed to change our emissions decades ago or find feasible, economically and ecologically viable massive carbon sequestration techniques yesterday.

That’s why I believe we are locked into massive unsurvivable changes as a best case scenario, and a mass extinction of anything bigger than a large cat. Much worse if we continue the current course.

Aaaaahahahaha….you fucking imbecile. Biden is much looser than uptight, stick up his ass Trump….that’s a good thing.

Fuck Loser Trump, an actual loser who never once got more votes than his opponent, and created the worst economic period in American history while dividing the nation to the brink of civil war. A real loser.

Fuck you moronic treasonous Trumptards too, too dumb to see how dumb you are. Too blinded by the orange glow to notice you’re falling off a cliff. Too infantile to know what to do about your full diapers. A real bunch of losers led by the biggest loser ever. 😂

Enjoy Roevember.

I did. And I'm happy with the way things are going generally. At least, regarding Joe Biden.


Big picture: there's a lot of terrible things happening in the world. My own half-assed-survey based on personal experience: most people don't follow passing laws and what the executive branch really does with any kind of seriousness. They may self-proclaim they "like reading the news" But most people who say things like that are content with a surface understanding of what's happening.

I mean, you know inflation is up AROUND THE ENTIRE PLANET right? https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2022/06/15/in-the-u-s-and-around-the-world-inflation-is-high-and-getting-higher/


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Besides Israel, other countries with very large increases in inflation between 2020 and 2022 include Italy, which saw a nearly twentyfold increase in the first quarter of 2022 compared with two years earlier (from 0.29% to 5.67%); Switzerland, which went from ‑0.13% in the first quarter of 2020 to 2.06% in the same period of this year; and Greece, a country that knows something about economic turbulence. Following the Greek economy’s near-meltdown in the mid-2010s, the country experienced several years of low inflation – including more than one bout of deflation, the last starting during the first spring and summer of the pandemic. Since then, however, prices have rocketed upward: The annual inflation rate in Greece reached 7.44% in this year’s first quarter – nearly 21 times what it was two years earlier (0.36%).

Annual U.S. inflation in the first quarter of this year averaged just below 8.0% – the 13th-highest rate among the 44 countries examined. The first-quarter inflation rate in the U.S. was almost four times its level in 2020’s first quarter.

Regardless of the absolute level of inflation in each country, most show variations on the same basic pattern: relatively low levels before the COVID-19 pandemic struck in the first quarter of 2020; flat or falling rates for the rest of that year and into 2021, as many governments sharply curtailed most economic activity; and rising rates starting in mid- to late 2021, as the world struggled to get back to something approaching normal.

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The pattern of rising and falling inflation happened because that flu that "will just go away like a miracle" ended up affecting the whole world's economy in a somewhat predictable pattern when it comes to inflation. Maybe the people who only casually glance at the news when they are flipping channels don't know better, but come on - you know that inflation rates in the United States are not specifically Joe Biden's fault right?


You still think they are? OKAY - HOW? Exactly. Point to legislation passed or not passed and the timeline of inflation in the United States.

Something like "Here you can see inflation beginning to spike, and it's the result of XXXXXXXXX that Joe Biden did, here's exactly how what he did affects inflation in this way."


Who wants to bet $20 that I'll get some response like that? What should the odds be set at if I am 100% certain all I'll get is just some snarky bullshit from an old bullfrog.

Lol. Such stupidity @bobknight33, as expected. No facts, no arguments to make, so let’s make infantile memes to show what serious adults we are instead….and it worked exactly as expected.

BTW- $43 billion won’t solve world hunger for a month…no amount of money can. New IRS enforcement agents make the government money, they don’t waste it. When their directive is to go after rich tax cheats, not anyone making under $400k per year but those making millions and paying zero taxes, yes, that’s an amazing idea that will benefit the country greatly and pay for itself in recovered revenue.

BTW- those empty shelf pictures are from 2000….probably the homeless in cities and lines at borders too. As for vacation, Trump spent 1 out of every 3.4 days, 428 days in total, on vacation as the economy crumbled, pandemic raged, and sedition fomented. Far more than Biden, who has taken way too many days off during the economic recovery, employment boom, and waning pandemic. D’oh!

BTW-Communist China and Vietnam eradicated an enormous lions share of that extreme poverty, well over 500 million out of poverty since 2000 between just those two, going to near 0% poverty by 2015….so much for capitalism’s saving grace, eh? Are you going to go sell the benefits of communism now? Derp.

This is why morons shouldn’t argue, they often make the exact opposite point from what they intended.


🤦‍♂️

Dictionary
Definitions from Oxford

a period of temporary economic decline during which trade and industrial activity are reduced, generally identified by a fall in GDP in two successive quarters.


IF only the other fake news would step up to the plate.

