>> ^A10anis:
@ Shinyblurry's post starting with "Your welcome" (didn't quote the lot of it because i don't want that dribble being repeated below my post)

Your hypothetical story used to make a point about how you make yourself feel better was quite disturbing. Under the same logic you employed there.. if someone told you "kill 1000 babies" and all suffering would end for eternity, your story would only encourage an idiot to be a horrific murderer because of some deranged persons words.

Actually, the point of the hypothetical was to show the sloppy reasoning inherent in digging for treasure in a spot marked other than X.

>> ^A10anis:
You state "The only thing which is stopping you is pride.". No, it's the use of intelligence.
* It's not believing things because they make me feel better, or allowing me to think less because i can say magic did it.

So, how is you believing that you have a superior intellect to someone who believes in God not pride?

>> ^A10anis:
* It's the love of actually thinking about situations from a 'likely/unlikely true based on scientific reasoning' position, which is what drives human advancements forward.

Since there is no empirical evidence for or against Gods existence, how do you calculate how likely or unlikely His existence is?

>> ^A10anis:
* It's not naively thinking or pretending there are great things to learn from a disgusting book of prejudice, torture, fear and horror (i.e. kill your loved ones because you hear voices or let towns rape your daughters because they're of less value than a male stranger).

The bible, apart from the revelation of God, is a historical account of the actions of fallen men. Men who were sinners and sometimes did things which were morally wrong. That there was no effort to cover up those sins is a point in favor, not against.


>> ^A10anis:
* It's not believing claims that a book is an accurate account of history and the universe, when it gets the most basic things a God would know wrong, coincidentally these claims are just the way things would appear to a human's untrained eye (sun revolving around the planet).

If you want to address the accuracy of the bible, you must first accurately portray the bible. My guess is that you have only studied the bible through the lens of skeptics. Do you know the actual history of how this idea came about? The bible does not say the sun revolves around the earth, but it was interpreted that way by Claudius Ptolemy in the 2nd century. Claudius proposed a theory of geocentricity, which at the time, was far more accurate than the existing theory of heliocentricity, and he interpreted certain passages of scripture to support his assertion. These passages, specifically Joshua 10:12-14, and Psalm 93:1, do not teach geocentricity at all, but were taken out of context by Claudius and others to promote the theory.

>> ^A10anis:
* It's because the bible (unbelievable in it's own right), once claimed to be a book of literal truth, becomes more and more metaphorical as science stomps its way all over the human races ignorance of the universe reaching greater level's of understandings that are testable through mathematical predictions.

The scientific theories which contradict the literal truth of the bible, such as the theory of deep time, macro evolution, and abiogenesis, are not subject to empirical testing. You cannot prove these theories in a lab. They are inferences based on circumstantial evidence, and are not truly scientific. You must *believe* them, and real science is based on knowledge, not belief.

>> ^A10anis:
Quote "Yet, it wasn't evidence at all, it was simply what I preferred to be true.". Seems like not much has changed, except your preferences.

Your preaching is nothing more than the same unjustified crap that those who don't have facts to support them continue to make. IMO you've either given up on your critical analytical abilities, or you're a troll copy/pasting.. given how similar your sentences are to other preachers.

What changed is that I fairly investigated the claims of Jesus Christ, instead of dismissing them based on a superficial knowledge of Christianity. When I did that, I received supernatural evidence that they were true.

>> ^A10anis:
Christianity is a sacrificial cult, full of unsubstantiated claims.

Your gross mischaracterization not withstanding, how have you investigated the claims of Jesus Christ?

>> ^A10anis:
Jesus's so called miracles appear in many other religions, usually descriptively to the letter.

Have any actual evidence to support this claim? Be sure to include the original sources and not just the claims of skeptics.

>> ^A10anis:
Your beliefs come from a time where women were valued as little more than a discard-able possessions.

Galatians 3:28

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

Scripture teaches that woman have the same value in the eyes of God as men do. God has assigned us different roles, but he shows no partiality between men and women.

>> ^A10anis:
And If your God did exist, then said God can go fuck themselves, as i have no desire to follow the direction and teachings of a psychopathic asshole.

I would suggest it is the distorted lens through which you see God that informs your negative opinion of Him.

