Run The Jewels - JU$T

Mastered economics 'cause you took yourself from squalor (Slave)
Mastered academics 'cause your grades say you a scholar (Slave)
Mastered Instagram 'cause you can instigate a follow (Shit)
Look at all these slave masters posin' on yo' dollar (Get it? Yeah)

Look at all these slave masters (Ayy) posin' on yo' dollar (Get it? Yeah)
Look at all these slave masters (Ayy) posin' on yo' dollar (Get it?)
Look at all these slave masters (Ayy) posin' on yo' dollar (Get it? Yeah)
Look at all these slave masters

Ayy
Business time, I'm on mine, I be mindin' mine (Make money)
Every time on my grind, I'm just tryna shine (Stay sunny)
Make a dollar, government, they want a dozen dimes (No cap)
The petty kind, might kill ya 'cause they see you shine (Stay strapped)
I done had to have a talk with myself plenty times (For real)
Am I a hypocrite 'cause I know I did plenty crimes? (Yes, I'm is)
I get broke too many times, I might slang some dimes (Back to trappin')
You believe corporations runnin' marijuana? Ooh (How that happen?)
And your country gettin' ran by a casino owner (Ooh)
Pedophiles sponsor all these fuckin' racist bastards (They do)
And I told you once befo' that you should kill your master (It's true)
Now that's the line that's probably gon' get my ass a-assassinated (Yeah-yeah, yeah)

Master of these politics, you swear that you got options (Slave, yeah)
Master of opinion 'cause you vote with the white collar (Slave)
The Thirteenth Amendment says that slavery's abolished (Shit)
Look at all these slave masters posin' on yo' dollar (Get it?)

Look at all these slave masters (Ayy) posin' on yo' dollar (Get it? Yeah)
Look at all these slave masters (Ayy) posin' on yo' dollar (Get it?)
Look at all these slave masters (Ayy) posin' on yo' dollar (Get it? Yeah)
Look at all these slave masters

(Confucius say)
Man, you better duck out, get the bag and then bug out (Uh)
Try to run home, you might run your luck out
'Cause just when your bases loaded
They'll roll a grenade in the dugout (You're out)
Earth folk, not a mellow bunch
We got our thumbs in the air like Hell or bust (Uh)
Look at who we done blessed with our trust
I don't think we'll be left with too much
Hand on my heart and my mind on my drugs
Got a Vonnegut punch for your Atlas shrug
They love to not love, it's just that dumb
Lord, sweet Buddha, please make me numb
Brain bounce off walls like a sentient Roomba
Just found out his creator's stupid
Lit by the supermoon, I'm too lucid
Plus got shrooms in the blood, I'm zoomin'
Beep beep, Richie, this is New York City
The X on the map where the pain keep hitting
Just us ducks here sitting
Where murderous chokehold cops still earnin' a livin'
Funny how some say money don't matter
That's rich now, isn't it? Get it? Comedy
Try to sell a pack of smokes to get food
Get killed and it's not an anomaly
But hey, it's just money

Mastered economics 'cause you took yourself from squalor (Slave, yeah)
Mastered academics 'cause your grades say you a scholar (Slave)
Mastered Instagram 'cause you can instigate a follow (Shit, yeah)
Look at all these slave masters (Yeah-yeah)
Let it sink in (Yeah)

20/20, run the map
Raw, I'm uncut in my hourglass
Don't watch it spill to the bottom half
You see the piece, now run it fast
On the tarmac in a Starter jack
C4 when I run it back
Like a track star run a record lap?
Nah, like when his needle catch (Yeah)
Clean look, poet pugilist
A shooter's view, a Zapruder flick (Yeah)
Too rude for ya rudiments
Who convinced you you could move against the crew in this?
Comin' up through the fence
Offshore outta Port-au-Prince (Yeah)
Louverture left his fingerprints
On our hearts at the gate and the world our residence
How can we be the peace
When the beast gonna reach for the worst? (Yeah)
Tear all the flesh off the Earth
Stage set for a deafening reckoning
Quick like the pace of a verse
So I'm questioning this quest for things
As a recipe for early death threatening (Yeah)
But the breath in me is weaponry
For you, it's just money

Varoufakis' Op-Ed in the Guardian closes with a remark that should be featured much more prominently in any discussion about the EU or the EZ:

"Based on months of negotiation, my conviction is that the German finance minister wants Greece to be pushed out of the single currency to put the fear of God into the French and have them accept his model of a disciplinarian eurozone."