Once again @newtboy you speaking from a position if ignorance.

Tesla is down 20 30% due to The economic forces not due to TESLA.
My current worry is a recession which will hurt all including Tesla stock price.. We can thank Democrat policies for steering us into this costly mess.



Tesla is expanding rapidly , Or as you indicate I am mistaken?

Q1 production over last few years.
2016 15K Vehicles
2017 25K
2018 35K
2019 77K
2020 102K
2021 180K
2022 305K

What dickhead data did you look at?

https://www.statista.com/statistics/715421/tesla-quarterly-vehicle-production/

Looks explosive to me, some can say exponential .
Maybe you dont know math that well -- And your a math teacher? So you say. Seems like you are doing a disservice to you students.

10% reduction of force of white collar jobs but hires hundred of workers for the auto lines.

Cherry picking data or do you just read headlines?


Now you push some BS just to please you ego?

"Says the guy who repeats every far right lie he hears."
I dont push lies. Just Truth That is Hunter biden in the video -- or am I wrong?


Then you write;;;;

"Then he says don’t listen to professionals or sales numbers, get your information from Tesla fan boys online exclusively."


Where did I say that? Pleas me .


Sandy Munro's team saying that the battery tech is obsolete.

Do you self a favor and look him up. He is way superior than your elitist mind is.


Difference between you and me is that you see 1 article and are now an expert.

How much articles/ videos have you watched over the last year about the EV market? 6? WOW Check out the big brain on you.


When will your ego pop?

I watch the whole thing ..

Btw @bobknight33 …. It’s obvious to those of us with brains that the rehash of the Hunter Biden nonsense is a blatant attempted red herring meant to distract from good economic news, because Cons absolutely HATE any good economic news during a Biden presidency…and we have increased GDP, massive increases in jobs (jobs, jobs, jobs….remember?), over a trillion in infrastructure to facilitate an economic recovery, increased wages, dropping fuel prices, and lots more the Cons want to ignore and deny….and you’re so ridiculous you think attacking the non political son of a politician means something besides exemplifying your kindergarten level mindset.
That’s why you posted this twice in a week…you need this distraction out there because gas prices plummeted.

Wrong is wrong, and this is wrong, you know it’s wrong, and you take great joy in it. Such a sad, grasping, ethically bankrupt fool you let Trump make you into….and you want more!

Hey, I got an idea…how about we investigate Trumps kids, who were top level unelected officials in our government after Trump installed them in top positions even though they couldn’t qualify for clearance, some because of drugs (Don Jr’s coke addiction for instance, helps him ignore the taste of Newsom’s huge cock in his girl’s mouth). How about we check their bank accounts, not just the American accounts that increased $640 million for Jared and Ivanka while working in the White House, but including their secret Chinese accounts the Chinese government uses to bribe them, and Saudi accounts the crown prince used to bribe Jared to the tune of TWO FUCKING BILLION DOLLARS, the secret Russian accounts Putin used to influence American policy, and their tens of millions in no show contracts with foreign governments that every watchdog in both countries has said clearly are bribes, the companies involved don’t meet minimum standards to even operate, much less actually do business.
You want to look at children? Start with those that were installed into high positions in government and took hundreds of millions with them when they left despite being unemployable drug fiends and morons…despite being directly involved in a failed coup against America, otherwise known as treason. You can ignore Tiffany, she wasn’t part of any administration…and forget Hunter, he isn’t either.

Such sad, weak, just pathetic attempts at meaningless distraction. Every accusation you make is an admission. Grow up, baby.

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Noooo….you still don’t like Biden. You still think self serving narcissistic Trump was a leader, but a lifelong frugal public servant isn’t. Nooooo! (I know there’s no breaking through your fantasy, bob. You are a lost cause, totally divorced from reality and totally uninterested in honesty).

No bob, I mean the Union…as in the United States of America. As in the Union vs the Confederacy. Trump nearly dissolved the Union, so much that Republican platforms now include secession as their goal. Derp. Another “L” for your column. Another dunce cap for your collection.
Republicans want to erase America out of infantile spite, but have no idea what to do afterwards. Better learn Chinese or Russian, red states can’t afford to defend themselves, you are all welfare queen states with the highest murder and crime rates.

Side note: But, this means you are anti union, so 100% anti worker? Really? What favors has Biden handed unions? Most unions (all you oppose) lobby for workers, blue collar employees. You would limit lobbiests to to those lobbying for billionaires and huge corporations (including religious corporations) that actively lobby against workers rights, pay, safety, ecological responsibility, hours, etc. Think about that.