>> ^A10anis:
PS: although I'm not censoring myself too much, it's not my primary intention to offend you (but don't care too much either), just can't stand how people spouting this type of content can think they 'should' be taken seriously.

Atheists rarely censor themselves when they speak to Christians. Nothing you've said here is unexpected. I do not take offense at what you said; on the contrary, I care about you as a human being made in the image of God, and I see you as being worthy of love and respect. My hope is that you come to know the love of Jesus Christ. You simply have no experience of God at the moment, but God is willing to show you He is there at any time. He loves you more deeply than you understand. Draw near to Him and He will draw near to you.

@ Shinyblurry's post starting with "Your welcome" (didn't quote the lot of it because i don't want that dribble being repeated below my post)

Your hypothetical story used to make a point about how you make yourself feel better was quite disturbing. Under the same logic you employed there.. if someone told you "kill 1000 babies" and all suffering would end for eternity, your story would only encourage an idiot to be a horrific murderer because of some deranged persons words.

You state "The only thing which is stopping you is pride.". No, it's the use of intelligence.
* It's not believing things because they make me feel better, or allowing me to think less because i can say magic did it.
* It's the love of actually thinking about situations from a 'likely/unlikely true based on scientific reasoning' position, which is what drives human advancements forward.
* It's not naively thinking or pretending there are great things to learn from a disgusting book of prejudice, torture, fear and horror (i.e. kill your loved ones because you hear voices or let towns rape your daughters because they're of less value than a male stranger).
* It's not believing claims that a book is an accurate account of history and the universe, when it gets the most basic things a God would know wrong, coincidentally these claims are just the way things would appear to a human's untrained eye (sun revolving around the planet).
* It's because the bible (unbelievable in it's own right), once claimed to be a book of literal truth, becomes more and more metaphorical as science stomps its way all over the human races ignorance of the universe reaching greater level's of understandings that are testable through mathematical predictions.

Quote "Yet, it wasn't evidence at all, it was simply what I preferred to be true.". Seems like not much has changed, except your preferences.

Your preaching is nothing more than the same unjustified crap that those who don't have facts to support them continue to make. IMO you've either given up on your critical analytical abilities, or you're a troll copy/pasting.. given how similar your sentences are to other preachers.

Christianity is a sacrificial cult, full of unsubstantiated claims.
Jesus's so called miracles appear in many other religions, usually descriptively to the letter.
Your beliefs come from a time where women were valued as little more than a discard-able possessions.
And If your God did exist, then said God can go fuck themselves, as i have no desire to follow the direction and teachings of a psychopathic asshole.

PS: although I'm not censoring myself too much, it's not my primary intention to offend you (but don't care too much either), just can't stand how people spouting this type of content can think they 'should' be taken seriously.

This is EXACTLY what I was talking about with the idea of net neutrality turning into something crazy insidious. It was only a matter of time before "managed internet fairness for all" was...well "manged internet unfairness for all", I just didn't expect it to happen so rapidly, then again, I didn't think Obama would be murdering US citizens either. Things seem to be accelerating out of control; faster than you can name the rights your loosing. This is what Net Neutrality looks like over time, it looks like radio and TV...highly monitored and censored for your own good. Want to broadcast your own radio station, too bad, you need clearance from the FCC. Want to open your own website, to bad, you need clearance from the FCC. Want to host content that you didn't make yourself, to bad, you need clearance from the FCC. Government has ALREADY had this role in radio and TV for decades, it would be foolish to think they won't eventually do the same here. Being that we just singed the NDAA, pretty sure SOPA or something like it will pass during this administration. Rant over! Thanks for the links @kceaton1, here's hoping this doesn't pass during some other holiday we are all drunk for..like the NDAA did.

I got tired of marc maron years ago, listening to his air america morning show.

>> ^spoco2:

Oh man, I've been listening to WTF a fair bit lately, but yeah, Marc definitely has that 'think how everything relates back to me and how the world observes me.
If I hear him say how he was the doorman at the damn comedy club one more time to a guest. WE GET IT, you've been around for a long time. You're not super famous, get the FUCK over it.
It's the perfect recipe for self loathing and misery... always thinking about yourself rather than others. It's very much what Stephen Fry says in regards to the 'I Mode'... listen to others, be interested in others. Get out of YOUR HEAD and focus on doing things and making yourself and others happy by not whinging about what is wrong, but celebrating what is right.
>> ^rottenseed:
BTW, I started getting annoyed with Marc Maron. He comes off as a self-important sycophant to me. I think it's because he hates himself so much...>> ^kymbos:
I'm a bit sad to say I'm slowly falling out of love with Louis and Marc Maron. I'm not sure what to do about it.
Dave Chappelle, please start a twice weekly podcast, I'm begging you!

