You forgot about

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klingon_culture#Afterlife

No I didn't. Klingon belief is that the first Klingons killed the Gods who created them and essentially took their place. Klingons believe in a heaven (Sto'Vo'Kor) and Hell (Gre'Thor) which is presided over by Khaless (God) and a devil (Fek'Ihr). They follow a moral system based on combat and honor which rewards proper behavior, and punishes what is considered negative behavior.

Were the ancient Greeks "Atheists"? Their belief system also involved the death of their primary origination God (Cronos). But just because that god died didn't mean the Greek theology was gone. It just took on a different aspect. Same with the Kingons who replaced their origination god with Kortar or Khaless or whatever. Worf is not an atheist. He has a very specific religion, which he believes in strongly.

>> ^Winstonfield_Pennypacker:

Sigh - without stepping into the issue of theism/atheism in real life - labelling this clip as 'atheist' is moronic because Worf was actually a deeply religious person according to the Klingon belief system. He in fact chided the Federation a bit in a couple TNG & DS9 episodes because they lacked a spiritual aspect. Interpreting this as an "atheist" clip is quoting two words of a fundie preach who said, "Christ died" and calling him an atheist. Stupidly inaccurate.


You forgot about the "they were more trouble than they were worth" part.

Theism/atheism and following ancient traditions are two completely separable things.

Sigh - without stepping into the issue of theism/atheism in real life - labelling this clip as 'atheist' is moronic because Worf was actually a deeply religious person according to the Klingon belief system. He in fact chided the Federation a bit in a couple TNG & DS9 episodes because they lacked a spiritual aspect. Interpreting this as an "atheist" clip is quoting two words of a fundie preach who said, "Christ died" and calling him an atheist. Stupidly inaccurate.

Yes, please!>> ^dystopianfuturetoday:

Dare I terrible this?

>> ^Deano:
Oh Worf. A millennium is 1,000 years. But he said "A millennia". Which is the plural. Should have dropped the A.
Anyway, I always thought whats-her-name there was very cute.


It's that bizzaro Klingon/CHiPs accent he has. Also, "what's her name" ended up marrying the doctor. When her character had Keiko's baby placed in her, it was to cover the fact she was having Bashir's kid.

I must admit, she speaks English well for a Klingon...

http://videosift.com/video/Eminem-s-Without-me-sung-in-Klingon
This is the same song but not the official video... So not a dupe...
And just FYI: It also has the entire lyrics written out in its comment thread.

Clever "talent" since only 15 people on earth actually know if he's speaking Klingon or gibberish.

I don't think that's amoral, I think that's decidedly immoral. Like @ryanbennitt says above, the Federation is keeping people stupid, allowing genocide, famine, wars etc. At the very least, they could introduce their replicators to all friendly states they met and given them INFINITE food and materials. Not doing that, is intentionally keeping them down.

Because it is a post-scarcity world, there is no limit to supplies in the advanced races, but there is in the simple ones and some people will starve, some people will die because of the inaction of the Federation. I think this is immoral. (Morality is obviously different from person to person, but I think the "least harm principle" is almost universal.)

They should of course be careful when introducing new technologies, and do it gradually, but to make an arbitrary decision like "all pre-warp civilizations get nothing" is immoral.


>> ^Bidouleroux:

>> ^gwiz665:
The Prime Directive is immoral.
quality doublepromote

The Prime Directive is amoral. It comes from the Vulcans. It is a rational directive so as to not be squandered by moral dilemmas (when two options seem equally "good" or equally "bad"). The Prime Directive is neither good nor bad, it's just a directive to cut the moral Gordian Knot. That the application of the Prime Directive is debated so much shows why it exists : to cut the crap debates around morality. Because it's easy to think you won't interfere when you're far away but not so easy when you're in the middle of a situation. Hence the directive and hence the fact that they can't really punish you when you ignore it in the heat of a situation, unless you committed an actual crime like genocide. And I say "committed", not "let happen". You can let happen a genocide if by doing so you are respecting the Prime Directive in regard to a pre-warp civilizations' internal matters. If its two warp capable factions of the same civilization, it's a matter of whether there is ground to recognize them as two different civilizations, which is a political decision more than a moral one.
In Voyager they sometimes had good reasons to ignore the Prime Directive, for example with the Ocampas they were aware that they were being protected by an alien (the Caretaker). Also, the Kazon were warp capable and were interfering anyway so that's a good reason to beat the crap out of them (plus they were hostile from the get go). You can refrain from interfering in the internal matters of a civilization, but you can't use that excuse when it's not an internal matter (e.g. Picard and the Romulans vs. the Klingon civil war : don't interfere with the Klingon's own internal affairs but also keep the Romulans from interfering because that's not an internal matter).
The Prime Directive is not an absolute, but a code of conduct. Also, the only way I could see to get punished under it would be to give warp technology to a pre-warp civilization. That's a inter-civilization incident because you effectively wilfully bring a new player (de facto ally since you control their level of technological progress) on the galactic table, skewing things in your favor by artificial means. That's why you don't see the Romulans, Klingons, Cardassians or even the Ferengi giving warp technology. You just can't do that without facing consequences from other warp-capable civilizations.