It is about the Franco-German dynamic within the EU and whether or not the monetarists in Germany -- the recession cult, as Bill Mitchell put it -- get to keep the rest of the EU in a permanent chokehold.

They pulled too close, fired way to fast, even the judge agreed. Yes, some blame falls on the parents, but how many cops are being shot and killed vs citizens at this point?

When does officer safety trump the fact that they are supposed to serve and protect, not shoot at the first option and sort it out later? They fired on Tamir within 2 Seconds of arriving on scene, 2 seconds...

What is even more disturbing about this case is, after shooting him, the police walked around the scene and looked for the weapon while the kid lay dying on the snow. Tamir laid there for 4 minutes bleeding from a torso gunshot wound until a police detective and an FBI agent who happened to be nearby came and rendered aid.

Both cops also had issues.

In a memo to Independence's human resources manager, released by the city in the aftermath of the shooting, Independence deputy police chief Jim Polak wrote that Loehmann had resigned rather than face certain termination due to concerns that he lacked the emotional stability to be a police officer. Polak said that Loehmann was unable to follow "basic functions as instructed". He specifically cited a "dangerous loss of composure" that occurred in a weapons training exercise, during which Loehmann's weapons handling was "dismal" and he became visibly "distracted and weepy" as a result of relationship problems. The memo concluded, "Individually, these events would not be considered major situations, but when taken together they show a pattern of a lack of maturity, indiscretion and not following instructions, I do not believe time, nor training, will be able to change or correct these deficiencies." It was subsequently revealed that Cleveland police officials never reviewed Loehmann's personnel file from Independence prior to hiring him.

Garmback, who was driving the police cruiser, has been a police officer in Cleveland since 2008. In 2014, the City of Cleveland paid US$100,000 to settle an excessive force lawsuit brought against him by a local woman; according to her lawsuit, Garmback "rushed and placed her in a chokehold, tackled her to the ground, twisted her wrist and began hitting her body" and "such reckless, wanton and willful excessive use of force proximately caused bodily injury". The woman had called the police to report a car blocking her driveway. The settlement does not appear in Garmback's personnel file.

Amazing pieces of work, and both out there to take care of us. I feel safe, do you?

Speaking from personal experience and while in uniform, I have gotten one death stare and innumerable positive comments from black folks who have said, have a nice day, have a safe day, etc.

I had one black guy who I was serving a summons on ask me if I was going to put him in a chokehold. I just ignored that statement and by the end of the conversation he said 'have a safe day, officer'. Because I treated him with respect.

But that's what most cops do.

Some inner-city cops don't put up with much shit from people, though, and they lose their perspective, but then they are dealing with far worse people on a daily basis.

another case where they keep using the wrong level of force. This is a situation where a taser actually would have been useful and would not have killed the guy, but nah, lets save the tasers for grandma, or the pet dog Spot.

I thought that was the whole point of tasers to be able to bring down a big guy like that without having to use chokeholds and other stuff like that where accidents can happen.

And that's ignoring the whole question of whether or not it was necessary to use force on the guy in the first place.

The Hate-GOP Machine
By Brent Bozell
7/27/2011


The latest polls show the people are not happy with President Obama's handling of budget matters, but Republicans look even worse. And yet, while the GOP delivers one idea after another, Obama has offered nothing, instead just attacking, attacking, attacking, blaming everyone but himself in utter denial of the reality that no man on the face of this Earth is more responsible for our debt catastrophe than he.

Why then is the public blaming Republicans more? It is because of the ceaseless, shameless and oftentimes utterly dishonest attacks on them coming from Obama's media hit men. A day doesn't go by without a leftist "news" media outrage. They come in all shapes, too.

First, there is the asinine. Think MSNBC anchor Mika Brzezinski. There she was broadsiding the Republicans for having refused Obama's proposal. "I think the Republicans look stupid and mean," she declared. "This is stupid. This is a no-brainer in terms of a deal. This is a no-brainer, and they look mean, and they look difficult, and they're going to lose this." But what is "this"? What was Obama's proposal? There was none, just nebulous language about the "wealthy" needing to pay their "fair share," of "revenue," which in the English language means a massive tax hike, which the GOP, correctly, rejects.

