Does anyone still believe Taxocrats "care" about "working people?" At least more than the other side?

Taxocrats take more money from Wall Street "donors" than Republicans. Taxocrats caused the housing crisis via bad loans to people who they knew would never repay.

Evil rich people have a second identity the left doesn't like to mention: "Employers." Taxocrats cause employers to do nothing and wait out the reign of financial instability fomented by confiscatory threats; no one is going on a hiring spree only to have Taxocrats slam them with a bill for socialist medicine.

Not that Maddow doesn't have a point. It's possible even those RINOS now realize The SS Obama is a sinking ship. Welcome to politics.

Nope, but the GOP isn't any better. Also, your comments on "employers" are overly simplistic. Firstly, take an employer who draws a reasonable salary and makes sure his company pays taxes. Now take an employer that takes tens of millions of dollars in bonuses and benefits, just because they can, and attempts to get laws passed which reduce his companies tax rate to basically nothing.

One of these employers is beneficial to the economy, the other leeches from the economy so I think it is unfair to lump them together.

Also, what's the deal with calling them taxocrats, don't you guys have some of the lowest rates of taxes in history right now?

>> ^quantumushroom:

Does anyone still believe Taxocrats "care" about "working people?" At least more than the other side?
Taxocrats take more money from Wall Street "donors" than Republicans. Taxocrats caused the housing crisis via bad loans to people who they knew would never repay.
Evil rich people have a second identity the left doesn't like to mention: "Employers." Taxocrats cause employers to do nothing and wait out the reign of financial instability fomented by confiscatory threats; no one is going on a hiring spree only to have Taxocrats slam them with a bill for socialist medicine.
Not that Maddow doesn't have a point. It's possible even those RINOS now realize The SS Obama is a sinking ship. Welcome to politics.

Let me tell you about "Employers". My former employer, just prior to the Presidential election sent out a memo saying that if Obama won the election and put his tax plan into effect he would have to fire 300 some people. Obama of course won, and even before Obama took the oath of office, they fired on the order of 380 people and told the rest that we wouldn't get a raise that year because the cost of living went down so much. He then went out and bought a private jet and another mansion in Glenmoor (a high end gated Arnold Palmer designed golf community) to add to the one he already had there (the second largest in Glenmoor) and his place on Miami Beach among others. A new year for the companies health care plan rolls around and the rates were supposed to go up 22% (the same amount as last year, but this is not mentioned the memo) but they held the line at only a 5% increase (again just like last year but not mentioned in the memo); the very next sentience of the memo about the health care cost increase goes to say how the company disagrees with Obama's costly health care plan as if it had anything to do with the insurance rate increases that year (one should note it is deceptive stuff like that which they put in their marketing which is why they can't do business in FL, PA, CA and a few others). Then when the Ohio governorship is up for election he sends another memo out talking how under Ted Strickland the company lost 380+ jobs and that we should vote for John Kasich. John Kasich wins and the owner fires 230+ people and once again no raises for anyone. 600+ people out of work but guess who still has his private jet. And it isn't like he is a rare case. Aside from the memos of voter intimidation he is typical of the rich and what they think of their employees. He has been given huge tax credits and incentives from the state, county and cities, but he still hasn't hired many people, and as a matter of fact fired over 600 people (far exceeding those hired by several hundred still) and pocketed the savings so he could get a jet. So don't believe or spread the lie that if we give the rich tax breaks or more money it will eventually help the working class. 30 years of trickle down economics has proven that doesn't happen. Of course you Republicans won't let facts stand in the way of robing the working class to support the rich, and using the media to tell them it is for their own good... sadly too many of the American public is too brain dead to realize they are being coned.
People like that guy is who the Republicans are all about rather blatantly, at least the Democrats pretend to care about the working class even if they don't have the balls to stand up to the Republicans or the rich. Some of the more caring Democrats have a plan that would balance the budget 10 to 20 years faster than the Republican plan, all without cuts to essential services to the working poor. If the Republicans really wanted to balance the budget as they say, and cut spending as they say, then they would go with the People's Budget, but since that cuts into Republican funded things like Tarp and cuts the military budget and raises taxes on the upper 2% they won't have it. Of course Obama and the majority of the Democrats are too chicken to support it themselves...

Nope, but the GOP isn't any better.

>>> Perhaps slightly better, which ain't saying much.

Also, your comments on "employers" are overly simplistic. Firstly, take an employer who draws a reasonable salary and makes sure his company pays taxes. Now take an employer that takes tens of millions of dollars in bonuses and benefits, just because they can, and attempts to get laws passed which reduce his companies tax rate to basically nothing.


One of these employers is beneficial to the economy, the other leeches from the economy so I think it is unfair to lump them together.

>>> I'll accept the accusation of being "overly simplistic" in this case, because despite the abuses by large corporations (including MS-DNC, who last year made 15 billion in profit but because they shill for obama, paid nothing in taxes) even they aren't hiring or expanding.


Also, what's the deal with calling them taxocrats, don't you guys have some of the lowest rates of taxes in history right now?

