this mask isnt for stopping the spread of infection. its for training in low oxygen environments or at altitude, so you perform better when surrounded by more oxygen.

I thought I addressed that. Travel was also open between states, and many countries with "free travel amongst nations" had no-travel/stay at home orders in place, unlike the U.S., and afaik, mandatory quarantine for all international travelers.

Again, because he eradicated the international Global Health Security and Biodefense unit, I can legitimately ascribe every single non Chinese death and most Chinese deaths to his actions directly. A pandemic on this level WAS foreseen after SARS, Ebola, and Swine Flu, it's why we created the GHSB. It's why we had a pandemic response plan that Trump completely ignored and actually denied it existed for months and months.

I also am going by facts. My facts say that at least four things Trump did against professional advice took us from prepared to minimise any pandemic to at worst a foreign epidemic to a place where months after pandemics start our leader denied any danger and made no moves to stop it.
1) Eradication of the GHSB, missed opportunity one to have zero US cases and avoid a pandemic completely.
2) Repeated early public denial of the danger while encouraging others to do the same and go about business as usual, missed opportunity two to have zero US cases, and a missed opportunity to minimize any spread if quarantining travelers (something else he failed miserably to even consider early on) failed.
3) Encouragement of those who trust him to ignore all mitigation efforts, don't mask, don't social distance, don't shut down non essential businesses, don't close schools, don't listen to medical professionals....missed opportunity number three to minimize US infections to thousands instead of hundreds of thousands. Remember the many months he said grandma would gladly die to get people back to work, pretending many months in that only feeble octogenarians get sick?
4) Denial of a prepared response plan, never following it and claiming total ignorance, missed opportunity number four to follow prepared plans based on science from day one, missing the opportunity to keep our infection rate at S Korean levels.

That's four well researched and vetted moronic, irrational, and irresponsible mistakes he personally made that multiplied our infection rate by 100- infinity times (if we could have had zero without his multiple massive and stupid mistakes, which is not just possible but likely, he can be said to have CAUSED every single US case, multiplying our infections by infinity.). There were more, but I'm beating a dead horse.
Remember, his real plan was natural herd immunity, with an expected 3-60 million deaths depending on who you asked.

I say if intelligent decisions could have avoided all US infections, and that's undeniable IMO, you can lay the blame for as high a percentage as you like on the leader who made bad dangerous decisions out of pure narcissistic ignorance and hatred of his predecessor...up to 100%. 80-90% still seems like I'm coddling him, at least two failures could have made cases zero, and others minimized it to under 10% of what we have. All four I listed almost certainly allowed >90% giving every doubt and giving him all possible credit....so yes, I'm satisfied I'm not exaggerating.

Obama's responsible and responsive planning and execution stopped Ebola from ever spreading here despite it making it to our shores, and it was FAR more contagious and deadly. Had we had Trump then doing the same things, there would be tens of millions dead and likely still spreading disease, imo.


Edit: let me try analogy...If a mayor removes the stop signs from 4 way highway intersections, they are responsible for every wreck that happens, even though other towns with stop signs still have wrecks at intersections. Trump pulled the signs, removed the flashing red light, and cut first responder funding, and claimed there never was a highway code to follow and he takes no responsibility for the jump in highway deaths.

Yes, they had isolation we don't, but also had fewer resources to work with by far, and are much closer to the outbreak in China with tons of travel between countries. I would say having a reasonable, thoughtful population that wanted to avoid being someone who spread the virus and killed people, so followed instructions nearly without exception, compared to the U.S. who had a leader denouncing closings, masks, and social distancing and a population that was happy to spread the disease for political reasons. I think that has WAY more to do with our horrific , worst on the planet per capita despite the most resources by far outcome.

We only have two borders to close. Canada is easy, just ask nicely and they'll stay home. The border with Mexico is a problem, granted, I found it odd Trump didn't use emergency powers to finish his fence when he had a legitimate reason, but that would mean admitting Covid is dangerous, but if we cooperated with Mexico to secure the border we could have minimized all international travel early.