There is the inaccurate. MSNBC daytime anchor Thomas Roberts loudly complains that the party of the "super-rich" is to blame. "We haven't had tax increases over the last 10 years. We've had a recession; we've had two wars to fight. Why do you think the top 2 percent of America has a chokehold on the other 98 percent?"

That's almost exactly upside down. The Tax Foundation has estimated that the top 1 percent pays 38 percent of the entire income-tax burden, and the top 5 percent pays 58 percent. The bottom 50 percent pays nothing in federal tax. With these numbers, it could be argued that the bottom 50 percent has a chokehold on the top 5 percent.

There is the "I've lost all sense of sanity and class" crowd, and yes, we're talking Chris Matthews here. On "Hardball," Joan Walsh of Salon.com said the Republican resistance to new taxes is "deadly and it's wrong and it's hostage-taking, and you shouldn't negotiate with hostage-takers." Matthews had a chance to step in with a gentle, "Whoa, cowgirl." Instead it just carried him away, and he could only add: "I agree. It's terrorism!" A pundit who looks at the debt talks and sees deadly terrorism doesn't need a math class. He needs psychological help.

There is the obsequious. Obama is painted as the perfectly reasonable negotiator who has bent over backward. NBC's Matt Lauer wants to know, "Where is the shared sacrifice going to come from on the Republican side?" CBS's Bob Schieffer insists Obama talks compromise, but "I don't hear any concessions from people on the other side. They just say no taxes, and that's their negotiating posture."

No one, but no one in the media (outside of Fox News, of course) is calling this double-talking president of ours on the carpet. This president who now tells us we must raise taxes to save the Republic is the same president who just seven months ago was telling us that everyone agrees the worst thing one could do during a crisis is raise taxes. Republicans agreed then and hold to that position now. That makes them unreasonable, unbalanced.

And where did this sudden spurt of media fiscal discipline come from, anyway? Where were they when America needed someone to ask Obama, Pelosi and Reid how they were going to pay for TARP? Where were the media demanding to know where the trillion bucks for the anti-stimulus program was coming from? How about the trillion for Obamacare?

They went along for the ride on all these budget-busting disasters. And now they have the temerity to lecture us on fiscal discipline?

There is the oblivious. Some journalists refuse to acknowledge that spending has soared under Obama. When Grover Norquist factually noted Obama's binge, CNN anchor Ali Velshi erupted in protest. "Wait a minute! 'He created with his spending'? You didn't just suggest that our budget problem is because of President Obama, did you, Grover?" Norquist said yes, he wasn't kidding. Velshi dismissed this concept as unreasonable: "OK, we're going to pass by that question because that's an unreasonable position."

In round numbers: In fewer than four years, Obama has increased the debt by $4 trillion. He proposes we raise it another $2.3 trillion. This makes Obama responsible for almost half the debt of the United States. But it is "unreasonable" to say so.

The leftist news media aren't coming to this debate to be an honest broker. They're just trying to break one side apart, and never mind that it's their vision that is driving us right over a cliff.

The Hate-GOP Machine
By Brent Bozell
7/27/2011


The latest polls show the people are not happy with President Obama's handling of budget matters, but Republicans look even worse. And yet, while the GOP delivers one idea after another, Obama has offered nothing, instead just attacking, attacking, attacking, blaming everyone but himself in utter denial of the reality that no man on the face of this Earth is more responsible for our debt catastrophe than he.

Why then is the public blaming Republicans more? It is because of the ceaseless, shameless and oftentimes utterly dishonest attacks on them coming from Obama's media hit men. A day doesn't go by without a leftist "news" media outrage. They come in all shapes, too.

First, there is the asinine. Think MSNBC anchor Mika Brzezinski. There she was broadsiding the Republicans for having refused Obama's proposal. "I think the Republicans look stupid and mean," she declared. "This is stupid. This is a no-brainer in terms of a deal. This is a no-brainer, and they look mean, and they look difficult, and they're going to lose this." But what is "this"? What was Obama's proposal? There was none, just nebulous language about the "wealthy" needing to pay their "fair share," of "revenue," which in the English language means a massive tax hike, which the GOP, correctly, rejects.

There is the inaccurate. MSNBC daytime anchor Thomas Roberts loudly complains that the party of the "super-rich" is to blame. "We haven't had tax increases over the last 10 years. We've had a recession; we've had two wars to fight. Why do you think the top 2 percent of America has a chokehold on the other 98 percent?"