Oh man, I've been listening to WTF a fair bit lately, but yeah, Marc definitely has that 'think how everything relates back to me and how the world observes me.

If I hear him say how he was the doorman at the damn comedy club one more time to a guest. WE GET IT, you've been around for a long time. You're not super famous, get the FUCK over it.

It's the perfect recipe for self loathing and misery... always thinking about yourself rather than others. It's very much what Stephen Fry says in regards to the 'I Mode'... listen to others, be interested in others. Get out of YOUR HEAD and focus on doing things and making yourself and others happy by not whinging about what is wrong, but celebrating what is right.

>> ^rottenseed:
BTW, I started getting annoyed with Marc Maron. He comes off as a self-important sycophant to me. I think it's because he hates himself so much...>> ^kymbos:
I'm a bit sad to say I'm slowly falling out of love with Louis and Marc Maron. I'm not sure what to do about it.
Dave Chappelle, please start a twice weekly podcast, I'm begging you!

I don't need to justify my lack of belief in something for which there is no evidence. As I've said before, any other position requires you to justify your lack of belief in an infinite number of insane possibilities. You open yourself to some really silly scenarios, and make yourself into a fool.

Believing in something for which there is no evidence requires justification, if you wish to pursue it logically.

You are the one who said the laws of nature are absolute. You can't question me for using your own logic against you. I never said they were absolute (and I don't believe they are).

Basically you'll believe whatever you want. I can't stop you. But if you actually spent some time thinking about what I've said instead of thinking about counter arguments before achieving any level of understanding you might get somewhere.

I feel very sad for you.

But on a happy note, this video has gone wonderfully for Get Up, and one can only hope our darn Prime Minister legalises it...

I don't have anything against gay people. It isn't as if homosexuality is so much worse than any other sin, although all the baggage that comes with it can cause a society to become totally degenerate. Take the greeks for example.

I don't label it sin because I am afraid of it, or for a feeling of superiority. I don't think I am superior to any other human being. I call it sin because that is what God said it is. It's immoral and goes against Gods design, and nature itself. You call me intolerant but you aren't tolerant of my beliefs, so I don't think you have anything to say about tolerance.


>> ^spoco2:
Damnit SB... come here and fucking rain on a damn beautiful video.
I got into work this morning and saw the email from GetUp (the advocacy group who created this), and thought I'd give the video a watch, having no idea what it was about. I could tell there was a twist at the end... but, I guess I just don't even consider a gay relationship to be a 'twist', that it wasn't something that crossed my mind. (probably should have been, if I'd been thinking about it I would have thought what the hot topics in Australia are currently around relationships).
But really well done, really great.
It's so very sad that anyone can watch this and feel anything but joy for this 'couple' (I only put couple like that as they're actors, not real). @shinyblurry, you are filled with hate born from fear. You fear gay people because you fear anything different from your little world. You label it 'sin' to make yourself feel righteous about condemning it, but it comes down to you feeling 'icky' about two men lovin' it up because you haven't been exposed to it...
I feel very sad for you. <IMG class=smiley src="http://cdn.videosift.com/cdm/emoticon/frown.gif">
But on a happy note, this video has gone wonderfully for Get Up, and one can only hope our darn Prime Minister legalises it...

Damnit SB... come here and fucking rain on a damn beautiful video.

I got into work this morning and saw the email from GetUp (the advocacy group who created this), and thought I'd give the video a watch, having no idea what it was about. I could tell there was a twist at the end... but, I guess I just don't even consider a gay relationship to be a 'twist', that it wasn't something that crossed my mind. (probably should have been, if I'd been thinking about it I would have thought what the hot topics in Australia are currently around relationships).

But really well done, really great.

