http://www.ontheissues.org/Domestic/Barack_Obama_Gun_Control.htm

Obama has voted contrary to his common sense stance on gun control.

He has never votes against anti gun legislation often votes for said legislation.

As with all politicians This man is a wolf is sheep's clothing.

"americans cling to their guns out of bitterness?" - I dont care if that was a slip up or not, Explain what the hell that means?

I don't cling to any thing, to me a firearm like an axe (both deadly) is a tool.

To think that a gun is any more dangerous than the person standing next to you in the subway is folly. Because with out the human element steel and cordite are just objects, they cannot act on their own accord.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag.(show it anyway)

The guy has a Master's Degree in International Relations from University of Chicago and was the editor of the Harvard Law Review.

I'll overlook a couple of policy shifts if we can have someone in the oval office who doesn't make mistakes like this.

Yes dag, what we need now is a slick-talker, to sell the bullshit coming down, instead of an inarticulate one.....all are the same as far as agenda.....agenda coming from outside the realm of "governments"....govs. are tools, like gun-haters are fools.

>> ^NordlichReiter:
http://www.ontheissues.org/Domestic/Barack_Obama_Gun_Control.htm
Obama has voted contrary to his common sense stance on gun control.

That link seemed a bit strange as evidence of your conclusion -- the quote at the top is the general statement of his position: there's a right to bear arms, but there's also reasonable limits we're allowed to place on the right.

The rest of the page is filled with comments/votes on what he considers reasonable -- you might disagree with what he considers reasonable, but he isn't voting contrary to his stated opinion.

As with all politicians This man is a wolf is sheep's clothing.
"americans cling to their guns out of bitterness?" - I dont care if that was a slip up or not, Explain what the hell that means?

He means that people are so used to getting fucked over by government on economic issues, they focus instead on gun rights, and start voting counter to their own economic self-interest on the basis of issues that probably have less impact on their life as a whole than the economic ones.

Here's a video where he explains it himself.

I don't cling to any thing, to me a firearm like an axe (both deadly) is a tool.

This is an argument I've heard over the years, but it's disingenuous to try to equate an axe with a firearm. An axe is usually used to chop wood, which is pretty non-lethal. Sure, it can be a deadly weapon, but that's not it's purpose. Guns on the other hand are designed to kill things -- in other words: a weapon. Sure, there are places you can practice with them without killing things, but that doesn't make it a tool.

I'm picturing Homer Simpson using a 44 Magnum to open his beer...it makes as much sense as that.

To think that a gun is any more dangerous than the person standing next to you in the subway is folly. Because with out the human element steel and cordite are just objects, they cannot act on their own accord.

This is a fair point, to a certain extent. "Guns don't kill people, people kill people," is true. Concluding that therefore we should make it as easy for people to kill each other as humanly possible because of it, seems misguided at best.

Despite what's grown into a very long post -- I'm pretty ambivalent about gun rights. I don't think we can get rid of them entirely, so law-abiding people should be able to buy them. I don't want just anyone to be able to get them, at any time, no questions asked, though. I'd like to own my own assault rifle, just in case someone starts a revolution, but even then, I'm not convinced it'd help me much in that situation, either.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag.(show it anyway)

^ Well put NetRunner.

Choggie - I will do everything I can to keep another clueless ideologue from leading the United States.

I'm not sure the damage that Bush has done can be repaired over 8 years - but I sure don't want to pour fuel on the dipshit fire by electing another one.

The last "slick talker" (is that code for a multi-syllabic vocabulary?) presided over 8 years of relative peace and prosperity.

The US got what it deserved by electing the dude they'd want to have a beer with instead of a smart leader - but enough already.

Yeah yeah yeah, looks are meant to deceive with regard to politics of the day. i have some friends who will vote for him based on one or two of the many carrots he's thrown out, oh yeah, and that he talks real purty....FUCK ALL...How about, nice ass, cute wife, bettter chose of suit cut than the others....WHATS YOUR RREASON??? They alll suck, and are meant to divert.
The anti-gun for the sake of peace and love, is well and good-Wrong pardigm at present,HELLLO!?- to wish them away, or give them up-
A fool sees a section of the portrait that appeals, and throws out baby with bathwater.....

Imagine a scenario whereby a nation of gun-owners, in a country whose culture and history includes and abides guns regardless of the few weak-minded simpletons who use similar above justifications for wishing them gone, is being under-minded by the few assholes in the political arena whose agendas include, but are not limited to, confiscation, incarceration, and ultimately, total control.....But wait-It is not the individual politicians, congressmen, senators, judges, etc. who work to create a situation which makes their tasks closer to being realized.....IT'S the cocksuckers who fund these insipid fucks, and influence governments and world events.

The beltway is a damaged, carcinogenic shithole, which needs a radical douche and remodel-Ol'bammy looks like just another putty....just as McPain, Clitless.....all are enemies of reason and life with their bullshit showing for all to see.....

You two need to embrace history, learn it, and know your fucking enemies......the enemies are not gun-owners, responsible or otherwise-The enemy is mind-control which speaks to the emotions, fear, and ignorance of a weak-willed populace.

Grow some balls, all you Americans and Ex-Patriots....and get this asshole off my telescreen, and stick him in room 101.....

I learn and teach proper gun safety. Just as any one else needs to learn how to drive a car safely. Yes I agree with common sense gun laws, but like copyright laws, FISA, and Patriot Act (Espionage Act)I do not agree with the amendments of very well written laws that already do their jobs.

He struck down Illinois gun rights, Chicago anti gun laws(supports them), and the right to own a Semi Auto in certain states. When there are bans on Semi Auto, Full Auto pistols, then there is a ban on the majority of handguns by proxy. Pump guns and Revolvers are unwieldy, I'm not talking about the right to defense I'm talking about the right to own and bear weapons that are formidable to the weapons that the good guys have.

They dont want the people to have these weapons because as is said: it impedes the right of them to enforce laws. No, it scares the shit out of authority, which is exactly what is needed. Criminals could care less what gun laws you put out there. Again I agree with common sense laws, but I do not agree with radical expansion of said laws.

On another note: Mcain is bush, Obama is a Fake Idol, Nader is a conspiracy theorist, and Lobbyist are money grubbing ass hats. The choice is? Gotdamn that's a tough choice.


Eisenhower said "Beware the Military Industrial Complex." http://coursesa.matrix.msu.edu/~hst306/documents/indust.html

Washington said "Beware of foreign entanglements."
http://www.earlyamerica.com/earlyamerica/milestones/farewell/text.html
To choggie, many presidents have warned us and yet we still continue to follow the lead lemming.

I really would like an example where gun ownership has meant people fight for their rights, or even hold their governments accountable.

Governments don't use weapons to keep populations under control, they use systems of coercion, propaganda and most of all the feeling of comfort and stability that no population will willingly fight against.

I think the whole lets keep weapons to make us safer from enemy x is a straw man argument, almost every other nation has decent restrictive gun control laws and are far more democratic and accountable then the US government.