That's almost exactly upside down. The Tax Foundation has estimated that the top 1 percent pays 38 percent of the entire income-tax burden, and the top 5 percent pays 58 percent. The bottom 50 percent pays nothing in federal tax. With these numbers, it could be argued that the bottom 50 percent has a chokehold on the top 5 percent.

There is the "I've lost all sense of sanity and class" crowd, and yes, we're talking Chris Matthews here. On "Hardball," Joan Walsh of Salon.com said the Republican resistance to new taxes is "deadly and it's wrong and it's hostage-taking, and you shouldn't negotiate with hostage-takers." Matthews had a chance to step in with a gentle, "Whoa, cowgirl." Instead it just carried him away, and he could only add: "I agree. It's terrorism!" A pundit who looks at the debt talks and sees deadly terrorism doesn't need a math class. He needs psychological help.

There is the obsequious. Obama is painted as the perfectly reasonable negotiator who has bent over backward. NBC's Matt Lauer wants to know, "Where is the shared sacrifice going to come from on the Republican side?" CBS's Bob Schieffer insists Obama talks compromise, but "I don't hear any concessions from people on the other side. They just say no taxes, and that's their negotiating posture."

No one, but no one in the media (outside of Fox News, of course) is calling this double-talking president of ours on the carpet. This president who now tells us we must raise taxes to save the Republic is the same president who just seven months ago was telling us that everyone agrees the worst thing one could do during a crisis is raise taxes. Republicans agreed then and hold to that position now. That makes them unreasonable, unbalanced.

And where did this sudden spurt of media fiscal discipline come from, anyway? Where were they when America needed someone to ask Obama, Pelosi and Reid how they were going to pay for TARP? Where were the media demanding to know where the trillion bucks for the anti-stimulus program was coming from? How about the trillion for Obamacare?

They went along for the ride on all these budget-busting disasters. And now they have the temerity to lecture us on fiscal discipline?

There is the oblivious. Some journalists refuse to acknowledge that spending has soared under Obama. When Grover Norquist factually noted Obama's binge, CNN anchor Ali Velshi erupted in protest. "Wait a minute! 'He created with his spending'? You didn't just suggest that our budget problem is because of President Obama, did you, Grover?" Norquist said yes, he wasn't kidding. Velshi dismissed this concept as unreasonable: "OK, we're going to pass by that question because that's an unreasonable position."

In round numbers: In fewer than four years, Obama has increased the debt by $4 trillion. He proposes we raise it another $2.3 trillion. This makes Obama responsible for almost half the debt of the United States. But it is "unreasonable" to say so.

The leftist news media aren't coming to this debate to be an honest broker. They're just trying to break one side apart, and never mind that it's their vision that is driving us right over a cliff.

Daym, you got me on one count at least. Yes, I admit to being at the Computer, of that I think we share somnething in common. As for Cheeto fingers, sadly they are not sold here, although I could probably find the equivalent brand here if it would make your argument anymore valid.

Its not about knowing how to deal with a deaf person, its about knowing what not to do, and I think pretty high on that list is putting them in a chokehold.

Gee, if only a TASER had been used instead of a chokehold...but that would've been "inhumane".

Tags for this video have been changed from 'police brutality, emt, oklahoma, chokehold, trooper daniel martin' to 'police brutality, emt, oklahoma, chokehold, trooper daniel martin, fascist cop' - edited by therealblankman

Aw, I like the Aikido vids you've been posting. Makes me think back to the days of my Aikido training. And I would disagree with you about Ikkyo and Nikkyo not being effective if your uke is kneeling. He doesn't finish those techniques because first, he doesn't need to; he already has full control of his uke with the joint-lock, and second, to finish those techniques he'd have to go down to the ground with him, at least that's how those are traditionally taught.

The first technique is a variation of Shiho-nage. Shiho-nage can be translated to "four-directions throw" because of the multiple variations there are. Here, we see the entering form, where you enter the technique by moving your center of gravity under your uke's arm. The turning form has you turning your body around the outside of the arm, but since your uke ends up on his back, its less effective within the context of handcuffing techniques. You want your uke to end up on his belly if you want to cuff him.

