As a TNG and DS9 devotee and an absolute HATER of Voyager and Enterprise (seriously, get a life), this movie was totally fucking badass. I saw it on an IMAX screen here in Taipei and at the end, I said screw the reserved Asian thing and applauded like I was on 68th and Broadway in NYC. Fantabulosterous.

Ah, but there was a twist in the tale...

DS9 handled subjects such as these so well.

Jean. Luc. Picard. Motherfucker.
>> ^Throbbin:
Great clip!
You can't trust bald people.

of course DS9

I think another thing I liked about DS9 was that as they introduced new characters, those characters were there to stay. They became an integral part of the web of stories and returned again and again.

Sure some characters returned on the other series but usually because it was for a reprise role, or another single episode story that didn't relate to the last one.

DS9 created an interaction of characters that grew in relationships between the characters and the audience. Every character story line intertwined with the others creating a massive in depth series story taht was leading everyone towards impending doom and war. Emotions ran high and you didn't always know who the bad guys were or who to trust.

I guess what I am trying to say is "Deep Plot". Like a hot wave that washes over you...

DS9 was slow to start so those who watched and bailed early missed what I feel was the best series. At first I was worried about everything being located on one space station that didn't go anywhere but I think the producers realized it as well.
They did everything they could to jumpstart the series and they succeeded!
Shaving Sisco's head and giving him a new look, Bringing in Worf, Expanding on Odo the Changelings, The defiant (the only federation ship with a cloaking device), Dax was a great Character, even once they had to change symbionts.

DS9 had the deepest character development out of any Star Trek series:
Sisko, Odo, Dax (1&2), Worf, Miles, Quark, Bashir, Kira, Garak and a dynamic supporting cast Gul Dukat, Nog, Rom, Gowron, Lwaxana Troi, Martok, Vash, Leeta, Jake Sisko, the Grand Nagus. The Changelings, Cardasians, Klingons, Bajorans, Humans, Ferengi, the Jem'Hadar...

The ongoing storyline with the war and the occupation gave a great overall setting for the episode stories. It kept serving the characters to us in new ways and let us see into the characters in more depth. I think it was the series with the most mature story line and had the most layers. It was war, intrigue, humor, alliances, secrets, threats, doom, development, exploration and more...

Um, so ya, I voted for DS9

Why I'm the third voter for Enterprise?

Quite simple actually: the internet. I didn't have broadband until 2002 and Enterprise was the first show that I downloaded, because I missed it on TV. And who would have thought that shows are much more enjoyable without cheap-ass dubbing? Not me, frankly. Never thought about it before.

Tried TNG and DS9 later in English as well, but by then, BSG had appeared and made everything look rediculous in comparison.

TNG got my vote, but after watching DS9 again on DVD this past year, it comes a very, very close second. The show took Trek to a more serious and realistic level, took on some darker themes... not quite to Galactica's level by a long shot, but still.

VOY was a pretty good show, but could've been a lot better if they replaced 80% of the actors. Possibly the same could be said for ENT, but aside from T'Pol and Phlox (and perhaps Hoshi), I hated the cast. That show was so horribly cast, particularly the lead. I enjoyed Bakula in Quantum Leap, but he was terrible in ENT.

As for TOS... it was before my time, and efforts to get into it have always met with disappointment for me. Some of the movies were good, though.

For me, DS9 was the best: great character arcs, especially for Dukat, Kira, Sisko, and Odo. Lots of Fighting In Space with the Defiant. The Bajorans were an intriguing culture to find out about, but the show never came down on the side of supernatural explanations for their gods and spiritual beliefs (Battlestar Galactica take note). And there was a huge, epic story with the Dominion War that stretched and developed through the whole series, whereas we were lucky if TNG had a story spread across two episodes. Not to mention the terrific production design and rich interplay between the characters. The characters never seemed to connect in TNG: everyone was too nice to each other and hardly ever argued unless they were under the influence of an Alien Arguing Virus or something. Plus TNG's sets were revolting and there was a frigging PSYCHIC PSYCHOTHERAPIST on the BRIDGE, for crying out loud. How unrealistic, how eighties, is that?

Voyager was little more than "The Seven Of Nine Show". Too many episodes focussed on this boring waste of narrative space. Being Borg, Seven should have been an interesting and unique character, but she was basically a Vulcan with a bit of plastic stuck around her eye. And they already had a Vulcan on board! Oh, and don't get me started on Neelix. More annoying than a tribble, the character of Neelix alone should have been enough to get the show cancelled after its first season. The appalling time-travel-paradox finale was baloney, and Janeway's voice was super-annoying.

Enterprise was another wasted opportunity, though I did like Scott Bakula. And as for TOS, I suppose I'm just the wrong generation to really enjoy it. I appreciate it for the groundwork, but it's not really the same standard as the later series.

Oh, and DS9 only had one episode with bloody Q in it, which is a good thing.

Aaaand relax.

I liked TOS for its campiness, it also had some good classic sci-fi 'man bites dog', almost twilight-zone quality twists and morals.

TNG is my favorite hands down, Patrick Stewart rocks the socks, and over all the series just felt a lot cleaner and focused. Good character development of a large cast. And while TNG didn't have many story arc's there was a consistency to the universe TOS lacked.

DS9 and Voyager had their moments, voyager really picked up after 7 of 9. I'm not saying that just because of her form fitting unitard, the writing and character development really seemed to get better. DS9 seemed really inconstant to me, some of the episodes were great and others were snoozers. Though I did like most of the episodes involving Quark.