It's so very sad that anyone can watch this and feel anything but joy for this 'couple' (I only put couple like that as they're actors, not real). @shinyblurry, you are filled with hate born from fear. You fear gay people because you fear anything different from your little world. You label it 'sin' to make yourself feel righteous about condemning it, but it comes down to you feeling 'icky' about two men lovin' it up because you haven't been exposed to it...

I feel very sad for you.

But on a happy note, this video has gone wonderfully for Get Up, and one can only hope our darn Prime Minister legalises it...

I actually find it very amusing that thumpa28 provided a really good example of EXACTLY what Christina was talking about when she talked about people telling atheists to "tone it down". Thanks thumpa! Next time, perhaps you should watch the video you're commenting on before making yourself look like a buffoon.

>> ^oritteropo:

As I don't generally find suffering, human or animal, terribly humorous I don't think there's much risk of laughing.
For reference, re the comments above, the cat swung in the saying has nine strands and not four legs.>> ^Yogi:
>> ^oritteropo:
Except that it's very likely to cause serious injury to the cat, I won't be watching this one.>> ^sillma:
It is pretty cruel, but it does look pretty darn funny as well.


I agree with you, it's not right to watch it because if you love cats you might accidentally laugh and make yourself feel bad. I applaud you sir, you've avoided a genuine human moment today, bravo.



I love cats but I nearly F'n Died laughing...and then I made myself sad. I'm sure if I got a chance to punch that guy in the face I'd laugh my ass off again...ahhh different strokes.

As I don't generally find suffering, human or animal, terribly humorous I don't think there's much risk of laughing.

For reference, re the comments above, the cat swung in the saying has nine strands and not four legs.>> ^Yogi:

>> ^oritteropo:
Except that it's very likely to cause serious injury to the cat, I won't be watching this one.>> ^sillma:
It is pretty cruel, but it does look pretty darn funny as well.


I agree with you, it's not right to watch it because if you love cats you might accidentally laugh and make yourself feel bad. I applaud you sir, you've avoided a genuine human moment today, bravo.

>> ^oritteropo:

Except that it's very likely to cause serious injury to the cat, I won't be watching this one.>> ^sillma:
It is pretty cruel, but it does look pretty darn funny as well.



I agree with you, it's not right to watch it because if you love cats you might accidentally laugh and make yourself feel bad. I applaud you sir, you've avoided a genuine human moment today, bravo.

Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows.

I was an agnostic until I was suddenly given special revelation of Gods existence.
I found out later that this means I am elected, in that God already knew before He made anything that He would create me here and now for His purposes
Some Christians think everyone is elected. I don't, personally.

All I have to say is get the fuck over yourselves. You're not as smart as you think you are. How about you be honest and stop playing the philosophical gotchya game and admit there isn't a shred of evidence in your corner, what so ever, and if we want to get real, morality is inconvenient for your sinning so of course it has to go

Lacking an objective standard for morality, what makes it wrong? Why is it bad to have sex with animals, hurt people, rape people..

Now on your example of rape victims, there are different translations for the particular hebrew word. It's not clear that is what it is talking about. However, I'll address it in the literal sense, though I won't commit myself to this definition. Sex is considered the spiritual act of marriage. When people have relations they are cleaved together in the spirit. That's why fornication is forbidden. So, whether it was unfortunate or not, the couple were married spiritually at that point and thus they would only compound the sin by being seperated.

What Dan Savage does isn't sex. It's consensual sodomy. Thats part of what evil does is redefine the meanings of things. The love that two gay men have for eachother is not beautiful, it is repulsive. God does not approve of their union, and they should never be married. What they love is sin, and sin is not beautiful. It is an abomination before the Lord.

fornication is just plainly a sin, and for the reason that sex is a spiritual marriage between two people. You are spiritually joined to whomever you have sex with, forever.
maybe you reprobates can't imagine giving up your carnal lusts because its what you're living for, but that lifestyle is meaningless, sad and no better than what animals do.

Do you have even a modicum of dignity or self respect? You have promoted yourself as a harlot and you draw mens attention with lasciviousness. You are prostituting yourself and it is revolting.

If you care to give an argument that isn't based on hyperbole, I might actually engage you. Otherwise, you're just making yourself look foolish, even if the ignoramouses on this site happen to agree with you. Any objective person who has studied this at length would find your conclusions childish at best.