The second is Sankyo. You hold your uke's arm as if you were holding a sword. As long as you are turning his arm towards his center, he cannot break free. It can be very painful to resist. If uke tries to strike at you with his free hand, you can apply more torque, which forces him to move away from you.

The third looks like a variation of Kaiten-nage, but I'm not 100% sure. It is an effective shoulder-lock, though.

The fourth is Nikkyo, performed from a two-handed chokehold.

The fifth is Kote-gaeshi, from mune-tsuki. Steven Seagal uses that one a lot in his movies, because if you torque the joint-lock at chest-height, your uke has to take a high-fall over his own arm, or risk breaking it - it looks very flashy when you perform it that way. You can be kinder, and let him down to the ground easier, though.

The sixth could either be another Kote-gaeshi variation, or a nikkyo variant, I can't see his hands well enough. Either way, its a very simple but effective joint lock.

The seventh starts out as an ikkyo, but I don't know the technical term for that elbow torque. I should also note that Ikkyo is called the "first principle" for a reason. If you can get into ikkyo, you can change up to nikkyo, sankyo, or yonkyo very easily. Well, yonkyo is a little harder, because it's a pressure-point-based technique, but Nikkyo was always one of my favorites because of how easy it can be to apply it, especially if you start from an ikkyo. One of my favorite things to do in a Ran-dori (gang attack exercise) was to get one uke into either nikkyo or sankyo and then use him as a shield to interfere with the rest of my training partners, before eventually forcing him into a roll-out.

The eighth and ninth are more variations of nikkyo, one from an ushiro (blind attack) bear hug, the next from a one handed chokehold. The same principle can be applied to a lapel-grab.

The finishing locks he uses aren't always the traditional locks that are taught - he's altered some to make it easier to cuff his uke without sacrificing efficacy.

I've posted before that these techniques are very old, and have stood up against the test of time. While Aikido itself is rather young, the concepts it borrows from are not - they come from ancient Jujitsu principles.

Man I miss training. Keep posting more vids like this, and I just might force myself to find a dojo around here...

I feel shame, watching this video, that both the kids and the officers acted in this way.

The kids shouldn't have run. The officers shouldn't have reacted so violently, and should have taken control of the situation more assertively and positively from the start.

P.S. That wasn't a real chokehold you saw, that was a schoolyard-variety headlock with minimal pressure on the carotid arteries and windpipe, in other words no real choking/strangling action going on. Hell, the officer should have been better trained than that and used a real restraining hold.

Why aren't these kids in a chokehold for violating city ordinance?

*sigh*.

While it is true that the Gracie family made submission attacks famous by representing Brazilian jiu-jitsu (BJJ) in mixed martial arts (MMA), everything you just posted is - and I almost never say this - completely ignorant of the sport and martial arts as a whole.

Submissions were not brought into "the sport" - and by this, I assume you mean MMA - by the Gracies. The Gracies, as I wrote in my BJJ sift, took the judo/jujitsu taught to them by Mitsuyo Maeda and developed the newaza groundwork into a new system, focused on establishing positional improvement and dominance before the application of submissions. It was this conceptual change from the general judo mindset of throw-and-fall-or-scramble-to-position, rather than the submissions themselves. Judo, for the most part, has all the submission BJJ does, it just generally doesn't train them as much or as well. So really, the submissions were brought into the sport by judo, which was brought into creation by Kano through adaptation of the teachings of jiu-jitsu. If you want to argue about fighters using the submissions, sure Royce Gracie made use of them famously in UFC 1, but the first UFC tournament was set up to ensure no other submission grappling styles, including judo, was entered to make a clearer differentiation of style versus style, among other reasons. When such fighter picking was stopped, submission fighters from many styles sprung up in MMA competition.

If you're not talking about modern MMA, then consider the fact that pankration from Greece in 648 BC was the first Western MMA competition, and chokeholds and joint locks were widely displayed and documented.

Consider that catch wrestling can be traced in nearly every culture, from Lancashire catch-as-catch-can wrestling to the US hook wrestling to the Indian pehlwani.

Or you might even be referencing the infamous gong sau of China, where kung fu masters would challenge each other for the rights to open schools in villages or cities, matching style versus style, starting from millenia ago and continuing to the present day. Of course, dubious as the documentation surrounding those matches were, and as stupid as kwoon-storming is, there have been accounts of Chin na masters defeating other strikers through armbars and rear naked chokes.

