"Who the fuck cares what the reason they wanted to invadeflee was?"

Characterization matters a little here, no?

"They had a right to refugee status there, not to take control and possession by force"

Which is at the heart of things.

The Arab narrative is that Jews arrived guns loaded and set about pillaging, killing and invading as soon as they had sufficient numbers, while the poor domestic Arab population had only been trying to assist and welcome in the refugees...

Which is ahistorical propaganda.

The reality is that for the most part, the European Jews arriving in Palestine were refugees and acting like refugees. Meaning they mostly just wanted to be able to provide food, shelter and safety for the families, just like everyone else. Most of them tried to set about doing this by legally purchasing land.

Lots of the local Arabs similarly were content to get along.

At that same time though, there were hardcore Zionists among the Jewish arrivals AND there were xenophobic elements willing to use violence within the Arab population too.

The tensions rose as the populations rose, but largely as a result of a large people being displaced, and NOT as the planned invasion you describe. The local Arab population started to band together to refuse to work, trade or sell to Jews. Violence broke out instigated separately on smallish scales by BOTH sides. Escalating violence followed, again back and forth between sides.

I'm in a camp that has a hard time blaming either the domestic Arab population for distress at the huge influx of refugees, nor for the European Jewish people having a low tolerance for discrimination and violence directed there way solely for being Jewish.

I see it as a huge mess, but with two large populations of Jewish and Arab people in Palestine acting not terribly unreasonably under circumstances of extreme pressure.

I think it's lazy and convenient to just declare 'invasion' so that you can simplify it all down to right/wrong and good guy/bad guy....

Ozzy Man is a good guy. He gives animals a voice.

the rub of "good guys w/guns" is the "good guys" requirement.

if the argument is "those that can be proven to be responsible, safe, and sane can own guns" then why fear the 'proof' part of the equation?

it's in their motto!

'bad guys' helping 'bad guys' get guns is bad guys, bad guys...whatcha gonna do?

plus

the idea that teachers/school kids can be expected to keep the doors closed - turn on the a/c or the heat up and just see if YOUR home doors are kept shut!

more fantasy from the infanticidally idiots. as if the uncompromising are themselves 'compromised'.




just think...this song is 30 yrs old...and it doesn't raise an eye brow now...

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The proof that these assholes don’t believe their “good guy with a gun” lie is they don’t allow guns at the NRA events.

I wish some nut(s) would attack the NRA event, shooting a few dozen gun proponent politicians that normally hide behind their armed security and bullet proof podiums. I’m sure their tune would change significantly if some of their ilk were silenced permanently. No one deserves it more than Abbot.

Edit: BTW…more unarmed school children have been murdered in school this year than police officers in the line of duty. For all their bravado, their whining about how dangerous it is to be a cop, the necessity for more militarized equipment for their safety, it’s actually more dangerous to be a 10 year old student. I guess those kids should all get vests, rifles, pepper spray, armored vehicles and buildings, etc. ..that’s the solution.

Also, guns are the leading cause of death for children under 19 …have been since 2020.

Fucking worthless cowards and thugs, every single one. They deserve one more bullet each…delivered at high speed.

Imagine the scenario where a bad guy pulls out a gun, the first "good guy" pulls out a gun, then a second "good guy" pulls out his gun... wanna bet the probability who the 2nd guy points his or her gun to? And the subsequent 3rd-nth good guys' guns going to point theirs to?

Oh, then unevitably the "no duty to protect" police forces come and shoot ALL the guys with guns.

Total chaos, and good luck untangling the legal lawsuits that will inevitably come after. America! F**k YEAH!!

"Good Guy With A Gun" Theory. These NRA honchos reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally don't want their subservient cohorts think one more step ahead of any argument. The sad truth is there's enough of mindless American too lazy (or even capable?) to think ahead just as they wished due to America's educational system and pathetic "freedom at all costs" patirotism & American 2nd Ammendment Exceptionalism crap.

There are many democratic countries that said no to widespread gun ownerships (Australia, NZ, Japan) and are far better for it. I guess (read: I don't watch C-SPAN) that sense of American Pride infects even the Democrats to be gutsy enough to compare the US to other countries during legislative gun-control debates?