Back to Canada, with two open borders. They have 23000 and a population of 37.59 million, so they also have a per capita death rate well under 1/2 ours, close to 1/3, and they also could have done better if we had done better. It's impossible to figure out what percentage of their infections came from the U.S., but it's definitely a significant number.

Other nations have divisions, if not states, provinces, prefecture, or some other separation of areas. I don't agree that because we have states in our country we are like the EU, because a federal law or executive order covers all states and territories, the EU has no such mechanism as far as I know.

We were the only nation with an international Global Health Security and Biodefense unit, with teams in China and elsewhere, designed to identify new diseases early to avoid pandemics. Trump is totally responsible for dismantling that office, meaning there's a likelihood every non Chinese death and most Chinese deaths would have been avoided had Trump not been butt hurt over a good system set up by Obama. His racist and political hatred put the planet at risk. That alone puts most deaths, U.S. and global, directly on his hands.

Also, the EU population is double ours, meaning with all the multiple open borders and haphazard mix of regulations from different countries, and the enormous immigrant populations, and some actual temporary lockdowns in some of their countries (but not all by far) their infection/death rates are barely over 1/2 what ours are per capita. That's not on par, sorry.

Some of their leaders have some blood on their hands because of poor or slow decisions, but few actually fought against all science and public health measures, denying the mortality rates and doctor's recommendations to convince their populations to do nothing at all to mitigate the pandemic...Brazil did....look at them now. Yes, the president of Brazil absolutely has blood on his hands, and his response mirrored Trump's.

I'm regurgitating the numbers Dr Birx used, and comparing our outbreak to other nations that took it seriously like S Korea and New Zealand. If we had used the same serious action S Korea had, our death rate per 100000 would be an astonishing 1/60th of what our death rates were in the first 6 months or so. Just universal mask wearing would have cut our deaths by an estimated >1/4, 130000 fewer deaths, and slowed the rate of new cases significantly, but Trump fought against them.

Here's the link on that data...., granted slightly dated.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/10/23/how-many-coronavirus-deaths-are-truly-attributable-trump/

Remember, the Whitehouse said 100000-240000 possible deaths, around the same time Trump said deaths would never rise over 20000, using the lower of those numbers and blaming Trump's policies for the excess we are >80% his fault now, using Trump's promised numbers over 96% are blood on his hands.

There's also the fact that after knowing about the uncontrolled epidemic in WuHan Trump let over 40000 people (just not Chinese nationals) back in the country from that region with no tests available and no quarantine except for those obviously extremely sick. An immediate and actual travel lockdown could have made our deaths zero, and definitely would have made them exponentially lower.

Then there's the dismantling of the Global Health Security and Biodefense unit he closed that likely could have identified the outbreak in China much earlier and again, made our numbers zero. It's exactly what they were created to avoid.

I honestly feel 80- 90% was being generous, in fact there's a real possibility that a thoughtful adult president would have made any number of intelligent decisions, any one of which could have avoided the pandemic altogether or minimized infections enormously, even minimizing the Chinese epidemic.

I do agree, Biden is doing much better at taking it seriously and acting like rapid vaccination is important, but still isn't doing enough. I would prefer an enforced national mask mandate, mandatory social distancing, school closings until vaccination saturation, etc until we have herd immunity....not half assed measures like 50% capacity at bars and restaurants, with few business shutdowns and zero enforcement, pretending it's over every time infection rates dip.

Anybody else remember "Threshold" from 2005-6?
This is a sign of alien infection.

Trump cared more than Biden.

I've always cared. Come in legally, so you wont end up trafficked and or packed in Covid infected cages.

So are you finally realizing Trump had a better plan?

What?

Nice you FINALLY have come around to the fact that Biden won not only the election but also the electoral college and the presidency....but things are far from fine thanks to the inconceivable incompetence from the last administration.

