>> ^moonsammy:


Actually, and counter-intuitively, there's apparently some evidence for wearing helmets to be less safe than going without. See video here.


I've heard that argument before, I wasn't convinced then and I'm not convinced now.

Science!

>> ^ChaosEngine:

There was really no call for that. He wasn't knocked off his bike, he was minorly inconvenienced for a few seconds in traffic. If the situations were reversed (i.e. if the cyclist cut off the car and the car smashed his bike), we'd be screaming murder.
On top of that, for the simple fact that he was cycling in traffic without a helmet, the cyclist is a fucking idiot.


Actually, and counter-intuitively, there's apparently some evidence for wearing helmets to be less safe than going without. See video here.

[redacted]

>> ^Mcboinkens:

>> ^MaxWilder:
There is a lot of debate about helmets. Some claim there is no reduction in injury where helmets are mandatory. Some even claim that helmets increase certain risks. I can't find the video/article I recently saw, but you can see the controversy on the wikipedia page.


Yeah, that's why athletes don't wear helmets, right?

The argument in that article is absolutely stupid. Of course a helmet may not save you if a car crashed into you. That wasn't what it was meant for. It was meant to provide protection for your skull, in any sort of calamity. Yeah, a child may die from being strangled by the helmet, but if you would rather them risk getting a head-smash into concrete that's your own parenting decision.
There isn't "a lot" of debate, and "some" people just spout crap to get more funding.
Millions of dollars go into research on helmets every year, you really think we'd be using them if they weren't useful?

Also: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-12333783

"The most obvious reason to wear a helmet is that doing so protects you in the event of an accident. But by how much?
Back in 2001, Australian experts set out to determine just this by trawling medical literature published in the past decade.
Their analysis found that wearing a helmet cut the risk of head injury and brain injury by half, and facial injury by nearly a third."
source: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0001457500000488



http://videosift.com/video/TEDxCopenhagen-Why-We-Shouldn-t-Bike-with-a-Helmet

Interesting. It must depend where then, I'm talking about Northern suburbs, and mostly teenagers.

I totally agree with your other point.>> ^Kofi:

In Melbourne I rarely see people riding without helmets. Most of my friends have been fined and now wear helmets but I am not 100% sure that the two are linked.
The point about cars is bullshit. Cars have seatbelts, airbags, crumple zones etc. A bike = 5 feet of falling over onto some skin, some bone and your mental life. Like I said, don't wear a helmet for your sake. Wear it for the sake of the people who have to look after you when you brain turns to goo.

Because they have seatbelts to stop drivers flying out the windscreen and airbags to try and prevent their head hitting things it can still reach.

Obviously racing is far riskier, the same reason that no sensible motorcycle or mountain biker would fail to use suitable head protection.

Away from heavy traffic, I think a cycle helmet is probably not needed for a regular bicycle. However, I wouldn't be without one when sharing a road with vehicles (*shakes fist at evil buses*).

>> ^Deano:
Man's got a point about cars - why aren't they wearing helmets if it improves safety in the event of a crash? Racing drivers have them.

All right, so it is legislated... but how often do you actually see helmets used? I would guess about 50% of the time in Melbourne, and how often are tickets issued???

I'm completely unconvinced that the lego (which half the observed cyclists ignore anyway) has discouraged cycling... I suspect it's just anti-helmet propoganda.
>> ^kymbos:

Interesting, but for a Ted talk it was a bit light on information.
So is his point that requiring people to wear helmets makes them think it's a dangerous activity and therefore they are disinclined to ride? I think in addition, the image-conscious don't like helmets messing their hair and making them look uncool.
Here in Aus, we have helmets legislated, and I hear it is an impediment to ride. I even saw one study that suggested that wearing a helmet makes drivers less inclined to give you space on the road.
I would like to see the data showing that bike riding is less dangerous than driving in a car. Also that the health benefits of riding outweigh the risks by 20 times. If anyone has links, please send on.

>> ^juliovega914:

This talk was severely lacking in actual citable statistics, or explanation of said statistics. It set off my bullshit alarm.


He's just saying if you play the odds you'd be smarter to wear a helmet in your car than on a bike, which no one does.
Combined with the fact that forcing people to wear helmets on bikes puts more people in cars which leads to a WTC sized pile of bodies every month in the US alone.