>> ^gwiz665:

The Prime Directive is immoral.
quality doublepromote


The Prime Directive is amoral. It comes from the Vulcans. It is a rational directive so as to not be squandered by moral dilemmas (when two options seem equally "good" or equally "bad"). The Prime Directive is neither good nor bad, it's just a directive to cut the moral Gordian Knot. That the application of the Prime Directive is debated so much shows why it exists : to cut the crap debates around morality. Because it's easy to think you won't interfere when you're far away but not so easy when you're in the middle of a situation. Hence the directive and hence the fact that they can't really punish you when you ignore it in the heat of a situation, unless you committed an actual crime like genocide. And I say "committed", not "let happen". You can let happen a genocide if by doing so you are respecting the Prime Directive in regard to a pre-warp civilizations' internal matters. If its two warp capable factions of the same civilization, it's a matter of whether there is ground to recognize them as two different civilizations, which is a political decision more than a moral one.

In Voyager they sometimes had good reasons to ignore the Prime Directive, for example with the Ocampas they were aware that they were being protected by an alien (the Caretaker). Also, the Kazon were warp capable and were interfering anyway so that's a good reason to beat the crap out of them (plus they were hostile from the get go). You can refrain from interfering in the internal matters of a civilization, but you can't use that excuse when it's not an internal matter (e.g. Picard and the Romulans vs. the Klingon civil war : don't interfere with the Klingon's own internal affairs but also keep the Romulans from interfering because that's not an internal matter).

The Prime Directive is not an absolute, but a code of conduct. Also, the only way I could see to get punished under it would be to give warp technology to a pre-warp civilization. That's a inter-civilization incident because you effectively wilfully bring a new player (de facto ally since you control their level of technological progress) on the galactic table, skewing things in your favor by artificial means. That's why you don't see the Romulans, Klingons, Cardassians or even the Ferengi giving warp technology. You just can't do that without facing consequences from other warp-capable civilizations.

I have the urge to start singing Klingon battle songs and drink 2309; there is no finer vintage.

This guy reminds me of someone....

From the moment he shifted to change posturally, I knew he was going to open his head and let it all fall out.

To this, I laughed the longest, hardest, and loudest I have all day.

Almost surreal, no, very surreal, I found myself waiting for him to rip off his face and John Belushi yell "It's Saturday...."

Hearing it in Japanese made it surreally perfect. Could have only been improved by Klingon.

I really lost it when he said if elected, he would be terrified.

MarinGunrock. Your dissing the music,but you have a Klingon icon ? Your the dipshit.

@westy

I agree with you on some things, but I can't let you get away with saying Star Trek Online looks terrible, I played that game when it launched, and it looked absolutely incredible (Visually) The on-planet landscapes could've used a bit more work, but space itself was jaw-dropping at some parts.

Also, I don't know if it's just your rig or what.. but almost all MMo's have little-to-no stability issues a few months after their launch. WoW started off rocky.. whenever I played it though, I never had any lag spikes, same with my current LoTRO, previous FFXI, etc. The only exception to this was Vanguard, and that's because it wasn't finished before they were forced to launch it.. and because of that, never got the subscriptions needed to fuel its continuing development and if it hasn't already, will soon die a horrible painful death.

Anyway, back to STO, The game itself was all about star trek. They made their devs watch the entire series of every generation of star trek t.v. shows and all the movies before they were even allowed to talk about what they wanted to do with the game.

The ships were all inspired by trek-cannon, the quests had the exploration elements, and fighting of klingons, phasers, torpedos, even sexy mini-skirts. I don't see how you can really say that it had nothing to do with the universe.

I caught one episode soon after it started and a Klingon was standing with the Captain on a high cliff and he actually said, "I can see my house from here.". At least I'm PRETTY sure he did. I did like a triple take trying to determine if I had slipped into some strange daydream or something.

Anyways, I didn't watch it much at all after that.

And yes, the opening theme sucked.