The Trump pandemic, thanks to zero leadership and seeming intentional sabotage by the outgoing administration, is the worst it’s ever been, things aren’t fine. It is the absolute wrong time to “open up and go about your business “. That’s simply asinine. It’s time to enforce stay at home orders and public masking, social distancing, etc by arresting and putting anti maskers and idiots who won’t social distance in prison. Put them in the Maricopa tent prison, feed them green bologna. Sorry, the prison hospital is full, just don’t be sick. That methodology worked in other countries, maybe because their government didn’t support and encourage anti maskers, anti social distancers, COVID deniers, didn’t give up on control in favor of disasterous herd immunity (except Sweden who abandoned it), nor did they encourage the civil unrest, attacks on government officials, super spreader events, refusal of all public health orders, and denial of the virus.

Nice that you’ve FINALLY come around to the truth that the Trump pandemic is real, not a hoax, not a mild flu. It only took nearly 500000 dead Americans to convince you. Of course, you’ll never admit you were wrong no matter how many are dead because of those mistaken beliefs.

This is a nationwide issue, not a state issue. The federal government needs to divert funds, manpower, facilities, ppe, equipment, logistics, vaccines, testing, and training. Operation warp speed failed on every count.

Since not getting treatment is a national public health issue as well as a personal issue, it is a federal issue. Poor people not getting testing or treatment spreads disease to everyone, not just to more poor people you don’t care about. This means yes, the fed should pay for medical treatment as a public health expense, especially since this public health disaster was exacerbated if not caused by the total failure of the federal government to act. Korea was infected the same day, they barely had an issue compared to the US.

Because you simply can’t get a funeral nationwide, and have no choice but to use the few facilities that will accept a body no matter the cost or service, and because this is a federal health emergency, this is a federal issue.

States have been BEGGING for this assistance and more for almost a full year now, your implication that states just need to ask for help is a proven falsehood. The federal government under Trump actually worked against states procuring their own supplies while telling them to procure their own supplies. Repeatedly, when states found the supplies they needed, the federal government would confiscate them, then hand the supplies over to private businesses to resell them to the states to the point that states stopped telling the fed they had found supplies and shipped them in secret to avoid having them stolen. We can only hope Biden has dismantled that ridiculous system the Trump administration set up.

Oh fuck, Bobby...20 lies to debunk? You suck.

1) and how many lost?...tens of millions
2) citation needed, and even if true, there are many more unemployed too, there are more of us. What you neglect is that there are more trying to work because it’s impossible to live on one average income and even children have to work to pay the family bills
3) citation needed, and lost how many millions? The net has been a loss of manufacturing, most of his gains never materialized
4) for one quarter after declining at the fastest rate in history for two. If I drop you off a 100’ cliff yesterday, then lift you up by 6’ today, I still made your position much worse even though it’s incredibly better than yesterday when you were falling...I don't get kudos for picking you up after stomping you into the dirt.
5) economic growth the quarter before reduced by what was it, >30%? That’s still a loss, dummy. See #4
6) new unemployment claims hit 50year highs for 3 quarters before, and new rules take many unemployed off the list so it looks better for Donny. The unemployment rate is still historically high
7)average household income has decreased. Rich became much richer, poor became poorer. Average Americans saw a loss in income
8 ) already discussed unemployment, you’re misstating or obfuscating the whole picture
9) anyone suspected of being undocumented is removed from the list....not an honest number by far
10) more fake numbers
11) more fake numbers
12) more fake numbers
13) more fake numbers
14) more fake numbers