It's clearly true that a city full of cyclists even without helmets is healthier, greener and nicer all round than cars; but the commercial forces that shape our lives are going in the opposite direction.

Interesting just for the absurdity of the situation, no?
The counter argument is pretty easy to sell too though..

http://youtu.be/-iaNlobvJMY

>> ^robbersdog49:

>> ^Opus_Moderandi:
Wonder if he would've been better off without the helmet...?

What? This is how bad it is with a helmet, and you think that having less protection around his head would somehow have been better? I'm betting if he'd crashed at 100mph everything would have been fine eh?


I knew it...

Your video, TEDxCopenhagen - Why We Shouldn't Bike with a Helmet, has made it into the Top 15 New Videos listing. Congratulations on your achievement. For your contribution you have been awarded 1 Power Point.

>> ^DerHasisttot:

>> ^Crosswords:
Um yeah, you know what makes me afraid to ride a bike in my city? Its not the idea of needing a helmet, its seeing the God awful drivers around my city. They have a hard time seeing me and not suddenly pulling into my lane when I'm driving a red 3k pound vehicle. I was in a near miss the other day when the car that had been driving next to me suddenly decided my lane was the one to be in. Our cars got so close I think a gnat that just happened to be between them got squished. So yeah no way in hell I'd ride a bike on the streets of this city. Even where they have bike lanes they've decided to measure about a foot away from the curb and paint a line down the normal street. So bikers have this tiny lane to stick too, and the people in cars, who already have a hard fucking time staying in their own lane, now have less room.
So yeah, I'd wager the rest of the world's cities that aren't so concerned about the danger needing a helmet might produce, and more about the danger of morons driving 2 ton boxes of steel and glass at 50 mph or more and their effect on you if the slam into you.

Are you from the US? If yes, I can understand why you wouldn't wanna ride a bicycle. On different occasions, different US friends of mine noticed independently that there are fewer car accidents in Europe/Germany. Then I researched a bit and found out that US driving tests are far easier than the german tests are; and the US tests are very possibly kept easy to have as many drivers on the roads as possible, influenced by the car and gas-industry.


I would have put it in a slightly different manner (more insults at the driverslicense"agency" what's it called -club) but that's exactly my point.
In Germany you fail the driving test (the actual driving test, not the theory beforehands) if you do one of these things once:
- miss of red light
- entering a one way from the wrong side
- missing a stop-sign
- error of priority in traffic
- ignoring any kind of prohibition sign
- not looking in all mirrors and over shoulder as you switch lines
- no blinking lights as you turn
- blinking lights as you dont turn
- no sign of caution if children, elderly or disabled people are around
- not enough distance to the car in front of you
- and a couple of more things
The test can take up to an hour of driving.
Oh yea the whole thing (driving lessons (theory and driving itself) and tests) costs around a thousand bucks.

If I would feel more save riding a bike here, I would close my eyes, stir with my feet and juggle chainsaws while I enter the AUTOBAHN.

Oh yes and to rejoin the topic: No helmet-campaign I heard of so far. No law against riding without one. Nearly all the children in the city wear one. As they get older they apparently grow out of them.

>> ^Crosswords:

Um yeah, you know what makes me afraid to ride a bike in my city? Its not the idea of needing a helmet, its seeing the God awful drivers around my city. They have a hard time seeing me and not suddenly pulling into my lane when I'm driving a red 3k pound vehicle. I was in a near miss the other day when the car that had been driving next to me suddenly decided my lane was the one to be in. Our cars got so close I think a gnat that just happened to be between them got squished. So yeah no way in hell I'd ride a bike on the streets of this city. Even where they have bike lanes they've decided to measure about a foot away from the curb and paint a line down the normal street. So bikers have this tiny lane to stick too, and the people in cars, who already have a hard fucking time staying in their own lane, now have less room.
So yeah, I'd wager the rest of the world's cities that aren't so concerned about the danger needing a helmet might produce, and more about the danger of morons driving 2 ton boxes of steel and glass at 50 mph or more and their effect on you if the slam into you.


Are you from the US? If yes, I can understand why you wouldn't wanna ride a bicycle. On different occasions, different US friends of mine noticed independently that there are fewer car accidents in Europe/Germany. Then I researched a bit and found out that US driving tests are far easier than the german tests are; and the US tests are very possibly kept easy to have as many drivers on the roads as possible, influenced by the car and gas-industry.