As for "ruining the sport", I can only assume you're talking about the present version of MMA, as represented largely by the UFC and Pride FC (which have recently been merged as one organization. The UFC and Pride, as you may know, evolved out of the Vale tudo competitions in Brazil and Japan, which when brought to the US were imitated and televised. Of course, you should also be aware of the fact that vale tudo tournaments were largely organized by Helio Gracie, the original creator of Brazilian jiu-jitsu, and his descendants. The UFC was created largely as the brainchild of Rorion Gracie, Helio's eldest son and BJJ black belt, as well as Art Davies, one of Rorion's student. In fact, according to many inside sources who were present for the UFC's founding, it was created in a large part to showcase BJJ for the US, just as Pride FC was created in a a large part to showcase Rickson Gracie, another one of Helio's sons, versus Nobuhiko Takada, a famous Japanese shoot-wrestler and mixed martial artist who also trained in a form of submission wrestling. So how exactly do you figure that modern MMA, which exists largely because the Gracies wanted to showcase the effectiveness of submission fighting versus pure striking styles, is somehow ruined because it did exactly that?

And finally, you have absolutely no idea about submission grappling. If you think getting a submission hold is a "basic skill" that can beat anybody, and the sport now revolves around using and avoiding those holds, then how do you figure that only one of the five current UFC title holders is a well-known submission specialist, and even HE won his title fight two days ago by knockout? If it's such a get-out-of-jail-free card, why doesn't everybody just use those magical subs? How come sprawl-and-brawl and ground-and-pound are becoming such dominant strategies of fighting in MMA fights? Oh, and what did you mean by "strength, skill, stamina or fighting spirit" having no effect on submission grappling? Superior skill, strength, stamina, and fighting spirit is what submission grappling is all about. The fighter with the greatest combination of all four will win, just as with any other art in MMA. Look at Yuki Nakai, the grappler who continued a fight despite being eye-gouged illegally to the point of complete blindness and yet continued on not only win his fight by submission but also fight AGAIN the SAME night against the most feared grappler in the world at the time, Rickson Gracie. Look at Ronaldo de Souza, aka Jacare, who had his arm broken in a fight but continued to fight and win. Heck, look at Rickson Gracie, who is well-known for having an insane cardio routines involving sandy beaches and mountain running. Or any of the MMA athletes at the top of the sport, who train and spar and weight lift and run and work out for hours on end each day and every day so they can become strong and build up endurance and improve their skills, all thanks to their fighting spirit and determination to be the best.

If you doubt me on any of those facts, just get yourself to a real, honest-to-goodness MMA gym, and tell the first MMA fighter you see that submission holds are ruining the sport. Seriously. I'd like to know what happens.

Do you know why I'm annoyed by your comment, Enzoblue? I'm annoyed because training submission grappling is not fucking easy. It is hard, painful work to train. It is expensive as hell, in terms of money as well as time and effort. I am shit-awful at it, and my only goal each day I step on the mat, which is every damn day, is to suck a little less than the day before, and sometimes, like today, I don't feel like that's happened, and I haven't been able to move my neck in certain directions for days because of a neck crank that got cranked on too hard. And yet tomorrow, I'm going to put on my smelly, sweaty gi, get in my friend's carpool, and go roll around on a mat with large, sweaty men who outweigh me by over 50 pounds on average for several hours, and come back tired and sore and cranky. (Hah, pun, get it? It's a joke because my spinal column isn't functioning properly.) And I'm happy with all of that, from the musty gym smell to the same old jokes my friends make about me being gay that they've made for years, because through my training I know I am acquiring a skillset that is not available or acquired in the general public, and yes, I do take pride in what I do because it is a part of my life and part of who I am, and also there's the fact that my training and dedication can and have helped me to choke fools out who are deserving of it, just as those things have saved the lives of friends and acquaintances who were attacked in ghettos and Iraqi villages. And yet here you come to say that I, along with every other MMA competitor who has devoted far larger amounts of their life to perfecting the art of submission grappling, am ruining the beautiful sport of mixed martial arts, a sport that I am, as well as those competitors far above me, dedicated to as well and one that I do my best to represent well in the public eye. No. I'm sorry, but I'm not going to let you say that, because you're wrong.