>>> Lowest tax rates compared to whom? Our corporate tax rate is 2nd or 3rd highest in the world. Real unemployment is 22%. We are 14 trillion in the hole. And despite the massive government fraud, waste and abuse no one cares about, the left wants to raise taxes. It's their knee-jerk response to everything.

Part of your writing is about what happened and the rest is about what you believe. Are the rich universally callous a-holes who care nothing about their employees? Some are like that, others ain't. Capitalism is like a military tank; it's better to be riding in the turret than getting caught under the treads.

Historically there appears to be more misery when taxocrats run the show than repubs. Why, what's stopping His Earness from announcing he loves socialism and implementing a carbon copy of the European model (have you see Greece lately)?

Not that I have much stake in defending them, but the wealthy pay the most taxes in America, despite the cheaters, that's fact. The bottom 50% don't even pay income tax but suck up plenty of "free" goodies.

There's a moral basis for making others pay a fair share of taxes, but not the lion's share.



>> ^RFlagg:

Let me tell you about "Employers". My former employer, just prior to the Presidential election sent out a memo saying that if Obama won the election and put his tax plan into effect he would have to fire 300 some people. Obama of course won, and even before Obama took the oath of office, they fired on the order of 380 people and told the rest that we wouldn't get a raise that year because the cost of living went down so much. He then went out and bought a private jet and another mansion in Glenmoor (a high end gated Arnold Palmer designed golf community) to add to the one he already had there (the second largest in Glenmoor) and his place on Miami Beach among others. A new year for the companies health care plan rolls around and the rates were supposed to go up 22% (the same amount as last year, but this is not mentioned the memo) but they held the line at only a 5% increase (again just like last year but not mentioned in the memo); the very next sentience of the memo about the health care cost increase goes to say how the company disagrees with Obama's costly health care plan as if it had anything to do with the insurance rate increases that year (one should note it is deceptive stuff like that which they put in their marketing which is why they can't do business in FL, PA, CA and a few others). Then when the Ohio governorship is up for election he sends another memo out talking how under Ted Strickland the company lost 380+ jobs and that we should vote for John Kasich. John Kasich wins and the owner fires 230+ people and once again no raises for anyone. 600+ people out of work but guess who still has his private jet. And it isn't like he is a rare case. Aside from the memos of voter intimidation he is typical of the rich and what they think of their employees. He has been given huge tax credits and incentives from the state, county and cities, but he still hasn't hired many people, and as a matter of fact fired over 600 people (far exceeding those hired by several hundred still) and pocketed the savings so he could get a jet. So don't believe or spread the lie that if we give the rich tax breaks or more money it will eventually help the working class. 30 years of trickle down economics has proven that doesn't happen. Of course you Republicans won't let facts stand in the way of robing the working class to support the rich, and using the media to tell them it is for their own good... sadly too many of the American public is too brain dead to realize they are being coned.
People like that guy is who the Republicans are all about rather blatantly, at least the Democrats pretend to care about the working class even if they don't have the balls to stand up to the Republicans or the rich. Some of the more caring Democrats have a plan that would balance the budget 10 to 20 years faster than the Republican plan, all without cuts to essential services to the working poor. If the Republicans really wanted to balance the budget as they say, and cut spending as they say, then they would go with the People's Budget, but since that cuts into Republican funded things like Tarp and cuts the military budget and raises taxes on the upper 2% they won't have it. Of course Obama and the majority of the Democrats are too chicken to support it themselves...

http://motherjones.com/politics/2011/06/speedup-americans-working-harder-charts

Look at the top three. Are the rich (aka the top 1%) universally callous a-holes? No.

Are a statistically significant number of them hoarding a disproportionate helping of the gains achieved through productivity increases over a the last few decades? Yes.

Is that trend happening very, very quickly right now? Yes.

Oh, and about the above back and forth about tax rates, actual tax revenue as a share of GDP is lower than ever right now, personal income tax rates are lower than they've been since the 1920's, capital gains tax rate is lower than it's been since the 1920's, and the effective corporate tax rate (i.e. once you account for exemptions) is about 25%, which is well below the OECD average.

So yes, taxes are lower than ever here in the US.
>> ^quantumushroom:

Part of your writing is about what happened and the rest is about what you believe. Are the rich universally callous a-holes who care nothing about their employees? Some are like that, others ain't. Capitalism is like a military tank; it's better to be riding in the turret than getting caught under the treads.

@quantumushroom

You do know that Greece's economic crisis is partially due to your friendly corporate friends at Goldman Sachs, right?

http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/0,1518,676634,00.html

@NetRunner

Damn, I knew the States had it bad, but not that bad.

...and people wonder why we aren't getting anything done (or Obama isn't)...

/partisan hackery to the n^th
//maybe we can give up GOP lawmakers to a global commission after they let it crash again, preferably somewhere in Europe...
///at the end of the day, we can only blame the Republicans and the citizenry that voted them in for this debacle

I'm also thinking that if you co-sponsor a bill, that should be an automatic yes to your vote.