I find it amusing that atheists like to say they are all great happy loving people who actually do more good works than the average Christian does. LOL This must be your non-neckbearded internet dwelling variety. Not at all the bitter, purile, egotists who love to trash believers at any opportunity that I've experienced. I'm sorry but atheists are terrible people. Immoral, selfish and apathetic to a T. Violent and angry too. Atheists are usually the worst kind of people you could imagine.

I'm not surprised by the bias of the sift, nor the childish behavior of its members..I was interested if anyone here had an inherent sense of fairness and could look past their own bias..but I guess not

Christians love atheists..just because we think you're wrong doesn't mean we don't love you. Atheists on the other hand seem to have nothing but hatred and derision for us..

You have the gall to impringe on my witness and imply im crazy..hey, at least im internally consistant.

I really think passive aggressive people are the worst kind of people besides atheists. Put them together and you've got a front seat to the 7th circle of hell. To me, you might as well be banging rocks together if you don't know you have a soul, or there is a God. People like this are mostly automated because they don't really know how anything works, or that God controls everything.

I don't deride anyone who doesn't believe me, I just happen to know anyone who isn't interested has become self-satisfied with the worldly understanding..which is worthless.

you can always look back on the glory days when you were a talking turd on the internet..

if he wants to be civil and converse like real people instead of rabid animals, I'll be here.


How is it that atheists seem to believe they can just go around and treat someone like garbage and talk down to them like children because they think they're right about something..why is this socially acceptable?

Yes, you're free to do whatever you want. Like any other slack jawed yokel idiot, you can live life the charlie sheen way, shallowly indulging yourself in all the puerile tripe you identify with a winning lifestyle.

You'll get to mock God for a little while and do what you want, until His mercy runs out and He takes you off of this world. You'll be found guilty at the judgement and then you'll join the devil and his angels in the lake of fire. Do you think you'll think it was worth it then? I'm betting not.

If you want to have an actual debate on civilized terms, I'll engage you. I've already answered enough of this bullshit. God is sovereign and can adjudicate His creation as He pleases. He destroyed the entire world in a flood, and that's everyone on the planet except for 8 people or so, and I don't think He was wrong.
Personally, if I was God I probably would have blown this fucking planet up a long time ago.
It's not an atrocity to take a life when you were the one who granted it in the first place and the one who sustained it daily.

What is contemptible, vainglorious and infinitely evil is the desire to disobey God and sin without consequence. Anyone who adovocates that deserves their punishment.

Gay rights? Sinners have no rights, they are a slave to sin. America is becoming more like babylon every day, especially in what it deserves as punishment for its actions.

Apparently homosexual atheists are in force these days.

as usual the sift turns off its brain

I am a highly rational and logical person , who has reasoned these things out to a much deeper level than any of you would be willing to give me credit for

You're entitled to your malformed, tumor-swollen opinion. Mine happens to have biblical justification.

In the context of a bunch of googly eyed mouth breathers saying God doesn't exist, where Satans special little helpers file in to preach their faith, not much is going to come out of this which is positive.

Wow, emote much? See what actually happened here is that you posted a bunch of information that wasn't true (while being rude and childish to boot), and I corrected you. Now, you send me a comment filled with personal attacks and call me immature. I'm guessing you're probably..15? Give me a break. Go do your homework and clean your room while you're at it.

I have better things to do than waste my time arguing on the internet for fun, and it's not fun to argue.

I'm commanded by God to preach the gospel and it's a joy for me to do so. I also enjoy a lively debate. That's why I am here.

You ever notice how hypocrites usually contridict themselves within a few sentences? I do..

The devil was once an ArchAngel who was created faultless,
He was in fact just an arrogant, prideful being who wanted all the power for himself.

One day, people will thank me for opening their mind up to how they've been lied to every day of their life and indoctrinated into a world system thats literally trying to drag them straight to hell.

Satan has you.

You need professional help. Seriously. Not kidding about this.



Preach on, brotherman. It's a sick kind of irony to do the very same thing you're accusing someone else of doing, especially whilst doing said accusing.



>> ^shinyblurry:

You think you were sent by God? Try again..
And no, being openly degraded and treated as inhuman isn't something I enjoy. I would rather have a civil conversation any day.