That assault-style (like the ARs) gun ownership rights is pretty FUBAR from the get go. If that's a right, why not grenades? Tanks, fighter jets, subs and heck, nuclear missiles? As long as I'm a "no criminal record" American citizen, isn't it my God-given right -- and my freedom! -- to own any weapons as long as I can afford it? Unhindered Capitalism at its finest we're talking here! The most American of values!

Yep…not true at Parkland, wasn’t true here. There were DOZENS of “good guys with guns” milling around outside, and 19 inside, not one even tried to help, some assaulted students, parents, and teachers, but not the shooter.

Edit: 19 officers were inside, on the other side of the door while children were being shot to death for 45 minutes…during which time they heard the screams of children being shot to death, they received multiple calls from inside the classroom explaining that there were multiple dead kids, multiple still living children, and more being shot with every call, yet they did absolutely nothing but wait. They claim today that they decided he was a barricaded suspect and there was no time pressure to stop him despite being able to hear children being murdered just feet away from where they stood with their thumbs up their asses.
It now seems, according to today’s story from police (a story that changes with every telling) even the tactical team from border police was on scene almost 40 minutes before they went in.

*doublepromote *quality debunking of another of the right’s idiotic talking points.

I think 21 officers from that force need to be executed on the spot by grieving parents, with no charges for the shooters, and the rest fired and banned from being even unarmed security guards for life, with prison if they even attempt another job in law enforcement. This was undeniable proof that police aren’t heroes, aren’t there to protect the public, and are in reality just cowardly thugs with guns and authority that don’t step up when needed.

Any time.
Men who need guns to be men are scared children….every time.

I would suggest that a good guy with a gun successfully stopping a bad guy with a gun is so incredibly rare it’s not exaggerating to say it just doesn’t happen statistically, but good guys without guns stopping bad guys with guns happens almost daily….because bad guys with guns are cowardly children.

If a hacker breaks into a company and is CAUGHT, then claims they were just testing security....the hacker gets prosecuted. It's not the hackers job to expose the problem unless the company hired them to do that. Otherwise any hacking efforts ever could just be excused as "security checks" and not prosecutable, even when they're successful at stealing money, data, and IP. Even if they do no harm and report themselves, it's still an illegal attack, just like if you catch me leaving your house after breaking in but I say I was just exposing your poor locks by picking them and searching your house....you've still been illegally violated.

If I break into a bank, break into all the safe deposit boxes, and when caught in the vault say" I was just testing security, what's your problem, I'm the good guy here", I'm going to prison, just like she should.

The daughter would be in trouble because she helped an adult sneak into the school, not because of the schools reaction but because of her clearly inappropriate and likely illegal actions.

She's a real nut or she never would have thought this was a good idea. Do you think any concerned citizen should do as she did? How do you distinguish security checks from kidnappers, pedophiles, thieves, .... People who take the law into their own hands at the expense of other people's security are not heroes, they're self centered, self aggrandizing, nutjob criminals.

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You’ve said the same about people in their homes, even about George Floyd if I’m not mistaken, he wasn’t running, straw man.

I do see his issue as a problem. I don’t think it’s an excuse to break the law in multiple dangerous or malicious ways like he did. I think, like most other countries have, we should pay people their normal wages to stay home quarantined so we might stop being the worst at COVID response on the planet and avoid this kind of situation altogether.
You seem to think we should pretend the pandemic is a fraud and go back to life like it was pre 2020....problem solved. Your words say as much. Sorry, that’s not realistic. That “plan” kills millions at best and destroys the economy in the process.

Btw, we've been over this a dozen times, I’ve never taken a dime of government assistance, and my wife and I live on $30k a year. Just because i don't need government assistance doesn't mean I don't see the need for others, just like even though I'm "retired" I can still understand the need for a paycheck, but needing money is not an excuse to break the law or heroin dealers and bank robbers would be good guys who just need to make money.

Yes, the government doesn’t care, that’s why it just passed another COVID relief bill that again gives the vast majority of the money to corporations and state government, not citizens (likely with the same lack of protections that let Kushner and a few Trumps take millions from the first relief bill). For once, Trump at least publicly tried to do the right thing (credit where it’s due) by insisting on larger payments like Democrats wanted all along and Republicans killed the idea.

Cop logic: If you are near a march against abusive racist police you hate all police and we hate you....and since we have masks on and immunity for our actions, we're going to fuck up your life in every way we can and blame protesters....
....because we're the good guys.