Now to really get the nerds really riled up , Enterprise D vs. a Star Destroyer.

TNG, TOS, Enterprise (third season was rad), Voyager (not too bad), and DS9 (too much politics).

Without Kirk and the Enterprise there would have been no DS9, no Picard nor a(shudder) Voyager. 'nuff said.

I'm torn between DS9 and TNG. TNG was my first love, though, so it gets the vote. Plus: Data and Picard.

OK, My choice is a big obvious Star Wars but here’s why:

1). Star Trek
There has never really been a great Trek movie. I always liked DS9 but I always found trek to be very limiting. There is the clinically dry Asimov type Sci/fi which becomes quite limiting and there is is the Frank Herbert style of Sci/fi/fantacy which leaves room to grow and expand and expand. I found Trek to be in the Asimov category. (I still like it though)

2). Lord of the Rings
Rings delivered greatness, it had to or it would have flopped. The books gave way to a whole new fantasy world and expanded into things like D&D and inspired worlds upon new worlds. The movies however were not inspirational in themselves. Well done and a great watch but the punch was already given to the books.

3). Harry Potter
Again, The books were well done and drew in every kid from around the world. The entire world was recreated by Rowling which sucked you in and put you in that world. The movies are well made and fun to watch but they don’t explore or break any new ground in movie making.

The Matrix
4). Expanded our views and took us on an adventure that was unique and new, It had a premise to be an amazing series and truly it was. The special effects were great but the effects started to become the movies by the last film and overshadowed the storyline. They just didn’t have a clear direction to take the movie into and for some reason felt they needed to conclude the story, although they didn’t.

5). Star Wars – Winner!
Star Wars hit the world with a wake up slap to the face. Maybe you had to be in our generation to have felt the slap. I was in grade 4 or 5 when it came out. It became THE most influential Sci/Fi/Fantacy movie ever, re-defining the entire genre and raising the bar on every other genre. The world could not get enough. From special effects to sounds, musical score, creatures, animatronics and stop motion. Star Wars set the Bar so high that 30 years later, people are still trying to top it.

YES, The prequels didn’t have the punch the original 3 had! But as a Spaghetti Sci-fi it has all the pieces. Not to mention the reach it has into our culture, Quotes from all 6 star wars movies are everywhere, ingrained in our everyday language. The religion, the lessons, the imagination, the books it inspired, the gaming, the slave Leia costume.

>> ^spoco2:
This doesn't get a WTF from me in the sense of 'Holy cow, are they really doing that?'
This gets a WTF from me in the sense of 'Really, people older than about 12 years old find this sort of stuff entertaining?'
Really, Anime fricken leaves me so cold. People wax on and on and on and on about how it's so damn superior to western animation, but really, so much of it is lazy (a LOT has an awful lot of static image in the frame with barely a mouth moving), outlets for the repression of the Japanese culture. The amount of violence and sexual abuse that is in these things is truly horrible. I found the violence funny when I was a kid, but after that, it just bores the pants off me.


How do you know this anime was made for people above the age of 12? Studio Ghibli films are usually for kids, I thought.

As for the rest of your post, I certainly spend more time enjoying animation that's "Made in Japan" than animation that's "Made in America", but I don't see why I should care either way. I'm an American. If I draw a shitty cartoon in my basement, am I automatically an example of shitty American animation? At what point is my failure my own and not my country's? Factor in multi-national corporations/ownership and the whole issue becomes even more muddled. Dreamworks and Pixar, to my knowledge, are the sole two animation companies in "The West" that are admired, and Dreamworks is owned by an Indian company based in Mumbai. Elsewhere, multiple anime titles have been and are being produced by Japanese studios specifically to appeal to "Western" audiences (read: white middle class youth), or at the very least significantly factor in their interests.

Anyway, the giant budget 3D animated movies cost dozens of millions of dollars to produce, and only offer up perhaps 90 minutes of entertainment after years of production time (The Incredibles cost $92 million, Wall-E: a whopping $180 million). Because of the massive budgets these movies require, the scripts of these films rarely take any risks. Everything's rated G and has a story that is very "lowest common denominator" in my eyes. I'm getting far too old to enjoy these films beyond their technical merits, since their target audience is primarily below the age of 14.

Meanwhile, partially due to smaller budget requirements in anime production, I can choose all sorts of anime that tries to cater to a slightly older crowd. Very little anime attempts to appeal to anyone above the age of 30, but even in the "age 13-18" type shows, there's interesting themes to chew on. One of my fav animes, Gundam, is basically Star Trek with robots. Its creators have described the show as a humanist show, and the shows take on imperialism, racism, and war really line up with what I saw in the humanist Star Trek shows (I loved TNG/DS9). Since Star Trek has been dead for a while, it's nice to have a place to go to (btw: the upcoming movie will abandon much of what the shows were about in favor of violence and sex). Most Gundam shows are about a teenage boy who hops into a war robot, gets traumatized by war, manipulated by corrupt politicians into fighting questionable wars, and deals with issues of imperialism. Not the most intellectually challenging stuff in the world, I know, but it sure beats what I've seen in stuff like 24 or Heroes and a lot of other dramas on the major networks. And those are aimed at considerably older demographics. I think the much smaller budget requirements of anime helps studios create things for niche demographics (such as sci-fi loving humanists) and that's good for me. Are they technically superior to something like Wall-E? Not by a long shot. But a 1,000 minute Gundam series didn't cost $180 million every 90 minutes either, and yet still left me more entertained.