Here’s the real data, notice only three states weren’t in the worst unemployment position ever last year.... https://www.bls.gov/web/laus/lauhsthl.htm
Also note not a single one is at it’s historic low unemployment, and most saw record high unemployment rates for most of 2020.
I give him credit, at the beginning of 2020, before he screwed it all up with his failures over the Trump pandemic, about 1/3 of states were near record unemployment by the newer standards. I have to wonder how much of those gains were due to changing g the criteria for counting the unemployed.
When you drop your victim in a 100’ hole you don’t get kudos for throwing them a 6’ ladder
15) you mean thrown out of the programs, there’s more need than anytime since the Great Depression. It's incredibly dishonest to make qualifying for assistance far more difficult, then use the lower numbers of people who qualify as proof you improved conditions. Utter bullshit.
16) they’ve pledged that before. Call me when they graduate, until then it’s another empty promise
17) citation? Probably a Trump speech talking point
18) it was Christmas...they ALWAYS surge in Dec, usually by a ton more than this year. Let’s see the yearly number for 2020. I don’t believe for a second it was better than 2019...citation? Oops, looked it up, declined, didn’t go up. I think you’re looking at predictions for December, they were WAY below predictions.

US Retail Sales Unexpectedly Drop in December
US retail trade fell 0.7 percent from a month earlier in December 2020, following a revised 1.4 percent decline in November and compared with market expectations of a flat reading. That was also the third consecutive month of decline in consumption, amid record COVID-19 infections, high unemployment levels and lack of government's support. Receipts declined at electronics & appliance stores (-4.9 percent vs -8.3 percent in November), restaurants and bars (-4.5 percent vs -3.6 percent), food & beverage stores (-1.4 percent vs 1.5 percent), general merchandise stores (-1.2 percent vs -1.3 percent), sporting goods, hobby, musical instrument & books stores (-0.8 percent vs -1.7 percent), and furniture stores (-0.6 percent vs -2.1 percent). In addition, online trade slumped 5.8 percent, accelerating from a 1.6 percent decrease in the previous month.

19) not for people making less than millions a year, our tax cuts were minimal, temporary, and unnoticeable. What’s the debt now? He cut revenue and increased spending....thanks to failing to deal with COVID, it’s likely he doubled the debt. What was the low estimate, >$6trillion in unplanned off the budget socialist handouts to fix his lack of a public pandemic plan. This year the debt is going to outpace gdp....the deficit was up by 35% BEFORE the Trump recession.
$300 billion didn't leave...that number was the total high estimate of businesses that said they were moving off shore because they didn't want to pay taxes or said they would move back...if you believe him...and it was only for one quarter, a one time gain at a cost of >$1.2 trillion per year In lost tax revenue. Great plan. It was a one time thing, and much of that business left anyway within the year. GM plant? Foxconn? Harley Davidson? How much of that claimed $300 Billion was based on promises that never materialized?

20) not most small businesses, only those making what was it, >$500000 a year? That’s not most “small businesses “....and that tax rate is temporary, phased out completely after 10 years, corporate tax rates and rates for billionaires is permanent.

You must ignore or fake all economic data from 2020 to make these claims, and even then they would be dishonest exaggeration based on baseless claims from a constant liar.

Not one point you made is honest...that’s why you can’t provide references or citations, you would be embarrassed to admit it all came straight from Don the con’s lying mouth and not organizations that professionally study these claims.

Now, he is infected with the virus.

130 infected secret service agents is what the biggest spreader, Trump, has now.
Odd, covid didn't disappear on the day after the election. Must be a liberal plot.

10 million cases, just under 250000 dead with over 1000 more dying daily, (that's 2.5% mortality) over a million disabled, 2 million hit with massive hospital bills, and rising faster than ever. Good thing it's mission accomplished.
🤦‍♂️

Trump's response...give me more money for lawsuits that really pays my debts. Pence's response, finally a meeting of the covid response team in which he refused to wear a mask or social distance.

Fake leaders, and now fake fundraising for fake lawsuits. Mortgage your house and pony up, buddy. Trump wants your cash NOW!

His personal lack of planning, lack of concern, and total ineptitude caused it. Because he isn't a leader, he shirks responsibility, but the responsibility is his, personally.