You fucking moron, it went from 3.08% (higher than Trump ever reached) in 2015 under Obama to -3.5% in 2020 (the lowest ever in history). Who the fuck told you .2%? Who told you Trump left it at 2.5%? Overall Obama’s growth rate was actually 50% higher than Trump’s, and Obama inherited a deep recession, Trump inherited a boom. They outright lied to you, and you just lapped it up without ever looking. They’re feeding you poo pie bob, not chocolate. I really wish I didn’t have to spend so much time correcting your obviously fabricated statistics, especially since you only spout them to force a correction, getting you attention, not because you believe or even understand them. So you understand, printing 50% more money while your economy is in the worst contraction ever causes inflation, and that’s what Trump did in 2020 while focusing on the election he lost in a landslide and ignoring the pandemic and economy.

Jobs?!? Obama job growth was near 8% adding 12.5 million jobs, Trump was the only president ever to lose jobs, losing 3.2 million. Another 100% break from reality, buddy. I’m telling you, you need professional help.

Yes, Trump did turn us around, from a massive recovery and booming economy to massive economic losses, job losses, absolutely insane deficits and trying to double the debt, huge money printing in 2020 (magic wand waiving) that creates massive inflation (that he now blames Biden for), undreamed of losses of life, and teetering on the brink of depression and pandemic. He made us madder. For libs that means angry, for cons that means totally bat shit crazy with no ties to reality at all.

Far from it, lots of positive, but so much negative left from the previous one we are still in the red.

They have made policies that help the American pocketbook, Trump robbed it blind to hand to billionaires (and fake billionaires).

Who told you that lie. The Democrats have done everything they legally can to force oil companies to increase production and stop price gouging, Republicans all voted against doing anything, then claim “Biden’s fault”. No fossil fuel production has been cut. You’ve been lied to, and you aren’t intellectually honest enough to investigate for yourself…you don’t want to hear the truth.

Republicans are to blame for high fuel prices, Democrats are responsible for the recent lowering. Democrats are making efforts to lower them further, Republicans are 100% opposed to any actions.

Trump benefited on fuel costs thanks to the economic collapse he caused by denying and ignoring Covid for months, dropping the demand for fuel to nothing…not a good policy overall, or do you suggest killing another million and shutting down another year to lower gas prices?


Lol. You are claiming reports say the average American spends $500 more on fuel and goods per month than under Trump? What reports? Glen Beck, AON, or Rush Limbaugh’s ghost? Only if you are a trucker using hundreds of gallons of gas a month. Even in California, fuel cost has gone up less than 1/5 of what you say.

Trump cost you SO much more than $6k per year, over $60k per taxpayer on the official debt alone…and these extra expenses (probably $100-$200 per month tops) are thanks to Trump printing 1/3 of every dollar in circulation (inflation) and fuel supply and demand being out of hand intentionally because oil companies make more money by producing less, and aren’t nationalized so the government can’t force them to stop gouging.

Such nonsense bob. Your facts are all wrong, and since you won’t investigate you are just going to continue to believe the lies you were fed. The people you listen to are making money off your beliefs, bob, and they see you as a huge sucker they can convince of anything and get your money or support for their America destroying “get me richer quick” schemes.

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Summary, since I don’t think you can read that much.
Union = United States Union, not unions
Gdp- Obama 1.59% rising consistently during his presidency Trump 1% falling precipitously to the worst ever in history. Also never beat Obama’s high.
Jobs- Obama added 12.5 million, Trump lost 3.2 million
Debt- Obama added $9 trillion, ending a recession and creating a boom over 8 years. Trump added $8 trillion on the books (and trillions more off the books) in 4 years ending a boom and creating a recession
Deficit- 2020 was the biggest budget deficit ever by >200% at $3.13 trillion and added well over $4.2 trillion to the debt that year, way more than 2021 at a still horrific $2.7 budget deficit but ending adding only $1.5 to the debt.

https://www.thebalance.com/us-deficit-by-year-3306306

Oil/gas price - all cost cutting measures opposed by Cons.

Well, well, well... base on this reasoning, the FIRST thing we should do is bring down is the stock price of Tesla, make it into a junk stock company for those endlessly promoting Musk here. Yessssss.......

Whether oil is finite or otherwise is kind of moot when we're talking about its impact on the economic & environment at large. With the advancement of renewable, clean energy techonology and ever cheaper cost of manufacturing & generation -- without even mentioning the political shift it would bring by reducing the power & authoritarian tendencies of the OPEC countires -- it's just plain Good Business to transition as fast as possible away from oil.

The cold hard facts is, the more undereducated peoples living in the red states goes, the more hate they'll get by watching even more Fox & OAN. The more paralysed the Feds are, the more they'll blame the Democrats. The more the "little blue collar guys" get screwed by the tax-evading millionaires & billionaires, the more they think Republican's drip-drip Trickle-Down Economics works for them! These are the only ways of thinking are make sense to (i.e. drilled into) them. I'm afraid they're too far gone.