ReverendTed

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Happy anniversary! Today marks year number 7 since you first became a Sifter and the community is better for having you. Thanks for your contributions!

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BoneRemake

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I think I read your statment wrong at the time.

BoneRemake

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So you are all for system channels with no moderation ? like when someone goes into the channel to watch videos with that theme and they get say... carebears 20th anniversary in the *americah channel ?

Issykitty

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Np. It is a weird embed, I realize. Weird as in sucky.
In reply to this comment by ReverendTed:
In reply to this comment by Issykitty:
This video is not dead.
In reply to this comment by ReverendTed:
*dead

Yeah, it's working for me now, too. Not sure what happened.

Issykitty

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This video is not dead.
In reply to this comment by ReverendTed:
*dead

siftbot

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dag

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Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

Yes, I think so. We can look for alternative sources.
In reply to this comment by ReverendTed:
Question:
Should we call "dead" on Sifts where Embedding is disabled?

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ReverendTed

said:

@hpqp
Good points, all.
However, the "cognition is sacred" (as opposed to "human life is sacred") viewpoint has a hole in it about the size of human consciousness. (Oh man, tangent time!) Some loudly proclaim the presence of a divine soul or spirit, but there is certainly something else there, aside from the physical form. 
Obviously, human (and for that matter animal) experience and behavior is influenced by the physical brain and its processes. Damage to it predictably and reproducibly changes behavior and perception. As much as some of us would like to think otherwise, the physical structure and function of the brain influences who we are and what we do as individuals. I would honestly have no problem accepting that the physical universe as we've modeled it functions precisely as it has, autonomously. (Right down to fruitless debates between individuals on the Internet.) Evolution is a real thing. The brain has developed as yet another beneficial mutation that promotes the propagation of its host organism. Input in, behavior out, feedback loop. Click click click, ding.
But the problem is that we experience this. Somehow this mass of individual cells (and below that individual molecules, atoms, quarks) experiences itself in a unified manner, or rather something experiences this mass of matter in a unified manner. No matter how far down you track it, there's no physical accommodation for consciousness. To give a specific example, the cells in the eye detect light (intensity and wavelength) by electrochemical stimulation. The binary "yes\no" of stimulation is routed through the thalamus in individual axons, physically separated in space, to the visual cortex, where it's propagated and multiplied through a matrix of connections, but all individual cells, and all just ticking on and off based on chemical and electrical thresholds. The visual field is essentially painted as a physical map across a region of the brain, but somehow, the entire image is experienced at once. Cognition is necessarily distinct from consciousness.

What this means, practically, is that we must attribute value to cognition and consciousness separately.
Cognition may not be completely understood, but we can explain it in increasingly specific terms, and it seems that we'll be able to unravel how the brain works within the current model.  It absolutely has a value.  We consider a person who is "a vegetable" to have little to no current or expected quality of life, and generally are comfortable making the decision to "pull the plug".
Consciousness, however, is what we believe makes us special in the universe, despite being completely empty from a theoretical standpoint.  If sensory input, memory, and behavioral responses are strictly a function of the material, then stripped of those our "unified experience" is completely undetectable\untestable.  We have no way of knowing if our neighbor is a meaty automaton or a conscious being, but we assume. Which is precisely why it's special.  It's obviously extra-physical.   Perhaps @gorillaman's tomatobaby (that is, the newborn which he says is without Mind) has a consciousness, but it isn't obvious because the physical structure is insufficient for meaningful manifestation.  I have difficulty accepting that consciousness, empty though it is on its own, is without value.  "So what," though, right?  If you can't detect it in anyone but yourself, what use is it in this discussion?   Clearly, there IS something about the structure or function of the brain that's conducive to consciousness.  We are only conscious of what the brain is conscious of and what it has conceived of within its bounds.  So the brain at least is important, but it's not the whole point.
Anyway, there's that tangent.

The "stream of potential life" argument has its limits. Any given sperm or egg is exceedingly unlikely to develop into a human. For a single fertilized egg, the odds shift dramatically. That's why people seek abortions, because if they don't do something, they're probably going to have a baby. The probability of "brewin' a human" is pretty good once you're actually pregnant. The "potential for human life" is very high, which is why you can even make the quality of life argument.

Obviously, you realize how those on the anti-abortion side of the debate react when someone who is...let's say abortion-tolerant ("pro-abortion" overstates it for just about anyone, I suspect) says that they're considering the "quality of life" of the prospective child in their calculus.  They get this mental image: "Your mother and I think you'll both be better off this way, trust me. *sound of a meatball in a blender*"
I appreciate that we're trying to minimize suffering in the world and promote goodness, but I think it's over-reaching to paint every potential abortion (or even most) as a tragic tale of suffering simply because the parent wasn't expecting parenthood.  Quality of life is much more nuanced.  Many wonderful humans have risen from squalor and suffering and will tell you earnestly they believe that background made them stronger\wiser\more empathetic\special.  Many parents who were devastated to learn they were pregnant love their unexpected children.  And holy crap, kids with Downs, man.  What's the quality of life for them and their parents?  Terribly challenging and terribly rewarding.
No, I'm not trying to paint rainbows over economic hardship and child abuse and say that "everything's going to be finnnnneeee", but quality of life is a personal decision and it's unpredictable.  Isn't that what "It Gets Better" is all about?  "Things may seem grim and terrible now, but don't kill yourself just yet, you're going to miss out on some awesome stuff."

Hrm. Thus far we've really been framing abortion as being about "unready" parents, probably because the discussion started on the "mother can choose to have sex" angle.
You've got to wonder how confused this issue would get if we could detect genetically if a fetus might be homosexual. Would Christians loosen their intolerance for abortion if it meant not having a "gay baby"? (Even if it would fly in the face of their belief that homosexuality is a choice.) Would pro-choicer's take a second look at the availability of abortion? Would it still be "one of those terrible things that happens in a free society"?

On western aid, you're spot on.  It's so easy to throw money at a problem and pretend we're helping.  Humanitarian aid does nothing if we're not promoting and facilitating self-sufficiency.  Some people just need a little help getting by until they're back on their feet, but some communities need a jump-start.  As you say, they need practical education.  I've only been on handful of humanitarian missions myself, so I give more financially than I do of my sweat, but I'm careful to evaluate HOW the organizations I give to use the funds.  Are they just shipping food or are they teaching people how to live for themselves and providing the resources to get started?  Sure, some giving is necessary.  It's impossible for someone to think about sustainable farming and simple industry if they're dying from cholera or starving to death.

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