Consider this: the UFC and modern MMA changed what "one would actually consider fighting". People used to think those flicky, chambered TKD kicks would hurt, or that they could just avoid a takedown attempt with elbows to the spine, or even in later years, they could just fight out of guard. The sport has evolved, and anybody who has a half a brain can see that a good MMA fighter needs to train to fight out of the three ranges that have been established through the test of the fight, standup, clinch, and ground, as well as be able to strike, grapple, and submit from all three ranges if necessary, as well as defend against an opponent's attempts to do so to oneself. Submission grappling is part of the sport out of necessity, not because it's what people (and by that I mean Westerners) think of when they think about fighting, or because it looks pretty - it's in the sport because it works. The skills and abilities trained in sub grappling allow a more skilled fighter to beat a less skilled opponent, given reasonable size comparisons, just as with every other martial art that has been used with success in MMA. The concept of MMA is the extension of Bruce Lee's philosophy of Jeet Kune Do - take what works, and lose what doesn't. So in reality, sub grappling being used to win fights in MMA is really part of the evolution and development of martial arts, in fact it embodies what MMA and the development of effective martial arts is all about. And if that simple fact offends, then perhaps you don't understand quite as much about MMA as you might like to think you do.

Ok Rembar, I thought my previous post might be misconstrued as an attack on MMA Judo BJJ police etc.

First I don't need to lay out my credentials, my points have to stand on their own merits, as well as do yours. The validity of a claim does not follow from the credibility of the source. But I will give my credentials anyway. 4 years of Judo, 2 while in HS, 2 in college, I have competed in several USJA tournaments in San Francisco, lost most of the matches, but I did win a few. My highest rank was a brown belt, and some would say I needed more time in to get that far. I know my way around a choke, from both ends. Beat time? None. Club security, 2 years. And you can get shot, stomped, and stabbed as easily as a cop.

That Said, I did not mean to criticise anything about fighting arts and competitions, just the application of chokes and strangles in subduing citizens. I will attempt to clarify my previous arguments.

1. The Health of persons being choked. The problem is not with the ease of choking, it is the ability to withstand and recover. Your average victim of a police incident is not an athlete, and in many instances is intoxicated. It is unequivocally more dangerous to cause an intoxicated person to go unconscious. In addition for most people, being choked can cause panic, which causes struggling that can lead to injuries not associated with the actual choke to both officers and suspects.

2. Excess adrenaline. I'll concede the point. Both cause much adrenaline to be spent. Although a good MMA fighter can control their emotions, and control the adrenaline to some extent.

3. Malice. What happens in a match when a guy is choked out, knocked out, or his joint is manipulated causing pain and damage? The ref stops the fight or someone taps out. In a police incident, the cop is the Ref. If the cop has malice, lookout, if the suspect gets the cops gun, or has a knife, bloodshed and death may follow. I'll take the malice evident in a controlled sporting event over the malice in a "real world" encounter any day. MMA guys just don't get stabbed, bitten, or shot, eye gouged, fishhooked etc. (ok maybe there has been some biting and fishhooking)

4. Poor Training. Duh right back at ya. The operative word here is POOR. Everyone reading this is not stupid. We know that cops need training in order to do their jobs without causing physical harm unnecessarily. It's a given. When training is inadequate, bad stuff happens. I think that was clear enough without additional comment.

I would like to comment on your points as well.

"I know the approximate times that my opponent will lose consciousness, will suffer permanent damage, and regain consciousness after the chokehold is released."

Really! Okay, the guys you practice with or fight ought to be similar, weight, age fitness. But how quickly will a 190 pound asthmatic college student who snorted meth all week take to pass out, and when will he wake up? Does he have a heart condition, suffer from panic attacks, have schizophrenia? These unknowns caused a french tourist in las vegas to die from a choke applied by metro several years back. By all accounts, the choke was applied properly. The taser is safer for the cop, as far as the suspect, I wouldn't guess that it is any safer.

"The Taser was developed to reduce the number of FIREARM-related deaths. FIREARM-RELATED DEATHS."

It was developed in response to a murder of 2 of the inventors friends as a non lethal weapon that did not classify as a fire arm and thus could be manufactured without the red tape the BATF would require. It was not actively marketed to police departments by taser int. until 1998. It was adopted by police departments as a non lethal weapon to be used to reduce officer injuries AND reduce shootings.

I do not have any arguments with your conclusion.