And he did it again, 17 more of you chumps were hospitalized for heat stroke/exhaustion after another super spreader rally yesterday. When fire trucks and paramedics showed up to help the people collapsed on the ground, Trump actually suggested they might be the enemy attacking his crowd, saying "lets find out if they're friend or foe, and if they're foe let's take care of this", telling the crowd to attack the first responders who were trying to save their lives if they suspect they might be non cultists... he's so incredibly clueless and irresponsible, and he doesn't care if you die as long as you vote for him first.

How many have had to be hospitalized after Biden rallies? ZERO.


At this point, it's a certainty that his Petri dish events have killed at least hundreds by infecting thousands, in every state he visits there's a corresponding massive spike in cases and deaths a week or so later, contact traced back to his rallies every time. This is forcing new lockdowns and has already overrun the medical system in many areas.

Side note, he's socialistically dumping the problems on the first responders in the areas too, having made no plans or contingencies for these foreseeable fiascos, costing the local towns tens of thousands to millions in unrecoverable tax dollars to clean up his messes, and he still hasn't even paid for his rallies from 2016 in most cases, costing dozens of cities millions each for events he put on with the agreement to pay for them, agreements he consistently welches on.

As for his idiotic herd immunity plan guaranteed to kill at least 8 million Americans and likely to kill more like 50-75 million thanks to a total overrun of the medical system causing a lack of treatment for most, virologists have determined the immunity it might give the population wouldn't last one year before the virus mutates enough to reinfect everyone, starting the pandemic cycle over.

But you fell for the idea because you a low IQ tool.

And this is you guy you voting for?

🤦‍♂️

By getting more votes.

He can accomplish this by not holding super spreader events daily.

Contact tracing has proven that Trump's cult meetings are all turning out to be super spreader events that are partially responsible for the second (being called a third) wave of infections, now at the highest level ever and rising while the Whitehouse completely gave up fighting it just in time for flu season.
Every cult meeting makes the lockdown longer and the economic and human damage greater.

Sane people understand.

Every trump chump rally has been a super spreader event.

According to public health officials in five different cities in three different States, Donald Trump's rallies have in fact been super spreader events for COVID-19 and the health officials looked at the hospitalization rates in their areas, the number of people hospitalized with COVID-19, the number of new COVID-19 cases and through contact tracing, were able to determine that these were people who attended Trump's rally or have been in close contact with people who attended Trump's rallies.
These were two in Pennsylvania, two in Minnesota, and one in Wisconsin. These took place several weeks ago, kind of before the really big rally blitz that he has been on the past 10 days.

He may singlehandedly be responsible for the second wave that's starting, Friday was the worst day for infections and hospitalization, Saturday was the second worst. You morons are killing yourselves off for Trump, and those that can get into a hospital and survive the ICU have an average $80000 bill, not including those that require lifelong care from brain damage or lung failures.

I hope Biden makes owning a maga hat the one pre existing condition that invalidates covid coverage, and insurance companies deny you all.

She refused to answer most questions relative to the job...and was dumbfounded by the most basic, simple question. If he hadn't told her there are five rights she would have answered "freedom of speech" and thought she answered well. She only answered softball questions and pats on the back before this. I can do that all day long.

Oh Bobby. Did bad man make Bobby cwy huwt? Yes, orangutan's bad, but he's not alone. I obviously see far more than just rage, but it is enraging for patriots to see a convicted con man and thief in the Whitehouse costing us trillions and hundreds of thousands of deaths being propped up by our enemies.

No Bob, I clearly don't prefer republicans who fit the definition you came up with...uneducated in crime, that doesn't fit the criminal republicans unless you mean uneducated in fighting crime, then check, rat infected Republican cities (big towns, but we'll humor you) that fits, debauchery (congratulations on looking up the spelling) holy shit does that describe Republicans more than democrats, keeping poor people poor, check republicans, doubly so if you make that poor black people.

Sorry sweetheart. Red Tsunami 2018 + 2020

2020- thanks trump.