In reply to this comment by oritteropo:
You know, someone has tried that excact clip, and only got 5 votes - http://videosift.com/video/Sesame-Street-Elmos-Song

Other Elmo ones have got as many as 135 votes - http://videosift.com/video/Elmo-Interviews-Ricky-Gervais

You'd be surprised what will do well here sometimes

Your two PQ'd on 9 videos would probably sift if you ran them through beggar's canyon on a Thursday or Friday (to get the weekend traffic), and then you would only need to post a handful more to get bronze (says the newbie to the long standing member!). If you renew your membership, a promote would be even better.

On re-reading your comment below, I'd like to clarify that I only ever meant to ban self promotion during an anonymous week contest, not in general, and it's certainly quicker to promote than to go out vote whoring the hard way.
In reply to this comment by Truckchase:
Ahhh, that explains it, mine aren't old enough to like anything but "Elmo's song" yet. Doubt that would get many votes.

In reply to this comment by oritteropo:
We might not quite be on the same page, but I think we're in the same chapter. I agree with everything you said here, except the part about changes being required to get there

I can confirm that children are no impediment to success here. In my case, I've had more success with ones my children like (or that I looked up for them) than the ones that I posted just because I liked them. They are usually only demanding until they're asleep

I'm quite surprised that BT and FA followed us here for this conversation too, even though I hang out in their corner of the sift. Perhaps they read the recent comment stream?
In reply to this comment by Truckchase:
Sounds good. At the end of the day I don't think video quality voting should be based on personal loyalty. You must have made quite an impression already to have a couple really great guys (BT, FA) on the sift upvoting your personal comment to some random dude.

If you're willing to take the time to make yourself an integral part of this community the perspective of favoring loyalty votes and disallowing self promotion will work well for you. On the other hand, I'm in favor of measures to empower those who don't devote much time to the site but enjoy it and the people just as much. (i.e. me; my kids are demanding) I would also argue that it would be healthier for the site and the community as a whole to welcome such measures since the attitude of person-to-person loyalty will endure regardless of the obstacles placed in front of it. The last thing I think you really want here is an echo chamber despite how appealing it may seem at face value.

I agree with that statement. Additionally, that bastard Elmo is riding Ricky Gervais' coattails.

You know, someone has tried that excact clip, and only got 5 votes - http://videosift.com/video/Sesame-Street-Elmos-Song

Other Elmo ones have got as many as 135 votes - http://videosift.com/video/Elmo-Interviews-Ricky-Gervais

You'd be surprised what will do well here sometimes

Your two PQ'd on 9 videos would probably sift if you ran them through beggar's canyon on a Thursday or Friday (to get the weekend traffic), and then you would only need to post a handful more to get bronze (says the newbie to the long standing member!). If you renew your membership, a promote would be even better.

On re-reading your comment below, I'd like to clarify that I only ever meant to ban self promotion during an anonymous week contest, not in general, and it's certainly quicker to promote than to go out vote whoring the hard way.
In reply to this comment by Truckchase:
Ahhh, that explains it, mine aren't old enough to like anything but "Elmo's song" yet. Doubt that would get many votes.

In reply to this comment by oritteropo:
We might not quite be on the same page, but I think we're in the same chapter. I agree with everything you said here, except the part about changes being required to get there

I can confirm that children are no impediment to success here. In my case, I've had more success with ones my children like (or that I looked up for them) than the ones that I posted just because I liked them. They are usually only demanding until they're asleep

I'm quite surprised that BT and FA followed us here for this conversation too, even though I hang out in their corner of the sift. Perhaps they read the recent comment stream?
In reply to this comment by Truckchase:
Sounds good. At the end of the day I don't think video quality voting should be based on personal loyalty. You must have made quite an impression already to have a couple really great guys (BT, FA) on the sift upvoting your personal comment to some random dude.

If you're willing to take the time to make yourself an integral part of this community the perspective of favoring loyalty votes and disallowing self promotion will work well for you. On the other hand, I'm in favor of measures to empower those who don't devote much time to the site but enjoy it and the people just as much. (i.e. me; my kids are demanding) I would also argue that it would be healthier for the site and the community as a whole to welcome such measures since the attitude of person-to-person loyalty will endure regardless of the obstacles placed in front of it. The last thing I think you really want here is an echo chamber despite how appealing it may seem at face value.